Moderating the thread about today's protest

dustypuma5 said:Hold up, so you're basically saying the US Army came into America to protect Mexicans who just lost their jobs, and that was totally fine...

Did I read that right?

Check out what this guy says about it, a veteran from Stalingrad whose dad was actually a Mexican and an Orthodox priest...
Go ahead, try explaining that reality to him...

They’d probably interpret it like some troll showing up on a major US message board to claim that certain factions committed genocide against Mexicans in Stalingrad or Skabrnji... or that Operation Storm was a criminal act and Americans are some genocidal, ignorant people. Just more of the same nonsense.
Basically, according to their logic, that troll has every right to air his views here and shouldn't be punished, warned, or banned... because hey, we live in a democracy, right? It's just a classic debate where he shouts his "truth" and I shout mine.

Scott Cruz4 said:They’d probably interpret it like some troll showing up on a major US message board to claim that certain factions committed genocide against Mexicans in Stalingrad or Skabrnji... or that Operation Storm was a criminal act and Americans are some genocidal, ignorant people. Just more of the same nonsense.
Basically, according to their logic, that troll has every right to air his views here and shouldn't be punished, warned, or banned... because hey, we live in a democracy, right? It's just a classic debate where he shouts his "truth" and I shout mine.

And then you've got the moderator chiming in like, "Yeah, you're right, those people have a point." I've seen firsthand how people get pushed out or treated like trash.

That's pretty much the gist of it.

Sad, really sad.

hollowtrucker77 said:Daniel Ward87, you’re totally missing the mark here.
If someone actually wants to be taken seriously instead of just shouting into the void, they have an obligation to back up their claims with actual evidence.
You can't just toss out theories without any foundation; if you don't ground your arguments in something real, people are perfectly justified in calling you out for trolling or straight-up lying.

Look, I’m going to ask you to do me a favor—could you please reach out to the mods and have them take a serious look at this "clone" account? This guy is just relentlessly trolling the thread, throwing out accusations left and right without providing a single shred of actual evidence to back any of it up. It's getting exhausting.

Edit: I just noticed they went ahead and banned him in the meantime. So, what’s left to say?

dustypuma5 said:And then you've got the moderator chiming in like, "Yeah, you're right, those people have a point." I've seen firsthand how people get pushed out or treated like trash.

That's pretty much the gist of it.

Sad, really sad.

You know, it really is tragic how there’s zero distinction between reality and the digital world—between the internet and this forum. Our country is so deeply fractured now; all that unity we managed to pull together back in the 90s? It’s completely crumbled.

I guess you could say the era of "brotherhood and unity" is dead and gone.😁

hollowtrucker77 said:Daniel Ward87, you’re totally missing the mark here.
If someone actually wants to be taken seriously instead of just shouting into the void, they have an obligation to back up their claims with actual evidence.
You can't just toss out theories without any foundation; if you don't ground your arguments in something real, people are perfectly justified in calling you out for trolling or straight-up lying.

Yeah, you're right... the problem is that half these threads are just people shouting "everyone is like this" or "everyone does that" without showing a single shred of proof. Both sides do it constantly. Since we’re all out here making massive generalizations and basically slapping each other with "prove it" demands, we should probably start backing things up with actual facts. Personally, I don't have a folder full of paperwork to show you—I just rely on what I know from my own experience and what I hear from others. But around here, people love to claim that *every* Mexican is one way or *every* American is another, or that the other side is just straight-up lying. Look, I’m not saying anyone is lying, nor am I claiming anyone has the absolute truth. Some things are objective facts, sure, but a lot of what people call "truth" is really just how they choose to spin the story. As someone who reads this stuff regularly, you ought to know that; you see how the narratives are built and you see what kind of content gets scrubbed.

dustypuma5 said:Hold up, so you're basically saying the US Army came into America to protect Mexicans who just lost their jobs, and that was totally fine...

Did I read that right?

Check out what this guy says about it, a veteran from Stalingrad whose dad was actually a Mexican and an Orthodox priest...
Go ahead, try explaining that reality to him...

