Russia's invasion of Ukraine: Part 5

steelheron25 said:Perhaps I missed it if this was already being discussed elsewhere,

Emmanuel Macron released a recording of his conversation with that absolute disgrace from The White House, occurring just four days before the invasion kicked off.

https://www.srf.ch/news/internationa...r-dem-krieg-ab

I haven't managed to track down the full transcript yet, but even the snippets currently circulating in the news media suggest, looking back now, that the individual in question was clearly suffering from some severe mental instability by late February—unless, of course, he is simply a notorious and shameless liar, which is also quite a possibility, isn't it?

There is a particularly absurd moment where he actually attempts to accuse Volodymyr Zelenskyy of trying to acquire nuclear weapons.

It's the usual stuff—distorting reality, claims of illegal regimes, illegitimate governments, and twisting everything to fit their own narrative.
Someone actually posted a video of Lavrov earlier—he didn't answer a single direct question; he just pivoted everything back to his side of the story.
They point fingers at Zelenskyy, conveniently forgetting he took office back in 2019. They also gloss over the 2019 demining agreements that were abandoned. First, they pulled back from the borders, then they backed out of the deals. Back then, Zakharov was even making statements saying they had zero interest in Ukraine 🤔.

Then there's the bit where Macron mentions looking at the Minsk agreement while wondering which agreement Putin is actually following. I can't tell if that's specifically in this article, but I've read about it elsewhere.

Per the article: People were being burned alive...
It likely refers to Odessa, but they always skip over how the euro Majdan and anti Majdan protests dragged on for months in Odessa, peaking in May 2014. That escalated because protesters weren't separated, and some people showed up armed. Those armed groups actually fired on the euro Majdan participants (whom the Russians call Nazis), though they were wearing masks. The craziest part is that they seemed to be hiding behind the police while shooting. I think about four people died there. Later, things spiraled out of control and crowds started clashing, throwing Molotov cocktails at each other—there were even reports of snipers firing on euro Majdan protesters from rooftops in Odessa. Any similarities to what happened in Kyiv? Pure coincidence, apparently. That's how the tragedy, the fires, and the deaths of about 48 people happened, and it was never properly investigated. Later, guys in balaclavas showed up hitting everyone in sight, though videos suggest they were targeting those exiting buildings—the "evil Nazis." Some of the armed individuals were identified, but naturally, they're all in Russia now, along with the legitimate president, Yanukovych.

https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/statu...97090129559553

So, here’s the deal: the Sultan decided to lift the veto on Sweden and Finland, and in exchange, the US agreed to help modernize Turkey's fleet of fighter jets.
Like I was saying before, the whole point was always about getting those restrictions on military tech lifted; the stuff about the Kurds was really just political theater meant for domestic consumption and keeping certain interest groups happy.
You honestly have to give him credit, though—unlike Putin and Russia, this guy actually knows how to cut a deal. You can't just walk into a negotiation, demand 100% of what you want, and call it "diplomacy" like Russia does. That's not negotiating, it's just straight-up blackmail.

Melissa Rivera5 said:But I guess there is a specific reason, though—defending against Russia. Since Putin pretty much proved he isn't exactly an angel.🙂>

So yeah, the latest word is that we just can't expect any kind of friendly relationship with Russia anymore. That’s why they’re ramping up readiness levels—shifting from 40k troops to 300k for a quick response.

Up until recently, Russia and NATO actually had this partnership aimed at peace. People used to look at Russia as a decent neighbor and a civilized nation, rather than what it's showing itself to be: an imperialist autocracy.

Even with everything involving Crimea and the sanctions, the general vibe was still that all these disagreements would eventually get smoothed over through diplomacy.

hollowdriver13 said:

Honestly, we probably just needed to sit back for a few more years and watch NATO fall apart on its own from all the constant bickering between members, eventually becoming this leaderless, aimless group that doesn't even know why it exists anymore.

The real question is, does Putko actually have that kind of luxury? Or did he decide he couldn't wait any longer and just went for the "let's see if this works" approach.

hollowdriver13 said:So yeah, the latest word is that we just can't expect any kind of friendly relationship with Russia anymore. That’s why they’re ramping up readiness levels—shifting from 40k troops to 300k for a quick response.

Up until recently, Russia and NATO actually had this partnership aimed at peace. People used to look at Russia as a decent neighbor and a civilized nation, rather than what it's showing itself to be: an imperialist autocracy.

Even with everything involving Crimea and the sanctions, the general vibe was still that all these disagreements would eventually get smoothed over through diplomacy.

NATO was literally created to defend against the USSR during the Cold War, then later it shifted toward the Russian Federation, and people were starting to wonder if it even mattered anymore. Well, clearly it does. Look, we can be as much of pacifists as we want, but Putler brought serious war back to Europe with those super childish threats about nuclear arsenals. It's honestly wild how some people here can call the Russian Federation a moral giant, defend this aggression, or call for the West to collapse and all that other nonsense.

hollowdriver13 said:https://twitter.com/ragipsoylu/statu...97090129559553

So, here’s the deal: the Sultan decided to lift the veto on Sweden and Finland, and in exchange, the US agreed to help modernize Turkey's fleet of fighter jets.
Like I was saying before, the whole point was always about getting those restrictions on military tech lifted; the stuff about the Kurds was really just political theater meant for domestic consumption and keeping certain interest groups happy.
You honestly have to give him credit, though—unlike Putin and Russia, this guy actually knows how to cut a deal. You can't just walk into a negotiation, demand 100% of what you want, and call it "diplomacy" like Russia does. That's not negotiating, it's just straight-up blackmail.

