Cross-country skiing

Jeffrey Cook78 said:Can someone give me some specifics on how things work? Like, do you guys organize trips to races (maybe out to the Rockies, Colorado, or whatever)?
Are those winter marathons still happening in places like Yellowstone or Mrkoplje? Where can I find the race schedule? Is there a league for Veterans?
How many members does the club actually have? Any perks for joining—like rides to the trails, gear, stuff like that?
And what about getting equipment? Can members snag better deals on skis or inline skates? Rental options? What kind of gear comes with membership, and where do you guys actually hold training sessions?

Cheers,

Hey Brenda Williams6, any chance you could weigh in on these questions? Thanks.

Also, if anyone’s wondering what we’re even talking about here, check out the World Cup coverage on ESPN from Kusam (Finland) lately.

John Morgan90 said:Hey to all my old runners from Six Mile, I’m checking in from Slo where I’m currently living and working, and I honestly can't believe people are even talking about cross-country skiing at Aspen Ski Club anymore.
The Aspen Ski Club does have ties to the former club, but they’re acting like total outsiders when they were actually the ones who dismantled the long-standing tradition of Six Mile Skiing just to serve their own petty interests—and now they show up acting like some kind of saviors....
If anyone is curious, just look up the registered addresses for the clubs in the official registry; you'll see one is the Aspen Ski Club and the other is a Biathlon club, which makes it pretty obvious who these people really are. 👎
By the way, I think I might still have the old crest somewhere, I just need to dig it out...

Sophia Richardson77, don't start a war here; if anyone's acting like an outsider, it's you, coming all the way from Slo and having the nerve to attack Americans who are actually putting in honest work. I’m the club secretary, I’m 25, and I live over in Bukovac; I spent the entire summer maintaining the trails at Aspen Ski Club and brainstorming ways to get people interested in cross-country skiing there again. You haven't the slightest clue how many times I've been shut down by local parks departments or the Ski Association, but despite all that, we managed to bring kids into the club, we have programs for community engagement and recreational skiing, and we're even hosting the open championship race on December 19th, 2010—which I am personally funding out of my own pocket, scraping everything together simply because I love this sport. As for the registry, feel free to go ahead and look it up, then tell me exactly what connection you think exists between the old club and the Biathlon club. Go ahead, check the website too and see if you can find a link there either.

Whoa, Brenda Williams6, why so tense? Did I hit a nerve there?!!!
You’ve still got a lot of growing up to do before you realize exactly what kind of crowd you've stepped into! Honestly, hats off to your effort, but trust me, I know exactly how the sports scene works in the city and at the Aspen Ski Club because I’ve been around the block a few times more than you have.
I actually reached out to some buddies over in Six Mile today who know the whole situation with the ski club, and they totally backed up my take on this.
Here’s the deal: the club is being run by someone who basically dismantled Six Mile Skiing in the first place—and get this, the club’s headquarters is registered at their own home address in Z. M. Plus, since you're acting as the secretary and right-hand man, you should know that the local Biathlon club is also headquartered at the residence of another individual (K.V.) who worked right alongside the first person to systematically wipe out the Six Mile skiing tradition. To those of us from the Six Mile area, it seems pretty obvious how these old clubs were gutted just to make way for these new private ones, but hey, I guess it's your fault for being associated with Bukovac.
Looking at the national team's results—which are also managed by this same group—it's pretty clear they're on the right track toward destroying cross-country skiing in America altogether. But I guess the folks up in the mountain regions are just happy with the crumbs they get, so they stay quiet while certain individuals scoop up all the cream of the crop.
And please, spare me the story about paying for everything out of your own pocket! I have to ask: whose car are you using to shuttle the kids up to Aspen? Is the Ski Association footing the bill for your gas?
LP

Jonathan Jackson20 said:Sophia Richardson77, stop picking fights! You're the only one acting like a wild man here, coming in from Slo to attack Americans who are actually doing honest work. I am personally the club secretary, I'm 25, and I live in Bukovac. I spent my entire summer working on clearing the trails at the Aspen Ski Club and dreaming up ways to get people interested in cross-country skiing there. You have no idea how many rejections I've faced from the local parks department, the Ski Association, and so on. Despite all that, we've successfully brought kids into the club, we have community and recreational programs, and we're hosting an open championship on December 19th, 2010, which I'm funding myself simply because I love this sport. As for the official registry, feel free to check it yourself and tell me where you see any connection to the old club or the Biathlon club. Go ahead, look at the website too and try to find a link there!

