Posts by Frank Barnes

Peter Young5 said:So, I finally picked up an HP 8610 today. It’s officially arrived. Everything seems to be running smoothly so far, and honestly, I’m pretty happy with it. I figured I'd drop a note here just in case anyone was curious about how this model holds up. I'll check back in after a month or two and let you know if everything stays solid.

Not bad at all.

When you get that "Ink Low" notification, don't even think about it—just swap them out for new ones. It’s really that simple.

Why?

Since you're calling those Ink Low alerts a problem, maybe you could just sell them off? $3.25 I don't know... maybe?

But let's be real—if you just keep pushing through and ignore that "REPLACE Cartridge" alert on the screen, you’re basically just throwing those forty bucks straight into the trash. Why bother? $3.25 It’s all garbage. At that point, those HP machines just become completely useless.

Ready when you are. Send over the text.

Peter Young5 said:The 8600 has been out for years now... he acts like he knows everything about it, but it's basically the same as the 276dw...

You can find an 8600 for $500.

Have you even heard of something called firmware?

Why am I asking?

Because the exact same cartridges work fine in an 8600, but they won't work in a 276. And both machines take HP 950 cartridges. Maybe they work if they come from a different manufacturer. But hey, if you've got money to burn, feel free to start buying ink from every single supplier on the market. Go ahead, make a spreadsheet and post it here so we all know which specific cartridge works with which printer. Just remember, the delivery date matters too. Just because one brand's ink works today doesn't mean it'll work tomorrow. Especially if you're using some Cloud service or online diagnostic tools and the latest drivers for this printer.

Or better yet, start hunting for compatible cartridges on eBay. Who knows, maybe you'll hit a lucky jackpot. You'll just have to be careful whether your printer is a US version, a Hong Kong, China version, or an EU or Eastern Europe firmware version.

And what do you think your local shop owner is going to tell you when you ask him if his cartridges will work on your specific printer?

That's why the smartest move is to grab an older, similar OfficeJet model that HP has basically given up on. You'll know exactly how it behaves, and you can do whatever you want with it.

Peter Young5 said:The HP 251DW is an inkjet, which obviously keeps printing costs way lower than its laser counterparts.😁

But honestly, what's the catch when you compare it to a laser printer in the same price bracket?
Is waiting 14 seconds just to get that first page out a bit much?🤔
What's your take?

It’s not a bad deal if you're sticking strictly to original ink.

As for third-party options or potential headaches... we won't really know until about 18 months from now, once these units actually start showing up at the repair shops.

Peter Young5 said:You can find an HP CP1025 for about the same price as a P1102, but the CP1025 gives you color and claims to have 8MB of memory plus 128MB flash...

Is that actually a better move than going with the P1102? I mean, if the black print quality is identical on both, is there really a catch?

The 1102 uses the 85A toner, whereas the 1025 runs on the 126A.

Honestly, it all comes down to when you plan on sending one of these machines to the scrap heap.

The manufacturer, naturally, is hoping that happens sooner rather than later.

Peter Young5 said:Maybe you misunderstood my point... I'm never actually looking to print a "photo." I just need to print a document that happens to have a .JPEG inside it.

If I set the resolution to 600x600, don't you think it’s going to drag things down, even if I'm just printing a few JPEGs that are maybe 10MB each?

And what happens if the file size exceeds what's available in the printer's memory? Does the computer take over the heavy lifting, or does the printer just freeze up on you?

It’s the exact same logic as building a website and having a window set to 300 x 300 dpi, then trying to cram a 2MB image into it. That's just not how it works. You’d use an image editor to scale it down first, right?

That’s essentially what a GDI driver does—it handles the processing on the PC side and sends the image off at 300 x 300.

But when you're dealing with PCL or PostScript communication, all that processing is handed off to the printer itself. And that's where you really start needing memory.

So, I'll say it again: there is absolutely no reason to try using a home laser printer for high-quality photo prints. Why bother?

Because these machines are built primarily for text. The way the developer roller distributes toner creates these little variances based on how much toner was used in specific spots, and sooner or later, those imperfections show up as streaks or blotches on your image.

Peter Young5 said:Hey there,

Could the fact that my HP LaserJet P1102w only has 2MB of memory actually cause me trouble?

What happens if I try to print a 10MB file all at once? Sometimes I need to print out a photo—you know, one of those documents where instead of scanning it, you just snap a picture with your camera—in black and white... Just one of those files can easily hit the 2MB mark.
Since that image takes up roughly 500 times more space than a standard Word doc, does it actually consume a similar amount of toner? I mean, maybe a little more because of the contrast, or is printing this way just a complete waste of money?

