What's going on with the Politics subforum?

It’s honestly wild how many people out there have no clue that things like uBlock or AdBlock even exist. I mean, seriously, look at sites like Reddit or some big news outlet—they can be an absolute nightmare of a spamfest, just absolutely drowning you in ads from top to bottom. It’s everywhere! You’ve got banners at the very top, pop-ups hitting you from the side, and then those random, annoying advertisements for various PDFs or whatever... it’s just constant. Thank god we actually have tools to deal with it, because otherwise, browsing the web would be a total headache.

It’s honestly impossible to shut them down. Every time you think you've finally cleared them out, like ten more pop up out of nowhere. And man, those redirects to sketchy-looking sites? They are absolutely relentless, especially on mobile if you aren't running AdAway or Chrome + uBlock. It's a total nightmare.

The traffic just totally bottomed out on all those PDF reports. Honestly, people have completely lost their nerve when it comes to fighting against those damn wind gusts...

I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve logged onto the political landscape only to find absolutely nothing worth reading.
It might be because of my mood on any given day—which, let's face it, happens—but I think the issue runs a bit deeper than that.
Sure, I only care about certain topics when it comes to politics, but when those specific interests come up, I usually have plenty to say. The constant bickering at the national level just doesn't grab me—at least, not the way it plays out here.

I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again: the political landscape on this forum is a total disaster. If you want me to list the trolls, I could go on forever—they’ve basically ruined the whole section. The way people communicate here is just completely irrational. Honestly, you wouldn't even hang out with this crowd at some dive bar in rural Nebraska. Who else would actually want to join in? Just like nobody wants to rub elbows with the local drunkards, nobody wants to deal with these guys either. It ends up being a closed loop where they just talk to themselves, repeating the same nonsense over and over...

It is what it is. Apparently, there's no plan to clean up this mess.
Whatever, though—not my circus, not my monkeys.

ZorroD made an interesting point, and honestly, we’ve all touched on this one way or another.

The issue is that massive, overblown topics get blown out of proportion until everything becomes a blurry mess. It's impossible to follow, and frankly, it's just a playground for trolls.

I’ve called for us to ditch this whole concept several times on this forum, but apparently, nobody cares.

Let me give you my take. I’ve been on this forum for nearly ten years, and I’d bet 80% of my posts are in the politics as such subforum. As for the political scene section? I can barely count on one hand how many times I've even clicked on it, though I probably left a few posts there too (likely just moved over from somewhere else).

Look, I'm being dead serious here: for months now, I’ve come to the politics subforum and—I don't know—just have nothing to say. It’s not because there isn't news happening in the country (or in politics), it's because the politics subforum has basically dwindled down to, like, seven or eight stagnant threads. The first page is full of topics older than a month, which, in my ten years here, has never happened before.

I'm asking because I genuinely don't know—and I'm not even trying to pick a fight with the mods here, just expressing my own confusion—is it even worth opening threads about current events like ZorroD suggested? Or not?

Or can I, only to have my posts drowned out by those massive, troll-baiting mega-threads?

Let's actually talk about this. Wouldn't we all prefer if the politics subforum went back to its former glory?

Bring back Crazy House! 🙂 🙂

Emily Myers32 said:I’ve lost count of how many times I've scrolled through this political scene and found absolutely nothing worth reading.
Maybe it's just my mood on certain days—which happens—but I think there's a deeper issue here.
Look, I only care about specific topics when it comes to politics, but when those topics come up, I usually have plenty to say. The constant bickering at the national level doesn't interest me at all, especially not the way it goes down on this forum.

I've said it before: this whole political scene is a disaster. If you want, I could list the trolls right now, but they've basically ruined the entire sub. The way people talk and communicate here is just nonsensical. You wouldn't even find yourself hanging out with the local drunkards at a dive bar in rural Alabama, so why would anyone want to associate with these people? It’s the same thing. Nobody wants to deal with them. And since they're the only ones left posting, it’s just an endless loop of the same garbage, over and over.

It is what it is. Apparently, nobody's going to clean up this mess.
Whatever. Not my circus, not my monkeys.

