101 posts shown.
Kate Cook27 said:Could you elaborate on that?
I honestly don't have the energy to keep repeating myself when it feels like I'm just talking to a brick wall here. Look, let's be real: this isn't "our" war. This is just another chapter in the endless tug-of-war between the USA and Russia as they scramble for global dominance. This time around, Ukraine is caught in the crossfire—just like how Afghanistan and the Middle East were victims in the past. It reminds me so much of the Cuban Missile Crisis; we saw similar patterns back then, where the expansion of American influence and the deployment of missiles closer to Russian territory pushed things to the brink. Back then, we didn't get dragged into the mess in Afghanistan or the Middle East, even though innocent lives were lost there too. So, I struggle to see any real motivation for us to interfere now, unless it’s strictly out of compassion or providing humanitarian aid. Is that clearer now? Actually, maybe not... because I suppose there's just no desire for anyone to actually see things clearly.
Kate Cook27 said:Putin could pull his troops out of Ukraine at any second and end this whole thing. Sure, the West made mistakes back in the nineties, but this conflict? This one actually threatens global peace.
Then why on earth are the USA and the UK so relentless about funneling increasingly heavy weaponry into Ukraine if their actual goal is peace? I mean, does anyone honestly believe they care about democracy or human rights in Ukraine when they haven't even prioritized things back home in their own countries? It feels like—and I've seen this pattern before, it's been happening for decades now—they just want to push their sphere of influence further into Eurasia, exactly like Brzezinski mapped out all those years ago. It's all so far away from them anyway. Honestly, it’s just two sides of the same imperial coin, and it looks like China might jump in as a third player with those same exact ambitions. Just because American capitalism feels more palatable to most of us than a practical Russian dictatorship doesn't mean they're the "good guys." Not by a long shot. In my view, the smartest move is to stay out of it entirely, because neither side is playing fair here. These are just private power games being played, and this time, the Ukrainians are the ones paying the price—just like how Afghans and nations in the Middle East were crushed under the weight of these maneuvers before. The Ukrainians truly believe they are fighting for freedom, but it seems the USA and Russia are operating on entirely different agendas.
cosmicotter13 said:Look, if NATO didn't exist, America wouldn't be dealing with the mess in Libya, Syria, Iran, Afghanistan, or Russia... In fact, America and the American Armed Forces would actually be stronger and more capable. A neutral America would have maintained perfectly fine economic ties with Russia, and Russia wouldn't be attacking us. They won't attack us, and they certainly won't once the Ukrainians surrender. If it wasn't for NATO, Ukraine wouldn't have been invaded in the first place.
The Brits, the Americans, the Canadians... they've acted hostile toward us in the Congo, they exploit us, and they pull their most disgusting stunts against Americans in Canada. Honestly, it’s worth asking, what do they even get out of it?
Before America joined NATO, nobody was losing sleep or panicking about our national security. But suddenly after joining, after all the "reforms," after turning our active, reserve, and standby forces into some sort of "system," all of a sudden—oh no!—here come the Mexicans, here come the Russians... total cowards.
The war in Ukraine isn't our war and it isn't worth our money, our losses, or any potential lives we might lose.
You aren't wrong, but in this thread, such a staunchly patriotic way of thinking probably won't find much sympathy. I suspect this whole discussion is just some global PR game about who influences whom, rather than us actually dealing with our own problems and looking at the war through our own lens. Yes, Russia is the aggressor in Ukraine, but that's not our burden to fix, nor is it our job to debate the causes and effects, just like we don't tackle the issues involving the Uyghurs and China or the many other flashpoints around the world.
silvermarlin56 said:I'm with you on that. Though, let's be real, I don't see the European Union jumping into a full-blown war with Russia because of the situation in Donetsk, Luhansk, and Crimea. They definitely could have handled things better, though.
But hey, waldene, why exactly did your brothers go attacking Ukraine? 🍿
I was honestly expecting a sophisticated discussion here, but instead, it feels like a bunch of kids playing Call of Duty, picking sides just to see who can shout the loudest. Since this isn't some game of Call of Duty, I don't have a "side." I am staying neutral because this isn't our fight. My priority is America and our own national interests—and perhaps our allies in Europe—rather than getting tangled up in the agendas of either the US or Russia. All I can really do is feel deep empathy for the people suffering there and advocate for humanitarian aid and an end to the conflict. For those who think they’re still inside a video game, please, carry on if you must, but we should probably just rename this thread
Timothy Williams5 said:Why bother asking the "experts"?