2. Regarding the wireless option—will everything run smoothly if I’m trying to print from the third floor while the printer is sitting on the ground floor, assuming they’re both on the same Wi-Fi network? (The signal reaches pretty far because we use a range extender...)

Thanks

I mean, who really expects to print high-quality photos on a home laser printer anyway?

Basically, you just set the resolution to 600 x 600 DPI and call it a day. Which brings us back to that point from before.

You can't have your cake and eat it too.

Aaron Thomas28 said:**Bold these two.** On my old Canon 4800, I used to watch the color levels on the control panel drop in real-time during head cleanings. It was wild. How much can a machine take if you have to run that three times a day? Honestly, I didn't think much of it when I switched to $6.25... until the print head finally fried, leaving me sitting there with four brand-new cartridges just lying in my desk drawer, haha. I think I might give this L355 a shot.

Before you pull the trigger, maybe call up an Epson service center and ask what they charge for a brand-new print head and the labor to swap it out.

Why?

Because you need to know how that stacks up against the cost of a Canon 4800. With these setups, when things go south, you aren't just tossing a printer and a print head; you’re losing the CISS and everything else you paid for. You end up paying for two or three Canon IP 4800s all at once. That's probably why the Canon IP 4800 and similar models aren't even being made anymore.

urbanfalcon7 said:....first off, thanks again for all the explanations and advice. After spending the whole day driving around, I ended up picking up an HP DeskJet 3545 on sale—it even came with an extra pack of original ink for free. As for the Epson L210, after a lot of overthinking, I realized I just don't need it. I mean, props to them and that color tech, which is actually great, but it feels more geared toward professionals churning out 20+ pages a day. I almost pulled the trigger, but it costs twice as much as this one, and I know you have to do the math on page yields... honestly, the HP won me over because the black ink (original) gets 360 pages and the tri-color (original) does 200, which is plenty for my kid and wife for over a year. Plus, the originals are about $78 + $23, at least that's what I was looking at... but the real clincher was that each color comes with its own print head, which was one of my big requirements when buying.... go ahead, tell me if I'm crazy...

If you had gone with the L210, you wouldn't have made a mistake as long as you were under warranty. But once you start paying for service and maintenance, the whole equation changes. That's when it becomes clear whether it would have been smarter to just get a CISS version like the SX 130—it’s basically 50% cheaper than the "use it and toss it" approach.

As for that DJ 3545, it might be smart to grab an Ecco mini refill set for $30, $50, or maybe $33, just so you have it on hand.

Take a look at this link; it might be useful to you.

And then you just refill the color cartridge.

urbanfalcon7 said:Alright, I'm heading out... I'll let you guys know what I end up grabbing later.

Definitely touch base once you're done. We want to see what else you could have scored for the same amount—or even less—if you'd gone with a refurbished model. It’s always interesting to weigh the pros and cons of buying new versus used.

And since there's an option to return it if it doesn't meet expectations, we're actually pretty curious to see how that whole process plays out with a printer purchase.

urbanfalcon7 said:....now I'm just completely lost. Earlier you were talking about those "permanent" cartridges and refilling them, but now you're saying manufacturers design printers specifically so you can't even find third-party ink... I mean, damn, what am I supposed to buy then? An Epson, a Canon, an HP? And which specific model? What's the main thing I should actually be looking for here?

Maybe take a walk down to a local electronics store and ask around. You've got plenty of interesting questions there to throw at any salesperson.

It would be even more interesting to hear how they try to answer them.

urbanfalcon7 said:....I’m a total amateur when it comes to this stuff, but after some Googling and getting your help, I think I get it now. I need to look for a printer where the ink sits in its own tanks rather than just cartridges. Sure, they might cost more upfront, but some of them can be refilled... Basically, for a student and all their school projects, that seems like the way to go—ideally with each color in its own separate container.... And if it stays under about $233, I'm heading out to a few shops in Chicago tomorrow to check things out.... I probably shouldn't mention specific store names here, right? So we'll see what the local shops have to offer, and feel free to drop some recommendations....

....From what I gather, Canon and HP have issues with third-party inks and their chips, but Epson doesn't seem to run into those problems.... Or did I get that part wrong?

You've got it backwards.

Why?

Because you're operating under the assumption that companies are going to design printers specifically so you can hunt down cheap, off-brand ink for them.

And what happens when a company decides that game isn't worth their time?

They simply stop making the models that allow for easy third-party ink swaps.

