Freedom and Education

wearyharbor41 said:I have written. Here. I am somewhat perplexed by the nature of your recent conduct—specifically, the way you chose to dismiss me so bluntly before pivoting into outright insults. It has become quite transparent why individuals who cling so desperately to the status quo would feel compelled to defend someone of your temperament.

I feel compelled to step in on behalf of my colleague, who clearly possesses both a conscience and a sense of reason. There is absolutely nothing hypocritical about her position; we aren't debating the merits of a liberal arts education here. We are discussing the realities of a concentration camp, which has nothing to do with academic enrichment beyond the most fundamental necessities, such as basic literacy and elementary arithmetic.

It is rather striking how much more one can absorb from two weeks of immersing oneself in documentaries than from four years spent sitting through elementary school history classes. There is a certain freedom in it; you aren't being graded on whether you correctly memorized the exact birth date or death date of some obscure figure who holds no relevance to the modern world.

It is quite obvious to anyone who possesses even a modicum of intellectual honesty, a functioning conscience, or a sense of moral integrity.

The same principle applies to all other items.

It would be remiss of me not to mention the sheer volume of wasted potential lying in our wake—all those individuals who possessed genuine talent and should have been honing their craft during those formative years, only to be thwarted by systemic brainwashing, relentless indoctrination, and the wholesale theft of their most precious resource: time.
Millions of people are being left behind because of such misguided policies and the systemic violence inflicted upon children.

By the time you walk across that stage at high school graduation, it becomes painfully clear that the curriculum has left you almost entirely unprepared for the realities of adulthood. We spend years studying abstract theories, yet we emerge without even a basic grasp of what truly matters—like how to actually maintain one's health, which is arguably the most vital asset any person possesses. We graduate knowing how to solve equations, but we remain blissfully ignorant of the fundamental mechanics behind how our government operates, what our legal rights actually entail, or what kind of practical challenges await us in the real world. It is quite a curious way to educate a generation: providing plenty of data, yet neglecting the essential statistics and life skills that would actually allow someone to navigate society with any degree of competence.

It is an absolute disgrace that we find ourselves in this particular era. Given our unprecedented technological leaps, one might have expected this civilization to finally demonstrate some semblance of genuine humanity or moral virtue. Instead, history will likely record that we are the first society capable of such profound sophistication only to prove ourselves monstrously wicked across every conceivable field, deliberately and with full intent, dismantling the lives of individuals on a global scale. ☕

It is only natural that those of us who possess some understanding of what awaits beyond this life find a certain quiet solace in the thought of accountability. There is a small, perhaps somewhat cynical, comfort in knowing that those who have meticulously engineered society to serve their own ends—those who systematically strip away freedoms and stifle human potential—will eventually face the consequences of their actions in the eternal realm. I suppose my only true satisfaction lies in the belief that there exists an inescapable justice, one that cannot be evaded by any amount of earthly maneuvering. 👋

Speaking for myself, my schooling definitely had a negative impact. Between dealing with bullying, intimidation, threats, and physical fights... I probably would've handled it better if I'd had any support from my parents. You can just tell when someone's been flying solo and had to scrap for everything they have. Besides, they teach you to submit to nonsense—to work and study things you know are useless just because you're being "graded." If you don't bend to the absurdity, you're labeled "bad."

copperhound12 said:

I mean, I guess if we're really going to sit here and dissect this, we have to look at the sheer scale of it all. It’s just... it's overwhelming, isn't it? Maybe I'm overthinking things, but I can't help but feel like we're missing the forest for the trees. I honestly don't know where to start, but let me try. There's this sense that everything we thought we understood about the subject is being completely upended, and frankly, it's infuriating! It feels like every time we get a handle on a concept, someone comes along and shifts the goalposts again. It's exhausting. I suppose I should be more patient, but how can you be when the foundation keeps shifting under your feet? It's just one thing after another. I guess... maybe I should just say that...
So, look, we’re supposed to be talking about the education system here—that's the actual topic at hand—but then, out of nowhere, you start pivoting and rambling about the nature of science instead. I mean, ah... sorry, but... 😁

Science. Education and upbringing—it all falls under that umbrella, doesn't it? It covers the fundamental frameworks of institutional schooling. I suppose the ultimate purpose of this whole field of science is to help tackle actual human problems, but honestly, it shouldn't stop there. It has to go deeper than that; it needs to be able to read between the lines and truly interpret the underlying realities we're dealing with. Critical.I mean, you really have to frame it as a public good. That’s the only way to make it work, because her entire fundamental premise is centered on actually solving problems—otherwise, she just falls straight into dogma. Real science isn't supposed to be some rigid, stagnant set of rules; it should be an adventure, a total game.

Look, if you really want to get into this, I’d highly recommend diving into David Bloor, specifically looking at the Edinburgh School and their work on the Strong Program. It's worth your time, I guess.

How could I possibly say no? I’m giving you the exact same response I gave when I first suggested you sit down and actually study that book.University transcript V. Stambolović

It’s actually a total paradox, and honestly, it feels like our own personal tragedy that we have to approach everything through its exact opposite. I mean, think about it—we have to embrace slavery just to even begin to grasp what freedom really means. We have to confront ugliness just to recognize beauty, or lean into hatred just to truly experience love. Even goodness... I guess we have to pursue the good only so we can finally, fully understand the primal evil lurking at the core of it all. It's exhausting, really.

Maybe it’s worth taking a moment to actually explain the "why" behind Basaglia's whole crusade. What you’re touching on here is what we call the Basaglia Law, or Law 180, which was all about the de-institutionalization of psychiatric hospitals. Even though Basaglia had moved on from his time working in Gorica (which is basically like a smaller version of a city in the Midwest now) quite a while before that, the specific psychiatric hospital where he used to work was eventually shut down for good back in 1978. I might dive deeper into the specifics of that later on. But fundamentally, Basaglia believed that psychiatric patients didn't deserve... Institutions. It always comes back to the institutions, doesn't it? I mean, really, if you look closely at how everything is structured, it’s almost impossible to ignore the sheer weight they carry over our individual lives. They aren't just buildings or sets of rules; they are these massive, immovable forces that shape every single thing we think and do. It's honestly exhausting to even consider how much influence they exert on the collective psyche. I guess what I'm trying to say is that we often forget just how much power these entities hold over us, acting as the silent architects of our entire social reality. It’s all quite overwhelming when you actually stop to analyze it. I just can't see them being therapeutic. Kids go to school to learn, and that’s my observation—they aren't heading to class for therapy. Honestly, adults don't exactly flock there for that reason either, though I suppose there are always those few exceptions to every rule. 😁 I honestly think it’s worth pointing this out so the rest of you folks on the forum get the full picture. Look, Basaglia wasn't out there writing down rigid dogmas, so I suppose you can't really blame the authors themselves if someone else decides to twist their theories into some kind of unshakeable doctrine. That’s just how people work, I guess. But regardless, you have to recognize that Basaglia was actually one of the absolute heavyweights driving the democratic psychiatry movement over in Italy during the 1960s and 1970s.

