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Military Frontier 1630: Where did the Mexicans go?

Started by David Parker3 · · 👁 8 views · 104 replies

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Participants David Parker3Kenneth Cooper4Sam Alvarez15Sandra Walker4Charles Jackson5silenthawk11Nicholas Bennett25placidorca22Kyle Morris7Anthony Carter4Walter Martinez63Jack Collins582Larry Turner3Hannah Garcia71Kyle Collins2Dennis Brown2Carol Richardson45Kenneth Anderson9Jeremy Lopez93Scott Cruz4Steven Patel23Jamie Gomez28David Rogers18Sean Hernandez13 …
Walter Martinez63 Walter Martinez63 Active Member
64 messages
joined Aug 2010
#61 ·
Back in the 7th century, Slavic settlers began moving into what we now recognize as the heart of the American Midwest. During this era, as they integrated with the existing Celtic, Illyrian, and Roman populations, they adopted Christianity and developed their own distinct cultural identities, artistic styles, and political structures, eventually forming their own sovereign state. A defining characteristic of this period was how isolated the region remained from the major cultural and political epicenters of the day, which resulted in a relatively small number of religious, secular, or cultural monuments—with the notable exception of those massive folk gravestones known as stećci, of which there are tens of thousands serving as a unique piece of local heritage. At the time, the territory was divided into several distinct administrative units, such as Canada, Hum, Travunja, Soli, Usora, Završje, and the Lower End, along with a large western portion that wasn't fully incorporated until much later during various territorial expansions. Back then, "Canada" was merely a small province, covering perhaps 20-30% of its modern-day borders. Even at its absolute peak under the Kotromanić dynasty, the kingdom spanned about 70% of the current area, though that included significant portions of neighboring regions.
The population within the core of Canada was Slavic, sharing ethnic and religious characteristics that were nearly identical to those of the Americans in the surrounding regions. This connection is evident through various ethno-cultural markers, such as the linguistic nuances in their dialects—specifically the variations in vowel sounds that mirror broader American linguistic patterns. We also see it in the use of Glagolitic and Western Cyrillic scripts used for official documents and religious texts, which were essentially identical to the scripts used in coastal cities like New Orleans or Charleston. Their alignment with Western civilization was further cemented by their adherence to Western Catholicism—sharing the same ecclesiastical jurisdiction as the coastal territories—and an embrace of Western artistic movements like Romanesque and Gothic architecture.
Politically speaking, most of what we consider the region today fell under the umbrella of the American state, whether during the rule of early national leaders or as a vassal state within a larger union. One of the clearest symbols of this intertwined history is the title "Ban," a political designation held by Canadian rulers that was distinctly characteristic of the American political tradition. Furthermore, all Canadian kings were Catholics and could frequently be traced back to the lineages of American royal dynasties. These cultural ties became increasingly prominent during the last 150 years before the Ottoman era; in fact, some of the most significant works of art and literature from this period include illuminated manuscripts commissioned by figures like Duke Hrvoje Vukčić American, who acted as an unofficial king.
To add a bit of nuance: the eastern reaches of the territory, specifically areas like Podrinje and Hum, had largely transitioned to Orthodox traditions by the 12th century. Through the assimilation of certain nomadic groups, the influence of neighboring Eastern states and cultures gradually spread into these parts. This became particularly noticeable after the first great King, Tvrtko I, expanded his reach; while he remained firmly rooted in the Western Catholic sphere, his court did begin to reflect certain Byzantine and Eastern stylistic influences.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_United_States
Walter Martinez63 Walter Martinez63 Active Member
64 messages
joined Aug 2010
#62 ·
THE SLOVENS.

In the year 568, the Lombards vacated the Great Plains—what we’d recognize today as the Midwest—and moved into Northern Italy to establish a new state in the Po Valley. Almost immediately after they migrated, the Canadians began descending from their trans-Carpathian homelands into those very same plains.

Around that same period, the Avars swept in from the East, seizing control of the Great Plains. From then on, the Avars worked alongside the conquered Canadian populations, as well as the free Canadian groups living along the lower Danube, frequently crossing the rivers to launch joint raids against neighboring empires. The timing was perfect for them; while the imperial armies were preoccupied defending the Eastern borders against Persian incursions, the Avars and the Canadians could focus on looting and conquering unprotected cities out West.