John Morgan90 said:Whoa, Brenda Williams6, take a breath—you’re getting worked up over nothing because you clearly missed the mark on this one.
You’ve still got some growing up to do if you want to understand the kind of crowd you've decided to run with; otherwise, hats off to your effort, but believe me, I know exactly how the sports scene works in the big city and out at the Aspen Ski Club because I’ve been around the block a few more times than you have.
I actually reached out to some buddies over in Six Mile today who know the inner workings of the ski club, and they basically just echoed everything I was thinking.
The reality is that the club is being run by someone who essentially gutted Six Mile Skiing in the first place, and get this—the club’s headquarters is registered right at this individual's home address (Z. M.). It’s not exactly your fault since you're the secretary and all, but then you've got the headquarters for that Biathlon club sitting right next door at the residence of another person (K. V.), who has been working hand-in-hand with the first guy to systematically dismantle the skiing tradition here in Six Mile. To those of us living in Six Mile, it seems pretty obvious how these old clubs were sacrificed just to pave the way for these new private outfits, and honestly, you can't really complain when you're aligned with Bukovac.
If you look at the national team's results—which are also under the thumb of these same people—it's my opinion that they are well on their way to destroying cross-country skiing in America altogether, though the folks over in Gorski Kotar seem perfectly happy to settle for the crumbs, staying quiet while certain individuals scoop up all the cream.
And as for this claim that you're paying for everything out of your own pocket, tell that story to someone who actually believes it; I’ll just ask you this: what vehicle are you using to shuttle the kids out to the Aspen Ski Club, or are you picking them up in a fleet provided by the Ski Association?
LP

Look, let me set the record straight: I used to be the club president myself, spending days out there grooming the slopes at the Aspen Ski Club, and don't you dare try to tell me that manual labor like mowing and digging is part of our official job description. I personally drive the kids to the mountains in my own car, and the parents pitch in whenever they can. If you're so skeptical, I can show you the bank statements and every single transaction from the moment we took over this club, showing exactly how much money we've received from the Ski Association. It's a flat zero. It’s clear you don't have the slightest clue about the uphill battles we deal with every day. As for the accusation that (Z. M.) ruined cross-country skiing, that's just a lie; he’s actually the only one left in the cross-country scene who is still pouring every ounce of energy into developing the sport. Whatever the others did isn't my business, nor does it have anything to do with me or this club. And regarding the national team, just look at the data: compare the number of snow days available during training now versus years ago, or look at how many competitions they attend compared to the past. Results are the coach's responsibility, not ours.
LP

Man, I was just looking for an old crest to scratch that nostalgia itch—you know, back when we were kids and everything felt simple because our only real concern was getting out on the slopes. But now you two are acting like you’re headed straight into battle or something.

Anyway, catch you guys on the trails. We'll see who actually knows what they're doing when the powder hits.

Cheers to both of you.

And Brenda Williams6, if you can't post that info here, just shoot me a DM. I've already got a few people asking about it.

Jeffrey Cook78 said:Yeah, well, I was just looking for an old crest to stir up some nostalgia from back when we were kids and everything seemed simple, because back then, we didn't understand much about anything else besides skiing—but now you two are acting like you're headed straight into a battlefield.

Anyway, I'll see you out on the slopes, and we'll see who's actually leading the pack.

Cheers to both of you.

And Brenda Williams6, you can just send me that info via private message if you want. If you can't post it publicly, no worries; I've already got a few people asking about it.

