Album of the Week: Morton Feldman - White on White (1993)

Tracklists and durations from the 1993, 1996, and 2017 releases:

1. Untitled I/92 (9:00)
2. Untitled II/92 (12:29)
3. Untitled III/92 (14:29)
4. Untitled IV/92 (16:31)
5. Untitled I/93 (20:29)

Tracklist and durations from the 2003 release:

1. Untitled I/92 (8:59)
2. Whiteout (For Takahiro Tanaka) (27:00)
3. Untitled IV/92 (16:00)
4. Untitled I/93 (20:12)

"The music on this CD is intended to be heard at a very low volume!" (from the liner notes of the 1996 reissue, my translation)

"[Günter] is the first person to make good computer music. It’s aesthetically very similar to the work of Morton Feldman - White on White, yet it remains computer music—which, of course, sounds like a contradiction." (interview with Jim O'Rourke, 1995, my translation)

"White on White" is the debut album by the German composer and musician Bernhard Günter, often described as the "guru of digital sub-sonic minimalism bordering on silence." He began his foray into computer music back in 1987. This record features five—well, four—pieces of sorts "musique concrète" crafted via sampler. It is pure experimentalism, often categorized under the lowercase and microsound subgenres.

Your audio setup matters here; the quality of your gear isn't trivial if you want to actually experience this. Minimizing ambient noise is just as vital. You could call Günter’s work a digital variation on the "deep listening" concepts explored in purely acoustic settings by Stuart Dempster and Pauline Oliveros. Instead of Gothic cathedrals, underground cisterns, or cavernous spaces, the environment where this sound lives is entirely virtual. But more importantly, it’s the space within the mind and heart where the sound transforms into music. Is that enough? Or is it too much?

With all due respect—and I know I’m probably risking a ban or getting flagged for this PDF excerpt—this absolute garbage isn't music. It’s just pure pretension, and frankly, it's mindless nonsense. You can't even call it ambient soundscapes. To me, listening to this feels like watching someone perform an act of indecency right in front of an audience under the guise of a "protest." Sorry, but I'm being honest. Music requires rhythm, melody, and harmony. Without those, you don't have music, and since there is absolutely nothing present here, there is no composition either. Consequently, you can't even refer to the author as a composer in relation to this work. And no, playing it at extreme volumes or whispering it won't change anything. Garbage is garbage, and anyone claiming to see art or music in this is just a snob trying desperately to feel special.

No offense intended to anyone, but I felt compelled to speak up because this is a music forum, not a sanctuary for the "misunderstood geniuses" of quasi-art—people who likely can't play a single instrument or carry a tune to save their lives.

Whatever you say. That’s your take, and I have zero issue with it. My impressions of this album aren't some absolute, objective truth—that much is obvious. It’s just that experimental music has been enriching my life for quite a while now, whereas for you, I assume it feels somewhat draining. So, thanks for the passionate input!

As an afterthought, you might actually prefer the artist's more recent album.

I don't see anything wrong with someone having a super negative take on any kind of music, so feel free to just relax, brightwolf48 😁 I haven't actually sat down to listen yet, but I'm definitely going to give it a spin soon 😉

Going in totally blind here—I know zero about this album—but based on what’s been said so far, I wouldn't be surprised if John Cage was one of the influences... we'll see how close my guess is!

Arthur Brown6 said:Well, a five out of ten. That’s your take—and honestly, I don't have any issue with it. My impressions of this album aren't some absolute, objective truth, obviously. It's just that experimental music has been enriching my life for quite a while now, whereas for you, I assume, it does the exact opposite. So, thanks for the passionate response!

Just as an afterthought, you might find the newer album by the same artist more to your liking.

👍
See, THAT is music—and incredibly compelling at that. It reminds me a bit of that period when Jonas Hellborg and Shawn lane were playing with V. Selvaganesh, at least during those lyrical passages. Just to clarify, my comment about "misunderstood geniuses" wasn't aimed at Arthur Brown6; I was referring strictly to the album I wrote about—not even necessarily the artist himself, since I haven't explored his entire discography.

@Arthur Brown6/">@@Arthur Brown6, that link to the other album reminds me of this, though naturally, it isn't on the level of one of the greatest guitarists ever.

My take on this is pretty much along the same lines, though I’m trying to be a little less aggressive about it than some of the others...

Arthur Brown6 said:Enough (or not enough)?

Just right, I guess.

brightwolf48 said:this (...) isn't music, it's just pure pretension and, honestly, total nonsense to me.

brightwolf48 said:look, THAT IS music, and it's actually pretty interesting.

I'm seeing this pretty late, so here are just my first few impressions:



that fear of emptiness is interesting. the fear of open space, of silence... there's been a name for it for centuries now.