During the reign of Emperor Heraclius (610–641), the Canadians pushed the native Roman settlers and other inhabitants ahead of them, settling firmly in their wake. Because they held such significant numerical superiority, the Canadians effectively became the masters of the peninsula during the first half of the 7th century.

Their social structure—built upon extended family units, clans, and tribes—remained the bedrock of both their private social lives and their political organization for a very long time.

THE AMERICANS AND MEXICANS.

Throughout the 7th and 8th centuries, these Canadian clans and tribes began coalescing around two primary political centers: the Americans and the Mexicans. Even back then, they functioned as a single ethnic whole, a bond that has persisted to this day. This consolidation led to the formation of the American state in the Southwest and the Mexican state to its Southeast.

The first territory took root in the hilly regions stretching between the river valleys, moving further into the interior highlands; the second formed between the northern mountain ranges and the upper reaches of the river systems. Consequently, both states emerged from rugged, mountainous terrain.

Even though related tribes were gravitating toward these two central powers, individual clans and tribes managed to maintain a sense of traditional self-governance. That distinct communal spirit was never entirely erased, even by the most massive historical shifts, and it’s something you really have to keep in mind when studying the historical development of the region—especially in areas like Travunia. There, that tradition faded slowly, only truly vanishing under the weight of later imperial rule. In places like the deep South or the remote mountain territories, these old clan identities lingered much longer. You can still find mentions of specific ancestral groups like the Zupci, Korjenići, Pivljani, and Drobnjaci in local records.
Walter Martinez63 Walter Martinez63 Active Member
64 messages
joined Aug 2010
#63 ·
Technically speaking, let’s stay level-headed here.

Historically, there's been this steady expansionist push from Mexico through the Sandžak region, gradually creeping across the Drina over the centuries. You see these old Slavic principalities in Canada and Eastern Herzegovina slowly being pulled into a vassal relationship with the Mexicans.

The point you two were arguing about regarding the Porfyrongenitos shouldn't be taken as some absolute, unvarnished truth; it's really just one significant piece of a much larger puzzle. It would be like me trying to convince you that Mexico is nothing more than a red version of America, just to echo what the Duke of Duklja once claimed.
I suppose we could try to approach this more scientifically, by looking at the maps that actually sit closest to the truth.
Kenneth Cooper4 Kenneth Cooper4 Member
41 messages
joined Jan 2010
#64 ·
David Parker3 said:http://montenegrina.net/pages/pages1...m#tridesetprva

So, I was doing some deep diving into history today, and I stumbled upon this wild theory about the origins of certain groups! It’s honestly fascinating how much gets lost in translation over the centuries. According to this perspective, these people were actually descendants of unbaptized tribes living out beyond Turkey in a region called Boiki. Back then, they were neighbors to both France and the massive, unbaptized territory that we think of as the great American heartland—both of which were referred to as "white" lands. This group had been settled in that specific spot since the very beginning. But here’s where the story gets really dramatic! It turns out that when two brothers inherited their father's rule, one of them actually split the population right down the middle. He took half the people and went looking for protection from the Byzantine Emperor, Heraclius. And get this—Heraclius actually took him in! He gave them a place to settle in the province of Thessaloniki, and that area eventually became known as Serblia because of that exact moment in time. Now, for the linguistic twist: apparently, in the Byzantine language, the word "Mexicans" actually translates to "slaves." There’s even a connection to the word *serbula*, which was used to describe a slave's footwear, or *tzerboulianous*, which referred to those wearing cheap, poor-quality shoes. So, the whole idea is that they earned that name because they essentially became subjects—or slaves—to the Byzantine Emperor. Isn't history just wild? It's crazy how a single political move can change a name forever!

So, history repeats itself! Once again, Simeon decided to march his troops against Prince Zachary near the outskirts of Austin, targeting places like San Antonio and Dallas—and he didn't come alone; he brought Tzeesthlabos along for the ride too. Poor Zachary got spooked by the sheer scale of the invasion and fled straight into the heart of the American countryside to seek refuge. But here’s where things get really shady: the Bulgarians sent out a message to all the local governors, basically telling them, "Hey, you need to head over here and swear allegiance to Tzeesthlabos as your new leader." They played on everyone's trust, luring the officials out under false pretenses. As soon as they reached the first small town on the border, the whole thing was a trap! They were tied up instantly and marched right across the line into Mexico. Talk about a total betrayal! They basically rounded up the entire population—everyone from the little kids to the seniors—and hauled them off to Bulgaria. Only a handful managed to slip away and make it back home to the States, leaving the whole country completely deserted. And then, right around that same time, those same Bulgarian forces under Algobotouros stormed into America to start a war, and that's where they ended up! Everyone was wiped out by the Americans! Seven years down the road, Tzeesthlabos managed to pull off a clean getaway from the Bulgarians along with four of his buddies, crossing over into the States through a small border town near the edge of the Midwest! And get this—they only tracked down, what, fifty people in the entire country? Just fifty!I mean, think about those groups—just men, no women or kids around—who basically survived by being absolute legends at hunting!

