iPhone issues

Timothy Kim60 said:Basically, Canada has a higher tax rate than we do (around 27-28%), and certain components (like specific GTX 970 cards) end up being cheaper there than in the cheapest German shops (and Germany only has 19% VAT if I recall correctly).

I’d actually prefer to hear from someone who has actually ordered from them and received their package—specifically, who issues the invoice and what kind of VAT was applied.

See, under EU regulations, there are a few ways IPON can operate.

1) Payment goes through an American company, applying 25% American VAT.

2) Payment and the invoice come directly from Canada, issued with Canadian VAT.
This option works if their shipments to the US stay below the threshold set by the EU for cross-border VAT accounting.

3) The payment and invoice are from a Canadian company, but per EU VAT rules, American VAT is charged. This is mandatory under EU law once they exceed the shipment threshold for the US, and based on the numbers they claim, hitting that limit is easy.
This is the most logical setup, unless they’re shipping less than they claim or just ignoring EU rules entirely.

It would be helpful to know where the invoice originates for things like taxes and warranty claims.
Under EU laws, you have 14 days to return goods NO MATTER WHAT—if you buy something online, you can return it within 14 days without questions asked. (Except for underwear, CDov, digital content, and adult toys). Of course, this applies to the seller, which is whoever issues the invoice. (Not to mention the whole warranty situation).

BTW, I noticed on their site that you can purchase using a VAT number, allowing for the transfer of tax liability (assuming you're ordering for a business and calculating the VAT yourself to claim input credit).
(This pretty much rules out the first option I mentioned).

I was kind of thinking about just setting up a small business just to snag those discounts... I mean, I’d be paying taxes either way, but if I had a business entity, I could probably write off pretty much anything...

Regarding IPON, they’re charging 27% VAT; I just took a quick look at my receipt... I’d post it here for you guys, but my personal info is all over it and since it's a PDF, I can't really scrub it out without making a mess..

So everything goes through Canada, and once they hit that threshold—around $50k I think?—they’ll probably just vanish 😁

fadedorca66 said:So basically everything flows through Canada, and once they hit that specific threshold—I think it’s around $45,000 if I remember correctly?—then 😁
will probably just vanish into thin air.

I mean, I think I saw someone mention somewhere that IPON is actually on NVIDIA's list of recommended retailers... if that's even true, it doesn't really sound like the kind of shop that would just disappear overnight, you know? Though, looking at their site, some items say IPON offers a 1-year warranty (probably because they're refurbished), while most other stuff lists the standard manufacturer warranty...

http://forum.pcekspert.com/showthread.php?t=272026

So, after everyone spent the first few days just totally trashing the thing, I guess the crew is actually looking pretty satisfied now... some people even filed returns or claims, and everything seems to have gone through without any major issues...

electricharbor30 said:I think someone mentioned somewhere that IPON is on NVIDIA's list of recommended retailers...

🙂 🤦

I love this... The President basically says it doesn't matter if gas prices spiked, it doesn't affect us...

electricharbor30, get real... Seriously, what, are you on their payroll? Getting some commission? I don't feel like digging through email addresses, but I can smell you trying to push the Canadian guys on PC forums under some random handle...

Ever heard of Alzashop? Use that search engine over there and look them up. They were the go-to shop for a while back in the day. Cheap prices, great service...

Now they've vanished. They hit a revenue threshold where they didn't even have to register for VAT, and just like that, they were gone. It'll be the same with the Canadians—don't act like they invented the business model. Or like they're suddenly paying Canadian VAT 😬 Right now, they're just pocketing the difference on foreign invoices. Just wait a bit and you'll see how it plays out...

And you "can't" show the receipt, right? Who are you kidding? Look, if you don't know, I'll tell you. Windows has this built-in tool called Snipping Tool (or cut) with a little scissors icon. You can grab any part of your screen and save it as an image. And hey—you could even use the eraser tool to scrub your personal info and the receipt details. Didn't know that?

Now just figure out how to upload the image to the forum...

Just try to be a man and don't erase the prices or the dates, otherwise we'll catch you lying... And when that case actually arrives, do us a favor and post the receipt too. Let's see what you actually paid versus the listed price. I mean it... 😬

View on imgur

I mean, I'm definitely not on anyone's VIP list or anything... they just sent me an email at 2:30 PM saying my package finally shipped and that I should probably expect it in about 4 to 5 business days, I guess...