You’ve got a point there. Honestly, all I’m trying to do is get today's kids and the rest of the community interested in cross-country skiing again. I've got plenty of folks ready to jump on the offer once they see it.
Hopefully, our paths cross on the mountain.
I'll reach out via PM with the details.
LP

Jonathan Jackson20 said:Look, I’ll tell you this much: even as the club president, I’ve spent days out there mowing the grass at the local park just to keep things running. You can't honestly expect us to handle all the manual labor and digging ourselves! We actually drive the kids around in my own car, and parents jump in to help whenever they can. If you doubt our finances, I can show you the bank statements from when we first joined the association—we haven't received a single cent in funding from them! It’s clear you don't have the slightest clue about the uphill battles we face. And as for the claim that Z. M. ruined cross-country skiing? That’s just plain false. He’s actually the only one left who truly cares about the sport and puts in every ounce of effort to grow it. Whatever the others did isn't my business, nor does it involve the club. As for the national team, just look at how many snow days we get during training now compared to before, or how many competitions they attend. Results? That's on the coach.
Best regards,

My dear Brenda Williams6, stop talking nonsense! It feels like your arguments just backfired because you ended up confirming the link between the clubs and the current president, which only supports what the people over in the suburbs are saying about him destroying our traditions.
It’s true that Z. M. is the only one left in cross-country skiing, but let’s be real: he’s the only one left because his arrogant and petty behavior drove everyone else away (just ask anyone in the local community what they really think of him as a person). Looking at the official non-profit registry, you’re virtually unknown in the cross-country community, and even less so in the local area. Honestly, I don't think you're in any position to defend the president, let alone try to teach anyone anything about skiing.
If what you're saying about the national team is actually true, then it’s incredibly sad. It would be quite interesting to find out who is footing the bill for these training sessions, especially since the results look more like a casual hobby group than an elite racing team—just look at that embarrassment from the last Olympics...
But hey, I suppose you need to say *something* to secure those votes at the assembly... if you were even qualified enough to make them count, ugh...
Best regards,

Sophia Richardson77,
I think you’ve got your wires crossed here. I don't know how things used to be back in your day, but around here in the States, the administrative heavy lifting is handled by the secretary, while the kids are actually coached by someone with a Master’s in Kinesiology, an education degree, and international certifications in cross-country skiing.
Look, if you have a bone to pick with a specific organization, go take it up with them directly. And if you just happen to have a grudge against cross-country skiing itself, please, do us all a favor and find something else to obsess over so the rest of us can just enjoy the sport in peace.
Best,

Jonathan Jackson20 said:Sophia Richardson77,
I think you’ve got the roles mixed up. I don't know how things were back in the day, but here in the States, the secretary handles the paperwork while the kids are coached by someone with a Master's in Kinesiology, a teaching degree, and international cross-country skiing certification.
If you have an issue with a specific organization, take it up with them directly. And if you just aren't a fan of cross-country skiing, please don't let it stop the rest of us from enjoying the sport!
Best regards!

Brenda Williams6, you're being pretty sharp, aren't you? It’s obvious that when you run out of actual arguments, you resort to nonsense—which only proves my point about the systematic destruction of cross-country skiing in Šestinčan.
Don't you see that I don't have anything against you or the sport itself? I just want to warn well-meaning people to watch out for leaders like yours, who seem to value nothing over their own interests (just ask anyone born in Šestinčan)—am I right?
And hey, if you ever need some actual cross-country skiing lessons, feel free to reach out; I doubt your club has many people with those fancy titles you listed!
Best,

So, has anyone here actually tackled that trail up near the Blue Ridge Mountains?
How long is the trek, exactly?

Joshua Johnson said:Alright, has anyone actually tackled that trail up in the Catskills?
How long is it exactly?

My kids from the club and I headed out there this past weekend; we had a ton of snow and the weather was absolutely gorgeous. Honestly, though, that trail is one of the tougher ones you'll find in the States in terms of how it's laid out.

The run is about 2.1 miles and it hasn't really been groomed by a snowcat. 1.2 miles, it’s roughly 1.2 km with a 600m drop.

Hey there,
I stumbled upon this thread out of curiosity—it’s probably the biggest discussion EVER on the American web regarding cross-country skiing!
The fighting here doesn't surprise me one bit; honestly, even though I'm not an insider, I'd say this is just symptomatic of how sports are handled in this country.
I've been a recreational ski racer for a solid 25 years now, and I fully intend to be doing this for another 25. I actually ended up wiped out without my skis during a recent run, but hey, I'll get back on track eventually.
I’ve never really felt the urge to join a formal club (I dabble in two other sports recreationally too, so let me be clear—this isn't a vendetta against ski clubs). You teach yourself, gear up, find a crew, and just enjoy the ride without the headache—though even that isn't easy when you're trying to go ski touring while living in a major metro area like NYC.
Props to the clubs, though; I hope they thrive and bring more people together. And the issue isn't just them: sports in this country are a total mess no matter how you look at it (and again, I'm not complaining—I'm just stating facts—I'm an athlete, not a critic). As a recreationalist, I've dealt with plenty of frustrations across various sports... Many of those local recreational hubs for "niche" sports were gutted back in the 80s. But damn, even much more vital things in this nation have been torn apart over the last 20 years, so who's going to cry about cross-country skiing? Or about the local park tracks where we used to run on rental gear when I was a kid, with two full buses hauling kids from the city to races, like Dadek mentioned? Besides, there's barely any snow left like there used to be... :,(