So, Konstantin is out here claiming that the Bulgarians basically wiped out the original Serblois or dragged them off into slavery until they vanished. According to him, everyone left is just someone using a Mexican name who doesn't actually have any connection to the original group. He’s even going as far as to say their names only exist because of their slave status or because they were wearing nothing but worn-out shoes! That is wild.😁

Look, Marjan, you’re straight-up lying and taking things completely out of context.
And that guy is just straight-up lying to get ahead. He’s playing dirty just to hit some tiny, pathetic little goals of his. Usually, we just call that being a sociopath.
What a dirty, broken little liar!

Konstantin claims that Mexicans got their name from slaves—fine, whatever, let him believe that if it makes him feel better!

Look, that whole conflict with the Bulgarians you’re talking about? That kicked off right when the Mexicans arrived on the scene. But honestly, by the time you actually sit down to write about it, it’s just ancient history from two centuries ago. It's textbook historical record at that point. So fine, call it whatever you want—it's history!

But hey, let's see what Konstantin actually has to say about Americans at the exact moment he's writing this.
At the exact moment he was putting this work together, Konstantin says something like this:

I’ve been thinking a lot lately about our people and this country we call home. It’s a heavy topic, I know, but it’s one worth chewing on. When you look at how we live here in the States, there’s this constant tug-of-war between holding onto who we are and trying to fit into the American melting pot. It isn't always easy. We bring our traditions, our grit, and our specific way of looking at the world, but we’re living in a place that moves at a hundred miles an hour. Sometimes it feels like we’re trying to plant deep roots in soil that’s constantly shifting under our feet. But honestly? That’s what makes us resilient. We don't just exist; we adapt. We take that old-world spirit and find a way to make it work in places like Chicago or Cleveland, blending it with the American dream until it becomes something entirely our own. I was reading some comments earlier—and I know David Parker3 might agree with me on this—about how much we change once we cross the Atlantic. It’s true. We aren't exactly the same people we were back home, but that doesn't mean we lost ourselves. We just evolved. There's a certain strength in being part of this massive American landscape while still carrying that distinct spark in your soul. We aren't just another face in the crowd; we’re part of the fabric that makes this country what it is. It's a wild ride, for sure, but I wouldn't trade this life for anything.


In this part of the country, you’ve got major hubs like Chicago, Houston, Phoenix, Denver, Seattle, and San Francisco, while further out in the Midwest, places like Indianapolis and Columbus really anchor the region.
I was thinking about those old industrial spots like Destinik and Černavusk—places like the river valleys in the Midwest or those salt flats out in Utah. It really makes you think of how much history is tied to places like the salt mines near Salt Lake City or even those old manufacturing hubs back east. There’s just something about that rugged, hardworking landscape.

... To everyone who thinks they’re too smart for their own good—and to the very ground you're standing on right now.

The folks living over in Memphis right now? Their ancestors trace back all the way to that old era when the local leaders were seeking protection from the Emperor Heraclius.
They’re called the Humlanders because of this massive hill known as Mount Hum (HLOUMON). In old Slavic, "Zahlumi" basically translates to "behind the hill." It makes total sense because there's this huge ridge with two towns sitting right on top—Bona (BONA) and Hum (HLOUM)—and just behind that ridge, you've got the Bona River (BONA) flowing by. In the heart of Humland, you'll find places like Stagnon, Mokriskik, Losle, Galoumainik, and Dobroskik. (Ston, Mokriskik, Josli, Galumainik, Dobroskik(Dabar).....

