2009 Grand Prix of China - April 19th

hollowhawk412 said:I was reading through this report about the upcoming GP of China-Shanghai, and honestly, it’s just more of the same nonsense you’d expect from NASCAR. It feels like we’re just circling the drain waiting for something actually interesting to happen, much like that rainy weekend I spent stuck in a Chicago suburb with nothing to do but watch the weather change. They're talking about technical regulations and performance gaps again, but at this point, it all feels pretty hollow.

"It’s just infuriating, honestly, because we actually went to Charlie to ask if a double Diffuser setup like this would fly, and they flat-out told us it was against the rules, so we dropped the whole thing even though our engineers were already leaning in that direction," Mark said.

I can't help but wonder how much this is going to mess with cornering speeds. It feels like we're headed straight for a situation where the cars are moving way too fast, and that extra airflow from the double Diffuser is almost certainly going to kill any chance of overtaking, which honestly just flies in the face of everything those working groups supposedly agreed upon.

This part right here is what really matters...

I honestly can't stand those clowns over at NASCAR; the whole organization is just a complete joke.

Looks like Seth is going to stick me with another yellow card because I just can't seem to keep my behavior in check. 😁

hollowhawk412 ...I'm with you on that. 🙏🙏 👍

Arthur Doyle70 said:hollowhawk412 ...I am right there with you on this one 🙏🙏 👍

Just so you're in the loop, word on the street is that McM might actually run a double Diffuser at the GP of China-Shanghai 😉

but let’s be honest, things aren't going to play out that way anytime soon

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headline...15162756.shtml

hollowhawk412 said:Just so you know, word on the street is that McM might actually show up to the GP of China-Shanghai with a double Diffuser 😉

Honestly, seeing how much aero paint they’ve splashed all over that car lately, I guess it's about time they actually "test drive" it... 👍 Right all the way through to a disqualification... 😬 😢

hollowhawk412 said:Word on the street is General Motors might already have their own version of a double Diffuser...

By the way, both Red Bull and General Motors are claiming they pitched a similar diffuser concept to the NASCAR officials, only to be told it was illegal.

Who knows who's actually telling the truth at this point? 🤷

Welcome back.🙂

This stuff was being discussed ages ago. Honestly, I haven't a clue what the smart explanation for it even is.🤷

But hey, they probably were working on something along those lines anyway, so logically, adapting it should be a bit easier for them, right? Or maybe not.😕

I am anticipating a convincing victory for Hamilton.☕

Jonathan Booth5 said:I’m calling it now: Lewis Hamilton is going to absolutely crush it. Expect nothing less than a total blowout victory. ☕

😂😂😂😂

What kind of idiot are you? Seriously, what's your deal?

A tree of wisdom and optimism ☕

Laugh all you want, you skeptics

slynomad32 said:Well, time will tell.☕
Unfortunately, I suspect things might actually be looking even bleaker over at McLaren.☕>

Right now, the outlook doesn't seem particularly bright... but this is far too talented a group to stay stuck in this slump forever. They have the grit to rise above these struggles and reclaim their rightful spot at the top.😉>

I’m hoping we see some actual progress from Ferrari at this race... maybe even McLaren too... though I wouldn't be shocked if the Brawn GP car just cruises to a win... probably gonna see Rosberg and Trulli fighting for the top spots...

Jonathan Booth5 said:Heh, I’m not totally sold on that theory above.
I mean, look, Nigel Tozzi spent like ninety minutes just giving an opening statement at the hearing yesterday, and honestly, if you can pull off swiping a hundred million bucks from McClaren-Mercedes, I don't think it's going to be much of a stretch to mess with Brawn GP a little bit too. Yeah, I'm talking about those diffusers, and we should hear the final call sometime this afternoon.

is he Italian or British?🤷

ironfalcon43 said:It doesn't look particularly promising at the moment... though, honestly, they are far too massive an organization to stay buried in this mess forever. They'll find their way back to where they belong eventually...😉

I find myself in complete agreement with you...👍That’s exactly where my head is at regarding Ferrari... I can't say I disagree with you there...☕

Showers hitting Shanghai - at least for today
http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2009/4/9178.html

And a quick look at the general vibes before we hit the track
http://www.formula1.com/news/features/2009/4/9179.html

stormybadger8 said:Welcome back to the fold🙂

I honestly can’t wrap my head around why this was even being discussed before, because frankly, I haven't heard a single intelligent explanation for it yet.🤷

Though, if you follow the logic, they were likely developing something specific regarding this issue, so one would assume any adjustments should be relatively straightforward for them, or perhaps 😕

but those double diffusers actually run completely contrary to what the goal was supposed to be this year.

