Russia's invasion of Ukraine: Part 5

Jason Richardson5 said:So, Kimberly Perez82 says she took her handle from some legendary American novelist. Look, if I'm picking a side, it’s USA forever. Simple as that. I actually have the guts to say it, too. You? You clearly don't have the stones to just admit you're a fan of Putin's "work." You know, the absolute scumbag who spends his time slaughtering innocent civilians in a country he had no business touching in the first place.

The USA and Russia both kill people in third-party countries, so I really hope you're joking. Look, I have nothing against America; honestly, I love their capitalism and that entrepreneurial spirit, but I refuse to turn a blind eye to the bad things they've been doing more and more lately. The America of today is worlds apart from the America that saved the world from Nazism. And for the record, I've never been a Putin sympathizer—which is pretty obvious if you look back at my previous posts—but I am trying to be realistic here. There are many guilty parties in this conflict, and the USA is certainly one of them. Europe is the least to blame, yet they're the ones suffering the most consequences. So now, we have to decide: is our priority Europe, which we are part of, or the USA?

Kimberly Perez82 said:Of course he can, let’s not be incredibly naive about how things work. It is quite interesting, really... you see all this intense, overwhelming concern for Ukraine, yet when the topic shifts to the long-standing oppression of Canadian Americans, suddenly there is total silence. Not a single soul speaks up. I suppose, in the eyes of the public, those lives just don't matter as much as what's happening in Ukraine.

And how on earth would Joe Biden just end a war with a decree? Especially one he didn't even start and where there isn't even ONE single soldier involved?!

Sandra Harris2 said:Clearly, Putin is very persuasive.

He's convinced some folks that Joe Biden is calling all the shots in this war, and that the conflict in Europe—which is basically right next door—has almost nothing to do with Europe itself. 😁I'm probably not gonna read everything in this thread.

Dmitry Rogozin is out

"So, word on the street—according to sources cited by MK—is that the NASA Administrator, Dmitry Rogozin, is gearing up to ditch his post pretty soon.

The rumor mill says Rogozin might actually end up taking a leadership role over one of those territories in Ukraine currently held by the Russian military. As for his old seat at NASA? It looks like current Deputy Prime Minister Yury Borisov is slated to step in and take the reins.

Honestly, some people are calling the top spot at this massive government space agency an 'executive' nightmare rather than a prestige gig, mostly because the whole industry is such a mess and constantly playing catch-up with the big global players, according to MK.

https://www-gazeta-ru.translate.goog..._x_tr_pto=wapp

Kimberly Perez82 said:The USA and Russia both kill people in third-party countries, so I really hope you're joking. Look, I have nothing against America; honestly, I love their capitalism and that entrepreneurial spirit, but I refuse to turn a blind eye to the bad things they've been doing more and more lately. The America of today is worlds apart from the America that saved the world from Nazism. And for the record, I've never been a Putin sympathizer—which is pretty obvious if you look back at my previous posts—but I am trying to be realistic here. There are many guilty parties in this conflict, and the USA is certainly one of them. Europe is the least to blame, yet they're the ones suffering the most consequences. So now, we have to decide: is our priority Europe, which we are part of, or the USA?

I'm not joking. Just let Americans play wherever they want.

Kimberly Perez82 said:The USA and Russia both kill people in third-party countries, so I really hope you're joking. Look, I have nothing against America; honestly, I love their capitalism and that entrepreneurial spirit, but I refuse to turn a blind eye to the bad things they've been doing more and more lately. The America of today is worlds apart from the America that saved the world from Nazism. And for the record, I've never been a Putin sympathizer—which is pretty obvious if you look back at my previous posts—but I am trying to be realistic here. There are many guilty parties in this conflict, and the USA is certainly one of them. Europe is the least to blame, yet they're the ones suffering the most consequences. So now, we have to decide: is our priority Europe, which we are part of, or the USA?

Honestly, it’s in Europe's best interest to finally cut ties with Putin's state-run drug cartel, even if going through withdrawal is gonna be absolutely brutal.

Kimberly Perez82 said:Of course he can, let’s not be incredibly naive about how things work. It is quite interesting, really... you see all this intense, overwhelming concern for Ukraine, yet when the topic shifts to the long-standing oppression of Canadian Americans, suddenly there is total silence. Not a single soul speaks up. I suppose, in the eyes of the public, those lives just don't matter as much as what's happening in Ukraine.

