steelsurfer42 said:So you're telling me there's a difference between my posts getting nuked and those death-promoters getting their content wiped? Give me a break! How can you sit there and act all offended by the mere suggestion of suppressing free speech, yet when I point to an actual, blatant case happening right in front of us, you suddenly have nothing to say? What's the deal with that? 🤔
I don't see any damn reason why we need to slap a disclaimer on every single post just because there's one in the PDF. Honestly, that would be a logistical nightmare! What, is the moderator supposed to manually edit every single thread? It’s ridiculous. Plus, it’s pretty insulting to the people on this forum who actually disagree with those kinds of views. Why make things harder than they need to be?
Maybe we should put a warning at the start of every single thread—or at least the first page of them—whenever people start promoting death? Seriously, shouldn't there be some kind of heads-up?
Here we go again. Every time someone posts about bombings on the PZ boards, it gets wiped instantly. If you’ve already replied to something before it disappears, just quote your own damn post—this thread is blowing up so fast that half my stuff is flying right past me! Seriously though, does anyone actually believe that "freedom of speech" covers sharing recipes for making explosives or guides on how to pirate software illegally? Is that what we're doing now? Since when did that become a right?
Jose White18 isn't even into alternative medicine. His comments are on a whole different level—I’d even go as far as to say his motives are similar to mine. Sure, I've posted on those alternative medicine boards, but that stuff makes up a tiny fraction of my total posts. It only ended up there because one specific chat thread got moved by accident. So, statistically speaking, I'm not even sure how much I've actually written there... And honestly? When I *did* post, I found myself clashing with the alternative crowd way more often than with the skeptics.
I am definitely not "selling an alternative." It’s pretty damn obvious that I’m not doing that, and neither is Jose White18. And look at Ryan Gomez4—she literally just said she works in construction. She isn't out here peddling MMS to anyone! 🤣
Thanks for the info, though I gotta say, what you’ve already laid out here is more than enough for me to work with. Seriously. ;
Maybe nobody is actually out there selling snake oil, but honestly, what else are we even doing here if we aren't just debating ideas? And yet, look at you all—suddenly playing bodyguard for people pushing concepts that are straight-up dangerous to anyone's health or survival. Seriously?
Just because someone works outside the medical field doesn't mean they can't spend their free time pushing an agenda. Look, I get it—nobody is actually out there selling much Yin Yang, but you can bet your life they’re lurking around hospitals telling people that modern medicine is dangerous. Seriously? You really think that counts as "freedom of speech"?
So, you want me to define what a forum scammer actually is? You really want to go there? Fine. Let's talk about these bottom-feeders. What even is a "forum manipulator"? It’s that special breed of snake who crawls into a thread just to stir the pot. They aren't here to discuss anything real. They don't care about the truth. They're just looking to play mind games, spread misinformation, and twist people's words until everyone's confused. They live for the drama! They feed on the chaos they create. One minute they're acting like your best friend, and the next, they're twisting the knife just to see if you'll bleed. Isn't it pathetic? How can anyone stand being around these types? They're nothing but vultures circling a discussion, waiting to pick it apart for their own twisted satisfaction. 😉
Alright, fine. Since we’re finally done with all that descriptive nonsense, can we please get back to the actual topic? 😛
What's with this style? Is it just me, or are we seeing people drop six posts in such a short window? Seriously, what gives? 🤷
🤣
If there’s one thing I’ve learned in my short life so far, it’s that you can't take anything at face value. Facts change. Perspectives shift. It’s all just a game of probability in the end. I’m not some fanatic who clings to anything. 😉 Look, the question isn't whether an alternative is this or that—that doesn't matter. What matters is that I have zero interest in protecting anyone's "sacred cows" or having forbidden topics on this forum. As a user, sure, I can just follow the rules or stay away from certain threads, but as a moderator responsible for enforcing them? No way. I am not going to censor anyone's opinion. I don't want my own beliefs protected by "official" measures either, because I've seen more than once how a "sacred cow" turns out to be nothing but nonsense once you actually have access to the info. And if we want as much information available as possible, you inevitably have to deal with some garbage. That kind of control is just not an option for me.