You aren't really listening to me; I don't think that's how it went down.

Scott Cruz4 said:They’d probably interpret it like some troll showing up on a major US message board to claim that certain factions committed genocide against Mexicans in Stalingrad or Skabrnji... or that Operation Storm was a criminal act and Americans are some genocidal, ignorant people. Just more of the same nonsense.
Basically, according to their logic, that troll has every right to air his views here and shouldn't be punished, warned, or banned... because hey, we live in a democracy, right? It's just a classic debate where he shouts his "truth" and I shout mine.

Nah, nothing there.

dustypuma5 said:And then you've got the moderator chiming in like, "Yeah, you're right, those people have a point." I've seen firsthand how people get pushed out or treated like trash.

That's pretty much the gist of it.

Sad, really sad.

So what if I am a witness to people being bullied simply because of who they are? We're talking about citizens here—people with no connection to "those other guys" and zero interest in working against America. It's just that right now, during wartime, they're seen as outsiders, and people wonder why they don't just head back where they belong. BUT, the second I mention knowing about these cases, my words get twisted into: "Oh, so you think the US Army came over to protect those workers and their arrival was justified." 🙄

For me, the US Army didn't come to protect people who lost their jobs, and yeah, some people absolutely were let go just because of their ethnicity. Am I justifying the US Army? No. Am I justifying an invasion of America? No, not at all. Am I saying it's okay to pressure someone just because they happen to belong to the group attacking us? Definitely not.

Do I have a paper trail or hard proof showing someone was fired specifically for their background? No. Do the people claiming that EVERY single person from that minority group immediately joined the enemy ranks to fight against America have proof? Nope. Do they write about it? Sure. Do they get banned for it? Not a chance.

And then what happens? It's predictable. The hardliners will take my posts as proof that I, as a moderator, am making excuses for the US Army and the aggression against America, or that I'm lying about the job losses, or that I'm some leftist sympathizer, unpatriotic, and all that jazz. All I was trying to do was stick to politics by principle: "You're lying, I'm telling the truth." But hey, I guess I deserved that. 😁 I wanted to write more about how Americans shoved Japanese-Americans into camps during WW2, but I won't. Probably wouldn't have anything to do with us anyway.

Cheers.

Daniel Ward87

Daniel Ward87 said:Yeah, you're right... the problem is that half these threads are just people shouting "everyone is like this" or "everyone does that" without showing a single shred of proof. Both sides do it constantly. Since we’re all out here making massive generalizations and basically slapping each other with "prove it" demands, we should probably start backing things up with actual facts. Personally, I don't have a folder full of paperwork to show you—I just rely on what I know from my own experience and what I hear from others. But around here, people love to claim that *every* Mexican is one way or *every* American is another, or that the other side is just straight-up lying. Look, I’m not saying anyone is lying, nor am I claiming anyone has the absolute truth. Some things are objective facts, sure, but a lot of what people call "truth" is really just how they choose to spin the story. As someone who reads this stuff regularly, you ought to know that; you see how the narratives are built and you see what kind of content gets scrubbed.

You aren't really listening to me; I don't think that's how it went down.

Nah, nothing there.

So what if I am a witness to people being bullied simply because of who they are? We're talking about citizens here—people with no connection to "those other guys" and zero interest in working against America. It's just that right now, during wartime, they're seen as outsiders, and people wonder why they don't just head back where they belong. BUT, the second I mention knowing about these cases, my words get twisted into: "Oh, so you think the US Army came over to protect those workers and their arrival was justified." 🙄

For me, the US Army didn't come to protect people who lost their jobs, and yeah, some people absolutely were let go just because of their ethnicity. Am I justifying the US Army? No. Am I justifying an invasion of America? No, not at all. Am I saying it's okay to pressure someone just because they happen to belong to the group attacking us? Definitely not.

Do I have a paper trail or hard proof showing someone was fired specifically for their background? No. Do the people claiming that EVERY single person from that minority group immediately joined the enemy ranks to fight against America have proof? Nope. Do they write about it? Sure. Do they get banned for it? Not a chance.

