Questions about water

wiredmarlin20 said:😁 😁
They listed everything under the sun!

Regarding corrosion...
I'll ask the crew tomorrow what the pipes are actually made of, but don't you think standard water main pipes would rust way too fast if they were just plain iron? That mix of dissolved oxygen and chlorine would speed things up big time.

The plumbing inside buildings is iron, but the stuff underground isn't—it's some kind of plastic. I saw them installing it (black and blue color), and I know my water tasted like plastic or rubber for about six months straight...🤮

No clue what the old pipes were before these new ones went in!

If PVC or whatever polymer they use actually messed with the taste, then every single bottle of flashy water out there would taste bland as hell.

Kevin Mitchell20 said:Personally, I just head straight to the spring, like I do... there are plenty of them around Chicago

Lead, most likely. And lead is terrible for brain development...

they're lead-based... but they're drain pipes...

Kyle Nelson2 said:they're lead-based... but they're drain pipes...

unfortunately they're used for water supply too. I know that for a fact since I'm working on a water management project...

Kyle Nelson2 said:If PVC or whatever polymer they use actually messed with the taste, then every single bottle of flashy water out there would taste bland as hell.

Look, if you leave water in a 10-liter plastic jug, it’s going to taste like plastic.
We’ve been over this—run an experiment if you don't believe me!

It's the same deal with standard plastic bottles, it just takes longer. Like, water sitting in a big jug for a week? It starts getting that slight plastic hit...

I stick to bottled water; it just tastes better to me. I end up drinking more when it’s like that. Plus, I'm definitely spending 🙂

wiredmarlin20 said:Look, if you leave water in a 10-liter plastic jug, it’s going to taste like plastic.
We’ve been over this—run an experiment if you don't believe me!

It's the same deal with standard plastic bottles, it just takes longer. Like, water sitting in a big jug for a week? It starts getting that slight plastic hit...

Plastic—specifically PVC—isn't biodegradable. It takes about 500 years to break down in nature. But let's say the water actually speeds that process up and it only takes 50 years. An average bottle weighs about 50 grams.
That would be roughly 1 gram per year. So, if you store it for a month, you're looking at 0.1 grams per 2 liters, which works out to about 0.005 grams per deciliter...

If I had to try and estimate how much volume that is (since I don't know the exact density of PVC per cubic centimeter), let's just assume it's similar to the weight of water. So, 10 cc³ is about 1 liter or 1000 grams.
10 cc³/20 = 0.5 cc³ = 500 mm³ (which is the volume of the bottle).
If the bottle breaks down over 50 years, that means about 0.2% of the bottle dissolves every month.
500 * 0.2% = 1 mm³ for the whole 2-liter bottle, or about 0.05 mm³ per deciliter of water.

So, in a worst-case scenario, we’re talking 0.05 mm³ of dissolved PVC per deciliter if the water sits for a month and the bottle decays in 50 years (instead of 500). Honestly, I think it’d be closer to 0.03 mm³ max.
Just for context, a grain of cornmeal or wheat grits is usually around 0.15–0.3 mm³.

Megan Wood81 said:Hello, everyone!
I find myself pondering various "water-related" matters lately 😁 , so
I was hoping to gather some of your thoughts on the subject 😉
Does the municipal tap water here in America undergo any fluoridation?
Do you typically drink from the tap, opt for bottled water, or perhaps something else entirely? 🙂
What is your take on Brita filters, and do you find them useful in your daily routine?
To what extent does the quality of your drinking water concern you—or does it even cross your mind at all?
One more thing, where might one find bottles of Evian? I haven't been able to spot them
in any local grocery stores... 🙄

I actually managed to grab some Evian over at Vrutak; they carry it every now and then, though it’s a bit hit-or-miss, but that’s really the only spot where I’ve had any luck finding it here in Chicago.

Kyle Nelson2 said:Plastic—specifically PVC—isn't biodegradable. It takes about 500 years to break down in nature. But let's say the water actually speeds that process up and it only takes 50 years. An average bottle weighs about 50 grams.
That would be roughly 1 gram per year. So, if you store it for a month, you're looking at 0.1 grams per 2 liters, which works out to about 0.005 grams per deciliter...