Yeah, everything changes. I mean, wouldn't you love to hear that the Earth actually orbits the moon, or that lions reproduce by splitting in half? :
To make any progress, it’s useless to keep questioning the exact same things over and over (unless you're digging deeper, but then you aren't really asking the same thing). You just have to maintain the existing knowledge—and trust me, given how massive the amount of information is today, that's a huge task—so it doesn't get lost. There are two fronts to this: education and fighting against pseudoscience. That second part has exploded lately because the pseudoscience crowd is getting louder and more aggressive every single day. Just look at what happened recently when Vinković was practically lynched just for daring to point out that Mišakov’s show has absolutely no business being part of an educational curriculum. The show is exactly where it’s always been: more pseudoscientific than ever. Regarding those sacred cows...
Oh, there’s plenty of that. But I wonder, what happens when someone comes onto the PZ board with actual research? Like, concrete facts, but they tie it to every topic they can find? It’s not off-topic, it’s not even unscientific, it’s just an argument—even if it's debatable. They’d probably be banned instantly as if they were a troll. It’s not just that skeptics naturally troll every alternative topic (and honestly, I don't even consider that trolling; I actually support those debates), but on top of that, while they're allowed to criticize, they simultaneously demand that certain "sacred cows" remain untouchable. Seriously... go play with your weird little fringe theories if you want, but don't come here trying to lecture us on our own medicine, okay?
You need to be more active in those spaces if you want to be able to judge them. You have to drive out the hardcore creationists, the perpetual motion machine believers, the cranks, and whoever else falls into that category.
New topics will definitely be accepted and analyzed, it's just that there aren't that many of them, and the people creating them often get absolutely livid when they get an explanation. I remember this one woman who was obsessed with interpreting her dreams through time travel, and she wouldn't even entertain the possibility that her own memory was just playing tricks on her. 😍
When I used to be on that old "On the Edge..." show, I left because they were systematically archiving and deleting posts from anyone who disagreed with the main themes. Looks like nothing has changed.
| Look, like I said, it doesn't matter. It's just your side showing up to push a specific agenda. Everyone else here—including those who technically oppose this stuff but are stuck doing their jobs (looking at you, mods and admins)—personally wouldn't touch this with a ten-foot pole if they weren't moderating this subforum. It’s a completely irrelevant point. So, don't even think for a second that "consensus" here means anything. You could get a consensus on which NFL team is the best during a weekly meeting at the Dallas Cowboys headquarters for all it's worth. 😁 |
So, you're telling me it doesn't matter when someone is out there convincing people that actual medicine is evil and that they should seek help from people who ended up in prison because of their "practice"?
I'm dying to know if people run into these kinds of issues on other forums too. 😁
Give me a break. I was talking about laws that actually apply to the real world.
I'm not going to weigh in on how other mods handle things—not that I should, since calling out moderator actions outside the private staff subforum is against the rules anyway. You should take that up with her or the admins directly. As for the post being deleted, I’m assuming it was just flagged as off-topic, not because someone was trying to censor an opinion.
Maybe we could put a warning at the start of every thread—or at least the first page of any thread—that promotes death?
There aren't really many threads like this. Most topics revolve around treating this or that, so people tend to jump in with those intentions. You can't exactly predict what kind of posts are going to show up.
Based on what my lawyer has told me so far, it looks like we’re stuck with this "cow medicine" approach for now. Looks like we'll eventually have to push for it to be banned. 😁
Once again, posts about explosives get wiped immediately on the PZ forums. If you’ve already replied to something, just quote it, because the threads blow up so fast that my comments tend to fly right off the screen. Does anyone actually believe freedom of speech should cover instructions for making bombs or guides on how to pirate software illegally?
We’ve already given an answer to this multiple times, but since people keep looping back to the same points, it’s pretty obvious they aren't actually reading the replies. Flooding the thread like this just puts everyone else at risk, and refusing medical treatment only hurts the individual. Comparing this to using pirated software is a stretch; while illegal software is inherently against the law, choosing to decline treatment isn't a crime—it's a fundamental right.