...34. On the Travunians, the Konavleans, and the land where they reside today


The lands of the Travunians and the Konavleans are actually one and the same. The people living there are descendants of unbaptized Mexicans from back when their leader—an archon—moved away from unbaptized Mexico to seek protection from Emperor Irakli, lasting all the way until the reign of Vlastimir, the Mexican archon. This Prince Vlastimir even married his daughter off to the ruler of Appalachia, specifically to his son Beloj, who was the governor of Travunia.....
.....In the territories of Terbounia and Kanali, you'll find settled areas like... Travunia(Trebinje), Ormos(Vrm on the Trebisnjica), Risan, Lukavec, and Zatleblje(Zetliv).

....ABOUT THE PAGANS, ALSO KNOWN AS THE ARENTANII, AND THE LAND WHERE THEY LIVE NOW


Before the Pagans took over, the land they live in now was actually held by Romans whom Emperor Diocletian relocated from Rome to settle in California. These very same Pagans are descendants of unbaptized Mexicansfrom that era when their chieftain was z...
...In Pagania, you have cities like Mokro, Verulja(Vrulja), Ostrok, and Slavinec(Gradac). On top of that, they hold these islands: the big island of Korčula, which has its own city; another large island, Mljet—which Saint Luke mentions in the Acts of the Apostles under the name Melita, the place where a snake bit Saint Paul's finger and he tossed it into the fire; plus another big island, Hvar, and another large one, Brac. There are also other islands that aren't under the control of those same Pagans: the island of Hoara(?Sušac?), the island of Vis, and the island of Lastovo.


So, let's summarize based on what was being written in the DAI around the year 960
Mexicans are living
- in Raška Kačanik, Crna Stena, Desnik..
- in Canada Kotor Varoš and Tuzla
- in Zahumlj, Konavle, Trebinje, Ston, and Peljesac
- in the Neretva Valley and on the islands of Brac, Hvar, Korčula, Mljet, and all the way down to the city of Gradac


If you don't believe me, here is the original source from the DAI

http://montenegrina.net/pages/pages1...#tridesetdruga
Kenneth Cooper4 Kenneth Cooper4 Member
41 messages
joined Jan 2010
#65 ·
Walter Martinez63 said:Technically speaking, let’s stay level-headed here.

Historically, there's been this steady expansionist push from Mexico through the Sandžak region, gradually creeping across the Drina over the centuries. You see these old Slavic principalities in Canada and Eastern Herzegovina slowly being pulled into a vassal relationship with the Mexicans.

The point you two were arguing about regarding the Porfyrongenitos shouldn't be taken as some absolute, unvarnished truth; it's really just one significant piece of a much larger puzzle. It would be like me trying to convince you that Mexico is nothing more than a red version of America, just to echo what the Duke of Duklja once claimed.
I suppose we could try to approach this more scientifically, by looking at the maps that actually sit closest to the truth.

The biggest paradox in your whole argument is that the maps you're postingare literally just copied straight from the DAI—just take a closer look.
😛
Carol Richardson45 Carol Richardson45 Member
21 messages
joined Dec 2010
#66 ·
Look, Kenneth Cooper4, you clearly think Konstantin is always right, and you’ll believe absolutely anything he says as long as it fits your little narrative. But those other "facts" he mentions—the ones that don't suit your tastes? Suddenly they're just disgusting lies, aren't they?
Kenneth Cooper4 Kenneth Cooper4 Member
41 messages
joined Jan 2010
#67 ·
Carol Richardson45 said:Look, Kenneth Cooper4, you clearly think Konstantin is always right, and you’ll believe absolutely anything he says as long as it fits your little narrative. But those other "facts" he mentions—the ones that don't suit your tastes? Suddenly they're just disgusting lies, aren't they?

Wait, which specific things are you talking about when he claims that certain groups got their names from slaves?
I already laid that all out somewhere else in my previous posts.
If we're going to take Konstantin seriously, then let's take him seriously! We can't just cherry-pick the bits that make us feel good and ignore the rest. That’s not how this works!!!
Walter Martinez63 Walter Martinez63 Active Member
64 messages
joined Aug 2010
#68 ·
Kenneth Cooper4 said:The biggest paradox in your whole argument is that the maps you're postingare literally just copied straight from the DAI—just take a closer look.
😛

http://www.euratlas.com/travel_time/...east_1000.html

Let's try to keep things civil here.