His work is nothing less than a metaphor for what lies ahead of us. That’s exactly how you have to read it—you really have to look deeper if you want to grasp the full picture!

And which institution are you actually referring to? Schools aren't the only institutions out there; there are plenty of them. Besides, how you personally interpret 1) freedom and 2) the concept of an institution is perfectly understandable—I have no issue with that—but not everyone sees things through your specific lens.

All institutions (including schools, for that matter) are functional and necessary (I've already made that point clear in a previous post); without them, society simply wouldn't be able to function. However, at some point, they inevitably deny the validity of personal experience, individual emotions, and independent thought—which effectively turns them into something sclerotic, crippled, and dogmatic. That is precisely why de-institutionalization becomes vital: because these entities trap their own truth, discarding any critical judgment that doesn't fit within their predetermined criteria. To put it bluntly: it is time for a change; the longer we delay, the more painful that transition will be.

You’re right, and you’re also wrong. Institutions are absolutely essential for our world to keep turning. But maturity (and a healthy dose of criticism) tells us that their status quo outgrew our "modern" needs a long time ago. It is time for a paradigm shift: our future has already arrived.

There is this fascinating book, "Better to Be the Wind Than the Leaf," a bestseller by some of our well-known local authors/psychologists: M. Rijavec and D. Miljković (which I often cite in my lectures). It emphasizes that the only true and successful way to raise a child is PARENTAL upbringing, because only a parent can, should, and must understand their child. But—and there's always that "but"—one ought to read wise books, engage with people steeped in experience, and communicate openly and honestly, because that is ultimately good for society and—of course—for ourselves. ☕

I look at what was said above as an affirmation, a positive message sent out to current and future parents to help them realize just how vital their role really is.

However, I don't quite agree with the idea of exclusivity—that parental guidance is the *only* successful path. While a parent certainly can and should try, they don't necessarily have to succeed in understanding their child perfectly, because you can't force understanding through sheer willpower; what matters most is the genuine desire to understand, while the child itself primarily needs love, respect, the warmth of a home or a supportive environment, security, and plenty of room to play...

I remember reading in Robert Fulghum's book, *All I Really Need to Know I Learned in Kindergarten*, where he mentions—if we think back to our very first picture books and the first words we ever mastered—that the greatest and most important word of all is: LOOK.

I recognized my own experience as a parent in that moment: saying "Look!" when I first carried my baby outside into the crisp air to show them the large snowflakes falling from the sky.

"Look."

What I mean is, it isn't strictly necessary for a child to spend their entire upbringing reading through endless volumes of wisdom, and let's be honest, parents rarely have the luxury of time for heavy reading while little ones are running around; while talking to experienced mentors and practicing sincere communication is always welcome and necessary, what a child needs most, without any doubt, is simply the feeling of being loved.

Yet, there are parents—or perhaps just one parent in the house—who fail to develop that warm, emotional connection with their child; they might be cold or emotionally distant, even if, on the surface, they provide for the child's physical needs just as well as an emotionally engaged parent would. But children are like expert readers of other people's emotions, and because of that lack of sensitivity, they can very early on develop a sense that they aren't loved, which can deeply impact how they value themselves as they grow up.

So, it isn't unusual that once a child starts school, they might find that warmth and sensitivity in a teacher or a mentor instead. School isn't just a place where you go to learn subjects; it's where you make friends for life, where your character is forged, and where the exchange of experiences through classes and after-school activities helps shape you far beyond what parental guidance alone could achieve—even if we tentatively call parental guidance the "only true" method of success.

We also can't ignore the heartbreaking reality that many children—as the statistics unfortunately show—are exposed to various forms of violence and harshness right within their own homes, so in my opinion, rather than saying "but," it would be much better to say "if" regarding the ideals mentioned in that book...

Steven Clark2 said:"Quote:"

I find myself wondering if we might need to reconsider our collective approach to the nuances of West Coast culture. It seems there is an ongoing debate regarding the specific mannerisms and social expectations prevalent among Californians, and I must admit, I feel somewhat ill-equipped to navigate these waters without more clarity. Perhaps I am being overly pedantic, but one cannot help but notice certain patterns that set them apart from the rest of the country. As specified by Steven Clark2: First and foremost, I would like to express my sincere gratitude for your incredibly inspiring and thought-provoking post; it was truly an important read, and I feel compelled to offer my response.

You are very welcome; I truly appreciate you taking the time and effort to engage with this.

I am, quite frankly, aware that this—let’s call it a "working" definition—is somewhat insufficient and incomplete. Why is that? Because if I were to attempt a truly exhaustive and total definition, I would find myself bogged down in explaining exactly why a thing is what it is. In doing so, I fear I would only cloud and dilute the actual heart of the matter: the connection between freedom and education. I hope you can understand my position and the intention behind my brevity, but I must insist: my fundamental and indisputable starting point remains humanism.

I completely agree that every definition remains inherently incomplete. You make an excellent point; it isn't always straightforward to categorize things precisely, regardless of whether one approaches the subject from a humanistic perspective or any other analytical framework.

And tell me, are you writing this from the comfort of your easy armchair—from some safe, secure little bubble—or are you actually out there on the desolate Himalayas, somewhere far beyond the reach of civilization?

I had a feeling you were going to say something along those lines. 😁 I should clarify that I am not merely speaking from the comfort of an armchair; I am reclining quite comfortably, if you must know. But jokes aside—as much as I enjoy my own ease, believe me when I say I have absolutely no desire to impose my views on anyone else. I certainly don't feel entitled to dictate what other people's children should or must do. That is where we differ. It isn't within my power to tell others what their core values should be. There is a certain elegance to the truth: once you truly grasp it, you realize it cannot be forced upon someone else. The moment you attempt to mandate it, it ceases to be a truth and transforms into nothing more than a dogma. And isn't that exactly what you are fighting against as well? 😁

"Quote"

I have two sons (if that is relevant to this debate?).