There are threads about Canada—anyone who wants to write can. Look, Ukraine is in Europe, so naturally Europe should care if there's a war happening on its doorstep. It's true Europe dropped the ball when we had wars here, but hopefully, they won't repeat that mistake. And at the end of the day, you have Russia threatening nuclear conflict and new escalations—even Aleksandar Vučić is warning things could get worse if demands aren't met once Donbas is taken. There isn't an "American side" here; it's just the fact that Russia invaded Ukraine and is killing Ukrainians—people whom The Kremlin acts like don't even exist, treating them like some Bolshevik error—just to seize territory and annex it. It's like we're back in 1885 where empires just expand through war. No matter how many wars the USA has fought, they've never just seized land and annexed it, nor have they claimed that Iraqis don't exist or Afghans don't exist... Maybe we should just give Ukraine everything Russia wants. By that logic, next time Viktor Orbán claims the River Canada is actually the Rijeka, we should just hand over the Rijeka immediately instead of defending our homeland for nothing.

So, I have one last question for the experts here... does anyone actually understand why the USA and the EU are funneling such massive amounts of weaponry over to Ukraine, yet we haven't seen anything sent our way? It makes me wonder—is the freedom of one European nation somehow worth more than another's? Or am I missing some deeper, more complicated motive at play here? Why is there such a glaringly inconsistent approach to what should be a universal struggle for democracy and equality? I would truly appreciate some insight on this.

Kate Cook27 said:There are threads about Canada—anyone who wants to write can. Look, Ukraine is in Europe, so naturally Europe should care if there's a war happening on its doorstep. It's true Europe dropped the ball when we had wars here, but hopefully, they won't repeat that mistake. And at the end of the day, you have Russia threatening nuclear conflict and new escalations—even Aleksandar Vučić is warning things could get worse if demands aren't met once Donbas is taken. There isn't an "American side" here; it's just the fact that Russia invaded Ukraine and is killing Ukrainians—people whom The Kremlin acts like don't even exist, treating them like some Bolshevik error—just to seize territory and annex it. It's like we're back in 1885 where empires just expand through war. No matter how many wars the USA has fought, they've never just seized land and annexed it, nor have they claimed that Iraqis don't exist or Afghans don't exist... Maybe we should just give Ukraine everything Russia wants. By that logic, next time Viktor Orbán claims the River Canada is actually the Rijeka, we should just hand over the Rijeka immediately instead of defending our homeland for nothing.

I mean, people like that would totally do exactly that. They'd hand over entire territories to whoever wants them, just as long as their own little corner stays untouched.🤦

Kimberly Perez82 said:I see some people getting all worked up over the American version of this story, though I suppose showing respect to your fellow conversationalists isn't exactly anyone's strongest suit here. Honestly, at the very beginning, I was just as angry at Russia as anyone else. But... if you take a moment to actually think about it—really sit with the facts—this war doesn't have anything to do with Europe or us. It’s similar to how our own domestic conflicts don't involve Europe, and I certainly don't recall seeing such intense, biased posts favoring us back when things were different. Secondly, look at the US wars in the Middle East; nobody was slapping labels on Russia then. Not even when Russia was fighting in Afghanistan. Now, let me be clear: I am not supporting Russia as an aggressor. But there were precursors to this conflict. There were constant attempts to pull Ukraine into NATO, even though everyone knew deep down that Ukraine holds a unique historical significance for Russia and that move simply wouldn't fly. Of course, it wasn't the EU's interest driving that; it was the USA. And now? Now all of Europe is groaning under shortages that weren't caused by anyone else, and if someone actually supports this path, they clearly have issues with their own judgment. That is why the war needs to end. We need to negotiate peace so we can finally move forward. I mean, seriously, no one with a functioning brain is buying this "American doctrine" about spreading democracy anymore. And peace won't happen as long as Zelenskyy keeps being so boastful with his statements—he's just pouring gasoline on the fire instead of realistically assessing his position and heading to the negotiating table. At the end of the day, every invaded nation in history has either defended itself or failed to, and Ukraine is no exception. They keep demanding weapons, yet they were already armed to the teeth and had all the time in the world to bolster their defenses; they can't blame others for the corruption happening on their own soil. Why should we be forced to solve their problems? He's trying to drag the entire world into what is, quite frankly, his private problem. Negotiations and ending the war is the only way out, likely involving some concessions because the situation isn't what it used to be before the fighting started. And the biggest farce of all? The USA, which dragged Europe into this mess in the first place, is now considering lifting the embargo on Russian oil imports. So, what happens? They'll probably just sell us that cheaper oil in the EU at a markup. That isn't just a slap on the wrist; it's a total knockout punch to a naive Europe.