It seems pretty obvious that there is a massive distinction between supplying arms to an internationally recognized sovereign state and sending them to a territory like ours—a newly formed, non-universally recognized entity where a civil war (if one believes that narrative) is unfolding.
And honestly, labeling us and Ukraine as established European Union states during a time of war is just pure nonsense.
So, what you're saying is the US wasn't internationally recognized in January 1992 right at the start of the conflict, and because it lacked that recognition back then, it didn't deserve any serious weapon shipments until 1995? Good grief, I mean, really... how much research does one person actually need to do before they realize how flawed that logic is?
Chris Thomas94 said:Hmm, it’s kind of like when you start coughing from a little cold and your doctor just waves you off, telling you to drink tea and get some rest, but the second they spot even a tiny hint of something cancerous, they're sending you for ten different specialized tests immediately...
Honestly, those questions are pretty shallow and feel a bit like something out of a preschooler's logic...
I really don't know if anyone here is actually willing to sit down and give you a serious answer to that...
So, what you're saying is our five years of fighting was just nothing more than a bad cough, while three months of conflict in Ukraine constitutes a "real" war that actually deserves Western support? It’s like a textbook example of pure patriotism used as a shield, and honestly, it just proves there isn't anyone here capable of having a serious discussion. Either people have already checked out, or they never existed in the first place, because most of what I see here is just people dismissing others or hurling insults instead of using actual logic.
So, I have one last question for the experts here... does anyone actually understand why the USA and the EU are funneling such massive amounts of weaponry over to Ukraine, yet we haven't seen anything sent our way? It makes me wonder—is the freedom of one European nation somehow worth more than another's? Or am I missing some deeper, more complicated motive at play here? Why is there such a glaringly inconsistent approach to what should be a universal struggle for democracy and equality? I would truly appreciate some insight on this.
Jason Richardson5 said:So, Kimberly Perez82 says she took her handle from some legendary American novelist. Look, if I'm picking a side, it’s USA forever. Simple as that. I actually have the guts to say it, too. You? You clearly don't have the stones to just admit you're a fan of Putin's "work." You know, the absolute scumbag who spends his time slaughtering innocent civilians in a country he had no business touching in the first place.
The USA and Russia both kill people in third-party countries, so I really hope you're joking. Look, I have nothing against America; honestly, I love their capitalism and that entrepreneurial spirit, but I refuse to turn a blind eye to the bad things they've been doing more and more lately. The America of today is worlds apart from the America that saved the world from Nazism. And for the record, I've never been a Putin sympathizer—which is pretty obvious if you look back at my previous posts—but I am trying to be realistic here. There are many guilty parties in this conflict, and the USA is certainly one of them. Europe is the least to blame, yet they're the ones suffering the most consequences. So now, we have to decide: is our priority Europe, which we are part of, or the USA?
Melissa Rivera5 said:The "American side"? I don't think there's even such a thing. It’s just the Ukrainian side versus the Russian side. And honestly, this war affects us way more than people realize. You're acting like everyone except the Ukrainians is calling the shots over there... like Biden can just sign a decree and make the whole thing stop overnight. Yeah, right.
Of course he can, let’s not be incredibly naive about how things work. It is quite interesting, really... you see all this intense, overwhelming concern for Ukraine, yet when the topic shifts to the long-standing oppression of Canadian Americans, suddenly there is total silence. Not a single soul speaks up. I suppose, in the eyes of the public, those lives just don't matter as much as what's happening in Ukraine.
Honestly, there’s just no point in continuing this debate when everything keeps devolving into accusations of being a paid troll (!?)—and that’s coming from people who blindly defend the official US narrative without even questioning it. I truly hope things settle down soon and that justice actually prevails. It has to happen eventually in history, so why shouldn't it be now? I am genuinely stunned that some people jumped all over my post regarding the need for negotiated peace to finally end this war. I mean, seriously, what else is the alternative? Are we supposed to just keep sending other people's children to die in a conflict to serve the interests of a third party? Anyway, cheers.