I suggest we keep this thread going: let us know where there's actual snow right now (since it seems nonexistent everywhere else), if any gear is on sale, or where the best deals are—basically, any info that's useful right now...

A question for folks from the rural mountain regions:
Are there any trails available for recreational skiing for the general public? If you know any, please recommend them! Feel free to share contact info or places to check regarding trail conditions... (probably through the local clubs?)

Frank Green2:
How much did the overnight stay cost you at the mountain resort last year?

Brenda Williams6:
I see you're putting a lot of work into the website and trying to recruit members, so here are a few suggestions: clearly state what you offer—what's in it for the kids training there, and what you provide for recreational skiers and the general public (since you mentioned you have programs for them). People want to see all the details before they ever pick up the phone...

Michael Patel6 said:Hey there,
I stumbled upon this thread while browsing, and man, this is probably the biggest discussion EVER on any American forum regarding cross-country skiing!
The arguing doesn't really surprise me—actually, even though I'm not an insider, I’d say it’s pretty symptomatic of how sports culture works here in the States.
I’ve been a recreational ski racer for a solid 25 years now, and I fully expect to be doing this for another 25. I actually ended up without my skis during a recent outing—which was a bit of a mess—but hey, things work themselves out eventually.
I’ve never felt the need to join a formal club (I dabble in two other sports recreationally too, but just to be clear—it’s not that I have anything against organized clubs). You can just teach yourself, gear up, find a little group of friends, and enjoy the ride without all the headaches—though even that isn't easy if you're trying to find decent trails while living in a big city like Chicago.
Credit where credit is due to the clubs, though; I hope they thrive and bring more people together. But it’s not just on them: the sporting landscape in this country is a bit of a circus, no matter how you look at it (again, not complaining—not complaining at all, I'm just an active participant here). As a hobbyist, I’ve run into plenty of hurdles across various sports... many of those local recreational hubs for smaller sports were basically wiped out back in the 80s. But honestly, even much bigger, more essential things in this country have been dismantled over the last 20 years, so who’s going to cry over cross-country skiing? Or about the local parks where we used to race on rental gear when I was a kid—back when, as Dadek mentioned, two full buses would haul kids from the city to competitions? And goodness, there isn't even enough snow like there used to be... :,(

I suggest we keep this thread moving: let us know where there’s still snow (since it’s hard to find lately), if any gear is on sale somewhere, or generally any useful info that matters right now...

A quick question for folks out near the Rockies:
Are there any good trails for recreational enthusiasts or general public use? If you know of any, please recommend them! Even a contact number for someone who knows the trail conditions would be great... (probably the local clubs?)

@Frank Green2:
How many of you ended up staying overnight near the mountains last year?

@Brenda Williams6:
I see you're putting a lot of effort into the website and trying to bring in new members, so here are a few suggestions: maybe list specifically what you offer—what kind of training the kids get, and what you provide for recreational skiers and the general public (since you mentioned having programs for them). People generally like to see all the details before they feel comfortable picking up the phone...

I actually ended up buying my skis and the rest of my gear over in Canada—sadly—because I couldn't find any decent cross-country skis here in the States...
Over there, it's a much more popular sport, and they constantly have sales and promotions on equipment...
A decent set of skis with bindings usually runs anywhere from $130 to $220...

Sure, you can find gear in Canada, but over the last decade or so, you could always pick stuff up at our local Intersport—and honestly, I think the prices were pretty decent, especially if you caught the end-of-season sales. At the end of the day, they're basically part of that same big retail network like Walmart.
One year, I picked up either a Fischer CS or an RCS set—I can't quite remember which—complete with bindings and poles, and if I recall correctly, I snagged it for less than $333 during a clearance sale. That was a long time ago, though... I'll probably take a quick look sometime this week to see if they even carry that kind of stuff anymore.