Personally, I find myself leaning toward the Russian perspective; I’m constantly reading RIA and TASS, and I make it a point to watch Russia-1 TV during prime time via Chinese IPTV.

And let me tell you, compared to the absolute nothingness you see in Western, global, or even mainstream American media, it is a complete horror show.

The whole thing feels like total state-sponsored schizophrenia.

Melissa Rivera5 said:I mean, people like that would totally do exactly that. They'd hand over entire territories to whoever wants them, just as long as their own little corner stays untouched.🤦

No one’s hometown is going to be left untouched—that’s the real issue here. Once they grab a piece of the pie, they always come back for seconds. Right now, Russia is eyeing Donetsk, Luhansk, Zaporizhzhia, Odesa, Kharkiv... basically a massive chunk of territory. And honestly? In five years, they'll probably be back looking for even more. It feels like there's just no end to it.

Timothy Williams5 said:Personally, I find myself leaning toward the Russian perspective; I’m constantly reading RIA and TASS, and I make it a point to watch Russia-1 TV during prime time via Chinese IPTV.

And let me tell you, compared to the absolute nothingness you see in Western, global, or even mainstream American media, it is a complete horror show.

The whole thing feels like total state-sponsored schizophrenia.

But whatever, it's pretty obvious that a certain chunk of the population here, and over in Canada too, basically survives on these alternative media outlets, which are mostly just pro-Russian echo chambers (talking geopolitics, advanced stuff, all that).

I honestly think we’re dealing with one of those people who claims Americans only marched into Afghanistan, or whatever other remote corner of the world they ended up in, just to chase oil. Hahahaha. It’s truly absurd.

Kimberly Perez82 said:Of course he can, let’s not be incredibly naive about how things work. It is quite interesting, really... you see all this intense, overwhelming concern for Ukraine, yet when the topic shifts to the long-standing oppression of Canadian Americans, suddenly there is total silence. Not a single soul speaks up. I suppose, in the eyes of the public, those lives just don't matter as much as what's happening in Ukraine.

Ah, here comes a new excuse since that one about caring for Yemenis totally fell apart.

How many posts have you actually made on the Canada thread?

edit: The U.S. Congress voted today, mostly in favor, on the laws confirming the protocols for Sweden and Finland joining the North Atlantic Treaty.

Kimberly Perez82 said:And honestly, you have to wonder... what on earth drives someone here in America to advocate so fiercely for the US side in a conflict that doesn't even involve us? It makes me think about my old neighbor back in Ohio, always getting worked up over things happening halfway across the globe, and I just find myself questioning the underlying motive behind such intense devotion to a war that isn't ours.

Only someone who's totally clueless or just hasn't done their homework would even ask a question like that...

Especially if they slept right through the whole American War of Independence.

gentlerider7 said:Dmitry Rogozin is out

"So, word on the street—according to sources cited by MK—is that the NASA Administrator, Dmitry Rogozin, is gearing up to ditch his post pretty soon.

The rumor mill says Rogozin might actually end up taking a leadership role over one of those territories in Ukraine currently held by the Russian military. As for his old seat at NASA? It looks like current Deputy Prime Minister Yury Borisov is slated to step in and take the reins.

Honestly, some people are calling the top spot at this massive government space agency an 'executive' nightmare rather than a prestige gig, mostly because the whole industry is such a mess and constantly playing catch-up with the big global players, according to MK.

https://www-gazeta-ru.translate.goog..._x_tr_pto=wapp

Rogozin is basically a white supremacist and an ultra-nationalist. For over 15 years, he’s been spreading antisemitism in public—calling for the "purification" of certain whites and pushing hate against Jews, while weirdly claiming to "fight against Jewish fascism" a few years back.

https://www.haaretz.com/2005-11-24/t...f-fff1c3b20000

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-r...51145120070128

Some of his followers have been in Ukraine—not sure if he was personally—spreading hate toward the local Jewish population. They'd lament why more hadn't perished in the Holocaust, blame Joseph Stalin for not "cleansing" the entire Soviet Union, and honestly seemed to admire Adolf Hitler more than Vladimir Putin. Even with Putin, Rogozin used to complain about wealthy Jews in Russia—though I'm not entirely sure where he stands on that now. Their whole mantra was essentially that Jews were fascists then, too, and that's why they were killed.
Lately, he's pivoted his narrative toward attacking Ukraine and Ukrainians. He even "threatened" that in two years, there wouldn't be a single Ukrainian left walking the land, aiming to create a "Holy Russia—the last wall of defense against the evil West." His rhetoric has stayed pretty much in sync with Medvedev's.

