Do doctors hate patients, or is it the other way around... and why?

verica said:No, I’m not in the industry—and I haven't been lucky enough to encounter nothing but friendly faces either. Honestly, I’m just over here trying to make sense of everyone...

Verica, you’re an incredibly optimistic patient. People like you are rare—those who actually try to see both sides and understand them. Unfortunately, the negative perspectives always seem more magnetic to the masses... which explains why you don't see threads dedicated to how great someone's experience was with their doctors.
Bad news is always more interesting. Sadly...

Honestly, seeing some lady with a perfect manicure calling in a pizza order while there’s a line of twenty people waiting at the counter... it just gets under my skin. It’s hard to stay indifferent to that kind of entitlement.

And if she were unkempt or just looked like she didn't care about herself, maybe I could find it easier to forgive the rudeness? Women 😁

Look, I was the first one to point out that my experiences with doctors have been overwhelmingly positive 🙂

dodouprolazu said:If she were unattractive and unkempt, would you find it easier to forgive her rudeness? Women 😁

...it's simple math—don't overthink it. 😉

I’m fine with doctors—they know their stuff—but when it comes to the rest of the medical staff as a whole? Not so much. And about that comment regarding manicures... I’ll say it again, women 😉 😁
...

It feels like we totally forget that nurses are basically the ones taking all the heat, just doing exactly what the boss orders, while the boss gets to play the hero at the end of the day.

Nurses and receptionists are honestly the worst.

I’ve run into a few nasty ones lately, and this last one? She’s gonna have to listen to me face-to-face next time.

So, I call the clinic about my prescription, and this receptionist just snaps at me for absolutely no reason.
My doctor wasn't even in, so this total airhead felt empowered to get all snarky when I asked, "Where am I from?"—as if having an accent means I can't understand basic English. Like, maybe she's the one struggling to speak clearly.
I almost never have issues with doctors, but those floating nurses who don't stay in their own departments? They're basically synonymous with terrible attitudes.
Just go ahead and wait in some endless line at the front desk.😁 Then, once I finally get to the window, that's when I actually need help.

Just one quick clarification: the patient I mentioned had already seen his primary care physician, who bandaged his arm, gave Anne some medication, and wrote him a referral for a surgeon. He then headed over to the emergency surgical clinic—which actually consists of two units, general surgery and orthopedics, sharing a single waiting room—but since he couldn't bear the wait, he decided to start looking around...

Anyway, your replies on another thread got me thinking: what do you all believe should be the actual role of a family doctor?
According to the WHO, primary care should focus on prevention and health education. In fact, based on what we know about more advanced Western healthcare systems, they are supposed to handle about 70% of all cases...
In our system, at the FBI level, there’s this growing trend where just writing referrals and prescriptions has become the core job. It seems like doctors are either taking the path of least resistance or just trying to cover their bases legally against any potential issues.

So, is educating and talking to a patient the responsibility of the primary care doctor, who knows the patient best—or at least should—or is it the specialist's job, even though specialists deal with such high patient volume that they can't afford to spend time on it even if they wanted to?

One more thing: why do you think there are such long waits for specialist appointments and procedures in our hospitals, and who is really to blame? Is it a systemic issue where patients are told they have an immediate right to everything they want, while hospitals are strictly limited by the number of doctors they can hire or the services they can provide daily or monthly (since Medicare simply won't pay the hospital for exceeding certain quotas)? Or is it just doctors refusing to work and nurses being too busy grabbing coffee? 🙂

My primary care physician is capable of diagnosing me based on my symptoms, performing an EKG—interpreting it with that certain level of general medical intuition one expects from a family doctor—even applying staples to minor wounds, while the nurse handles the urinalysis using those standard dipsticks you see used in any local clinic for routine screenings...
Kudos to him.