It's not just that all this stuff is valuable from a distance; some people want to experience it up close. For some, both versions feel like home. Others couldn't imagine living in them at all... but that doesn't make them any less valuable. Especially not for those they were built for.

More later, maybe.

Steven Newman50 said:I don't see any issue with someone having a super negative attitude toward any kind of music, so just relax, brightwolf48 😁

I don't know, I guess I have a bit of an issue with reactions like this. I really wouldn't want this style of communication to become the norm in these threads. On the other hand, I wonder what triggered brightwolf48 to feel the need to be so incredibly expressive. Because, let's be honest, indifference toward the music—or rather, the album content—definitely isn't the reason.

Look, this forum has seen way worse. I still remember those massive blowouts over the third season of Twin Peaks. And hey, look, if you hated it, that’s totally fine—you’re allowed to think it was garbage, that's your right! Why does everyone have to agree on everything? But the whole thing falls apart when someone just keeps droning on and on, acting like they're dropping some deep truth that everyone else is too blind to see... It’s exhausting. In those cases, you kind of have to say something, though I guess that just turns the whole thread into a mess...

But honestly, you made a really cool point by shifting the focus toward what music actually *is*. You just have to keep an open mind here. Unconventional stuff is designed to push boundaries and question the very definition of musical expression. At the end of the day, we're talking about a music album with a super deliberate concept...

It definitely isn't meant for Top 40 radio play, and even if the harsh labels people are throwing at it are a bit much, there's something interesting about what you said regarding the reaction to it. The fact that people are even talking about it means it worked, in a way. It provoked a response, and that's something... 🙂

You might have noticed I’m not usually one for starting fights—that initial outburst was really just a byproduct of pure irritation from listening. By my second post, I had already made it clear I wasn't targeting any specific forum member, nor even the composer himself; in fact, after the OP posted, I told him his second album was actually quite interesting. I gave it a listen, too—it's another unconventional record consisting mostly of first-take improvisations, and in that regard, I found much to praise about his work.

If this album was partially intended as a provocation, then it worked perfectly on me—which, I suppose, means it achieved exactly what the author intended for its target audience.

As Steven Newman50 pointed out, this was likely done under the influence of John Cage. But my issue is that with his piece 4'33", he reached the absolute peak of musical paradox—assuming you can even call that "composition" music. To my mind, John Cage shouldn't be used as a blueprint for anyone else; he went all the way to the edge, and there simply isn't anything more significant or larger to achieve in that direction that still carries any meaning.

@Lisa Davis46/">@@Lisa Davis46
That first image by Kazimir Malevich represents a similar pinnacle of subversive thought—you can't go much further than that. It's the same with those Haneke films you linked. Any subsequent works that try to ride the coat-tails of such subversive ideas and themes just irritate me; the problem is they can never be more subversive or provocative than the very icons or styles they are imitating. Ultimately, if there were no boundaries in art at all, someone would eventually just screen a snuff film and declare it high art.
I won't say the same for modern architecture, though—I actually love it. I'm a huge fan of bright, open spaces, and the Bauhaus movement as a whole is nothing short of genius (and no, I don't mean the department store).

I bet Kazimir Malevich’s White on White caused quite a stir back in its day, too. I mean, what’s even the point of an artist "trying to provoke a reaction" if they can't actually handle the fallout once it happens?

Then again, I have no clue if that was even what Günter was going for here.

I wouldn't exactly put Neige Salie in the same bucket as White on White, though. There were plenty of those "anti-music" sonic experiments happening way before 1993.

Just because something doesn't click with a mainstream audience doesn't automatically make it a masterpiece. It reminds me of something an artist said—I can't recall who exactly—about how just because a work is commercial doesn't mean it lacks quality, just like being non-commercial doesn't suddenly make it good.

I'm not saying Günter's work isn't high quality. I'm just saying that the fact that something isn't making money isn't a valid argument for why it's great.

"Irritation"—that’s the right word. Honestly, it just comes down to personal musical taste and your own history as a listener. For instance, some other forum called this and several other drone albums nothing more than a "collection of test signals." A test for what, exactly? And for whom?

For me, listening to this album is a form of meditation. Especially now that I have my own little dedicated space where I can focus intensely on music without much outside noise—and even more so since I picked up a high-end subwoofer. I realize those are trivial details. Still, this music is almost entirely stripped of external associations. It actually surprises me that the album even has a title, especially one so poetic ("dirty snow").

If anyone is interested, I can translate a fantastic interview with Olivier Lamm that was published on the South by Southwest website.

Gerald Jackson48 said:(...) considering there were plenty of similar sonic experiments ("anti-music") long before 1993.

