Mixed Martial Arts in Indianapolis?

Look, it’s the same old story—these guys all come from the local gym. The guys over at Gold's Gym go absolutely nuts for this stuff, so they just group up and tear into you. And honestly, most of the time I'm stuck playing guard. My go-to moves are the armbar from guard or a triangle choke, but let me be clear: it’s not because I’m some tactical genius choosing them. It’s pure survival. When you're facing someone who's significantly heavier than you, you don't get a choice. You just do what you have to do to stay alive. 😁
Anyway, what if we skinny guys actually got together for once? 😁

"Skinny people of the world, unite!"

For instance, I’ve rolled with guys weighing over 220 lbs a few times. Even when they had about 30 or 40 lbs of extra weight on them, it didn't really slow me down; I was able to take them down, control them, break through their defense, and dictate the pace however I wanted. He had practiced some judo back in the day, but the weight difference just didn't translate to a strength advantage, so I didn't run into those typical struggles you might expect...

I've actually thought about joining a local club myself, but honestly, nothing I've checked out really clicked with me. I’m looking for something with plenty of live rolling during practice, rather than just endless drilling of specific sequences that you end up never using in a real situation.

Looking at the posts above, it seems like self-taught people regularly beat those Judas types at their own game.
I have to admit, I’ve definitely been there myself. 🙂

Hehe... I guess it’s always important to pick your battles, right? :-) For instance, I haven't had much luck going up against wrestlers—especially those who only ever studied judo as an elective course at the Democratic Party university.

PS Can someone please mention Indianapolis real quick so this thread doesn't get totally off track?😁

Indianapolis is a great city, and I've been wondering about the practical advantages of wrestling over judo—specifically, which techniques actually hold up better when things get real.

Daniel Chavez14 said:Indianapolis is a great city, but I’m actually curious about the advantages of wrestling over judo—specifically, which of their techniques prove to be more effective.

That’s a great question! :-)
If you're looking at Greco-Roman or freestyle wrestling, you won't find many of the traditional levers or chokes you might expect. Interestingly enough, some wrestlers do utilize neck cranks (which usually just end up being variations of chokes and control positions), and certain shoulder locks too—though I honestly couldn't tell you why those specific ones are prioritized.
If what you're really interested in is submission wrestling (I'm not sure if there's a specific American term for it), the biggest distinction is that, unlike judo, BJJ, or sambo practitioners, wrestlers don't wear gis or anything similar, which completely changes the tactical approach. When it comes to holds, leverage, and submissions, it's essentially a synthesis of all grappling skills. Just keep in mind that in most competitions, things like neck cranks, heel hooks, and spinal attacks are typically banned.

Now, when it comes to dealing with an opponent, you absolutely have to have a solid game plan. For instance, whenever I realize someone is significantly stronger than me or just plain better at takedowns—look at this Judas over here—I knew damn well I didn't stand a chance trying to take him down myself. If I tried, he’d just toss me aside, end up in some ridiculous side mount, and then I'd be completely screwed. It’s a mess. Instead, you just play it smart, pull him into a guard, and go from there. It makes things much more manageable.
Americans are honestly the best when it comes to positioning; they find their way to the top whenever they feel like it.

wanderingridge said:When it comes to positioning, Americans really know how to take control whenever they decide to step up.

I actually rolled with this one guy recently, and he was pretty solid—honestly, a bit stronger than me, which seems to be the theme of my life! I managed to catch him in a guillotine right out of the gate and tried to pull my guard back in, but he slipped right out of it. As he was getting back up, I attempted to transition into a knee lever, but I just couldn't get any traction because everything was so sweaty. After that, I went straight into defensive mode... I set my guard and just waited. I couldn't move him an inch, and there wasn't enough space to even attempt a sweep from the bottom because he had me pinned flat against the mat; I just couldn't create any room to work. In my struggle to keep things under control, he started working his way through my half guard and eventually transitioned into side control. He went for a kimura, and after a few minutes of fighting it, I just couldn't hold on anymore—my forearms were absolutely burning and I couldn't even keep my grip tight. The kimura locked in, and it was tap-tap.😢

Zachary Bennett3 said:the biggest difference is that unlike Judas, JJ, Samba, and those other fighters,they don't wear gi's.

What even is a gi?😕
Are you maybe talking about a kimono?

Zachary Bennett3 said:Spot on! :-)
Well, if you're talking about Greco-Roman or freestyle wrestling, there aren't really any levers or chokes involved, which I think you probably already know. Somehow, though, wrestlers still seem to know their way around neck cranks (since they're basically just variations of ties and control positions) and different versions of shoulder locks—not that I have any clue why, honestly, some wrestler should probably be able to explain that one to us.

In wrestling, they do all sorts of shoulder locks on the ground, but not things like a Kimura... more like Nelsons, half-Nelsons, and quarter-Nelsons.
I mean, I could totally walk you through how that looks in a wrestling match if you're actually interested.

The thing is, in wrestling, the whole point isn't about finding a lever you can't escape from; it's more about using leverage to flip someone from their chest onto their back (getting the pin).

So, yeah, they definitely have experience with stuff that's super similar.

If you're curious about what people call submission wrestling (I'm not even sure if there's a specific American term for it), the biggest difference is that unlike guys doing Judo, Jiu-Jitsu, or Sambo, these wrestlers don't wear gi's and their equivalents, which changes the whole vibe of the sport. As far as moves, levers, and chokes go, it’s kind of like a mashup of all different grappling skills. Usually, at competitions, they don't allow neck cranks, heel hooks, or attacks on the spine.

Actually, I think heel hooks are allowed; you can check the full rulebook right on the ADCC website.

- Steve -

Daniel Chavez14 said:What even are gays? 😕
Maybe they're just kimonos?

Yeah, totally the same thing. I mean, maybe? haha.

- briskjackal5 -

briskjackal5 said:In wrestling, they use shoulder locks on the ground—not quite like a Kimura, but more like Nelson, half-Nelson, or quarter-Nelson holds.
If you want, I can walk you through how those look in a wrestling match.
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I'm definitely interested.
Some photos would be perfect, if you have a link.

briskjackal5 said:In grappling, they utilize shoulder locks while on the ground—not quite like a Kimura, but more along the lines of Nelson variations, like half-Nelsons or quarter-Nelsons.
I can walk you through how those look in actual grappling if you're curious.

I have a decent idea of what Nelsons look like, but thanks for the reminder that they actually exist... Most of my mental imagery comes from pro-wrestling (😳), so I tend to overlook their legitimate roots.
Man, a full-nelson can be brutal (it’s less of a neck-crank and more of a shoulder wrench) if someone strong gets a grip on you; honestly, most people have probably been caught in one at some point without even realizing it.🙂

PS Heel-hooks are allowed pretty much everywhere... ADCC allows them, though you won't see them in lower-level tournaments.

Found something pretty interesting:

http://members.fortunecity.com/furna...olds/holds.htm

I used to train judo back in Virginia. The sessions were brutal, honestly—we spent an incredible amount of time drilling throws, pins, and chokes. I actually still have my old manuals on submission holds and grappling techniques. Given that background, which sport do you think provides the best foundation for MMA, and where would be the best place to go for serious training?

WHAT'S THE BEST SPORT TO START WITH FOR MMA AND WHERE CAN YOU ACTUALLY TRAIN FOR IT?

It’s Muay Thai, wrestling, and BJJ—that’s the tried and true combo right there.