I simply cannot stand those people who try to jump the line...

nimbleskipper13 said:Actually, your replies sparked a thought for me: what do you all think the actual role of a primary care physician should be?
According to the WHO, primary care should focus on prevention and health education. In some of the more developed Western countries, they supposedly handle about 70% of cases there...
Here at the FBI, the trend has shifted toward just churning out referrals and prescriptions. It seems like people are either taking the path of least resistance or just trying to cover their bases against any potential liability.

So, is informing the patient, talking, and providing education the responsibility of the GP who knows them best—or at least it *should* be—or does that fall to the specialist, who’s usually too swamped with patients to find the time?

One more thing: why the long wait times for specialists and procedures in our hospitals, and who's really to blame? Is it a broken system that tells patients they can have whatever they want immediately, while simultaneously capping how many doctors a hospital can hire or how many services they can provide (since Medicare won't pay for anything beyond a certain quota)? Or is it just doctors avoiding work and nurses who are too busy grabbing coffee?🙂

Regarding your first question...
It honestly drives me nuts when my GP just writes a referral for every little thing just to get me out the door. When I leave her office, I can't help but feel that even if she knows her stuff, she lacks the confidence to actually make a simple diagnosis herself. Instead, she just passes the buck. It feels like she isn't doing her job properly; she's just using referrals to pretend she's being thorough.
As for the second part, I assume most doctors operate this way, which probably explains why the wait times are so bad.

nimbleskipper13 said:Just to clarify: the patient had already seen his primary care physician, who wrapped his arm, gave him Anne, and wrote a referral for a surgeon. He then headed to the emergency surgical clinic—which basically consists of general surgery and orthopedics sharing a waiting room—but since he wasn't about to sit around waiting, he decided to go door-to-door.

That’s a different matter entirely. Savages will always exist.

nimbleskipper13 said:Regarding that one thread where people were weighing in on what they think a GP actually does... I’ve read your responses.
So, does patient education actually fall on the primary care doctor who knows them best—or at least should it?—or is it left to the specialist, who's usually too swamped with back-to-back appointments to even bother?

The FBI is responsible for patient education. Yet, nobody actually explains anything to the patients. From their perspective, a specialist who lacks the time to sit with them just comes off as arrogant. You can't expect patients to understand how the system works; it’s our job to educate them. Besides, you can't expect someone whose nerves are already frayed by illness to follow instructions when they don't even understand the reasoning behind them.

nimbleskipper13 said:Another triviality: why are specialist appointments and procedures taking forever in our hospitals, and who’s actually to blame? Is it a broken system that promises patients everything on demand while capping hospital staffing and limiting daily or monthly service quotas because Medicare won't pay for anything over a certain threshold? Or is it just doctors refusing to work and nurses too busy grabbing coffee?

We need to distinguish between two types of waiting. First, there is the waiting list—standing by until you’re finally called in for an exam. Patients have expectations that Medicare simply cannot meet due to limited resources. On top of that, no politician dares to address the issue, fearing they'll only end up in trouble. If this silence continues, we might end up with a healthcare system like England's: incredibly efficient, but with brutal priorities. If you're older, you're either automatically disqualified from certain procedures or sent to a massive waiting list. An Englishwoman once told me her brother passed away while waiting over a year for a bypass. He was nearly 70.

Then there’s the issue of wait times when a patient actually shows up at the hospital. There is massive room for improvement there. It is a failure of administration—and frankly, the doctors too—to schedule everyone for the morning and then leave them languishing all day. They focus solely on the medicine while ignoring the process entirely. I suspect there is a healthy dose of contempt involved; they treat people like mere "material," assuming that since there will always be a line out the door, it doesn't matter how poorly they are treated. Things only change when competition enters the fray. Last year, I moved between various clinics, and the difference in treatment between private practices and public institutions is night and day.