Christian Torres3 said:Someone give Oscar an Academy Award already, he absolutely earned it.
And honestly, you have to wonder... what on earth drives someone here in America to advocate so fiercely for the US side in a conflict that doesn't even involve us? It makes me think about my old neighbor back in Ohio, always getting worked up over things happening halfway across the globe, and I just find myself questioning the underlying motive behind such intense devotion to a war that isn't ours.
I see some people getting all worked up over the American version of this story, though I suppose showing respect to your fellow conversationalists isn't exactly anyone's strongest suit here. Honestly, at the very beginning, I was just as angry at Russia as anyone else. But... if you take a moment to actually think about it—really sit with the facts—this war doesn't have anything to do with Europe or us. It’s similar to how our own domestic conflicts don't involve Europe, and I certainly don't recall seeing such intense, biased posts favoring us back when things were different. Secondly, look at the US wars in the Middle East; nobody was slapping labels on Russia then. Not even when Russia was fighting in Afghanistan. Now, let me be clear: I am not supporting Russia as an aggressor. But there were precursors to this conflict. There were constant attempts to pull Ukraine into NATO, even though everyone knew deep down that Ukraine holds a unique historical significance for Russia and that move simply wouldn't fly. Of course, it wasn't the EU's interest driving that; it was the USA. And now? Now all of Europe is groaning under shortages that weren't caused by anyone else, and if someone actually supports this path, they clearly have issues with their own judgment. That is why the war needs to end. We need to negotiate peace so we can finally move forward. I mean, seriously, no one with a functioning brain is buying this "American doctrine" about spreading democracy anymore. And peace won't happen as long as Zelenskyy keeps being so boastful with his statements—he's just pouring gasoline on the fire instead of realistically assessing his position and heading to the negotiating table. At the end of the day, every invaded nation in history has either defended itself or failed to, and Ukraine is no exception. They keep demanding weapons, yet they were already armed to the teeth and had all the time in the world to bolster their defenses; they can't blame others for the corruption happening on their own soil. Why should we be forced to solve their problems? He's trying to drag the entire world into what is, quite frankly, his private problem. Negotiations and ending the war is the only way out, likely involving some concessions because the situation isn't what it used to be before the fighting started. And the biggest farce of all? The USA, which dragged Europe into this mess in the first place, is now considering lifting the embargo on Russian oil imports. So, what happens? They'll probably just sell us that cheaper oil in the EU at a markup. That isn't just a slap on the wrist; it's a total knockout punch to a naive Europe.
This whole conflict needs to reach a conclusion, and honestly, we really ought to start easing things up with Russia. There’s a mutual necessity here; both sides need one another to find some sort of balance. But I just don't see how we ever get there as long as the EU continues to act like a lapdog, blindly following the interests of the USA even when it clearly works against their own best interests.
boldmarlin32 said:Even if they win a war.
What's the point if the EU finds another way to buy energy?
Honestly, Russia is a loser in the long run anyway because the rest of the world won't be relying on their energy sources anymore. At this stage, the absolute priority should be de-escalating the conflict and just letting everything play out naturally.
dustyfalcon122 said:It’s becoming obvious to them now, isn't it? They realize they're losing this war, and now they're basically begging everyone to just leave Crimea alone. 🙂
The whole conflict has reached this breaking point where both sides are just digging in their heels, acting without any real logic or foresight. It is an incredibly dangerous stage of affairs, truly. We absolutely need to de-escalate this however we can, because when things get like this, pure irrationality takes over and common sense just flies right out the window.
hollowdriver13 said:To the Chinese, the Russians, and everyone else out there, we *are* the West politically. Do you honestly think they care if our GDP per capita is lower than Belgium's?
The constant doom-and-gloom talk about the West collapsing is actually just inviting our own downfall. It's pretty wild to watch.