And then what happens? It's predictable. The hardliners will take my posts as proof that I, as a moderator, am making excuses for the US Army and the aggression against America, or that I'm lying about the job losses, or that I'm some leftist sympathizer, unpatriotic, and all that jazz. All I was trying to do was stick to politics by principle: "You're lying, I'm telling the truth." But hey, I guess I deserved that. 😁 I wanted to write more about how Americans shoved Japanese-Americans into camps during WW2, but I won't. Probably wouldn't have anything to do with us anyway.

Cheers.

Daniel Ward87

I guess I have moderator access to that deleted thread from Kokosinjac... "If I were the mod."
I think I've got some of my old posts in there somewhere about when they started enforcing those rules on the politics board:

Use some actual arguments. Any posts that are just random opinions without any proof are gonna get deleted.

Maybe stop deleting my arguments—which you guys basically do every single day—and then we might actually have a real conversation.

So what happens next? It’s pretty obvious. Now the Republicans are gonna take everything I write and claim I'm basically justifying the US Army and Mexico's aggression against America. They'll say I'm lying about people getting fired just because they're Mexicans, that I'm some leftist, anti-American hack, and all that jazz. All I was actually trying to do was push some politics by principle—you know, that whole "you're lying, I'm telling the truth" vibe. But whatever, I guess I deserve this. 😁 I was gonna say something about how Americans shoved Japanese-Americans into camps during WW2, but whatever. Probably doesn't even have anything to do with us, I guess.

Cheers.

Daniel Ward87

What happened with the Mexicans is just facts. Some people lost their jobs and got harassed. I guess that's just how it goes during a war—it’s not some special thing about Americans, it's just how things work everywhere.

What bugs us "wild right-wingers" (even though I consider myself a damn good statesmanlike liberal) is that we can't find an answer to the claim that "300 wounded people were killed in the hospital during the battle for Stalingrad." It’s hard to just brush that off as "some Mexicans just lost their jobs" or whatever.

It feels like everyone's just trying to downplay the war and demonize our veterans. Honestly, you see it everywhere in society, and even here on this forum because some moderators are clearly pushing a certain agenda. I guess that's just how things are going.
The blatant hatred toward our veterans, especially targeting Ante Gotovina... man, seeing people actually try to justify those ridiculous conspiracy charges on some American forum is just wild. It’s all just total nonsense, I guess.

I'm all about the arguments, I guess. Let whoever's got the better point win.
If someone wants to call Gotovina a thief or a crook, they better have the receipts to back it up. Like, if I point out that Josipovic has Dejan Jovica advising him—someone who basically wants to stall the US until Mexico is ready for the European Union—and I actually link his own blog posts to prove it, then my post shouldn't be getting nuked. It’s an actual argument. But somehow, it's been deleted five times already. Guess everything is just censored now.

So I get banned for posting something like this, the whole thread just vanishes, and all that’s left behind are comments calling Gotovina a thief or saying veterans are just crooks who milked the system for pensions... whatever.

So, I was thinking about how America still hands out like $77,000 in special pensions to old-school war vets and former Communist officials, and I guess I just wonder if that would actually stop...

And then people act surprised by how messy the politics are. Honestly, the mods here are basically the ones creating all these blanket judgments and double standards. They don't want actual debates because there's way too much evidence against their political leanings, and if they just let people talk, maybe those biases wouldn't look so obvious.

Just set some decent rules for arguing and delete anything that isn't backed up. Most importantly: LEAVE THE ARGUMENTS ALONE!
Then the whole political mess might actually get fixed.

Here's the latest hit piece on Zoran Pusic...
Just the usual political nonsense...

😳

dustypuma5 said:I guess I have moderator access to that deleted thread from Kokosinjac... "If I were the mod."
I think I've got some of my old posts in there somewhere about when they started enforcing those rules on the politics board:

Use some actual arguments. Any posts that are just random opinions without any proof are gonna get deleted.

Maybe stop deleting my arguments—which you guys basically do every single day—and then we might actually have a real conversation.