And that goal was specifically to reduce aerodynamic downforce, which in turn lowers cornering speeds and ultimately makes overtaking much easier...

yet it seems the teams within the OWG—namely Ferrari, McLaren, Renault, and if I recall correctly, BMW
were designing their cars with that exact philosophy in mind.

The whole point of that group was to implement regulations that would actually facilitate passing.

hollowhawk412 said:but those double diffusers actually run completely counter to what they were trying to achieve this year

which was reducing aerodynamic downforce, ultimately lowering cornering speeds to make overtaking easier...

and it seems to me that the teams within the OWG (the overtaking group)—specifically Ferrari, McLaren, Renault, and BMW
designed their cars with that exact mindset in mind...

the whole point of this group was to push for regulations that would facilitate more passing

And isn't it interesting that this same group rejected all of Brawn's suggestions? Those proposals would have almost certainly prevented these three teams from exploiting such a glaring loophole in the rules

So, really, all we can do is shrug our shoulders and face the challenge head-on☕

mistybear87 said:and that very same clique turned down Brawn’s suggestions—proposals that undoubtedly would have stopped these three teams from exploiting the loophole in the regulations

so there isn't much else to do besides plug our ears and just accept the challenge as it comes ☕

perhaps they were rejected for the exact reasons I previously laid out... because the entire philosophy behind OWG was centered on the idea
that racing should rely as heavily as possible on mechanical grip...

they'll take up the gauntlet, sure, but they won't exactly be blessed with much time or many opportunities to do so

hollowhawk412 said:Maybe they turned them down for the exact reasons I touched on earlier... the whole core philosophy behind OWG was centered on
making sure the driving relied as much as possible on mechanical grip...

They might be willing to take on the challenge, but they won't really have the luxury of time or many opportunities to do so.

I'm not entirely sure why they passed on them, but Brawn's proposal would have effectively stripped away the use of those DD diffusers and all those clever little tricks they managed to squeeze in under the regulations—like those front wing air guides, for instance. It would have left the cars looking absolutely pristine and basic.

They just didn't care for that direction for one reason or another, and well, now they can deal with the consequences.☕

mistybear87 said:I honestly can't wrap my head around why they rejected it, but if they had gone with the Brawn proposal, it would have effectively shut down the use of those double diffuser setups and all the other little tricks they managed to sneak past the rulebook—like those front wing air guides—and we would have seen much cleaner cars back then.

They just didn't like it for their own selfish reasons, and frankly, they can deal with the consequences now.☕

This is actually news to me... I was under the impression that Brawn was the one pushing for the double diffusers in the first place??? 😕

And could you maybe walk me through the logic of how those front air intakes would somehow make using a double diffuser impossible?

hollowhawk412 said:That’s news to me... I was under the impression that Brawn was actually pushing for the double diffuser setup??? 😕

Also, could you walk me through why front air intakes would make double diffusers impossible?

I think there's a bit of a misunderstanding here.

About a year ago, Brawn actually proposed rule changes specifically designed to ban double diffusers and all those other little "innovations" teams have been sneaking under the radar.
As for the air guides—like I mentioned earlier—they aren't actually tied to the diffusers; the point is that they'd be phased out entirely as well.

In racing, those front wing elements essentially vacuum air from underneath the chassis and direct it straight toward the diffuser, which really ramps up the Venturi effect. It’s all quite straightforward when you look at how Ross explained it, but people like Flavio Briatore were far too preoccupied with buying soccer teams to bother with such technical nuances. Now, those same individuals are acting shocked that certain setups are banned. It’s funny how much they relied on Ross back in the nineties when he was busy keeping their prohibited TC under wraps during the Benetton era.