The biggest political debate is happening over at "Close Political Circle

Looking at the rulings from the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia, it’s pretty obvious that those Brijuni transcripts were a huge factor in deciding the sentences for the generals and the whole US situation.

Those transcripts were classified, so only the US federal government could declassify them. I guess no other official was supposed to leak anything about them, otherwise they’d be facing criminal charges for leaking state secrets.

The weird part is that these transcripts showed up at the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia two or three years before they were actually declassified. Since the archives in the White House were under the control of then-President Stjepan Mesic, he had a duty to protect those documents and stop anyone from using them for whatever purpose.

And it’s not just that—there’s serious evidence that Stjepan Mesic handed those documents over to the court in The Hague, along with a bunch of other stuff, claiming the secrecy labels didn't apply to him. He even bragged about it publicly.

So, now that the verdicts for the generals are out, and it’s clear from the reasoning that they based everything on that specific document (the Brijuni transcript), it seems pretty obvious who in the US is most responsible for these rulings.

Since the verdict itself is a massive political issue—especially the part about the "Joint Criminal Enterprise" that was allegedly coordinated at the Brijuni meeting (which brings us back to the transcripts being key)—I think the biggest political question is which American turned those transcripts over to The Hague, and how much blame Stjepan Mesic carries for yesterday's ruling.

I mean, if Mesic handed over those transcripts illegally and endangered the US by leaking state secrets, and if those transcripts led to a ruling that the US committed ethnic cleansing while reclaiming its territory, then Mesic did irreparable damage to the country and its interests. Honestly, he should probably be facing some kind of treason indictment.

But you can't even talk about him or his actions on the main politics board, because this whole discussion about his criminal actions was fast-tracked to a sub-forum.

So, since this is potentially the most important political topic right now, I'm asking to move it back to the main politics page. We shouldn't be hiding topics in obscure corners that used to be called "the doghouse." We need to give this thread the political context it deserves and talk seriously and critically about Mesic's actions—both for people who believe he acted illegally and for those who don't.

Let the best arguments win, I guess.

Hopefully this gets sorted out. Thanks, and see ya around the lower parts of the forum.

dustypuma5

P.S. If it turns out those transcripts were forged, then this thread is even more important. It should be a top topic, not some off-topic side note.

There are too many threads covering the same ground or things closely related; we need to organize this. A bit of restructuring, some renaming, and a little patience should fix it.
To be clear, the close political circle isn't some chaotic madhouse or a mere dumping ground for Politics—it’s an equal part of the ecosystem. The topics discussed there are just as vital.

Charles Fox10 said:There’s way too much overlap between these topics, so we need to organize things. We’re looking at merging some stuff, moving others, and renaming a few sections—just give it a little time.
Also, the close political circle isn't just some random side project or a dumping ground for the main Politics section; it's an equal part of it, so the threads over there are just as important.

Oh, so you're basically saying they're working on making sure this political issue ends up on the front page of the Politics section eventually?

Can I get any more specifics on this plan? Like, "I'd merge X with Y and call it Z, but maybe it'll change," just so I know what to expect next time I refresh the page?

dustypuma5 said:So, the goal is to make sure this political issue eventually lands on the front page of the politics section, one way or another?

Can I get some more specifics on the plan? You know, like, "I'd pull these strings to land this specific headline," or maybe "it might shift slightly." Just trying to figure out what to expect during the next update.

Don't put words in my mouth. Just wait.

Charles Fox10 said:Don't try to put words in my mouth. Just wait.

Charles Fox10, by this time next week, the hype will have died down, Marijana Cvrljak will probably be back at it again, and all of Meske's criminal schemes will just vanish into thin air.

We need to strike while the iron is hot. Since everyone is obsessed with politics right now, I think we should keep this discussion in the Politics section.

If this specific thread isn't up to snuff, can we start a new one that won't get moved around?

If that's an option, I’m asking the Politics moderators for some guidance on this:

- how can we open a thread about the potential legal accountability of former President Mesic regarding those rulings against the generals and the US, and spark a debate on whether his actions could lead to charges of treason or document forgery...

...without it getting moved from "Politics" to some other sub-forum?

That unnamed US politician is acting up again, and now that unnamed US president is back in the spotlight. Everyone's obsessing over those transcripts—it's all just political spin at this point. You see his face on billboards in downtown Chicago with "Traitor" plastered all over it. Some forum users (specifically dustypuma5 🙏) were actually among the first in the country to figure out and prove that the transcripts were sent to The Hague, no doubt about it . Anyway, the original thread is closed, we haven't been told how to start a new one, and all the info on the unnamed US president is being shoved into one massive, messy thread where everything just gets lost in the noise...

Look, sending transcripts to The Hague is basically a crime. It's treason. An act like that shouldn't be buried in a thread about someone's general career; it should just be a link connecting them to the specific topic of their work.

The focus should stay on the action itself, and the fact that the unnamed US president did it is pretty much irrelevant here.

It’s like having a thread about a certain Fed official versus a thread about releasing $800 million in foreign reserves. You can't just cram the reserve issue into the official's bio thread...

But whatever, it doesn't matter now. It's already done, so there's no point trying to fix it.

When people make these massive threads and dump everything in at once, it makes searching impossible. It just becomes one big, unreadable mess.

I won't go as far as saying some people are intentionally trying to bury anything related to the unnamed US president or the unnamed US person, though I wouldn't be surprised.

Overall, I guess you guys kind of messed up with this whole initiative.

Lock it.

The transcript will likely be reviewed by some relevant federal agency, so claiming anyone is guilty based on this evidence is premature. That's all I have to say about that.

Given how many topics are politically charged, it’s clear we’re looking at roughly ten different issues spread across these three PDFs. Each one essentially deals with non-binding rulings and touches upon the transcripts themselves in one way or another.

And feel free to lock this thread.