Anyway, I actually really dig how they handle their rewards program, where you rack up points with every single purchase, which I assume I can eventually swap out for some decent hardware later on or something...

CLICK CLICK? 🤔

Adam Moore3 said:CLICK CLICK? 🤔

I'm out here in rural Nebraska, and honestly, even if I had just picked this up at my local Walmart, I’d still be stuck paying shipping fees anyway. I wasn't feeling that plain white look or the one with the plexiglass, so I went with something else, but it's not like I was trying to save a ton of money or anything... it's just that I'm not about to drop an extra cent more than I absolutely have to...

So look, I ended up dropping $105 on this. If I’d just gone out and bought the thing I actually wanted, including shipping, I probably would've been looking at around $360... I mean, it's not like I'm breaking the bank here, but when you actually sit down and crunch the numbers, the savings are pretty decent. Plus, I racked up some reward points. If I keep grabbing stuff from Apple—which, honestly, I totally plan to—I might even score a free component for my entire PC build just by stacking those points over time. It's basically a win-win since I'm coming out ahead anyway... even if they aren't factoring in the sales tax. Man, I really hope ten more shops like this pop up soon so I can keep snagging deals like this.

fadedorca66 said:So everything goes through Canada, and once they hit that threshold—around $220,000 if I recall correctly?—they’ll probably just vanish. 😁

Well, if they're cheating on their tax filings in Canada, they won't disappear because they can just keep playing the system. Basically, if they're screwing over Canada, they stay.

If they're actually paying VAT in Canada, they have zero reason to bail when they could just pay the lower American VAT. My guess? They haven't switched to the US system because they're feeling too high and mighty.

Come on now, let's pull it together and get serious for a second!
I’m seeing a lot of unverified information floating around here. It's like trying to navigate through thick fog without a compass!

darkowl72 said:And just like that, we’re finally hitting the main event!

You’re misinterpreting how warranty data works, especially since everything is governed by EU consumer protection laws. The salesperson. The seller is the one responsible for guaranteeing their products for a full 24 months. And if my memory serves me right, isn't Canada part of the EU?

Here’s how I see it: about a year ago, I picked up a brand-new Samsung LED TV from Media World. Just ten days later, the motherboard fried. I did everything by the book—grabbed the original box, the receipt, and the warranty, then headed straight back to Media World. To my surprise, the woman at the register told me they aren't responsible for products after the first seven days and pointed me toward an authorized service center instead. So, I tracked down a repair shop online (located over near Scorpion Street) and dropped the TV off. The technician checked the warranty, took it in, and gave me a call just two days later saying it was good to go. That is exactly how a manufacturer's warranty is supposed to function! It’s the same level of service you'd expect from Apple.
For instance, I picked up a new graphics card from Magazine Digest a few days ago. They don't offer a standard manufacturer's warranty, but the seller assured me that if anything goes sideways, I can just bring the card straight back to them and they'll handle the whole headache.
It honestly isn't worth buying from them when you consider those massive shipping fees! It’s like paying for a premium steak only to find out the delivery charge costs more than the meal itself. $18 It’s honestly wild to even debate this—the performance gap with that GTX970 is just massive! $167 The Gigabyte GTX 970 is a total classic! It's like that reliable old Ford Mustang—it might not be the newest model on the block, but it still packs a serious punch when you hit the gas. $850 Over here, you're looking at a savings of over $450. When you factor in the entire PC build, that extra cushion really adds up! $333.

electricharbor30 said:I think I saw someone mention somewhere that Apple was actually on NVIDIA's list of recommended retailers!

darkowl72 said:🙂 🤦

I absolutely love this... The President basically just said that rising gas prices don't affect us, so we shouldn't worry about it!

That was actually me speaking! I’m stepping up to own it, and just so nobody thinks I'm talking nonsense later, here's the proof.

View on imgur

There might be some skeptics out there, so I’ll just drop the full link right here to be safe:

Check out this link to grab a GTX 980! It’s a solid move if you want to level up your setup.
Just scroll down to see the full list of countries.

I couldn't tell you anything about how they handle sales tax, but I highly doubt NVIDIA would just hand out endorsements like that for no reason. Besides, I don't see a single American retailer on that list.