If I had to try and estimate how much volume that is (since I don't know the exact density of PVC per cubic centimeter), let's just assume it's similar to the weight of water. So, 10 cc³ is about 1 liter or 1000 grams.
10 cc³/20 = 0.5 cc³ = 500 mm³ (which is the volume of the bottle).
If the bottle breaks down over 50 years, that means about 0.2% of the bottle dissolves every month.
500 * 0.2% = 1 mm³ for the whole 2-liter bottle, or about 0.05 mm³ per deciliter of water.

So, in a worst-case scenario, we’re talking 0.05 mm³ of dissolved PVC per deciliter if the water sits for a month and the bottle decays in 50 years (instead of 500). Honestly, I think it’d be closer to 0.03 mm³ max.
Just for context, a grain of cornmeal or wheat grits is usually around 0.15–0.3 mm³.

👍 👍 👍

Everything you said is technically true, but it's also true that if you leave water in a plastic jug for a certain amount of days, it picks up a plastic taste (not a smell). Your math suggests there’s nothing to fear regarding ingesting dissolved (decomposed) plastic, but when it comes to the flavor... do the experiment yourself!

I know this because whenever I head out to the mountains in the Midwest, I fill up four 10-15 liter jugs of water that I know is top-tier, but I have to pour some into glass bottles just so it doesn't end up tasting like plastic.

When I'm back home in the Midwest, I always stick to spring water because the municipal tap water tastes absolutely horrendous—it has this awful, lingering stench. It’s especially jarring when I return from my trips to San Diego, where the water quality is truly top-tier. I recall reading somewhere that the water in San Diego is considered some of the finest in the country because of the surrounding mountain ranges and similar geography; presumably, by the time the water reaches the taps, it has been naturally filtered through all those rock formations... or something along those lines.
I have no scientific way of proving it, but I know for a fact that the water there is delicious, whereas just thinking about that Midwestern tap water makes my stomach turn...

mellowbadger24 said:I actually managed to grab some Evian over at Vrutak; they carry it every now and then, though it’s a bit hit-or-miss, but that’s really the only spot where I’ve had any luck finding it here in Chicago.

I've spotted Evian at some of the local gas stations—only problem is, it was sitting there for about 13 bucks.$4.75-honestly, that is just way too much to pay for a liter and a half of water.
Especially since, if you ask me, it doesn't even come close to being as good as our Jane.

Kate Cox2 said:I've spotted Evian at some of the local gas stations—only problem is, it was sitting there for about 13 bucks.$4.75-honestly, that is just way too much to pay for a liter and a half of water.
Especially since, if you ask me, it doesn't even come close to being as good as our Jane.

Honestly, I can't wrap my head around why people still do it. Walking into a store here in the States and seeing Evian priced at thirteen bucks? It’s absolutely ridiculous. I was grabbing some supplies the other day and saw that price tag, and I just had to take a second to process the sheer absurdity of it. At that point, you aren't even paying for water anymore; you're basically paying a premium just for the branding and that fancy label. It feels like a total scam when you realize how much more you're shelling out compared to just grabbing a decent bottle of Brita filtered water or even a standard brand from the local supermarket. I don't know, maybe I'm just being cynical, but it feels like such a waste of money.$4.75 To me, a single liter of this stuff is just a massive waste of time—honestly, I’d call it something much worse than stupid. 🤣

So, I gave that Active O2—you know, the one with the extra oxygen boost from Adelholzener Quellen—a shot. It’s quite pleasant, really, though I wouldn't go so far as to say it’s some kind of revolutionary breakthrough. By the way, I haven't actually tried Evian yet, but if you ask anyone, they'll tell you it isn't any better than Jane.

It’s not that the water lacks "flavor"—some just tastes better than others—and I'm not even talking about whether it's chemically or biologically pure 😬. Harder waters—like what you get near the coast in places like San Diego—usually taste way better than that soft, flat stuff from the plains.
Vienna has some of the best water on the planet—it's piped in straight from the Alps using gravity alone without needing pumps, running nearly 106 miles. A few months back, they even started bottling it to sell as souvenirs—I saw it all over the internet.

I stick to Jane; out of all the bottled brands, it’s the least salty for me (and honestly, the closest thing to Evian 😛). Down here in my part of the US, the tap water is pretty bland, and it never stays cold enough—unlike the water in a place like Rijeka—no matter how long you let it run, it always ends up feeling lukewarm.🙄

Water from the coast near San Diego tends to be soft, whereas the stuff you get in Chicago is notoriously hard...