Or they start designing models that make finding compatible ink nearly impossible.

It doesn't matter which manufacturer you're looking at. They all share the same bottom line.

urbanfalcon7 said:Come on, just tell me which specific Epson model you're targeting with this post so I can go find it...

The model doesn't really matter. What matters is the ink being used.

If you’re looking for a specific model we’ve been putting through the wringer here in the States—testing them with a CISS setup that’s still running like a champ even after 24 and 36 months...

1. Epson Px 710
2. Epson Cx 3200

Roger Martinez97 said:Anyone out there? 🤔

So, what's on your mind?

urbanfalcon7 said:I get where you're coming from, but the boss insists this paint has been in him for quite a while now and he’s been working just fine...
So, we're looking at a 100% defective cylinder head?

Even a brand-new LED bulb doesn't just pop the second you screw it in.

Yet some of them burn out in a week, and one single bulb costs as much as five old-school incandescents.

urbanfalcon7 said:I picked up a Canon pixma MP520, but after printing just one single page, this message popped up on the display

alternating with this one



The ink is third-party stuff—clear cartridges, fully loaded, liquid state... the print head is bleeding all colors (you can see it if you dab it with a paper towel), but it just won't work. It was working fine before, and now? Is it an issue with how they were filled, or is the print head just dead? I've been Googling, but nothing helps—just endless talk about resets and whatnot. Would switching to different third-party inks fix this? Please, help me out here; this machine is great, it’s got everything a kid could need...

Just to be clear, I've already cleaned all the contacts with alcohol...
What's the move? Should I return it, or is there actually a way to fix this?

When manufacturers over in China produce things, they basically bake a 5% defect rate right into the shipment. Honestly, it's often closer to 10%.

That scrap rate shows up everywhere in production. You get cheap plastic that cracks or an Intel that's shorted out.

If you drop an Intel like that into your printer, a short in the Intel can cause a short in the print head, and then the printer won't recognize the head at all.

To verify that, you'd have to buy a brand new print head and try putting that suspicious third-party cartridge into it. If the same error pops up, then yeah, you're definitely stuck in that 5% to 10% failure bracket.

And if you take it to a repair shop and ask them to run that test, don't be surprised if they show you the door and tell you to come back next time with original ink in the machine.

urbanfalcon7 said:Edit: A friend is offering me an old Epson Star 3G for $33. It’s been sitting idle for two and a half years, so the colors are probably dried up. Is it even worth trying to clean it, or should I just run the other way?
If I were looking for something new, what would you recommend—a 2-in-1 or just a standard inkjet? I can't go with a laser because I need it for my kid's schoolwork, which involves all sorts of color printing... As long as it isn't outrageously expensive, the refills are easy to find and affordable, and it isn't total junk. Basically, looking for the ultimate student best buy. Thanks.

Epson doesn't even make inkjets in that price range anymore, and honestly, no one with half a brain is selling a perfectly functional unit like that for $33.

Just for comparison, for $167 you could pick up a refurbished Epson MF equipped with continuous ink tanks, including enough ink to match the volume of 88 standard cartridges. And you'd actually know you're getting your money's worth since it's a verified bundle.

On the other hand, if you grab this Epson for $33, you're almost certainly looking at a service bill of at least $50. Then there's the cost of new ink—because why bother cleaning a print head only to refill it with the same sludge that clogged it in the first place? You're looking at a minimum of 4 * $6.75 == $27 or about 20 times the cost of the 88 cartridges == $587.

Or you've got the $33 + $50 for the repair, plus 150, plus $50 for that continuous ink kit, plus the actual ink for those 88 refills.

And if you aren't careful and pick a model that burns through 3.5 ml of ink per cartridge, you might find yourself needing 136 cartridges to get the same value.

Do the math yourself and see which option actually makes sense.

Austin Chase2 said:So, if I’m getting this right, this new printer comes with enough toner for maybe 300 to 400 pages? And once that runs out, what am I looking at for the cost of a replacement? I really need to see the actual numbers here.

You actually have a few different ways to go about it. Generic replacements usually run you around $100 -$50. If you want to stick with the originals, expect to pay closer to $133. Honestly, though, the best deal is probably grabbing a double pack for $50 plus tax. You get twice the prints, and all you have to do is refill the cartridge yourself when it runs low.

You can find more details on that at the link below

Austin Chase2 said:Can you give me a bit more specific help? I honestly don't know the first thing about toner. Roughly how many pages am I looking at per cartridge, and what would the cost difference look like between buying originals versus copies?