True enough. The bullies have chased off the decent people.

To everyone complaining about the Politics subforum—honestly, I feel for you, but if that’s truly the biggest thing weighing on your life...

You can't change the system, and you certainly can't fix anything when, as you put it, the place is just full of trolls and loudmouths...

Just change your own habits instead. Every fool has their own little way of enjoying themselves—just let them have it while you move on...

@Gray, I’m calling you out, along with the rest of the mod team, to step up and deal with this.

The issue is real—I'm clearly not the only one seeing it.

Can you please weigh in on my post?

Emily Myers32 said:I've shared my thoughts on the political scene subforum several times now. Honestly, it’s a disaster. If you want me to list the trolls, I could go on forever, but they have essentially ruined the entire section. The way people express themselves and communicate there is just irrational. You wouldn't even find this kind of behavior in some dive bar in rural Nebraska. Who else would even want to participate besides them? Just like nobody wants to associate with those local drunks, nobody wants to deal with these guys either. It seems like they're the only ones left posting, just talking to each other in an endless loop of the same nonsense.

It is what it is. It seems like there’s no intention of cleaning out that backwater crowd...
It doesn't really affect me, though; it's not my business.

I couldn't agree more. I can speak from personal experience here—that’s exactly why I stopped posting there, despite having every intention of contributing...

I know the moderation team has decided to tolerate insults directed at public figures (it seems even being incredibly disrespectful has become acceptable), but it’s a dead end. If someone jumps into a thread and starts attacking a politician out of pure frustration, a few "hyenas"—as I called them recently—will quickly join in to mock or "like" the vitriol. What kind of actual contribution does that make to the discussion?

On one hand, they scrutinize every single comma on ideological threads (like the ones about immigration and such), yet on the other, they allow this level of hostility and disrespect. 🙄

And yes, consider this a critique of the moderation, and I realize I might be risking a warning from the admins for saying this, but this is the fundamental issue, no matter how much anyone tries to look the other way...
Social media platforms existed before, and so did ads and server crashes, but the decline in engagement and interest in the political subforum started quite recently...

But anyway, I'll quote our fellow forum member Blank Page once more:

It is what it is. It seems like there’s no intention of cleaning out that backwater crowd...
It doesn't really affect me, though; it's not my business.

P.S. I know you all love hearing this, but if this post is going to earn me a strike anyway, here is one final observation: every single active moderator on the Politics subforum leans toward the left. That is also one of the reasons why interest in this section is fading...

It’s total nonsense to claim young people aren't hanging out on forums because of social media. Look, I’m 25 years old, and I honestly only check Facebook about three times a week. You guys need to chill out with the strictness. If you actually tolerated a certain level of controversial posts instead of censoring everything, people would actually want to write more.

Personally, you kill my motivation to post half the time because you jump in to nitpick every single little thing. Just loosen up a bit. You don't need to intervene, hand out warnings, or delete stuff every time someone says something slightly edgy.

P.S. Go ahead and slap me with another warning for calling out the mods if you want, but stop kidding yourselves thinking the lack of activity is because "youth" has moved on. That's just lazy generalization. Not every young person is some mindless zombie blindly clicking likes on a Facebook feed.

Politicians in this world don't deserve our respect, and honestly, nobody listens to them anymore. We all know they've sold their souls to serve special interests. It feels like everyone is corrupt, just clawing for their own positions.
They contribute absolutely nothing to the public. Because of that, I don't really see why I should bother respecting the average person who just found a way to chase their own ambitions through this online space.
Demanding respect when you haven't earned it is just foolish. To me, politicians are basically parasites we keep feeding while they tear apart our lives and society.

I really want to emphasize one thing here—having a different opinion isn't the issue at all.
In my experience, the best discussions I’ve had were with people on the Forum where we couldn't even agree on the color of the sky—literally. But those were actually healthy debates, without anyone jumping down each other's throats, trolling, or leaving three-word replies. Just solid, well-reasoned, and substantive thoughts...