I was hunting for gear for my kid this year (8 years old, about 4'5"), and honestly, our local stores are a complete desert. At the Intersport in the WTC in Rijeka, they literally only stock adult sizes—way too long on the skis and poles, and the boot sizes are all wrong.
I eventually managed to score some used gear in Canada through an online classifieds site www.bolha.com. I picked up some Peltonen 157 cm skis with bindings (NNN-Rotafella) for $40, Alpina boots in size 34 for $20, and I found 110 cm poles at a local ski shop in Rijeka for $33. Everything is in great shape and hasn't seen much use!
The skis were picked up in Ljubljana while I was there on a business trip, and the boots were sent via "POSTE RESTANTE" to Jelšanin (for those who don't know, that's right on the border, about 16 miles from Rijeka). It turned out to be the easiest and cheapest way to go; shipping was only about $5, which is significantly less than shipping to America, and I didn't have to deal with any customs headaches.
All in all, the full setup cost me around $60, which is at least half the price of the cheapest new gear available in Canada. Kids grow out of this stuff so fast anyway; they'll probably need new boots by next year regardless.
My advice to anyone just looking to get into cross-country skiing recreationally: take a look at this classifieds site. There is plenty of inventory if you can find a good deal, you just have to keep an eye on it.

My wife and I headed out to Zagmajna yesterday—it’s an Olympic biathlon center located near Mrkoplje. Honestly, the trail itself is stunning, cutting right through this gorgeous coniferous forest. It was just pure peace and quiet... absolute bliss, I suppose. The path is well-maintained, though they haven't set up any tracks for classic skiing yet. There wasn't a soul in sight. We passed two guys who were just heading out right as we arrived. There's a bit of a lack of snow on the trail, but it isn't a dealbreaker. As for the infrastructure surrounding the area? Nonexistent. There's nothing out there toward Mrkoplje (maybe 2-1.9 miles miles away). There used to be some facilities there, but they're in pretty rough shape, and while there is construction happening now, who knows when it'll actually be finished. All in all, the trail is beautiful and the nature is even better, so that's really what matters. Oh, and the loop is about 2.5 miles long, but you can shorten it if you need to, so I guess there's something for everyone. If you're looking to go cross-country skiing and soak in some scenery, I'd say it's worth the trip.

Michael Patel6 said:I suggest we keep this thread going—let’s hear where the snow is actually sitting right now (since it's nowhere to be found), if any gear is on sale, or just general tips on where to find the best deals... basically, all the essential info.

A quick question for those living in the mountains:
Are there any good recreational running trails around for locals? If you know any, please recommend them! Even a contact might help—maybe local running clubs would know which paths are currently well-maintained...

@Frank Green2:
How much did your stay at the mountain resort end up costing you last year?

Well, your estimate for that resort sounds a bit off to me. Back in January 2010, the four of us paid about $80 a night for an apartment, and honestly, it was flawless.
Fast forward to now, and we wanted the exact same place, but the hotel was quoting $125 a night. We even asked why the price jumped so much—especially since they had squeezed us into a larger unit last year for the price of a smaller one, simply because they didn't have our specific reservation available, despite us booking it back in September. I remember thinking it was a bit odd how they managed to fit two extra people in by using the kitchen sofa...🙂 At least they didn't overcharge us then! This year, though, we skipped the smaller unit entirely because nobody wanted to sleep in the kitchen.

We eventually ended up in a lovely apartment in the mountains, literally a stone's throw from last year's cross-country ski trail. It was hit or miss with the weather—snowless for the first half of the week, then non-stop snowfall for the second. We kept hoping a snowcat would show up to groom the trails, but no luck. A few local kids were just cross-country skiing along the side roads instead.

When we were leaving, we chatted with the hosts about the trail situation, and here's the scoop: the snowcat is privately owned by someone who just built a new lodge near the nearby village. Since he's always working, the machine stays over there, and he might head our way to clear trails if the neighbors stop complaining about him driving through their fields. So, despite the great scenery, we aren't counting on the trails being ready until the local municipality or some official organization steps up and gets its own equipment.