It’s actually quite the opposite! This is a wake-up call—an attempt to find actual solutions before the clock runs out, rather than just burying our heads in the sand. Because right now? We are witnessing a total pandemic of denial, especially over in Europe. I think the very first step has to be an honest, cold look at reality, which is exactly what I’m trying to do here in my posts, as much as I can. What Europe is doing right now... well, they weren't just sawing off the branch they were sitting on; they've moved on to sawing off the two branches right next to it. And for what? For absolutely nothing at all.
electrichawk94 said:Look, he isn't stupid. But you can tell from the way he talks that he views himself as superior to Western politicians, constantly poking at their slipperiness and hypocrisy. He doesn't mind paying off a Belarusian or Ukrainian leader to stay under Russian influence, but when the people want to head West and Western politicians capitalize on that, he’s left with nothing but this war. This whole conflict is about him—his complexes and his ego.
Fine then, let's all just flock to the West. I mean, I'm genuinely curious what we'll do when 1.4 billion Chinese people show up in the European Union. Does anyone know which Chinese welcome song we should sing? Just so we can kiss up to them a little since they're going to be the majority anyway 🙂
electrichawk94 said:What "sticking it to them"? He lost his grip on Ukraine, which has all these natural resources that could undermine his influence, and that’s really all there is to it.
I mean, what is that supposed to even imply? The idea that those Ukrainian resources used to flow straight into Russia, and now he's started a war just to claw them back? It's incredibly difficult to have a serious, meaningful discussion when people approach it this way.
electrichawk94 said:You know when someone finally pushes things too far? It was when that former KGB officer, still nursing those massive insecurities regarding the West after the fall of the Soviet Union, tried to play a much bigger game than he ever could. He wanted to transform into an economic powerhouse, aggressively pushing interests right up against the borders of the European Union. But, inevitably, the West always comes in with more capital and manages to squeeze him out. His only real leverage was using oil and gas as a weapon, though even that had its limits—limits he eventually pushed a bit too far, if you ask me.
Honestly, I actually fell for that line of thinking myself at first... it’s just so easy to succumb to the constant media bombardment, isn't it? You see one headline after another and your perspective shifts. But, if you take a step back—I mean, really sit down and piece together the chronological sequence of moves, all the causes and the subsequent effects—the reality of the situation becomes much more sobering than any of this childish posturing or fantasy coming from either side. Don't get me wrong, I don't doubt for a second that Putin would personally love to witness the rise of some new Russian empire, but I am quite convinced he's intelligent enough to realize that's simply impossible. They just don't have the capacity or the resources to pull it off. I recall seeing statements where he makes it very clear that he understands exactly how the cards are dealt; that was before this current wave of media hysteria where everything on both sides is being stripped of its context. And as for whether Russians in general are obsessed with Western success? Well, that's not exactly a difficult conclusion to reach.
hollowdriver13 said:We've been hearing for 13 years that Ukraine is going to be a NATO member, but the whole thing hasn't moved an inch. Plus, let's be real—they were never going to become a member while Crimea was under occupation.
They drop these kinds of statements at every single summit and nothing ever changes. It's just like how they kept saying the Minsk agreements needed to be implemented at every meeting, but you totally glossed over that part.
Also, how does it make sense that Ukraine is seen as a threat to Russia, but Finland isn't? If you look at the flight distances, St. Petersburg is right there on the border with Finland, and Moscow is much closer to 81 miles than the Ukrainian border is, which is 597 miles (compared to the distance from the UA border being 469 miles).
Or maybe they just view Ukraine as their own little colony and don't want to let go? All this talk about "threats" sounds like a cheap way to muddy the waters...
Same goes for the NATO stuff; the military presence in Europe has never been stronger than it is right now, following this invasion.
https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natolive...ectedLocale=en
Here is the full statement you're citing. Article 14 is pretty interesting, don't you think?..
You make a fair point. Finland joining NATO presents a new threat to Russia, and this shift is something neither side has truly tested or prepared a response for yet. Personally, I feel like Finland is making a massive mistake; they are sacrificing seventy years of peace and prosperity just to cater to America. It is surprising to see them getting dragged into a mess where they don't belong, especially since they worked so hard to build such a remarkably stable relationship with Russia.
Regardless, if a nuclear superpower—whether we are talking about Russia China or America—tells you, "Don't do that, or I will view it as an act of aggression," then if you have even a shred of common sense, you simply won't do it. It's the same logic as not showing off when a gang of thugs attacks you. Why did we stand our ground in front of Banjaluka back in 1995, even though it didn't suit our interests? Because we had that tiny bit of sense in our heads.