In my view, this carries significant weight because you possess the lived experience of a parent. You have personally navigated—and continue to navigate—the full spectrum of childhood highs and lows within the American school system. 😁 When you write about a topic like this, there is a world of difference between hearing from someone who is actually raising children and someone who is just observing from the sidelines. Having two sons myself, I can certainly attest to that shift in perspective. It seems my eldest is already gravitating toward the tech sector, while as for my younger one... well, I honestly haven't the slightest clue what his future holds. lol

If you examine my current analysis regarding the state of our education system, I am certainly not suggesting that we should simply provide basic social safety nets to those living in material hardship. My argument isn't just about providing standard institutions to pull people out of poverty or offer them a semblance of stability. While they undoubtedly need that material security and humanitarian support, I find myself compelled to look far beyond the immediate needs of the masses. After all, I consider myself to be standing on the shoulders of giants, and my true ambition is to orchestrate an entirely new paradigm.

I’m not sure I fully grasp your point here. Are you suggesting that institutions, like schools or government agencies, actually need to be provided with insurance or something similar?

My goal is to foster a more humane society. That is precisely why I want to challenge and deconstruct institutions—to serve as a witness to actual human reality. This represents a new quality; I am seeking entirely new values.

To be perfectly honest, that sounds like a phrase every dictator in history has recycled. 😁 What was Hitler looking for—something old or something new? What about Lenin? 🤣 You can never truly impose values upon people; once they are forced, they cease to be "values" and instead become, heaven forbid, mere institutional mandates. 😁 Ultimately, you risk becoming a walking contradiction, where the very thing you fight against becomes the exact thing you end up championing. Please remember that values cannot be mandated. Even when we try to instill them through culture, education, or our public institutions—what does that even amount to besides just more structure?

I am applying this specifically within a medical (psychiatric) context. Why? Because I have synthesized various mental states, my own clinical practice, and our social reality, as evidenced in the aforementioned "Institutional Negation" by the late, renowned psychiatrist Franco Basaglia.

Good grief. 🙂

Can you truly believe that you perceive things this way (from my perspective)? It seems our capacity for critical thinking is viewed as some sort of "erroneous" step—initially introduced during our primary socialization, and eventually continuing, developing, and touching upon those vital, critical internal points within us during secondary socialization...

Of course you can't believe it, but there are several valid reasons why things are the way they are.

First off, everything you're describing feels to me like a football game where two teams are playing against one another. You're either on one side or the other. Then you have the crowd cheering for one team or the other—though there are always neutrals—and even the referee is part of the setup. lol. Critical thinking, in this sense, is just being on the field, in the stands, or acting as a player. It is merely a small slice of the broader spectrum of Western culture and nothing more. If you were to ask someone in China or India how they approach thought, you might find a different story. There is also lateral or divergent thinking, concepts that are far less discussed. Critical thinking is typically a linear mode of thought. A perfect example of this mindset would be comparing militant atheists to religious fundamentalists. On a deeper level, there is absolutely no substantive difference between these two groups; the gap is much smaller than it appears at first glance because both utilize the exact same linear methods of reasoning and conclusion-making. I actually studied militant atheism and religious fundamentalism quite extensively a long time ago.

In order to think outside of these rigid categories, you must transcend critical thinking altogether. With critical thinking alone, you won't achieve any true paradigm shifts, even though it seems that is exactly what you are aiming for. 😁Admittedly, change does occur, but only when it is forced—when it is imposed through sheer coercion. That is when values and ideologies are shoved down people's throats, including the very concepts you are discussing here. If history hasn't made that clear by now, then I fear there is a fundamental misunderstanding at play.

"A scientist is an individual whose professional duty is to be disobedient." (Osovsky)

To my mind, statements like that are purely populist. Someone using internet slang might call them complete nonsense, and while I generally dislike using such coarse language unless absolutely necessary, I feel compelled to say it: they are absolute nonsense. Someone having a bad morning might simply ask, "Who cares about Osovsky and what he thinks?" And honestly, they would have a point. Relying on quotes like this makes your argument seem rather unserious. A scientist is a human being just like anyone else—a rancher, a shepherd, or a bus driver. They perform their jobs, believe they are the best at what they do (with rare exceptions, of course), strive for independence, and can just as easily be susceptible to bribery, backstabbing colleagues, lying, or stealing. Beyond those basic human traits, a scientist is, first and foremost, just a person. Every time I hear these myths and dogmas about scientists possessing an aura of infallibility—portrayed in white lab coats and thick glasses—it genuinely makes me feel uneasy. These are all myths manufactured by those who find such imagery useful. A scientist being "disobedient"? Perhaps one in a thousand, which doesn't deviate much from the typical human average. This applies whether we are talking about a preacher standing up against corruption, a miner feeling undervalued compared to his peers, or even a woman at a local farmer's market complaining about her stall fees. It is nothing more than that, and anyone suggesting otherwise is clearly missing the point entirely. Period. It is perhaps because people overindulge in moralizing with pens and paper—or, to put it in modern context, with keyboards—that figures like Dietrich Bonhoeffer are so misunderstood today.

When my eldest was in elementary school, they were using this "Step by Step" curriculum, which had just been rolled out right around the time he started, and I have to say, I was absolutely blown away by how the school operated; it felt more like a series of engaging activities than rigid lessons, and his teacher was this wonderful young woman who truly cared for her students as if they were her own flesh and blood.
The only thing was, we parents were always looking ahead at a potential hurdle—the idea that once these kids transitioned into middle school and hit that more traditional, old-school academic structure, they might struggle to adapt. Since the "Step by Step" approach functions almost like a creative workshop, it felt like such a missed opportunity that the upper grades weren't designed to follow that same creative philosophy.

Eric Newman75 said:What exactly is an elementary school here? A restaurant? A swimming pool? No, it’s an educational institution. Period.

Fair point. You didn't actually say "it stifles creativity," or "they won't let them," or "making it conscious," or call anything "ridiculous," or mention "children's rights," etc. And you definitely didn't forget to use punctuation where it belongs—like when I intentionally played around with that inverted sentence structure.

Honestly, every single middle schooler—yeah, even the ones who have to be dragged there kicking and screaming—is more literate and sharper than you are.

Sure, you caught the grammar mistakes, but this comeback is pretty low blows.

Why not just engage with what the guy is actually saying? Why go straight for the throat? The author's point is legit and makes sense. You should really look into the ideas of philosopher Ivan Illich. He actually wrote a book called Deschooling Society.