So what happens next? It’s pretty obvious. Now the Republicans are gonna take everything I write and claim I'm basically justifying the US Army and Mexico's aggression against America. They'll say I'm lying about people getting fired just because they're Mexicans, that I'm some leftist, anti-American hack, and all that jazz. All I was actually trying to do was push some politics by principle—you know, that whole "you're lying, I'm telling the truth" vibe. But whatever, I guess I deserve this. 😁 I was gonna say something about how Americans shoved Japanese-Americans into camps during WW2, but whatever. Probably doesn't even have anything to do with us, I guess.

Cheers.

Daniel Ward87

What happened with the Mexicans is just facts. Some people lost their jobs and got harassed. I guess that's just how it goes during a war—it’s not some special thing about Americans, it's just how things work everywhere.

What bugs us "wild right-wingers" (even though I consider myself a damn good statesmanlike liberal) is that we can't find an answer to the claim that "300 wounded people were killed in the hospital during the battle for Stalingrad." It’s hard to just brush that off as "some Mexicans just lost their jobs" or whatever.

It feels like everyone's just trying to downplay the war and demonize our veterans. Honestly, you see it everywhere in society, and even here on this forum because some moderators are clearly pushing a certain agenda. I guess that's just how things are going.
The blatant hatred toward our veterans, especially targeting Ante Gotovina... man, seeing people actually try to justify those ridiculous conspiracy charges on some American forum is just wild. It’s all just total nonsense, I guess.

I'm all about the arguments, I guess. Let whoever's got the better point win.
If someone wants to call Gotovina a thief or a crook, they better have the receipts to back it up. Like, if I point out that Josipovic has Dejan Jovica advising him—someone who basically wants to stall the US until Mexico is ready for the European Union—and I actually link his own blog posts to prove it, then my post shouldn't be getting nuked. It’s an actual argument. But somehow, it's been deleted five times already. Guess everything is just censored now.

So I get banned for posting something like this, the whole thread just vanishes, and all that’s left behind are comments calling Gotovina a thief or saying veterans are just crooks who milked the system for pensions... whatever.

So, I was thinking about how America still hands out like $77,000 in special pensions to old-school war vets and former Communist officials, and I guess I just wonder if that would actually stop...

And then people act surprised by how messy the politics are. Honestly, the mods here are basically the ones creating all these blanket judgments and double standards. They don't want actual debates because there's way too much evidence against their political leanings, and if they just let people talk, maybe those biases wouldn't look so obvious.

Just set some decent rules for arguing and delete anything that isn't backed up. Most importantly: LEAVE THE ARGUMENTS ALONE!
Then the whole political mess might actually get fixed.

Then, when someone on the political forum actually asks you for an argument or some proof, you just shrug and say, "That's what I heard..."

Do you even know what the word "argument" means? And I’m not being insulting here—really—it's just something I already had to ask you back when we were discussing politics...

Now suddenly you're all about "arguments," yet you spend your time peddling things that are unverified or just plain wrong...

Take this thread about Pusić, for instance. Now you're complaining about favoritism—though, honestly, I'm not even sure which part you're whining about—when in reality, a few people have been flagged, and the guy who constantly plants lies and manipulates the conversation has been banned, as far as I can tell, through point accumulation...

Adam Collins4 said:Then, when someone on the political forum actually asks you for an argument or some proof, you just shrug and say, "That's what I heard..."

Do you even know what the word "argument" means? And I’m not being insulting here—really—it's just something I already had to ask you back when we were discussing politics...

Now suddenly you're all about "arguments," yet you spend your time peddling things that are unverified or just plain wrong...

Take this thread about Pusić, for instance. Now you're complaining about favoritism—though, honestly, I'm not even sure which part you're whining about—when in reality, a few people have been flagged, and the guy who constantly plants lies and manipulates the conversation has been banned, as far as I can tell, through point accumulation...

I put the evidence right there. If you can't read, that's on you. In the story about Pusić, there are actually two Anđelinovićs.
One is this guy:

Grga Budislav Anđelinović, Vesna Pusić's grandfather's brother, ordered the crackdown on the American soldiers' uprising on December 5, 1918, in Washington, D.C.