The whole point—at least for me—is to debate someone who doesn't see things your way. I keep posting in that thread about immigration specifically because, despite all the pushback, there is still actual, decent conversation happening there. It’s great, though I’m getting a little bored since everyone eventually starts thinking exactly like me—I'm running out of things to say...😬

I’m only mentioning this so it doesn't seem like I'm looking for a hive mind.
It's quite the opposite—I'm certainly not just some eccentric individual hallucinating things that aren't there...

Honestly, most of the topics here just don't grab me. After spending three days on this sub-forum, I feel like I already know everyone's predictable stances; I can practically guess what people are going to type before they even hit "submit." What’s even more frustrating is how the exact same arguments just get recycled from one thread to the next.
It’s much better to head over to other forums to see how people are tackling certain social or political issues. You usually find much better moderation there, and the discussions actually tend to be productive.

Between the technical glitches on this site and the overall user experience, I haven't felt any real incentive to write long-form posts for years now—that's a big part of why I'm so quiet around here.

All things considered, the state of this forum is a perfect microcosm of the American political scene at large. It's just party zealots and trolls running the show while anyone remotely sane stays far away from the debate.

Emily Myers32 said:The whole point for me is having a debate with someone who actually disagrees... I keep posting in that immigration thread mostly because, despite all the complaints, there’s still some actual civil discourse happening there. It’s fine, though, except I'm getting a little bored since everyone there seems to share the exact same opinion... which leaves me with nothing left to say 😬

I’m only mentioning this so it doesn't look like I'm looking for an echo chamber.
It’s actually quite the opposite, because I'm certainly not the only crazy one here hallucinating things that aren't there.

First of all—and this isn't directed at you, Paul—Dorian has asked a few times that we don't veer off-topic, so it's just not fair to rustywalker42.

But since we're ignoring those pleas and just recycling the same old moderator complaints, I might as well weigh in, and I'm actually glad you brought it up.

That bolded, underlined part about "everyone thinking the same way" refers to the anti-immigration posts. Like, 99% of the content in that thread is anti-immigration.

And hey, if that's how people feel, so be it. But it’s honestly tasteless and bizarre to hear people whining about not being allowed to express different viewpoints. They mean protecting against hate speech or stopping people from painting every Muslim as a terrorist... I really can't decide whether to laugh or cry when someone gets banned from a thread where 99% of the posts are anti-immigration, just because they dared to write something that wasn't pro-immigrant 🤦

Politics is just spinning its wheels—meanwhile, TV News is charging ahead at full speed. It’s already outpaced both local news and sports, and honestly, if they didn't have that Big Brother vibe going on, it would probably overtake everything else too. Give it two or three years, and it'll be bigger than the entire political scene combined.

The moderators are basically invisible. Truth be told, TV News is highly visited and actually stays organized and easy to navigate—quite the contrast to Politics, which is just a cluttered mess. The political section is also suffering from a massive lack of unique voices. If I were to open five random threads in Politics right now, 90% of the people talking would be the exact same handful of users appearing in all five.

rustywalker42, I won't even bother commenting on the pricing regarding bans and those pointless red cards because they are utterly trivial. When you actually look at individual bans, you almost always find that it isn't about a fundamental disagreement over an issue, but rather something far more petty and decidedly unprincipled. However, since you mentioned wanting to view this topic through a broader lens, I will weigh in on a few other points raised.

First, I actually agree with the idea that grouping discussions into massive, monolithic threads often serves to dilute the conversation. These mega-threads are nearly impossible to follow; if you aren't glued to them constantly, there is zero chance you’ll catch something interesting that was discussed five or ten pages ago. An alternative would be smaller, more focused threads centered on specific events rather than on the personalities involved. For instance, if Milijan Vaso Brkic, acting as the number two in the nation's largest political party and its ruling organization, sends two distinguished intellectuals and professionals away—if they don't feel secure here, they should probably just go live somewhere else—that ought to be its own separate thread. This would benefit not just the regulars, but the community at large, as we all know far more people lurk on the Forum than actually post. Not to mention, it would make things much easier to Google. The problem, however, is that such an approach would require significantly stricter moderation than what we currently have. A thread like that would likely devolve by the second page into deep-dive medical analogies, exhaustive analyses of every actor's track record, citing old news clips to prove who the media loves or hates, or rehashing old grievances about where someone stood in the '40s versus the '60s, or whose grandfather fought for which side in the civil wars... The moderators would be drowning in work, off-topic posts would be deleted constantly, threads would get locked, and everyone would start screaming about censorship. Or, alternatively, we'd just end up with five or six identical threads where nobody keeps order, and we lose clarity instead of gaining it.
That said, if some kind of consensus could be reached on this matter, I would gladly support it.