Thanks for the reply 😉

Standard industry testing usually assumes 5% coverage. For 1,000 pages, depending on the machine, you’re looking at needing roughly 35 to 40 grams of toner...

When you buy a brand-new printer, it comes with an initial starter toner. Here are two photos.
One shows a brand-new starter toner straight out of a fresh unit, and the other shows that exact same type of starter toner once it’s been completely drained.

People can talk all they want, but these pictures don't lie.

Now, if you take that same amount of money and go with a reliable refurbished unit instead, and run the same test, the difference is about 135 grams.

Basically, for the same investment, you're choosing between 500 prints versus 4,000. If someone actually sat down, did this math, and kept a stock of 30 to 50 units ready to go, they could pretty much guarantee a massive rush of customers who realize just how much better that deal is.

electricowl4 said:There were no kickbacks, no fancy perks, and definitely no commissions involved. It was just a matter of pouring over catalogs from local shops back then and picking whatever looked like the best bang for the buck. There isn't much room for shady business when you're buying entry-level gear. 🙂 The issue is that nobody can actually remember where it was bought. The local committee has been completely overhauled—and let me tell you, there isn't a single tech-savvy soul left in the current group—so the paperwork has vanished into thin air. Plus, most of the shops and repair centers in Cleveland don't stay in business longer than a cheap firework; it probably came from a store that went belly-up years ago. And the Epson website? It offers zero info on local service centers around here, just listing places in Carmel-by-the-Sea or Washington, D.C. By the time you factor in shipping and service costs for those, it’s honestly cheaper to just buy a new one and keep this old thing as a dedicated scanner.
As for the service center unboxing a brand-new toner cartridge... yeah, that sounds about right. But I assume the toner stays in the printer once they're done, so I don't really see what the big deal is. Aside from, you know, the massive headache of actually finding a repair shop first.

That said, I'm all ears for advice on which device to get next. It's entirely possible that repairing this one or buying more ink will end up costing more than it's worth.

That’s what happens when you rely on glossy brochures and paid reviews. I haven't seen a single one of those write-ups that actually addresses the kind of headaches you're dealing with now.

So, if you're looking for something long-term, proven, reliable, and budget-friendly, you have to talk to the people whose printers are still kicking after years of heavy use. Just don't expect to find a machine like that in any of those big-box retail stores mentioned earlier. You'll have much better luck finding a 100% functional unit through a refurbished deal.
Basically, if you can find documented proof that a specific model is still running strong somewhere today with a page count sitting at 250,000, that is your gold standard. You'll have access to cheap parts, plenty of toner, and easy service because those models are staples in government offices. If you look at a printer and see it's only clocked 10,000 or 20,000 pages, and fixing it costs as much as a new toner for this Epson, then there's nothing left to debate. Sure, it won't do color, but as we've seen, you don't really need color anyway. Of course, none of the retailers selling brand-new printers want you buying used, reliable workhorses like that, so you can be certain they'll steer you away from that choice. Which brings us right back to studying those flashy ads and biased reviews.

electricowl4 said:I don't think that's it. He was using color when there was still plenty left, and there’s a specific toner for every single color. Even if moisture were the issue, shaking the toner would at least shift the pattern, and it hasn't. Besides, it's not exactly a heavy-duty machine—hardly enough usage to cause buildup... anyway, thanks for the advice.
The thing is, these toners aren't cheap. We really don't want to drop the cash on a new cartridge only to find out that wasn't even the problem. That's why I'm looking for a repair shop that can actually take a look and tell us what's going on.

That’s just what happens when someone is forced to buy some niche piece of gear, or picks a specific model just because they were offered a massive discount or a sweet commission on it.

Nothing new under the sun, really. And don't go thinking some service center is going to open up brand-new, genuine cartridges for free without charging you, regardless of what the actual issue turns out to be.

Why?

Because certain color laser toners are designed like fuses. You put it in one machine, it reads the Intel chip, drains the data, and boom. Then you move that same toner to a different printer, and it reports itself as empty. Why? Because the data stayed behind in the first printer. Honestly, who knows how these specific color lasers behave, especially when you're dealing with this kind of exotic hardware? The device itself is probably 100% fine. You just won't know for sure until you've swapped out all four toners.

So, the bottom line? You're stuck buying yet another unproven, cutting-edge device and repeating the same mistake all over again. And nobody is going to help you, because that's exactly why manufacturers keep churning out these "new" models—to keep those little tricks in play.

And we all know refurbished units aren't even an option for customers like that.