Sure, and for a very long time at that. I highly recommend this great compilation from 1986:

Controversial reactions are a given here. 😁
This is one of the first—if not *the* absolute first—albums in its genre, which alone makes it worth a look. I dug into onkyokei and similar musical dead ends a while back (pretty surface-level stuff, honestly), and Ryoji Ikeda was the one that actually stuck with me. I’m gonna spin this again soon, but after all this time, I need to set the right vibe first. 😁

Arthur Brown6 said:Personally, listening to this album feels like a form of meditation to me. Especially since I finally have my own little setup—a quiet space where I can really focus on the music without much outside noise—and even more so since I picked up a high-end subwoofer. I realize that's all trivial detail, but still. This music is almost entirely stripped of any external associations. It actually strikes me as odd that the album even has a title, and a somewhat poetic one at that ("dirty snow").

In that light, I can completely understand why you feel the way you do about this record; we’re all wired differently. Certain sounds or visual textures might feel soothing, relaxing, or even spark creativity for one person, while triggering an entirely different reaction in someone else. For me, unlike you, it was likely more of a negative stimulus. Honestly, the world would be a pretty dull and hollow place if we all reacted to the same things in the exact same way.🙂

I hadn't heard of Günther before, so this was my first time listening, but honestly, it reminded me more of those sonic spaces Ryoji Ikeda or Alva Noto explore than anything related to John Cage.

"Meditation" is probably the right word for it. I don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but I've read in a few places that the title actually came from the author's haiku poetry, just like this:

The title of the album comes from one of his haiku: "elle fonderait dans ma main / un peu de neige salie" (roughly "it would melt in my hand / a bit of soiled snow").
(...)
He became interested in Japanese aesthetics and haiku and this interest is reflected in The Economy of his compositional materials and The Use of silence in his work.

And now I see that this exists too...

Gerald Jackson48 said:I guess Malevich's white on white painting probably caused quite a stir back in its day, too. But what's really the point of "wanting to provoke an audience response with a work of art" if the artist then refuses to deal with—or just doesn't know how to handle—those reactions?
(...)
I wouldn't really compare Neige Salie to white on white, though, since there were plenty of experiments with sound ("anti-music") way before 1993.

I wasn't trying to make a comparison; I was just trying to steer the conversation toward minimalism and experimental stuff instead of what we started with. 🙂 That painting definitely has its history and was pretty controversial as soon as it hit the galleries, especially with critics, so nothing surprising there... though it's nowhere near the impact of the 'black square,' which actually triggered intense emotions and very positive personal responses from people, which was the whole goal:

"According to minimalists, a work of art represents nothing. It’s only what you see. The other thing doesn’t exist. They have an objective quietness."

I was more drawn to the idea of infinite space, the repetition, and how soothing the image is. Even that dirty white, with its soft, subtle tones.

brightwolf48 said:Music without rhythm, melody, or harmony isn't music, and there is absolutely nothing here; therefore, there's no composition either. And no, turning it up or down doesn't help. Garbage is garbage, and anyone claiming they see music and art in this is just a snob trying to feel special.

I actually loved how intense your negative reaction was. 🙂 It didn't surprise me, but the choice of words did.

brightwolf48 said:I don't think John Cage should be anyone's role model. I mean, he already pushed things to the absolute limit. He went all the way, and honestly, there isn't much left to do in that direction that would actually make sense or feel significant.
(...)
That first Malevich painting is the absolute peak of subversion and pure concept. You honestly can't top it. It’s the same deal with those Haneke films you linked. Any other later works that try to lean on those same subversive themes and ideas just... I don't know, they just irritate me. The thing is, I can't really be more subversive or provocative than my own idols. Or maybe that's just how it works. I guess I'm just stating my piece here. What’s the basis for that? I mean, what are you actually basing this on?

I'm glad you decided to head in this direction, but I can't say I agree with that last point. I mean, there’s always room to grow... and maybe even to get better! 🙂
Look, I know this isn't really the topic at hand, but it’s easier for me to explain using houses and architecture. With buildings, purpose is the priority—you actually have to be able to live in the space. Long before the Bauhaus movement ever existed, a much more radical minimalism had already been achieved halfway across the world in the East. That style is still evolving there in ways most people here just don't get. As for this other, experimental direction—the examples I mentioned aren't even recent anymore—that kind of growth is driven by technology. But what I find interesting is that for them, technology doesn't dictate or limit the outcome. The final product isn't some forced "style" or a way to show off. It's something way more complex, and in the end, it just results in pure simplicity.

That’s just incredibly hard to pull off... I guess. Maybe.

Just another half-baked example. It’s got Kanye West vibes when it comes to style and—I guess—beauty. Or at least that's what someone wrote somewhere, claiming they discovered two magic words. Wabi-sabi.So, he claims they became part of his entire life philosophy and completely overhauled how he lives, right? And that’s how we ended up with this "stunning" house. Its value is mostly aesthetic, I guess, so there’s really no point in even bringing up that multi-million dollar price tag. Honestly, the house is the complete opposite of what those two words actually mean. Even if the designer managed to hit their goals of beauty and harmony, it’s still way too far from being pure, humble, or possessing that kind of intrinsic, elegant simplicity.