It’s possible that nobody is actually selling snake oil here, but then again, this whole place is just about what people write. Yet somehow, you all find yourselves playing defense for those pushing ideas that are genuinely dangerous to health or life.
Well, we're all in this together. If I were running the show over in the politics or history department, I'd probably react pretty much the same way whenever someone tries to force those niche, topical debates onto everyone else. 🙂
Just because someone isn't in the medical field doesn't mean they can't spend their free time pushing an agenda. Sure, maybe Yin Yang isn't exactly moving units, but they're certainly making a habit of walking through hospitals telling people that conventional medicine is dangerous. Do you really consider that a valid exercise of free speech?
If someone is working within a hospital, that falls under the jurisdiction of the hospital administration. In my view, they have every right to oversee what happens under their roof, including stepping in to issue sanctions when necessary. That said, I believe people should still be able to discuss anything and everything—there shouldn't be any forbidden topics.
What’s the deal with people dropping six posts in such a short window? Kind of a weird vibe.
lol
So, does that just make them total pushovers? 🤔
Well, everything changes. I recently found out that the Earth actually orbits the moon, and apparently, lions reproduce by splitting in half. :
Constantly questioning the same basic facts isn't progress—unless you're actually digging deeper, but that’s a different conversation entirely. You just have to maintain what we know, especially considering how massive the sheer volume of information has become lately. We can't afford to lose it. There are two main fronts in this effort: education and the fight against pseudoscience. That second one has exploded over the last few decades because the pseudoscientists are getting louder and more aggressive by the day. Just look at how they recently went after Vinković simply because he dared to point out that Mišakov's show has absolutely no business being part of an educational curriculum. The show hasn't changed; if anything, it's more pseudo than ever. It's all about protecting those sacred cows.
The issue with this show isn't actually its content, but where they decided to slot it in the schedule. In a free society, you can't police what people believe. Whether someone thinks the Earth is a flat pancake or that fossils are just some trick by the devil, defending against those views is basically an infringement on freedom—no matter how ridiculous the opinion might be. Trying to fight these crusade-style battles won't help anyone either; it’ll just drain your time away from things that actually matter. I remember back when I was younger and full of fire, thinking I had to step in and clear up everyone's misconceptions. But as you get older, you realize that's just a naive waste of energy. It’s much smarter to pour that effort into actual research rather than chasing down other people's nonsense. 😁 "The struggle." God, that sounds so pretentious. 🤣 You can fight for whatever you want, sure. But I have zero patience for people treating sacred cows like they're gospel, and that’s really all there is to it. 🙂 Look, like I said before, you guys are technically right on all counts. There’s really no point in dragging this argument out any further.
You really need to spend more time out there if you want to have an informed opinion on this. You'll run into all sorts of people—creationists, perpetual motion enthusiasts, extremists, and probably a few others of that same stripe.
New topics always get scrutinized and analyzed around here. The problem is that there aren't many of them, and the people posting them often fly into a rage the moment someone offers an explanation. I still remember this one woman who was dead set on interpreting her dreams through time travel. She wouldn't even entertain the idea that her own memory might be playing tricks on her. :cerhek:
Back when I was part of that old "On the Edge..." group, I ended up leaving because they were systematically deleting and wiping out anyone who dared to disagree with the main topics. Looking at things now, it seems like absolutely nothing has changed.
Look, I haven't been on the PZ forums or the old subreddits lately, so I really don't have anything to add to this conversation. 😳
So, you're telling me you don't care that someone is out there convincing people that modern medicine is evil and that they should instead seek help from practitioners who have a criminal record?
No, and I’m not saying we shouldn't call things out. My issue is with the idea of being afraid to write or think something because of potential repercussions, even if those threats are just happening online. 🙂
Just wait and see. I was talking about laws in the real world.
I have no idea where you'd find 🤔
We aren't talking about the real world here; we're talking about the digital space and the rules of this forum. 😁