Based on what's being said about the area further north, they've cleared at least one path, but overall, things are looking a bit bleak.
If anyone spots a good trail out there, please let the group know! 🙂

Oh, and looking at the shops over the last few years, the best selection of gear I saw was last month at the Intersport over at the Westgate mall. I wasn't with an expert, so I can't vouch for the technical specs, but they had brands like Fischer and TecnoPro—here are some photos.

Chloe Perez said:That whole situation with Rogl felt a bit off to me. Back in January 2010, the four of us paid $74 a night for an apartment, and honestly, it was absolutely flawless.
Now we were looking at that exact same spot, but they were quoting $114 a night from the hotel side. We actually asked them why there was such a huge price jump—especially since last year they bumped us into a 4+2 unit but charged us the rate for a 2+2, probably because they didn't have the 2+2 available despite our reservation back in September. I also thought it was a little weird having to sleep on a couch in the kitchen just to squeeze two extra people in there. 🙂 At least they didn't overcharge us! Regardless, we decided against the 2+2 this year because nobody wanted to end up sleeping in the kitchen.

In the end, we headed out to the mountains near Blue Ridge, staying in a fantastic apartment located literally two meters from last year's cross-country trail. For the first half of the week, there wasn't a snowflake in sight, but once the second half hit, it just wouldn't stop snowing. We kept hoping a snowcat might show up to groom things, but no luck there. Some local kids were out cross-country skiing on the side roads, though.

When we were leaving, we checked in with the hosts about the trail situation, and here's the scoop: the snowcat is privately owned by the guy who just built that new lodge and ski hill over in Kupjak—that little town nearby. So, that machine is constantly over there, and he might eventually come over to Blue Ridge to groom a trail if the neighbors stop complaining about people crossing their fields. So, even though the location looks promising, we aren't counting on Blue Ridge until the local club, the city, or some other organization steps up and gets their own snowcat.

Based on what’s being said about Zagmajna, they did manage to clear at least one trail, but overall, it doesn't look great.
If anyone else spots a good trail, please let the rest of the group know! 🙂

Oh, and looking at the shops over the last few years, I saw the most gear just last month at the Intersport over in Westgate. I wasn't with an expert, so I can't really vouch for the quality level. They had brands like Fischer and Technopro—here are some photos.

I just got back from the Blue Ridge area today, and you're totally right about the snowcat; the trail wasn't anything special, but since I'm just a beginner, it met all my needs...
There's a competition happening next weekend, so the trail should be in great shape by then...
From what I heard, a local entrepreneur actually wanted to build a massive ski resort there—they even had all the infrastructure ready and bought a snowcat, but the locals refused to sell him the land needed for the project...
As for lodging, half-board is $97/person for double or triple rooms. The hotel is actually wonderful; it was just built two years ago...
Skiing is $10/day, lessons are $33/hour, and you can rent gear too, though I don't know the exact price...
I'm heading back again next weekend, so if anyone else is interested, let me know...

Joshua Johnson said:I just got back from the mountains today—and you were spot on about the snowcat! The trail wasn't exactly world-class, but since I'm still a total beginner, it did the trick for me...
There's a competition happening next weekend, so the slopes should be in great shape by then...
From what I heard, a local developer actually planned to build a massive ski resort there—they even set up all the infrastructure and bought a snowcat—but he couldn't get the locals to sell off enough land to make the project happen...
As for staying over, half-board is $97/person for double or triple rooms. The hotel is honestly lovely—it was just built two years ago...
Skiing is $10/day, lessons are $33/hour, and you can rent gear too, though I didn't catch the price...
I'm heading back again next weekend, so if anyone else is interested, let me know...

So, were you over at the Kupjak area? I'm just curious where they'll have the trails ready for next weekend—is it at the Kupjak snow park or right up in the main mountains?

Chloe Perez said:Wait, were you actually out at Kupjak? I'm just trying to figure out where they'll have the trail set up next weekend—is it going to be over by the sledding hill in Kupjak, or are we talking the main area in Ravna Gora?

The trail is right near the school—the sledding hill is closer to the restaurant and hotel area, so I'm pretty sure that puts it in Ravna Gora... it's the specific trail used by their local club, Ravnogorac...