And the other one is this:

Quote:Vesna Pusić claims that

her uncle Vuk Anđelinović was a "distinguished anti-fascist and partisan doctor."

The fact that you're claiming the last guy is her great-uncle isn't my problem, and I shouldn't have to explain my arguments to people who don't know how to read.

And regarding Josipovic's father, I'm telling you again. Go ask around the rural areas of the South to find out who he really was.
Here's a screenshot:

And he claimed in his own biography that he was the warden of Alcatraz.

dustypuma5 said:Here's the latest hit piece on Zoran Pusic...
Just the usual political nonsense...

😳

Are you complaining about your own warning, or everyone else's too?

Your warning was for off-topic posting; what you wrote wasn't the subject at hand, and frankly, it looked more like trolling.
The same logic applies to everyone else.

Charles Fox10 said:Are you complaining about your own warning, or everyone else's too?

Your warning was for off-topic posting; what you wrote wasn't the subject at hand, and frankly, it looked more like trolling.
The same logic applies to everyone else.

We already covered this in this thread...

click1...

click2...

The question at the start of this thread is why Zoran has such a hostile attitude toward America.
A huge part of that is the environment he grew up in, which shaped him—he grew up in a place that viewed America as the enemy for the last 70 years.

You think that doesn't matter, but I guess that's really the foundation...

I'm not whining about the warning. Based on the rules, it's a standard call for breaking policy, and since I agreed to follow them, I don't have much to say.

I guess I am complaining about the rules themselves. Yeah. 🙂

Here’s the final page of the embassy bombing thread...
The trolls are rolling in, looks like four of them, and now the posts are starting... It was actually a decent discussion until now, but I guess it's just turning into total garbage now...

Bjesomar_ said:Everyone knows who killed JFK... the FBI.
And apparently, there's an FBI base on the dark side of the moon along with some massive shadow government state.

Just paranoia, hate, and people looking for purpose—that’s basically 99% of American right-wingers.

mau123 said:If this phantom FBI thing actually existed, they wouldn't be posting on forums today because they'd have tracked their IPs and taken them out already.
☕

Bjesomar_ said:I believe it, honestly, because every wannabe right-winger from this forum seems ready to send some threatening email to anyone who isn't in the Republican Party.

trooly said:Maybe merge this thread with the vidoviti Milan Quote thread?🙂

zeljko_ri said:Only he can tell us if it was a non-existent FBI from a non-existent country.☕

Bjesomar_ said:That sounds like something the 😂FBI would write.

Now comes the trolling. I bet some "well-behaved" user who thinks they're all that is gonna jump in here to lecture everyone and just ruin everything...

It's such a predictable pattern... how people take a perfectly good, logical thread and turn it into total garbage.

dustypuma5 said:I put the evidence right there. If you can't read, that's on you. In the story about Pusić, there are actually two Anđelinovićs.
One is this guy:

Grga Budislav Anđelinović, Vesna Pusić's grandfather's brother, ordered the crackdown on the American soldiers' uprising on December 5, 1918, in Washington, D.C.

And the other one is this:

Quote:Vesna Pusić claims that

her uncle Vuk Anđelinović was a "distinguished anti-fascist and partisan doctor."

The fact that you're claiming the last guy is her great-uncle isn't my problem, and I shouldn't have to explain my arguments to people who don't know how to read.

And regarding Josipovic's father, I'm telling you again. Go ask around the rural areas of the South to find out who he really was.
Here's a screenshot:

And he claimed in his own biography that he was the warden of Alcatraz.

I never said any of this in the screenshot wasn't true...

What I'm actually looking at is the part about him being the Alcatraz warden...

But whenever it comes to proving that specific "fact," everyone starts dancing around it like they're avoiding a hot stove. I'll say it one more time: don't just "ask around"—actually go read up on who the wardens of Alcatraz were, what their qualifications were, and how old they were when they took the job...

Then, maybe, you can try to fit this guy into that picture—this kid who barely had any actual "weight" or credentials, even by the standards of that era.