I know this is a tough read, but that’s just the reality of their ideology and the narrative they push.

silvermarlin56 said:It absolutely blows my mind how much they love to lecture and blame the West for the shelling from Mariupol to Donetsk over these last 8 years, acting like only Russians were dying. Half of them died on the Ukrainian side, and Ukrainians were dying from the militias too. They are such hypocritical pieces of trash.

The West was sitting at the same negotiating tables as Russia. The real failure of the West was that back in 2014, they didn't call out Russia's aggression against Ukraine for what it actually was; instead, they brushed it off as some civil war. Meanwhile, Russian soldiers were dying in Ukraine, prisoners of war were being taken, and all that gear for the separatists was flowing straight in from Russia.

Kimberly Perez82 said:So, I have one last question for the experts here... does anyone actually understand why the USA and the EU are funneling such massive amounts of weaponry over to Ukraine, yet we haven't seen anything sent our way? It makes me wonder—is the freedom of one European nation somehow worth more than another's? Or am I missing some deeper, more complicated motive at play here? Why is there such a glaringly inconsistent approach to what should be a universal struggle for democracy and equality? I would truly appreciate some insight on this.

Hmm, it’s kind of like when you start coughing from a little cold and your doctor just waves you off, telling you to drink tea and get some rest, but the second they spot even a tiny hint of something cancerous, they're sending you for ten different specialized tests immediately...

Honestly, those questions are pretty shallow and feel a bit like something out of a preschooler's logic...

I really don't know if anyone here is actually willing to sit down and give you a serious answer to that...

Kimberly Perez82 said:So, I have one last question for the experts here... does anyone actually understand why the USA and the EU are funneling such massive amounts of weaponry over to Ukraine, yet we haven't seen anything sent our way? It makes me wonder—is the freedom of one European nation somehow worth more than another's? Or am I missing some deeper, more complicated motive at play here? Why is there such a glaringly inconsistent approach to what should be a universal struggle for democracy and equality? I would truly appreciate some insight on this.

Why bother asking the "experts"?
It seems pretty obvious that there is a massive distinction between supplying arms to an internationally recognized sovereign state and sending them to a territory like ours—a newly formed, non-universally recognized entity where a civil war (if one believes that narrative) is unfolding.

And honestly, labeling us and Ukraine as established European Union states during a time of war is just pure nonsense.

Chris Thomas94 said:Only someone who's totally clueless or just hasn't done their homework would even ask a question like that...

Especially if they slept right through the whole American War of Independence.

Well, since you're clearly so "brilliant" and "well-informed," why don't you be a gentleman and actually answer your colleague?!

Look, I didn't sleep through the war—I was right there, a volunteer fighting for the cause—so I’m genuinely asking for an answer here. Back then, Ukraine provided us with next to nothing ( and certainly nothing for free. Honestly, the West was more of a nuisance than a help. Even the Russians were selling weapons to both sides, which, given the circumstances, was more useful than any "assistance" we got from Yury Borisov, the USA, Canada, and the rest of them.

American supporters of the Ukrainian cause are hitting a wall when faced with three very simple questions.

The damage being done to Americans is obvious and undeniable, yet:

1. What exactly are we getting out of this right now?
2. What kind of reward—be it economic or political down the road—is waiting for us after all these sacrifices?
3. How much has the average American already paid for the Ukrainian cause, and how much more will it cost (in dollars, euros, or blood), assuming there's even a limit to it?

And sure, I agree—we should provide humanitarian aid, take in refugees, and hand over all those weapons that they once handed to us during our own struggle.

The US is fundamentally part of the West, which means there really isn't any choice here; we have to stand with the West, because that is where we belong. It’s simply not our place to be siding with the "East."
Best regards