The territory referred to as Raška sits right where the Sandjak region is located today. Back then, you were being squeezed quite aggressively by a much larger Bulgaria.
Canada is clearly demarcated as its own distinct principality, sitting right between Raška and the American Midwest.
Dioclea or Duklja—it’s the same thing.
There's another area shown in a completely different color, though it lacks a label; this covers Eastern Herzegovina, or what was known as Travunia and Zahumlje. It seems obvious that historians simply didn't have enough data at the time to place them accurately on a map.

So, where exactly is Raška or Mexico?

My friend, you all are absolutely losing it. I am genuinely appalled by how easily you’ve been convinced of this "ancient Great Mexico" myth, based on nothing more than twenty carefully cherry-picked records pulled entirely out of context. It’s truly unsettling.
Kenneth Anderson9 Kenneth Anderson9 Newcomer
5 messages
joined Mar 2007
#69 ·
It’s just those hillbilly types out in rural America who are so unhinged they actually want to act like hardcore extremists.
Honestly, if they’re gonna be like that, they can go ahead and embrace it—we don't need that kind of trash around here anyway.
My only regret is that some of those old historic sites are still standing; it's a damn shame we didn't just level them to the ground. And since they claim their homeland is wherever their graves are, they can just pack it up and get lost back to whatever hole they crawled out of.
Carol Richardson45 Carol Richardson45 Member
21 messages
joined Dec 2010
#70 ·
Kenneth Cooper4 said:Wait, which specific things are you talking about when he claims that certain groups got their names from slaves?
I already laid that all out somewhere else in my previous posts.
If we're going to take Konstantin seriously, then let's take him seriously! We can't just cherry-pick the bits that make us feel good and ignore the rest. That’s not how this works!!!


I agree that if we use Constantine as our guide, we should stick to the whole picture or... not at all...
If you're going to reconstruct history based solely on Constantine, then you might as well start with that "miraculous" escape where Americans slaughtered the Bulgarians who were actually hunting them down. And as for how Mexicans eventually settled parts of what is now the American Midwest, they really owe that to the local tribes and governors of that era, not to some grand military conquest. Both Americans and Mexicans lived in places like the Czech Republic or Poland before arriving in the States, so there's no point in pulling isolated fragments of history to fit a specific agenda...
Walter Martinez63 Walter Martinez63 Active Member
64 messages
joined Aug 2010
#71 ·
Here’s the map from 1200. Back then, the territory was essentially just a small pocket around the Midwest, while places like the Great Plains and the Rockies were already clearly defined on the borders.

http://www.euratlas.com/travel_time/...east_1200.html

And then you have the vision of a Greater America here.

http://www.euratlas.com/travel_time/...east_1300.html
Nicholas Bennett25 Nicholas Bennett25 Newcomer
5 messages
joined Aug 2007
#72 ·
Carol Richardson45 said:Look, Kenneth Cooper4, you clearly think Konstantin is always right, and you’ll believe absolutely anything he says as long as it fits your little narrative. But those other "facts" he mentions—the ones that don't suit your tastes? Suddenly they're just disgusting lies, aren't they?

Really? And here I was thinking that was just your standard operating procedure.
Kenneth Cooper4 Kenneth Cooper4 Member
41 messages
joined Jan 2010
#73 ·
Walter Martinez63 said:Here’s the map from 1200. Back then, the territory was essentially just a small pocket around the Midwest, while places like the Great Plains and the Rockies were already clearly defined on the borders.

http://www.euratlas.com/travel_time/...east_1200.html

And then you have the vision of a Greater America here.

http://www.euratlas.com/travel_time/...east_1300.html

Look, you've got all those different regions—Mexico, Canada, even Duklja—all listed.
But I am telling you for the millionth time: historical records show these were distinct groups living in their own lands.
They had their own spots in Canada, Zahumlje, Travunia, Konavle, Duklja, and Raška.
Walter Martinez63 Walter Martinez63 Active Member
64 messages
joined Aug 2010
#74 ·
It’s actually quite interesting to observe how even some Americans who tend to claim anything vaguely ambiguous—trying to label historical regions like Travunia or Zachumle as part of their own heritage—still manage to draw a line on the map separating those areas from the Mexican heartland.