I mean, the demands aren't even that crazy. But honestly, I think the USA applied a bit of pressure on their end too.
Btw, idk why everyone is so obsessed with racing for military tech. It’d be way better if they just competed over whose economy is actually stronger.

Jeremy Peterson4 said:I mean, the demands aren't even that crazy. But honestly, I think the USA applied a bit of pressure on their end too.
Btw, idk why everyone is so obsessed with racing for military tech. It’d be way better if they just competed over whose economy is actually stronger.

Well, it's because military tech is basically a way to flex how strong an economy actually is; you want that stuff to be absolute cutting edge.
Plus, let's be real—the money in that industry is pretty sweet... 😬

hollowdriver13 said:Well, it's because military tech is basically a way to flex how strong an economy actually is; you want that stuff to be absolute cutting edge.
Plus, let's be real—the money in that industry is pretty sweet... 😬

I don't know about that. Just look at North Korea.
They’ve got missiles that are better than most places on the map, but they can barely afford basic groceries.

Jeremy Peterson4 said:I don't know about that. Just look at North Korea.
They’ve got missiles that are better than most places on the map, but they can barely afford basic groceries.

Look, when I said "NORMAL" countries, I wasn't talking about places where 70% of the budget goes straight to the military, another 20% is spent on Mercedes-Benz fleets and Hennessey hypercars for the big boss, and the last 10% is just enough to keep the common folks from starving. 🤷

Donna Harris11 said:Are we talking about the same military that spent years shaking down migrants coming from Libya?
Even CNN got in on the act, running those nauseatingly sentimental reports.😁

Please... just answer my last question.

George Robinson43 said:I certainly haven't seen any evidence that these migrants are an armed militia marching toward Europe.
Have you?

Don't exhaust yourself trying to sound like an expert; it’s a total mission impossible for someone like you.

Were you just this delusional for the last eight years while all the fighting was going down in Luhansk and Donetsk?
Oh right, I forgot, those are just "Asian hordes" to you—second-class victims, so it doesn't really count, I guess.☕

I should probably point out, though, that for the people who love using that phrase about "Asian hordes" (which the pro-Ukrainian crowd seems to adore), the concept of an invasion from Asia actually started on Germany's eastern border.

hollowdriver13 said:

Honestly, we probably just needed to sit back for a few more years and watch NATO fall apart on its own from all the constant bickering between members, eventually becoming this leaderless, aimless group that doesn't even know why it exists anymore.

The move by Sweden and Finland to join NATO was actually something Putin anticipated the moment he decided to invade Ukraine. In fact, there isn't much happening over the next decade that Putin hasn't already accounted for. NATO lost the chess match against Russia the moment Vladimir was born; we just didn't realize it at the time. Except, of course, for a handful of users on some obscure American message boards...

The only thing Putko actually called correctly was the total collapse of Russia.

Joseph Clark37 said:The move by Sweden and Finland to join NATO was actually something Putin anticipated the moment he decided to invade Ukraine. In fact, there isn't much happening over the next decade that Putin hasn't already accounted for. NATO lost the chess match against Russia the moment Vladimir was born; we just didn't realize it at the time. Except, of course, for a handful of users on some obscure American message boards...

Look, Sweden and Finland jumping into NATO was pretty much a foregone conclusion. Putin was probably banking on some lightning-fast blitzkrieg scenario where the West would just stumble around blindly and eventually be forced to accept the status quo—you know, with Ukraine under the Kremlin's thumb. He likely actually believed that most Ukrainians didn't back their own government and would be more than happy to see Viktor Yanukovych back in the driver's seat.

Jessica Peterson2 said:Would that make someone weep, or just lose their mind?☕

What’s the vibe like where you are? Do you actually know anyone who’s seen combat over in Ukraine?

rowdytiger13 said:That’s the same woman Erdogan put in charge of the Turkish relief funds for women and children, yet now she thinks she can just talk back to the President.
The little gnome from The White House and his missiles certainly strike fear into the hearts of many.

It seems to me they are carefully calibrating the escalation, despite all the loud-mouthed rhetoric being thrown around. Russia has certainly found itself in a delicate spot, but their assessment appears correct: they’ll likely weather these sanctions much more easily than the West expects.

Donna Harris11 said:Were you just this delusional for the last eight years while all the fighting was going down in Luhansk and Donetsk?
Oh right, I forgot, those are just "Asian hordes" to you—second-class victims, so it doesn't really count, I guess.☕

I should probably point out, though, that for the people who love using that phrase about "Asian hordes" (which the pro-Ukrainian crowd seems to adore), the concept of an invasion from Asia actually started on Germany's eastern border.

You conveniently left out the fact that for those eight years, the fighting was hitting Ukrainian positions and cities far more often than Lansing or Pittsburgh.

William Anderson5 said:You conveniently left out the fact that for those eight years, the fighting was hitting Ukrainian positions and cities far more often than Lansing or Pittsburgh.

Yeah, I mean, how they talk about it... like Donetsk and Lansing should've been totally leveled and the people there just eaten alive by cannibals or something. But honestly? The cities are basically fine. Electricity, water, gas—everything's still running.

The largest prisoner exchange to date just took place, bringing 144 soldiers back home to Ukraine, including 95 who were held at U.S. Steel.

Arthur Watson4 said:The largest prisoner exchange to date just took place, bringing 144 soldiers back home to Ukraine, including 95 who were held at U.S. Steel.

And get this—apparently those 95 guys are all severely disabled from their injuries. It seems like it was just too expensive for the Russians to keep paying for their medical care!