Sent from my Galaxy S10 using Reddit

And why don't you just actually read everything that was posted before jumping in with a comment?

Eric Newman75 said:And why don't you just actually read everything that was posted before jumping in with a comment?

Fair point, man! My temper flared up there—definitely wasn't my finest moment. My bad.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy A52 using Reddit

Joseph Murphy10 said:Fair point, man! My temper flared up there—definitely wasn't my finest moment. My bad.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy A52 using Reddit

Well, maybe we should try to see a more positive side of things for once?

🙂)

What’s your take on the whole relationship between freedom and education—do you think they actually work together,
or does one inevitably end up stifling the other?

steelridge58 said:Well, maybe we should try to see a more positive side of things for once?

🙂)

What’s your take on the whole relationship between freedom and education—do you think they actually work together,
or does one inevitably end up stifling the other?

Oh, my dear Volver. 🙂
Volver Hekatonhir's got a point—I probably should've actually read the thread first...

Look, I don't think it *has* to be an either-or situation—it could go either way. But honestly? You’ve gotta look at this alongside everything else that’s gone wrong in modern life here in the West. We've basically built a society that runs totally contrary to actual human nature. Since we aren't exactly planning on reverting back to being cavemen anytime soon, our only real move is to dial back our freedom and bend it to fit what education requires—with a few rare exceptions, obviously. As for what those exceptions actually look like? Well, maybe this little story from my school days about 50 years ago will give you a hint.

Look, we gotta be real about how things used to work back in the day in American schools. Times were different—way different. You didn't question the teachers; you respected them, period. End of story. Back then, if a kid was acting up, teachers could actually discipline them—a quick slap to keep them in line or a few choice words here and there to set them straight. Nobody blinked an eye at it. But here’s the thing—it wasn't just about being a bully. Kids knew exactly which teachers actually earned that authority through actual presence and leadership, rather than just relying on raw force.

So, we had this student back in the day who was—to put it mildly—completely checked out from everything the school was teaching. It wasn’t that he couldn't keep up or anything; it just wasn't his vibe. His world was out in the fields, living off the land, dealing with livestock and ranching. Fast forward to today, and that’s exactly how he lives. From what I hear, he’s happy, healthy, and totally content without needing any of these modern digital distractions. If he ever decides he wants an iPhone 13, he'll just go out and buy it with cash like any other professional would. And hey, if having purchasing power and owning stuff matters—and Marks says it definitely does, arguably more than anything else in the world—then he's doing just fine.

Going to school every single day was a total nightmare for him. Honestly, he couldn't stand being away from his sheep and horses for even two hours—not that he actually learned a damn thing while he was there. Not that failing out of class meant much in the real world—thanks to the sheer power of the iPhone 13, he’s doing just fine surviving today—and since he’s still out there living his life, I guess he hasn't exactly found a "higher purpose" either.

So, there was this one time he went head-to-head with his teacher. It went down like this:

Teacher: Hey class, what was the last thing I said? You, quit messing around—pay attention. Repeat my last sentence back to me.
Student: I haven't got a clue—I'm not even listening to you guys.
Teacher: Seriously, how are you gonna survive out there? What’re you even gonna do for a living? You don't know jack—not a single thing! You don't even know what a verb is? Explain the Pythagorean theorem to me. Tell me the difference between gymnosperms and angiosperms. You've got zero clue! Who even let you make it to seventh grade?! HOW ARE YOU THIS STUPID!!!

So, this kid spent the whole time playing dumb—answering "I don't know" to basically everything. But then the teacher finally snaps and calls him stupid right to his face. Big mistake. Kid wasn't having it and decided to swing back.

Look, Teach, I get where you're coming from, but let me throw a curveball at you. Fine, you're the expert—so tell me this: if you're so damn smart, whose donkey just knocked up Marks' mare?
Whose? How the hell am I supposed to know that? What kind of nonsense is this?
Look, teach, you gotta listen—this matters to me. I mean, look at this mare she popped out for Frank—it’s a beast, straight from Mark. If you actually take a second to look at this filly, you'll see she's a total sweetheart—strong, huge, and perfect for pulling heavy loads.
And what does any of that have to do with me?
Look, it actually has everything to do with me—it’s vital to my life. It matters way more than all your nerdy nonsense. If we're talking about a beast that's actually calm, then I can load it up with firewood and gear without it kicking my teeth in or making my job a total nightmare. That's what I care about in this life—not your damn verbs or Pythagoras math. 😁

Look, I totally get the argument that different people need different skill sets, and yeah, maybe even different levels of depth in those subjects. But there’s a core set of knowledge that just shouldn't be up for debate. Whether you're headed for an Ivy League university or straight into a trade school, you’re going to need math, biology, and language skills. Period. There shouldn't be any "watering down" there. It’s honestly embarrassing when people can't wrap their heads around basic percentages or have zero clue how their own bodies actually function. This whole pandemic situation really drove home the fact that a huge chunk of the population can't even tell the difference between a bacterium and a virus. And don't even get me started on the literacy crisis. High schoolers wouldn't have ever realized that versi refers to specific lines of poetry if they weren't so disconnected from literature—mostly because nobody reads anymore. You've got adults asking what a himba even is. They seem to have a knack for being two-faced and hypocritical, though I highly doubt they'd even recognize their own hypocrisy or the concept of a "hine," which, by the way, comes from the verb hiniti. I even heard about some kids reading works by HLAPIĆ who were asking what klinčići were, and their teacher—completely baffled by this total lack of logic and imagination—just told them they were little nails.

The school system isn't the villain in every single story, just like it isn't the hero responsible for everything.

Joseph Murphy10 said:Oh, my dear Volver. 🙂
Volver Hekatonhir's got a point—I probably should've actually read the thread first...

Look, I don't think it *has* to be an either-or situation—it could go either way. But honestly? You’ve gotta look at this alongside everything else that’s gone wrong in modern life here in the West. We've basically built a society that runs totally contrary to actual human nature. Since we aren't exactly planning on reverting back to being cavemen anytime soon, our only real move is to dial back our freedom and bend it to fit what education requires—with a few rare exceptions, obviously. As for what those exceptions actually look like? Well, maybe this little story from my school days about 50 years ago will give you a hint.