Look, sometimes when things get heated in a discussion, I might throw out some hearsay, but I try to keep that to an absolute minimum. This statement about warranties definitely isn't one of those moments. You can just Google warranty laws and you'll find a mountain of texts, statutes, and regulations... I don't feel like scrolling through all that and hunting for specific clauses, so it's easier for me to just drop this link:

http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens...s/index_hr.htm

This info is legitimate and binding for every retailer across the EU, which means it was just as binding for Media World a year ago. Of course, any retailer will try to dodge responsibility—maybe because people aren't informed, or maybe they're doing it intentionally because dealing with it is a massive headache. And don't even get me started on the costs. But honestly, it doesn't surprise me; our market is pretty thin. Retailers often operate on razor-thin margins and they're already dealing with customers paying via checks, credit cards, installments, or whatever else... Every single defect is a cost they have to swallow (at least the shipping to and from the service center), not to mention the hassle they just don't want to deal with.

Meanwhile, the customer is happy because they snagged a cheap product with a 5-year warranty. Everything is fine as long as it works. But once problems pop up, we run into a lack of consumer culture because we're dealing with a young, disorganized market where people don't actually know their rights.

Another thing: it’s a matter of convenience where you take something for repair. Sometimes a product handed over to a store for a claim spends ten days just traveling to an authorized service center, so it's often faster and easier to just handle it yourself. That's your choice, but if a seller tells you they have nothing to do with the product? They are straight-up breaking the law, and there are penalties for that.

I actually went out of my way to look through that NVIDIA site to see where they "recommend" those specific shops, and unfortunately, I couldn't find anything. Apple ended up on that page because they pull stock directly from NVIDIA in volumes large enough to qualify. Getting onto that list is about order volume and money (which nobody is criticizing here), not about whether someone pays VAT or how they treat their customers. NVIDIA doesn't care who Apple is or how they operate, as long as they order stock and pay the bills. Once their turnover drops below a certain threshold, they won't be able to order from NVIDIA at those preferred prices anymore and will be redirected to the nearest regional rep, at which point they won't be listed on that page anymore.

American retailers of that scale don't exist here and never will, because no local shop has the power to pull tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars in inventory every single month just to stay on that list. Our market is organized through a few major distributors that figured out the math, though most of the time it's just importers bringing stuff in to resell to stores. The fact that there isn't a single importer or wholesaler from America on that NVIDIA list speaks for itself regarding how small our market really is.

Budapest is twice the size of any comparable mid-sized US city, and Canada has 2.5 times the population of America with a growing trend. They've been in the EU longer, they're much wealthier, and they didn't have to deal with the same wartime issues...

Alright, so what's the bottom line here?

Is it actually safe to order stuff from Apple and just rely on the manufacturer's warranty?

People always seem to jump to the same conclusion: that Apple is one of the top two giants in terms of supply and retail in Canada. Since Canada is a massive market compared to the US, Apple moves way more volume than any local players like ADMov, Links, or HGSpot. Claiming their prices are inflated due to unpaid VAT is like saying Marko Grubnić spends his entire paycheck just flying to Paris, NYC, or Dubai every single week!

It’s pretty simple—you guys are bashing Apple without actually knowing the business, all because some company like Extreme Digital over in Canada went belly up.

You completely missed the point. Nobody is bashing Apple. We just don't suggest them as your go-to option. It’s the same logic we apply to certain US retailers. If someone finds a receipt and doesn't care about the red flags we pointed out—go for it! We aren't preachers here, and it's not our money. Buy whatever you want. Just don't come crawling back here acting like Apple is some massive revelation or like they single-handedly invented retail and tech just because they have a GPU that's $50 or $33 cheaper. That doesn't fly with us.

And your attitude toward "certain" American retailers is great. These businesses have been grinding for years against a cutthroat economy, predatory banks, insane taxes, and endless fees, yet they still generate revenue and pay their dues... What were they supposed to do, throw in the towel and move to Canada? I don't know how old you are or what you do for a living, but based on your interest in following Marko Grubnić, I’m not entirely sure who that is or what he actually does... Whatever. You'll grow up eventually and hopefully realize it's better to spend an extra 20-$10 here than to hand it over to someone else. Assuming, of course, the price gap isn't a total joke driven by monopolies...