The US is actually one of those rare places where you can find massive amounts of drinkable water just sitting there. Honestly, I only bother with bottled stuff when I'm stuck in the car or traveling through some remote area; once I'm home, I go straight from the tap. It feels like a total waste of money to hand over cash for bottled water when our local supply is perfectly fine to drink. Megan Wood81 was asking whether we fluoridate our water here, but unlike a lot of other places out there, it isn't standard practice for us. As for the chlorine issue, it's simple—just pour the water back and forth between two glasses a few times or let it sit for a bit, and the chlorine evaporates right off. And by the way, the water in San Diego isn't soft; it’s definitely softer than what you get in Chicago, but it doesn't qualify as soft. I have to admit, though, it's easily one of the best and cleanest water sources in the country. (It's been proven.)

So, regarding the Nobel corporation and those kinds of gadgets... I actually had a representative come by to run a water survey. I can't quite recall the specific company name, but all these filters operate on the exact same principle involving water electrolysis. Honestly, the woman was completely unprepared—or rather, she just threw out so much jargon at me that my head started spinning. She tries to perform this electrolysis test on a sample, and sure enough, the water turns black. Then, she runs the water through their filter, and lo and behold, nothing happens during the electrolysis. Well, of course nothing happens, because she’s essentially producing demineralized water that doesn't conduct electricity anymore. If the water tastes flat and lifeless, it's because it is. And then, as if that wasn't enough, the grand finale was her offering me an add-on to buy a component that "improves" the taste by re-mineralizing the filtered water. It's just a total waste of money, isn't it? At least not until we're forced to drink it. I even asked her if she could try the electrolysis on some Jane's water, but she refused, claiming she wasn't allowed to—though I'm certain the result would have been identical to just using tap water from the sink.

All those water filters are total garbage and nothing more than a marketing scam... In cities like San Diego or Miami, the tap water is actually some of the best you'll find, and it'd honestly be a waste of money to install filters because the water has such a "smooth" taste (even if they claim water is just a colorless, odorless liquid with no flavor 🙂 ))
As for me, if I'm drinking water, it's straight from the tap, though my partner prefers Jane (it's tough to get used to that "hard" Midwest water after having a taste of that smooth coastal stuff)

And I’ve got my doubts about bottled water too. Tap water is monitored every single day, but those bottled brands??? On this last bottle of Jane we bought, the label says it was tested back on December 22, 2006.!!!!

gentlecanyon92 said:And what if studies have already shown otherwise? That plain tap water actually outperforms anything flashy in a bottle?

So, they were just testing standard tap water from people's homes... not some fancy "spring water"?

Yeah, I’ve come across that too. Honestly, tap water is amazing, especially here in the States or over in places like Austria where there’s just an absolute abundance of fresh water. For the most part, it’s actually a step up from anything you’d grab in a bottle.

The only real things you have to watch out for are nitrates from agricultural runoff or maybe traces of pharmaceuticals that find their way into the supply. Other than that, the water quality is monitored so strictly that you can drink it without stressing out at all.

1. The regulations for bottled water are actually quite different from the standards set for municipal tap water—they’re much more flexible when it comes to bottled stuff. For instance, while the EPA sets the limit for manganese in tap water at 0.05mg/L, the standard for bottled water is way higher at 2mg/L. Or take ammonia: tap water is capped at 0.1mg/L, but there isn't even a specific limit for bottled water...
2. If you live somewhere where the local health department has already cleared the water as safe, but your water still has a weird smell or taste, you might want to look into replacing your home's plumbing. It’s kind of like replacing a roof or updating your siding; you wouldn't call out a professional roofing contractor and expect them to fix your house for free.
As for water hardness, there aren't any legal maximum limits for Calcium or Magnesium, though there definitely are minimum levels required for drinking water.

At the end of the day, which water you choose to drink is entirely up to you.

Kevin Mitchell20 said:unfortunately they're used for water supply too. I know that for a fact since I'm working on a water management project...

Precisely. The older supply pipes are lead, but it’s hardly an issue since they’re lined with a thick layer of calcium buildup, effectively insulating the water from the lead.

The situation is somewhat grim in the Midwest plains, where arsenic and other elements are present by default.

Personally, I drink tap water after a minor intervention. I have a built-in Norwegian filter—a Polar system. The taste is actually quite excellent.

Bottled water, on the other hand, often has a certain "greasy" quality to it. I suspect it's just the plastic.