Look, we gotta be real about how things used to work back in the day in American schools. Times were different—way different. You didn't question the teachers; you respected them, period. End of story. Back then, if a kid was acting up, teachers could actually discipline them—a quick slap to keep them in line or a few choice words here and there to set them straight. Nobody blinked an eye at it. But here’s the thing—it wasn't just about being a bully. Kids knew exactly which teachers actually earned that authority through actual presence and leadership, rather than just relying on raw force.

So, we had this student back in the day who was—to put it mildly—completely checked out from everything the school was teaching. It wasn’t that he couldn't keep up or anything; it just wasn't his vibe. His world was out in the fields, living off the land, dealing with livestock and ranching. Fast forward to today, and that’s exactly how he lives. From what I hear, he’s happy, healthy, and totally content without needing any of these modern digital distractions. If he ever decides he wants an iPhone 13, he'll just go out and buy it with cash like any other professional would. And hey, if having purchasing power and owning stuff matters—and Marks says it definitely does, arguably more than anything else in the world—then he's doing just fine.

Going to school every single day was a total nightmare for him. Honestly, he couldn't stand being away from his sheep and horses for even two hours—not that he actually learned a damn thing while he was there. Not that failing out of class meant much in the real world—thanks to the sheer power of the iPhone 13, he’s doing just fine surviving today—and since he’s still out there living his life, I guess he hasn't exactly found a "higher purpose" either.

So, there was this one time he went head-to-head with his teacher. It went down like this:

Teacher: Hey class, what was the last thing I said? You, quit messing around—pay attention. Repeat my last sentence back to me.
Student: I haven't got a clue—I'm not even listening to you guys.
Teacher: Seriously, how are you gonna survive out there? What’re you even gonna do for a living? You don't know jack—not a single thing! You don't even know what a verb is? Explain the Pythagorean theorem to me. Tell me the difference between gymnosperms and angiosperms. You've got zero clue! Who even let you make it to seventh grade?! HOW ARE YOU THIS STUPID!!!

So, this kid spent the whole time playing dumb—answering "I don't know" to basically everything. But then the teacher finally snaps and calls him stupid right to his face. Big mistake. Kid wasn't having it and decided to swing back.

Look, Teach, I get where you're coming from, but let me throw a curveball at you. Fine, you're the expert—so tell me this: if you're so damn smart, whose donkey just knocked up Marks' mare?
Whose? How the hell am I supposed to know that? What kind of nonsense is this?
Look, teach, you gotta listen—this matters to me. I mean, look at this mare she popped out for Frank—it’s a beast, straight from Mark. If you actually take a second to look at this filly, you'll see she's a total sweetheart—strong, huge, and perfect for pulling heavy loads.
And what does any of that have to do with me?
Look, it actually has everything to do with me—it’s vital to my life. It matters way more than all your nerdy nonsense. If we're talking about a beast that's actually calm, then I can load it up with firewood and gear without it kicking my teeth in or making my job a total nightmare. That's what I care about in this life—not your damn verbs or Pythagoras math. 😁

🙂))

verbs and Pythagoras

That story would honestly come off as nothing more than a joke if you hadn't prefaced it by saying you actually saw it happen during your time in school.

That teacher was absolutely terrible!

But it's also worth considering how these seemingly irreconcilable sides could not only be reconciled, but could actually drive positive progress in both directions when looking at the big picture.

If that teacher had any real intuition, he could have suggested to the student—and perhaps even the whole class—that they organize a field trip out into the countryside. It could have been part of the curriculum, held right where that student lived, in his own world—out in the fields, surrounded by nature, sheep, horses, and all that agricultural life. While there, they could have practically studied the differences between gymnosperms and angiosperms, or even applied the Pythagorean theorem to three-dimensional objects. It would have been such an interesting challenge to design math problems based on practical applications found in his immediate, everyday environment. Doing something like that would have fostered much more mutual respect, and I'm certain that student would have been far more eager to show up to class and actually engage with the lessons.

In my view, the success of whether students actually enjoy their studies or develop a genuine interest in their subjects rests almost entirely on the teachers; regardless of whatever educational system is in place, the relationship between the teacher and the student plays a massive role in how receptive a student is to learning.

Look, Volver, that would be the dream, but back then it was pure fantasy—and honestly, I don't think we're much closer today. Still, the core idea makes sense. Like Hekatonhir pointed out above, education is a necessity, whether you like it or not (those examples mentioned earlier are honestly revolting, even if I see them playing out all the time). But the system is just too "cookie-cutter." It’s designed to reject anyone who doesn't fit the mold—anyone who isn't just another brick in the wall. Kids might not realize it consciously, but they feel it—that pressure to be exactly like everyone else instead of being their own unique selves. And the worst part? You get these totally unrefined individuals who wouldn't know their head from their elbow, yet because they're hyper-focused on one tiny niche, they end up with PhDs. Talk about a bad look for both actual education and our precious scientific civilization. 🙂

Maybe we can take this further and talk about modern life. Most of us live in cities now, which are basically hubs for alienating people from their true nature. City life actually encourages that "one-size-fits-all" approach to learning. Realistically, the future isn't in the concrete jungles; it's in getting back to nature. I'm not the only one saying that, either. Especially when civilization eventually bites the dust. When that happens, the most vital skill will be knowing what's edible and what isn't. I've actually got a bit of an edge there, haha. I can catch a bird with a makeshift trap, hook a fish, grow potatoes, spot a few types of mushrooms, find wild greens, and even snack on snails. Maybe the younger crowd will actually live to see the day when those skills become the most important things you can know.

Ronald Howard3 said:Speaking for myself, my schooling definitely had a negative impact. Between dealing with bullying, intimidation, threats, and physical fights... I probably would've handled it better if I'd had any support from my parents. You can just tell when someone's been flying solo and had to scrap for everything they have. Besides, they teach you to submit to nonsense—to work and study things you know are useless just because you're being "graded." If you don't bend to the absurdity, you're labeled "bad."

I appreciate your sincere, objective, and constructive contribution to this discussion. It stands in stark contrast to others here who seem rather insulated, preferring to dissect what someone else wrote in a textbook rather than applying their own human intellect and reasoning to the reality of the situation and the problems I’ve laid out.

Regrettably, it seems you are yet another casualty of this system—one that inflicted genuine harm and stifled certain human potentials, leaving you acutely aware of just how damaging the whole structure truly is.