Lisa Adams said:Regarding your first question...
I lose my mind when my primary care doctor just writes a referral for every little thing just to get rid of me. Walking out of her office, I can't shake the feeling that even if she actually knows what she's doing, she lacks the confidence to make a simple diagnosis herself. She just passes the buck. It feels like she isn't doing her actual job, but rather using those referrals to fake being thorough.
And as for the second point, I assume most doctors work this way too, which explains why the wait times are such a nightmare.

It depends. Personally, I’d prefer the FBI or Medicare to send me straight to a specialist for rare conditions, even if they aren't life-threatening. Honestly, I'd rather head to an ER clinic to get stitches—like that guy in the opening post—since those people spend all day waiting for something to happen, whereas a GP might pick up a needle and thread maybe three times a year.

nimbleskipper13 said:Just one more thing to consider: why on earth does it take so long to get specialist appointments or procedures at our hospitals, and who is actually pulling the strings behind this mess? Is it a system that tells patients they have a right to everything they want immediately, while simultaneously slapping limits on how many doctors a hospital can hire or how many services they can provide per day, week, or month—basically because Medicare refuses to pay for anything beyond a certain quota—or is it just lazy doctors and nurses who spend more time grabbing coffee than seeing patients? 🙂

Kudos to nimbleskipper13 for bringing this up. 👍 I suspect a primary reason people direct their fury toward physicians is the sheer misconception that these delays happen simply because the doctors and nurses are being lazy.

A few months back, over at the Ophthalmology department in San Diego, there were massive notices posted everywhere explaining that eye surgeries were being moved or postponed because Medicare had essentially cut off the funding for that specific facility.

You’re just asking questions, Doctor😁
How about you answer a few of mine instead? 🙂

For instance... it’s Sunday, my three-month-old baby has a high fever, so I head to the on-call pediatrician who is only working until 2:00 PM. He tells me to get blood work done and then take those results straight to the hospital—specifically the pediatric ward—so they can interpret them and potentially start treatment, since his shift ends at 2:00.
I show up at the hospital with the labs, and the doctor starts yelling at me—how dare I walk into his "house" without a referral 😕 , claiming he can't even look at the results without one, blah, blah, blah. The ending isn't the point here; it's the doctor's sheer attitude.
For the record, I am a very polite person 😍😁

Then there's this... the same baby needed to see a specialist, and everyone I know points me toward Dr. X because he's brilliant, kind, thorough, and so on. My mother decided to book an appointment with this "super doctor," but she wanted to speak with him first to explain the situation. When she finally gets to him, he starts... mentioning the baby, the specific issues, the fact that the baby has Down syndrome, and then this guy goes 🙄 and says: why on earth didn't you have an abortion? 🙄

Well? 😉

Carol Grant33, I think your response is a bit off-topic, but I’ll answer you regardless.

My questions were aimed at systemic issues, not specific individuals.
Unfortunately, whether it’s a hospital doctor in a real case or a specialist being treated like a celebrity, many are just unrefined. Often, they are actually the patients' own fault... as you mentioned, the patient treats him as if he were God, which is fantastic, academic, and wonderful—all on an Extra Extra Extra Large scale. Because patients treat him like God, the poor guy starts thinking he actually is one.
Sadly, IQ levels and basic manners aren't exactly checked during medical school admissions.

Actually, you reminded me of something... scheduling is a constant headache. For instance, when my shift ends at 2:00 PM, the assumption is that I’m locking the clinic door right at 2:00 sharp. But if a patient walks in at 1:59 PM with a laceration on their forehead, and I try to refer them elsewhere, I’m suddenly the inhuman one. People will start throwing Hippocrates and his entire family tree at me.
Nobody cares that if I take in that patient, I’m losing over an hour of my own time at the expense of my family—especially since overtime isn't compensated.