Secondly, I think it is intentionally permitted to call a politician a scoundrel or use coarse language against them, whereas such remarks wouldn't fly if directed at forum members or specific social groups. And that is perfectly normal. Public figures have public actions, and we can allow ourselves to be a bit rougher with them. One could argue the opposite—that an insult toward Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, Frljic, Pusicka, or Glogosk should be treated as an insult toward me, you, lonebadger6, Blankica, or Gufi—but that would lead to the total sterilization of the Forum. What cannot be allowed, however, is being able to tear into Frljic, Pusicka, or someone similar while being prevented from doing the same to Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, Reiner, or Glogosk. But I suppose even children understand that, so I won't labor the point. Forum members, on the other hand, are our peers and fellow debaters; they aren't public figures and aren't subject to that same level of scrutiny, which is why we protect them. We also protect social groups because insulting a group is inherently improper; groups aren't monoliths, and even if someone knows a dozen examples that confirm a stereotype, we won't allow that stereotype to be typed out as an unpunished slur against the whole group.

Does this way of looking at things lead to a decline in membership? Or does the cooling of discussions and the weakening of the user base stem from an entirely different set of reasons (Facebook, one generation of users aging out while another remains uninterested, the sheer abundance of online platforms, debaters getting tired of mindless stories about fascists and partisans, the availability of pornography and other ways to find excitement, or perhaps frustratingly unreliable servers and the lack of technical explanations as to why Tapatalk still doesn't work...)? I don't know, and I leave those contemplations to the admins and the owner.
Personally, I am driven away from the Forum by the endless debates over historical factions and these stupid technical glitches. But perhaps you or someone else is being pushed away by something else entirely. 🤷

(Please excuse any technical glitches; I'm typing this on a glass surface...)

Look, if you examine each individual thread on the political scene, they aren't even total caricatures—not really.
But nobody ever points that out...
The issue lies in the big picture. In my view, at least 70% of what happens there should be classified as trolling. It's just constant derailment, dragging every debate toward the same old direction—just empty, repetitive comments thrown back and forth... it isn't a real discussion 🤷
Right now, this entire sub-forum serves exclusively as a playground for party loyalists—most of the regulars here won't even touch "general" political topics, heaven forbid something regarding the US or the EU. Honestly, someone needs to say it clearly. If that was the goal, fine, but if not, then things really ought to be fixed, don't you think?

Anyway, I’m proposing we start a new (and improved 😬) sub-forum, something like Current Hour. We could have daily topics that naturally move fast—since there's always a new headline anyway—where people can actually discuss specific events from the political life of the country.
The main part of the forum should stay dedicated to monolithic issues like immigration, border disputes, Social Security, healthcare, and so on. The only downside is that certain specific events just don't get the deep dive they deserve.
I don't know, just throwing some ideas out there to be constructive... 🤷

As for the immigration threads, I have no idea where lonebadger6 found that 1% who would actually support pro-immigration views—there are zero posts or users like that. Zilch. I suppose I'd love for someone to pop up just to spice things up a little... 🤣

William Bennett53 said:rustywalker42, I’m not even going to touch the whole debate over strictness versus those useless penalties. It’s a waste of breath. When you actually look at individual calls, almost every single time it boils down to something petty rather than any real principle or high-minded reasoning. But since you said you wanted to take this conversation a step further, I’ll weigh in on some of the other points being made.

Look, that’s not what I’m trying to do here—I’ve already said that a few times now. This whole thread is just about figuring out why the message count and user activity on this subforum are absolutely tanking. Why is everyone disappearing?