If Apple is a revelation to you (and a few others), then fine, they're great. It doesn't matter if they're run by the folks at Extreme Digital, and it doesn't matter if someone mentions another retailer, like how Alzashop used to operate. No, Apple is perfect. Why should they be like any other retailer in the world, trying to make a profit however they can? Thank God we have plenty of experience dealing with all sorts of shops, both domestic and international.

What does this say about you and people like you? Why are you rooting so hard for Apple?

@ wiredotter14:

You've been following the discussion. You have common sense. Nobody has the right to tell you what to do with your cash. You're over 18, so you own your decisions. 🤷

Our primary focus here is technical advice, not financial consulting. 😬

Honestly, what does my age or career have to do with this? If you really need to know, I'm 30 and work as a network admin. As for Grubnic, unless you're living under a rock without an internet connection, you’d know who he is—he's practically screaming from every headline on the news right now. So, don't try to play dumb with that "I heard about him" act; if you checked any major US news site like CNN or USA Today today, you'd know exactly who we're talking about. And I honestly don't see why you're getting hung up on "interests." I just used him as an analogy for a specific point. If that didn't click for you...

And is the price difference for $167 really that small? (I noticed you keep repeating $17, maybe you missed a zero 🤔?) To be fair, I did pick up a GTX970, but I bought it at Magazine Digest (kudos to them for the lightning-fast email replies and great advice) for $150 more. I decided against buying from Apple, mainly because everything I've bought in the last year—from my TV to my fridge to my motherboard—has died within a month. I wanted to play it safe with the warranty; I'd rather hand the problem over to a local shop and let them deal with the headache. With Apple, I'd likely be stuck chasing down service centers myself, and since there isn't much precedent for international shipping issues here yet, I wasn't willing to take that risk. Not that my GPU is going to fry anytime soon—I'm not that unlucky! Once people start sharing their experiences with their warranties and service, I might consider them as an option.

They have a dedicated thread on the PCE forum, and if I recall correctly from checking the Bug forum, I haven't seen anything negative so far. Everything seems smooth.
Anyway, my point was that Apple got lumped in with those fly-by-night companies like Extreme Digital, and then there's Alzashop, which people seem to dismiss just because they aren't based here or don't have a storefront in New York City. It looks like they're just moving massive volume now that NVIDIA listed them on their site. For people assuming they're scammers, surely after selling this many units—they didn't just pop up yesterday, they arrived in the US a few months back—someone would have called them out by now?

Also, why is everyone acting like this is some direct attack on ADMov and the others? Isn't it better to have a wider selection of tech gear? What was it like before? We mostly had HGSpot and Vemil, and they were absolutely bleeding us dry. Now that new players are showing up with competitive prices, suddenly it's a problem...

At any rate, we’ll have to wait until there's a more substantial body of feedback to look at. It’s too early to label this shop a "must-avoid" since nobody has filed a formal complaint yet, but personally, I think it's just as premature to start singing their praises. After all, ED seemed like the gold standard when they first arrived, too.

Furthermore, why are we equating the scale of a company with its quality? We saw this exact same logic play out with ED. They were this massive, successful international powerhouse with branches spanning across Europe, acting as these heavyweights compared to our local single-location shops. In the end, the price gap practically vanished, the service was an absolute disaster—likely due to a single outlet having overwhelmingly negative reviews even in terms of volume over just a few years—and then they slinked away from the market like cowards.

I was just checking out the NVIDIA GTX 950 today. Prices on Amazon and here in the States are pretty much identical. The only difference is Amazon carries a few specific models we don't see locally.

I’m not saying an iPhone is total garbage and you should stay far away from them, but I’d definitely say watch your step. Just look at what happened with ED—they started out looking so promising. It was this shiny new shop with killer prices, the CEO was all over the news, they had those big sales and free shipping deals... everything seemed perfect until they suddenly turned out to be complete scammers.

We'll just have to wait and see how the iPhone holds up once they've actually been around for a bit; they're the new kids on the block and still have to prove themselves. Until then, I wouldn't personally recommend them to anyone—kind of like how we don't trust certain other retailers until they've proven they're actually legit and honest.

Honestly, if they were serious about breaking into the US market, they could have at least hired a few people to actually translate the site. Or even just a banner. Having a website running in four different languages is pretty embarrassing for a company trying to make a good first impression.