😢

I honestly can't help but feel like I’m overthinking this whole thing, but sometimes you just have to get these thoughts out there because they've been swirling around my head all day. It’s funny how we get so caught up in the minutiae of life that we forget to just step back and look at the big picture, though I suppose I'm the last person who should be giving advice on perspective given how much I tend to obsess over the smallest details. Anyway, I was thinking about how much energy we pour into things that might not even matter in the long run, and it really makes you wonder if we're all just spinning our wheels in different ways. kaže:
Look, steelridge58, what you’re describing sounds absolutely perfect on paper, but back then it was nothing more than a total pipe dream, and honestly, I don't think we've moved all that much closer to it even today. Still, the core idea carries so much weight and genuine purpose, because if we listen to what Hekatonhir mentioned above, education is something we simply cannot do without—it's an absolute necessity in this chaotic world we live in right now—even if the specific examples being thrown around here are frankly pretty appalling, though I suppose I can't really act surprised since I see the same mess everywhere I look. It was vital back then, and while it might feel slightly less urgent in our current landscape, it's still fundamentally essential. The way mass production works, it’s just built into its very nature to reject any kind of uniquely crafted soul that refuses to see itself as just another brick in the wall of the system—even if the kids might not consciously realize it, they can certainly feel that pressure deep down—instead of recognizing themselves as these original, one-of-a-kind individuals who aren't even remotely like anyone else.It’s honestly one of the most infuriating things you can witness—watching some completely unrefined individual, someone who lacks even the slightest shred of fundamental common sense, claw their way up to becoming a PhD just because they happen to be hyper-focused on one tiny, narrow slice of expertise. It feels like such a massive slap in the face to the very idea of true education, and frankly, it serves as a pretty grim indictment of our entire scientific and technological civilization that we worship at the altar of such specialized, hollow credentials. 🙂

I had this one perfect photo saved that I really wanted to upload here to illustrate what I was talking about above, but I just can't seem to track it down anywhere. It’s a great shot—it shows this long line of men all standing perfectly straight in a row, looking exactly like they walked out of a corporate catalog, all dressed in these identical, sharply tailored dark suits without a single hair out of place. But right in the middle of them, there's this one kid who is just completely breaking the mold, wearing an unbuttoned flannel shirt over a T-shirt with jeans and sneakers, looking totally disheveled and grinning ear to ear while he's actually doing a handstand right there in the lineup. 😉)

That photo really hits the nail on the head and perfectly illustrates exactly what you were getting at.

The real issue here is that even though the official goals for our public schools claim we’re trying to foster things like genuine student interest, independence, creativity, moral awareness, and a sense of responsibility toward oneself and the environment—not to mention social consciousness and respect for human rights—it all feels incredibly hollow when the actual classroom instruction doesn't allow for any of it. We talk a big game about nurturing autonomy and creative thinking, yet the system simultaneously stifles those exact qualities by refusing to let students learn in ways that actually suit them. It leaves me wondering just how much room there really is for true independence or innovation, especially considering that teachers themselves are often denied the very freedom to be creative and autonomous if they're expected to instill those same values in their students.
So, why is there such a massive gap—and I’m assuming it’s huge—between what people claim they want to achieve in theory and how things actually play out in practice?

It’s honestly kind of heartbreaking when you look at how we run classrooms, because we basically demand that students solve problems at breakneck speed, often forcing them against these incredibly tight deadlines just to see who can finish first. There are plenty of kids out there who simply need a little more breathing room to actually process what they're looking at—they want to sit with a problem, really chew on it, and find their own way through it—but if they don't hit that arbitrary stopwatch goal, they're labeled as slow. It’s a total recipe for frustration, and I truly believe it does massive damage to their self-confidence, not to mention the fact that teachers end up missing these brilliant, creative breakthroughs just because they were too busy staring at a clock to notice a student's unique approach.

That’s exactly why I keep coming back to the idea that the bond between a teacher and a student is everything, though it’s certainly not something you can just write down in a syllabus or codify in a handbook; it’s something that has to be built organically over time. It shouldn't be a one-way street where we expect the student to do all the heavy lifting when it comes to adjusting to different learning styles, because even if the standard curriculum doesn't exactly leave much room for a more relaxed or personalized approach, there really should be space for that kind of mutual adaptation to happen.

Regarding what you mentioned about targeted competence, I’ve got to say, I see this all the time at my job where I work alongside these high-level IT specialists who practically have PhDs hanging on their walls, yet they couldn't put together a single decent, functional resume if their lives depended on it. I honestly don't know how else to put this, but I really feel like we need to get our act together regarding this whole situation because everything feels so incredibly disorganized right now. I’ve been sitting here staring at my screen trying to figure out how to phrase this without sounding like some soulless corporate robot, because honestly, nobody wants to read a memo that sounds like it was written by an AI from 2010. I’m working on two different versions of a notice for our clients—one that’s a direct letter they actually need to act on regarding their accounts, and then a second, much more casual "FYI" style email that’s just meant to keep them in the loop without causing a panic. It’s that delicate balancing act, you know? You want to be clear about when they need to swap out their info or move things around, but you also don't want to sound like you're shouting at them through a megaphone. I'm just hoping I can nail that tone where we sound professional enough to be trusted, but human enough that they don't immediately hit "unsubscribe."

I suppose I wouldn't be quite as hard on those kids who don't really grasp what little ones are supposed to know yet. 🙂)

Joseph Murphy10 said:Look, Volver, that would be the dream, but back then it was pure fantasy—and honestly, I don't think we're much closer today. Still, the core idea makes sense. Like Hekatonhir pointed out above, education is a necessity, whether you like it or not (those examples mentioned earlier are honestly revolting, even if I see them playing out all the time). But the system is just too "cookie-cutter." It’s designed to reject anyone who doesn't fit the mold—anyone who isn't just another brick in the wall. Kids might not realize it consciously, but they feel it—that pressure to be exactly like everyone else instead of being their own unique selves. And the worst part? You get these totally unrefined individuals who wouldn't know their head from their elbow, yet because they're hyper-focused on one tiny niche, they end up with PhDs. Talk about a bad look for both actual education and our precious scientific civilization. 🙂

Maybe we can take this further and talk about modern life. Most of us live in cities now, which are basically hubs for alienating people from their true nature. City life actually encourages that "one-size-fits-all" approach to learning. Realistically, the future isn't in the concrete jungles; it's in getting back to nature. I'm not the only one saying that, either. Especially when civilization eventually bites the dust. When that happens, the most vital skill will be knowing what's edible and what isn't. I've actually got a bit of an edge there, haha. I can catch a bird with a makeshift trap, hook a fish, grow potatoes, spot a few types of mushrooms, find wild greens, and even snack on snails. Maybe the younger crowd will actually live to see the day when those skills become the most important things you can know.