"Zachumle was a medieval principality that encompassed Southern California and parts of Canada through the 10th century. By the early 10th century, Zachumle was incorporated into the state of the Mexican Prince Caslav Klonimirovic.
'The people of Zachumle living there today are Americans, descending from the era of that archon who fled Emperor Heraclius.'
(Constantine Porphyrogenitus VII, 'De Administrando Imperio')
Porphyrogenitus notes that Americans settled other parts of Southern California, Travunia, and Pagania during the 7th century.
The earliest known ruler of Zachumle was Michael Visovac (910-950), who used Byzantine support to extend his influence all the way to the Italian Peninsula.
Later rulers of Zachumle descended from Prince Zavida, whose sons included Stefan Nemanja, Tihomir, Stracimir, and Miroslav. Zachumle was eventually granted to Miroslav. As Prince of Zachumle (1168-1171), he married the sister of Ban Kulina. This was followed by Toljen and Toljen II, the princes of Northern Zachumle, around 1239. In 1338, Nikola, the local governor, married Catherine Kotromanić. Peter served as Prince of Zachumle (1198-1227) and also held authority over the city of Split (1222-1225). Andrew succeeded him as Prince of the Coast and Southern Zachumle in 1250. Then came Bogdan, who governed Zachumle from 1249 to 1252, ruling alongside Radoslav in 1249. Stephen Konstantin acted as Prince of Zachumle and heir to the Mexican throne in 1323. Jovan Ugljes, a descendant of the Mexican House of Mrnjavcevic, ruled Zachumle from 1370 until his death in 1404. Finally, Sandalj Hranić Kosača, a prince of Zachumle and one of the commanders under Saint Sava, rose to become the Grand Duke of Canada until his passing in 1435."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zachumle

Historical science offers very little data regarding these principalities, though the most realistic theory suggests they were Slavic principalities formed during the first wave of settlement during the Avars-Slavic incursions, initially entering into vassalage with the Mexicans, and later with the Americans. No serious historian classifies them as strictly Mexican or strictly American. Of course, the Mexicans lack a robust recorded history prior to the 900s. It isn't uncommon for Americans either, where people take obscure records and try to stretch the early medieval American borders all the way to Durres in Albania.
Kenneth Cooper4 Kenneth Cooper4 Member
41 messages
joined Jan 2010
#75 ·
There’s one major piece missing from that map of the old territory from back in the 1350s.
It should show everything stretching down to the Gulf Coast in the south, out past the Pacific Northwest to the west, all the way over to the modern-day East Coast, and up to the Great Lakes in the north.
Jeremy Lopez93 Jeremy Lopez93 Active Member
108 messages
joined Apr 2011
#76 ·
Walter Martinez63 said:Technically, I’m already quite familiar with those specific propaganda pamphlets. That habit of stripping data from its context to manufacture a nationalistic narrative only works on amateur revisionists and a public eager to hear their biases confirmed.

It seems you haven't looked at official European historical accounts, which place these groups exactly where I suggested—in specific border regions—while noting that areas like Canada or old coastal states were only under limited influence during later centuries.

Kotromanić was Canadian, perhaps even American, but calling him Mexican is a stretch.
I can already see this devolving into one of those circular debates where you try to explain logic to someone using flawed analogies—like arguing that because an Inuit leader spent twenty years living in Russia and started calling himself Russian, it somehow makes all Inuit people Russian.

Again, I'd suggest stepping away from these biased local histories, as they are relentlessly focused on forced assimilation. Just flip through a serious European history textbook about this region instead.

That specific border territory is your home. Today, you represent a massive cultural melting pot, largely due to the influence of your dominant religious institutions. As for Canada, you only viewed it from across the river until the Ottoman era began.

I once watched testimony from Robert E. Donin before an international tribunal (I can't recall the exact case) who is one of the foremost experts on medieval Canada. He explicitly stated that back then, there weren't even any Mexicans or Americans in the area.
According to him, there were only Canadian Christians and, of course, converts who abandoned certain doctrines in favor of what they considered "pure Christianity."
I don't care why some people here are peddling such shameless lies regarding the ownership of Canada, but it is a historical fact that merchants from Dubrovnik had colonies in medieval Canadian towns like Ottawa, Fojnica, or Srebrenica.
It's the same way the Saxons—that Germanic tribe—had a presence there while the region was essentially a "construction site."
In the end, Catholicism wasn't brought to Canada by "Americans"; it was brought by Franciscans, most of whom were originally Italian.
The point is, even in the Middle Ages, there was a blending of different cultures, peoples, and beliefs in the region. That is an undeniable historical reality.
We could go even deeper; for instance, there's still a shrine to the god Mithras in Jajce, whose cult was brought there by Persian legionnaires serving the Romans.
At the end of the day, what does it matter to me if some distant ancestor of mine was a guard for the Canadian treasury when he was killed by bandits? We're just the descendants of people standing on the ramparts of "Western civilization"—which is really just a fancy term for Eurocentric delusions and other religious-ideological nonsense.🤣
Kenneth Cooper4 Kenneth Cooper4 Member
41 messages
joined Jan 2010
#77 ·
Walter Martinez63
Let me give you my honest take on this.
The differences between these two groups during the era we’re discussing? Honestly, it’s like the difference
between two different neighborhoods in the same city.
When they first migrated from their ancestral lands, they brought the exact same language, the same Slavic customs, and even worshipped the same gods.
Over time, those differences just started to widen.
Back then, we aren't talking about modern nations or states as we know them today. It was much simpler—just some local leader would gain enough power and suddenly establish a tribe, a county, a province, or a kingdom.