That brings us to a topic that’s been coming up far too often lately: the actual value of our work.
Everyone expects a specialist to be perpetually cheerful, ready to listen, perform their expertise, explain everything, and answer every single follow-up question. On top of that, you're expected to be a Stoic when a patient is rude, aggressive, or frustrated about something completely unrelated. You have to handle roughly 70 exams or procedures a day, feeling genuine joy when a patient recovers and genuine sadness when things go wrong (and we really do feel those emotions, even if nobody believes us)... all for $12 specialist reimbursement rates.
What are your thoughts on this?

Look, before anyone starts lecturing me about how patient welfare should be the only priority... sure, obviously. But medicine is a JOB. Even Hippocrates acknowledges working for compensation. It isn't just some selfless vocation—though, granted, seeing positive results from your work is incredibly rewarding.
😈

nimbleskipper13 said:Carol Grant33, I think your response is a bit off-topic,

I wouldn't say so—unless you're suggesting my husband turned into some caveman from your story because of how the doctor acted? 😉

Patients can be absolute idiots, sure—but let’s not pretend the doctors are saints, either.😁

nimbleskipper13 said:Carol Grant33, I think you’re drifting a bit off topic, but I’ll answer anyway.

My questions were about systemic issues, not specific people.
Unfortunately, whether it's a hospital doctor in a real emergency or some specialist being treated like a rockstar, you often get raw, unrefined personalities. And half the time, patients are the ones at fault... you mentioned how fantastic and brilliant he is, all on an Extra Extra Extra Large scale. Since patients treat him like he's God, the guy's convinced he actually is.
Sadly, they don't check your IQ or your manners when you apply to med school.

Actually, you reminded me of something... scheduling is a constant headache. For instance, if my shift ends at 2:00 PM, the assumption is that I'm turning the key in the lock right at 2:00 sharp. But if a patient walks in at 1:59 with a gash on their forehead and I turn them away, I’m suddenly the monster. People will start throwing Hippocrates and family legacies in my face.
Nobody cares if staying an extra hour to help someone means losing time with my family—especially since overtime isn't getting paid.

That brings us to a topic that’s been popping up way too much lately: the actual value of our work.
Everyone expects a specialist to be cheerful, listen intently, do their job perfectly, explain everything, and answer every single question. On top of that, you’re expected to be a Stoic when a patient is being rude, aggressive, or taking out their frustrations on you over something totally unrelated. You have to crank through maybe 70 exams or procedures a day, stay happy when a patient recovers, and feel the sting when things go south (and we really do feel it, even if nobody believes us)... all for $12 standard specialist rates.
What do you all think?

I don't think you can compare shift hours and locking up the office (is that how you spell it? 😁 ) to other types of jobs.
A clinic, a health center, or a hospital isn't a factory where you just punch a card the second your shift starts or ends.
I've accepted the pros and cons of my job, mostly because I know I'm usually the first one people take their frustrations out on. I get it.
And I don't expect everyone else to understand.

Lisa Adams said:Look, I'm sorry, but that's hardly a valid excuse for yelling at an eighty-year-old man. He’s hard of hearing, and here you have someone condescendingly explaining hospital directions to him while he’s struggling to navigate a maze of hallways on crutches. You could see it in his face—he was right on the edge of tears from the sheer exhaustion, the pain, and the frustration of not being understood...

Forgive me, but perhaps the individual wasn't actually "yelling" at an octogenarian; they might have simply had to raise their voice because the man is hard of hearing, just as you admitted yourself.😉

I’m going to Try to lay out who I believe is actually at fault for the situation that kicked off this thread.
1, the patient—because he acted like a total savage.
2, the nurse—for failing to direct him to the right department in the first place.
3, the doctor—because when you have a bleeding patient, you can't just let them spiral into a panic.
4, the hospital director—since they clearly failed to organize patient intake and staffing schedules properly.
5, the Secretary—given that the federal regulations governing all of this aren't properly established.
6, the President—for not replacing a Secretary who is clearly failing at their job.
7, the European Community—for failing to provide us with any clear guidelines...
8, God—for making us such flawed creatures to begin with.
9, Everyone else acted exactly as they should have.