Look, I actually agree—bundling everything into these massive, monster threads just dilutes the conversation. It’s impossible to follow. If you aren't glued to the screen 24/7, how are you supposed to catch something interesting that happened five or ten pages ago? The alternative? Smaller, focused threads centered on specific events rather than just dissecting people. For instance, when Milijan Vaso Brkic, sitting right there as the number two guy in the nation's biggest ruling party, sends out two high-profile intellectuals and professionals... if they don't feel safe enough to show up here, they should just go live somewhere else. That deserves its own dedicated thread. It would help the regulars and the lurkers alike—and let's be real, way more people read this Forum than actually post on it. Not to mention making things easier to Google. But here’s the catch: that approach would require way stricter moderation than what we have now. A thread like that would spiral by page two. It wouldn't stay on topic; it would turn into a deep dive into everyone's personal lives, digging up old scandals, accusing media outlets of bias, or dragging up who fought where in WWII—who was a hero and who was a collaborator. The mods would be working overtime deleting off-topic nonsense, threads would get locked constantly, and everyone would start screaming about censorship. Or, on the flip side, we'd end up with five or six identical threads about Vaso where nobody stays on track, and we lose all clarity anyway. What's the point?
Look, I’ll say it again: if we could actually reach some kind of consensus on this, I’d be all in. Wouldn't that be something?

I don't get it—what’s the actual issue here? This Forum has operated on this exact principle for years. At the end of the day, an American version of Godwin’s Law is inevitable; you can't run from it. Personally, I don't see the problem. Why on earth would anyone be expected to hover over the Forum 24/7? A moderator steps in when they can and cleans up the thread. And honestly, one of the biggest headaches is locking threads. We should be avoiding that at all costs and only resorting to it as a last resort.

Is this actually a legal issue? I’m being serious here. Are you all just terrified of some potential lawsuits? (I haven't been keeping up with today's legal reality, anyway.) Is the fear that el Paso.net is going to get wiped out what's driving this? Is that why you think someone needs to be constantly "watching over" the topic?

I’m not going to get bogged down in the whole "carding" debate—whatever needs to be banned, just ban it. I’d much rather talk about this bit regarding off-topic posts. Honestly? I think it’s perfectly fine if the thread drifts off-topic a little—and I mean *little*—as long as the moderation is actually decent. If the mods know what they're doing, you can easily steer things back to the main gossip. Besides, a tiny bit of side-tracking might actually make the discussion better. Don't you think?

Look, what I’m trying to say is simple: you can call a politician a complete scumbag or tell them where to shove it, and that’s allowed. But try that same crap toward a regular user or one of our social groups? Not happening. And honestly, that’s how it should be. These people are public figures; their actions are out there for everyone to see, so why shouldn't we be able to get a little rough with our criticism? We could decide otherwise if we wanted—we could treat an insult toward Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, Frljic, Pusicka, or Glogosk as if it were a direct attack on me, you, lonebadger6, Blankica, or Gufi. But if we did that, we might as well just sanitize the entire Forum until it's completely sterile. You can't have it both ways. You can't allow us to tear into Frljic, pupovca, or Pusicka while protecting Kolinda Grabar-Kitarović, Reiner, or Glogosk from the same treatment. It's common sense. Even kids get that, so I shouldn't have to spell it out. The users here? They're our peers. They're fellow debaters, not public figures, so they don't deserve that same level of scrutiny. That's why we protect them. As for the social groups, we protect those too. Insulting a group is just plain wrong. Groups aren't monoliths. Even if someone knows a dozen examples that seem to back up a stereotype, we aren't going to let them post that stereotype as a free pass to insult the whole group. Period.

Look, I don't think this part was ever actually up for debate. At least, not in my book. 🤷

Is this way of looking at things actually tearing the membership apart? Or is the decline in discussion and the shrinking crowd caused by something else entirely? Maybe it’s Facebook, or just an aging generation of users while the younger ones couldn't care less. Is it because there are too many online platforms now? Or maybe people are just sick of the endless, mindless debates about fascists and partisans? Could it be the easy access to porn and other ways to get a quick thrill? Or is it just the frustrating, broken servers and the total lack of technical updates on why Tapatalk still doesn't work? I have no clue. I'll leave those deep thoughts to the admins and the owner.