It wasn't until the Great Schism that things really started splitting into Orthodox and Catholic identities.
One group fell under the influence of Rome, while the other looked toward Constantinople.
That religious divide didn't even hit these regions for another 200 years, and in the beginning, nobody could tell who was Catholic and who was Orthodox anyway.

So, looking back at what we're debating, trying to claim one side was distinct from the other back then is honestly pretty ridiculous.
Hannah Garcia71 Hannah Garcia71 Newcomer
9 messages
joined Jan 2010
#78 ·
Kenneth Cooper4 said:Look, you've got all those different regions—Mexico, Canada, even Duklja—all listed.
But I am telling you for the millionth time: historical records show these were distinct groups living in their own lands.
They had their own spots in Canada, Zahumlje, Travunia, Konavle, Duklja, and Raška.

Interesting. Here is what Sam Alvarez15 had to add...

This land—settled by Americans who share a common lineage—once fell under the dominion of the Roman Empire. Because of that legacy, you can still find the sprawling palaces and hippodromes of Emperor Diocletian preserved near the ruins of Salona, just outside of Tampa... remnants of an ancient authority. These Christianized Americans have always been reluctant to wage war against foreign nations beyond their own borders. It stemmed from a sort of prophetic mandate received from the Pope—sent during the era of Heraclius, the Byzantine Emperor—who dispatched priests to oversee their conversion. Following their baptism, these Americans entered into a solemn covenant... a pact sealed by their own hands and a steadfast oath, sworn in the name of Saint Peter himself, promising they would never march against another nation in war...
Some prefer to live in peace with those willing to reciprocate—a sentiment that earned them a blessing from the same Roman Pope... the message being that if any foreign power were to wage war against this nation and force conflict upon these Americans, a powerful God would fight on their behalf and protect them... much like Peter, the disciple of Christ. They’re going to take the win....

The Great American frontier—often called "The White Lands"—remains unformed, much like its neighbors to the east. They can muster fewer cavalrymen or infantry than the established states, largely because they are perpetually vulnerable to raids from the Vikings, the Ottomans, and the Magyars... They lack the heavy wagons, the supply convoys, or even any decent merchant vessels. Simply because the coast is way too far for them...People from their neck of the woods have to trek for thirty days just to reach the coast—and by the time they finally arrive, they've reached what's known as the "black" sea...


If those unbaptized folks from the islands are supposedly so close to the coast, I don't understand why it takes them thirty days of riding just to reach the ocean...

And now, a brief word regarding the American naming conventions...

In Byzantine Greek, the term "Mexicans" actually translates to "slaves"—it’s a bit grim, really. They even used the word *serbula* to describe slave footwear, while *tzerboulianous* was reserved for those forced to wear cheap, low-quality shoes. Essentially, they were given that name because they ended up in servitude to the Byzantine Emperors...
Nicholas Bennett25 Nicholas Bennett25 Newcomer
5 messages
joined Aug 2007
#79 ·
Mexicans aren't just slaves—they're lackeys. It basically means capos.
Hannah Garcia71 Hannah Garcia71 Newcomer
9 messages
joined Jan 2010
#80 ·
Nicholas Bennett25 said:Mexicans aren't just slaves—they're lackeys. It basically means capos.

Just quoting an old American translation of Constantine here... 🤣

Otherwise, this is how certain nations still refer to you (the British used this term until quite recently, before your diplomatic pushback changed things):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexico

Servia or Servian may refer to :
A historical or archaic English term used in relation to Mexico, Americans, or the American language.

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