I completely agree.

Last spring, during one of our trips, our little group ended up on a high mountain plateau in the Ozarks, and we were just absolutely floored seeing sheep scattered under a sky filled with "fluffy clouds," along with horses, goats, and kids... and encountering that stunning landscape, combined with everything else we found there, left us feeling a bit dazed from that crisp, sharp mountain air. It was all made perfect by meeting a local man who lives there, tending to his animals and looking after them (he sounds just like that schoolmate you mentioned), and we ended up talking with him for hours; he kept questioning us, laughing at our ignorance while asking if we knew the names of the plants we were stepping on, before kindly explaining which was which and how they could be used medicinally... all in all, it was a couple of hours of unforgettable "outdoor class" that I would wish upon anyone, and I'd love to experience it all over again myself.

I'm certain that man would gladly host an entire classroom for a two-hour lecture on Nature.

wearyharbor41 said:I appreciate your sincere, objective, and constructive contribution to this discussion. It stands in stark contrast to others here who seem rather insulated, preferring to dissect what someone else wrote in a textbook rather than applying their own human intellect and reasoning to the reality of the situation and the problems I’ve laid out.

Regrettably, it seems you are yet another casualty of this system—one that inflicted genuine harm and stifled certain human potentials, leaving you acutely aware of just how damaging the whole structure truly is.

😢

If you decide that the only "objective" or "constructive" way to look at a topic is the one that perfectly aligns with your own intensely negative outlook, then that isn't true philosophy, not even in the slightest. And honestly, trying to take shots at others by claiming they aren't being "sincere" or "constructive" enough isn't really how you participate in a real conversation.

steelridge58 said:

I honestly can't help but feel like I’m overthinking this whole thing, but sometimes you just have to get these thoughts out there because they've been swirling around my head all day. It’s funny how we get so caught up in the minutiae of life that we forget to just step back and look at the big picture, though I suppose I'm the last person who should be giving advice on perspective given how much I tend to obsess over the smallest details. Anyway, I was thinking about how much energy we pour into things that might not even matter in the long run, and it really makes you wonder if we're all just spinning our wheels in different ways. kaže:
Look, steelridge58, what you’re describing sounds absolutely perfect on paper, but back then it was nothing more than a total pipe dream, and honestly, I don't think we've moved all that much closer to it even today. Still, the core idea carries so much weight and genuine purpose, because if we listen to what Hekatonhir mentioned above, education is something we simply cannot do without—it's an absolute necessity in this chaotic world we live in right now—even if the specific examples being thrown around here are frankly pretty appalling, though I suppose I can't really act surprised since I see the same mess everywhere I look. It was vital back then, and while it might feel slightly less urgent in our current landscape, it's still fundamentally essential. The way mass production works, it’s just built into its very nature to reject any kind of uniquely crafted soul that refuses to see itself as just another brick in the wall of the system—even if the kids might not consciously realize it, they can certainly feel that pressure deep down—instead of recognizing themselves as these original, one-of-a-kind individuals who aren't even remotely like anyone else.It’s honestly one of the most infuriating things you can witness—watching some completely unrefined individual, someone who lacks even the slightest shred of fundamental common sense, claw their way up to becoming a PhD just because they happen to be hyper-focused on one tiny, narrow slice of expertise. It feels like such a massive slap in the face to the very idea of true education, and frankly, it serves as a pretty grim indictment of our entire scientific and technological civilization that we worship at the altar of such specialized, hollow credentials. 🙂

I had this one perfect photo saved that I really wanted to upload here to illustrate what I was talking about above, but I just can't seem to track it down anywhere. It’s a great shot—it shows this long line of men all standing perfectly straight in a row, looking exactly like they walked out of a corporate catalog, all dressed in these identical, sharply tailored dark suits without a single hair out of place. But right in the middle of them, there's this one kid who is just completely breaking the mold, wearing an unbuttoned flannel shirt over a T-shirt with jeans and sneakers, looking totally disheveled and grinning ear to ear while he's actually doing a handstand right there in the lineup. 😉)

That photo really hits the nail on the head and perfectly illustrates exactly what you were getting at.

The real issue here is that even though the official goals for our public schools claim we’re trying to foster things like genuine student interest, independence, creativity, moral awareness, and a sense of responsibility toward oneself and the environment—not to mention social consciousness and respect for human rights—it all feels incredibly hollow when the actual classroom instruction doesn't allow for any of it. We talk a big game about nurturing autonomy and creative thinking, yet the system simultaneously stifles those exact qualities by refusing to let students learn in ways that actually suit them. It leaves me wondering just how much room there really is for true independence or innovation, especially considering that teachers themselves are often denied the very freedom to be creative and autonomous if they're expected to instill those same values in their students.
So, why is there such a massive gap—and I’m assuming it’s huge—between what people claim they want to achieve in theory and how things actually play out in practice?

It’s honestly kind of heartbreaking when you look at how we run classrooms, because we basically demand that students solve problems at breakneck speed, often forcing them against these incredibly tight deadlines just to see who can finish first. There are plenty of kids out there who simply need a little more breathing room to actually process what they're looking at—they want to sit with a problem, really chew on it, and find their own way through it—but if they don't hit that arbitrary stopwatch goal, they're labeled as slow. It’s a total recipe for frustration, and I truly believe it does massive damage to their self-confidence, not to mention the fact that teachers end up missing these brilliant, creative breakthroughs just because they were too busy staring at a clock to notice a student's unique approach.

That’s exactly why I keep coming back to the idea that the bond between a teacher and a student is everything, though it’s certainly not something you can just write down in a syllabus or codify in a handbook; it’s something that has to be built organically over time. It shouldn't be a one-way street where we expect the student to do all the heavy lifting when it comes to adjusting to different learning styles, because even if the standard curriculum doesn't exactly leave much room for a more relaxed or personalized approach, there really should be space for that kind of mutual adaptation to happen.

Regarding what you mentioned about targeted competence, I’ve got to say, I see this all the time at my job where I work alongside these high-level IT specialists who practically have PhDs hanging on their walls, yet they couldn't put together a single decent, functional resume if their lives depended on it. I honestly don't know how else to put this, but I really feel like we need to get our act together regarding this whole situation because everything feels so incredibly disorganized right now. I’ve been sitting here staring at my screen trying to figure out how to phrase this without sounding like some soulless corporate robot, because honestly, nobody wants to read a memo that sounds like it was written by an AI from 2010. I’m working on two different versions of a notice for our clients—one that’s a direct letter they actually need to act on regarding their accounts, and then a second, much more casual "FYI" style email that’s just meant to keep them in the loop without causing a panic. It’s that delicate balancing act, you know? You want to be clear about when they need to swap out their info or move things around, but you also don't want to sound like you're shouting at them through a megaphone. I'm just hoping I can nail that tone where we sound professional enough to be trusted, but human enough that they don't immediately hit "unsubscribe."