Sure, there are metrics for everything—this included. It’s obvious to me that for various political reasons, the owner of this Forum isn't going to drop the actual numbers, but I’m betting they’re pretty pathetic, especially regarding the Politics sub-forum. And please, spare me the insinuations about the moderators. I haven't been posting much over there lately, so honestly, even if I wanted to call them out, I couldn't. I don't even know what's actually happening.

I know what I see. And what I see is exactly what I laid out in my first post. That’s the whole damn problem.

Personally, I can't stand how this Forum just turns into nothing but endless bickering between extremists and stupid technical glitches. Maybe you find something else interesting, or maybe someone else does, but for me? It's just noise. 🤷

My bad on the typos—typing through a cracked screen here...

Maybe we should just start strictly sanctioning people who drag up old history out of context? Just ban it. Seriously.

What exactly is holding me back? I literally wrote it in my first post—I just don't know what there is to say. Every time I open this Forum, I'm stuck. What am I even supposed to write? Not even worth my time..

Look, just try it—or at least think about it. If you guys are admins, supermods, or mods, why not just kill those massive, brain-dead threads once and for all? Honestly? I think half our problems right here stem from those bloated topics alone.

Sometimes you just need a little luck on your side;
- Someone actually managed to read the collection of messages, complaints, and comments I spent about fifteen minutes typing out on the "Messages, Complaints, and Comments" section right before its mysterious disappearance. 😍

But honestly, that’s not the point.
What matters way more is that rustywalker42 is onto something here—someone really ought to take action regarding this.

Here is an example of how things *shouldn't* be handled, if you ask me:
- I rushed over to the "Politics" section and found the nearest closed thread with a title like this:
"Should the government ban dangerous wireless tech (WIFI, WLAN) and tablets in schools?"
Here’s the link: http://www.example-us-forum.com/showthread.php?t=933163

- A user puts in the work—writes a solid post, provides links, builds an argument, etc.—only for a moderator to swoop in with an axe and chop the whole thing down at the root. They didn't even wait to see if the topic would spark interest among users or if counterarguments might fuel a deeper debate.
The users themselves should decide if a topic is worth attention—whether it's scientific, fringe, conservative, liberal, whatever—by engaging with it or ignoring it. If it's boring, it should just naturally evaporate from the forum without outside interference.

Bottom line: in the "Politics" section, people should be allowed to open all sorts of topics, and interventions should be kept to an absolute minimum.
Less is more.
That way, the threads that actually matter stay at the top, while the uninteresting ones just fade away on their own.

Generic threads like "The US Government" shouldn't even exist.
When something interesting actually happens within the administration or around Washington, someone will start a specific thread about a specific issue. That’s how the "Politics" section stays relevant.
A topic will last exactly as long as it needs to, and then it'll be replaced by the next big thing coming out of the Government.

I really hope someone takes these good-faith suggestions from the users seriously.

Moderation definitely plays a huge role in all this.
For instance, they shut down that whole thread about the World Trade Center—which, let’s be real, had its fair share of fans (and haters, obviously) and went on for countless pages. The mod killed it just because, if I remember right, two guys drifted slightly "off-topic." (In my experience on my usual forums, you’d just give someone a heads-up instead of totally nuking the entire discussion.)
Honestly, it made me lose all motivation to post in that subforum, even though I actually wanted to keep going.

From what I can see, people here are sharing plenty of memes, but the mods seem to be overstepping a bit too much (at least from my perspective). It reminds me of how back in places like Poland, I saw four different forums collapse within just a year or two—including two massive ones with tens of thousands of users—all for these exact same reasons.

We've entered an era where people just aren't having it anymore when it comes to being controlled, lectured, or punished. People rebel fast and move on to new communities, especially since there are so many other options out there now.

I'm not saying this to be a critic (hey, everyone manages their own backyard differently!), I'm just sharing my observations.