Don't come for me just yet... here's another one. This is it.. 😁

I guess Japan just gets it. They have this natural grasp of deeper moral and aesthetic principles that others struggle with. But then you look at the Belgian approach, and it's a completely different story. I don't know what to tell you. It’s just how things are. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think it's pretty obvious. I guess we should just deal with it. I guess Kanye and his crew just skim the surface, picking up only the shallowest layers. They end up totally misreading the whole thing, turning it into nothing more than some trendy fashion statement or a way to signal prestige and luxury. It’s like a design house trying too hard to sell an image—prioritizing the packaging over the actual substance. They're basically just pretending to be something they aren't.

And that’s just not how it works with this kind of music. I guess.

@Lisa Davis46/">@@Lisa Davis46
Give me a break—you’re talking about subversion and pushing boundaries in music, art, and film, yet you’ve landed right in the middle of a total misunderstanding of Japanese philosophy. This isn't just some niche concept; it's woven into their daily existence—from their music and theater to their painting, poetry, interior design, and architecture. And now, we have Kanye West and Kim Kardashian trying to navigate it? Of course it's difficult to grasp or integrate such an art form when it's rooted in the life philosophy of a culture that remained largely isolated from the rest of the world for so long through its own traditions and beliefs, even while being uniquely advanced in its own way.

A little off-topic here:
While I still maintain that the album in question lacks actual musical merit—acting more like a sonic installation, as lemonzoo so aptly pointed out—it absolutely holds value because it forces people to question their own perspectives. From that standpoint, it serves a purpose.

I actually suspect Günther was aiming more to spark a debate than to provide something meant for listening in the dark; he’s essentially trolling Mozart the way Hegel trolls Kant with his antitheses...

Just isn't for me...

brightwolf48 said:With all due respect—and I realize I’m likely risking a ban or a partial suspension for even bringing this up—this entire PDF is complete garbage. It isn’t music.Honestly, it feels like pure posturing to me—just plain, utter nonsense. We can't even have a serious conversation about ambient soundscapes without hitting a wall. It’s as if being tied to "art" has become this performative act, like someone purposefully acting out something crude right in front of an audience just to call it a protest. I’m sorry, but I have to be blunt. Music without rhythm, melody, or harmony isn't music at all. In this particular case, there is absolutely nothing to be found here—no structure, no substance, and certainly no composition. To call the author a composer based on this work would be a complete stretch. And let’s get one thing straight: no amount of cranking up the volume or listening intently in a quiet room is going to change the reality of the sound. Garbage is garbage, regardless of how you approach it. Honestly, anyone claiming to see artistry or profound musicality in this is just a pretentious snob trying desperately to feel sophisticated.

No offense intended toward anyone here, but I felt compelled to weigh in. This subforum is dedicated to music, not to some pseudo-intellectual sanctuary for "misunderstood geniuses" who likely couldn't play a single instrument if their lives depended on it, let alone carry a tune to save their souls.

That was exceptionally well written.👍
My only regret is that you went back and edited your post just to avoid looking incompetent in front of the experts.☕

I’m not entirely sure what you’re getting at with that, but if you're looking for my input on anything specific, just say the word. I tend to prefer a bit more substance before I dive into a discussion. kaže:
I have to admit, I find these kinds of reactions a bit difficult to stomach. Personally, I’d prefer if this style of communication didn't become the new norm around here; it tends to derail the actual discussion. On the other hand, I can't help but wonder what exactly triggered that need for such an elaborate outburst from brightwolf48. It certainly wasn't a simple case of being indifferent toward the music—or rather, the content of the album.

Perhaps what truly grates on his nerves are those pretentious snobs who insist on finding profound artistic merit in every piece of absolute garbage they encounter.🤔
Or, in this particular instance, are they simply hearing music where none actually exists?🍿

@bluecyclist64/">@@bluecyclist64
I haven't changed my stance. I still find music to be essentially worthless—though, if you view it as a sonic installation, it becomes open to debate and could potentially serve as an interesting provocation or a foundation for discussion.

bluecyclist64 said:Maybe he’s just fed up with those snobs who try to turn every pile of trash into high art?
Or, in this specific instance, hearing music where there isn't any at all? 🍿

Yeah, I guess that’s one way to look at it. Great. But here’s the interesting part: honestly, almost nothing in music really gets under my skin or annoys me, especially when it’s just total nothingness. You just stay indifferent, right?

But if you feel this desperate need to react, then clearly something is getting to you. Way more than you probably want to admit, I guess... 😉