I suppose I wouldn't be quite as hard on those kids who don't really grasp what little ones are supposed to know yet. 🙂)

I completely agree.

Last spring, during one of our trips, our little group ended up on a high mountain plateau in the Ozarks, and we were just absolutely floored seeing sheep scattered under a sky filled with "fluffy clouds," along with horses, goats, and kids... and encountering that stunning landscape, combined with everything else we found there, left us feeling a bit dazed from that crisp, sharp mountain air. It was all made perfect by meeting a local man who lives there, tending to his animals and looking after them (he sounds just like that schoolmate you mentioned), and we ended up talking with him for hours; he kept questioning us, laughing at our ignorance while asking if we knew the names of the plants we were stepping on, before kindly explaining which was which and how they could be used medicinally... all in all, it was a couple of hours of unforgettable "outdoor class" that I would wish upon anyone, and I'd love to experience it all over again myself.

I'm certain that man would gladly host an entire classroom for a two-hour lecture on Nature.

My biology professor used to take us out into the wild all the time. He’d tell us to collect plant samples, but it was never just mindless picking; he’d set up a hypothesis—like how a certain species spreads—and we had to prove it through experimentation.

The man could identify a single leaf instantly, rattling off the Latin name, several local nicknames, and its specific properties. On those trips, we collected hundreds, maybe even thousands, of specimens. I found out later that he was actually one of the leading experts on medicinal herbs in all of Europe. He never bragged about it, though. To us, he was just an authority figure—basically a walking computer. We knew he made his own teas and salves, and that he collaborated with various institutions, but we didn't realize just how wise he truly was until much later. He wasn't teaching us to memorize facts; he was teaching us how to think, measure, and verify.

Ronald Howard3 said:Speaking for myself, my schooling definitely had a negative impact. Between dealing with bullying, intimidation, threats, and physical fights... I probably would've handled it better if I'd had any support from my parents. You can just tell when someone's been flying solo and had to scrap for everything they have. Besides, they teach you to submit to nonsense—to work and study things you know are useless just because you're being "graded." If you don't bend to the absurdity, you're labeled "bad."

Are you even aware that you haven't actually written a single word about—well, education? People go to school to learn, yet you haven't specified what you actually learned, what you failed to grasp, or what you feel you could have mastered if the school hadn't stood in your way...

Does this mean today's education system is so broken that students don't even realize the purpose of an education or why they're sitting in those classrooms in the first place?

Eric Newman75 said:My biology professor used to take us out into the wild all the time. He’d tell us to collect plant samples, but it was never just mindless picking; he’d set up a hypothesis—like how a certain species spreads—and we had to prove it through experimentation.

The man could identify a single leaf instantly, rattling off the Latin name, several local nicknames, and its specific properties. On those trips, we collected hundreds, maybe even thousands, of specimens. I found out later that he was actually one of the leading experts on medicinal herbs in all of Europe. He never bragged about it, though. To us, he was just an authority figure—basically a walking computer. We knew he made his own teas and salves, and that he collaborated with various institutions, but we didn't realize just how wise he truly was until much later. He wasn't teaching us to memorize facts; he was teaching us how to think, measure, and verify.

👍

That is just wonderful. Such a joy to read!

Even if your professor and my biology professor were likely from the same generation and went through the exact same American school system, they couldn't have been more different in how they approached teaching, learning, and treating their students—not to mention their obvious passion for the subject itself. My professor was definitely a jokester and a favorite among the kids, but we never really received that level of quality or that deep approach to learning that you described here.

People love to claim that schools are where morality goes to die. Sure, that happens sometimes, but let’s be real—it happens just as often at home.
In both settings, you’ll find endless examples of characters being broken—or, occasionally, some integrity actually being preserved. It really comes down to an individual's innate nature and how much effort is actually put into their upbringing...

The Education of an Orator / Marcus Fabius Quintilianus. 1st Century AD.

Even so, Quintilian leaned toward the value of schools and public education.

What exactly did Quintilian write, and why does his work still matter to us—to our civilization and our heritage?

Don't assume everything is laid out for you online. In reality, the internet only scratches the surface of true knowledge.

Are we dealing with people who think scrolling through the web and living their daily lives is enough of an education? They claim traditional schooling stifles a child's freedom... but have they actually heard of Marcus Fabius Quintilianus? Have they even picked up his books?

Or will they just dismiss Quintilian as "irrelevant"? Maybe they’d go as far as calling for him to be banned altogether.

Is Quintilian somehow to blame for all the corruption and decay currently plaguing our youth?

What's your take?

Marcus Fabius Quintilianus's De institutione oratoria
.

Here are the links. The text is in Latin—but let’s be honest, we all know our Latin; we don't need formal schooling for that, it's something you pick up out in the real world...
There are two options here—some prefer the feel of an old book, others swear by an e-book, so take your pick.

https://archive.org/details/marcusfa...ge/n4/mode/2up

https://www.gutenberg.org/files/2182...-h/21827-h.htm

Sam Martinez9 said:Are you even aware that you haven't actually written a single word about—well, education? People go to school to learn, yet you haven't specified what you actually learned, what you failed to grasp, or what you feel you could have mastered if the school hadn't stood in your way...

Does this mean today's education system is so broken that students don't even realize the purpose of an education or why they're sitting in those classrooms in the first place?

First off, I disagree that school is about "learning"—it's more about breaking you down so you fit into the system. I was an honors student, sure, but only because my parents pressured me into thinking it was vital. Honestly, 90% of it was just wasted time—most teachers are just losers clinging to a paycheck while pretending to be authority figures. Kids see right through it now, especially when they see guys like "Piggy" making bank and living the dream. Even look at Secretary Banožić failing a grade back in the day, while the current elite thrives after scaring us with threats about being locked up in minimum-security prisons.

Why doesn't anyone ask why we lack basic financial literacy? It's because the system wants us to be debt-ridden slaves—it makes people much easier to control that way. It’s baffling how many parents just hand their kids over to this system and trust total strangers to do a better job of raising them than they could themselves.😵