Religion classes in school - Megathread

I’m planning on sticking to the same routine we've had so far.
The older kids will be hanging out together in the auditorium, which basically serves as their "common area"—they won't be mixing with anyone else since everyone else stays put in their own classrooms.
As for the younger ones, they'll be in the teacher's office/resource room with the instructor, so they stay isolated from the rest of the group too.
If the administration wants to take some time to deep-clean and disinfect the rooms in the meantime, honestly, that's fine by me...

Susan James said:Hey everyone, let's dive into some deeper discussions and philosophical dilemmas here, but please save the heavy religious and political debates for those specific subreddits.
Since we're on Reddit, let's keep it focused on the student experience—specifically regarding religious education classes. I’m curious about how this affects you or your kids at school. Whether it’s the teachers, the other staff, the students themselves, or the parents, I want to hear the good and the bad from both the kids taking the class and those who opt out.
I’m open to all kinds of stories, but honestly, amidst all the endless debates about the Vatican or money in the North America, the practical questions often get lost. I want to talk about things like scheduling first and last periods, study halls, parental consent forms, and how students are treated in school depending on whether they attend these classes or not.

And speaking of current events, check this out:

If classrooms aren't supposed to be mixed, and if these specialized subjects are held right in the middle of the school day, where are the students who don't participate supposed to go? Unless they just skip the first and last periods entirely?

Whether this fits here or not, the way religious instructors are hired and how irresponsible they can be toward principals really bugs me.

We had a situation once where a very "pious" instructor teaching religion would punish kids running in the halls by banning them from going to snack time. Since she didn't target my little girl, there wasn't much I could do, but it was such a dirty move to deny a kid a meal that, by the way, parents are paying for. Only two or three parents complained, and even then, it was pretty weak because they cared more about keeping good relations for the sake of grades. That instructor only left once they found her a "proper" replacement.

On top of that, school assemblies have turned into religious services. Half the content—choirs, short plays, essays, whatever—mentions Isis, deities, angels... My daughter used to love participating in school events, but since I forbade her from being involved in anything religious, her teacher just stopped letting her participate in anything at all.

I've already posted about kids being stuck hiding in the bathrooms during religion class. They got kicked out of the library because it was small and needed space for the younger grades. Then the principal chased them off the hallway because "there's a draft, they'll catch a cold." They couldn't go to Van because leaving campus during class is banned, the cafeteria was closed, and they weren't allowed in the locker rooms either. So, they were just left to spend 45 minutes enjoying a smelly restroom.

My girl is in high school now, but there's no way I'd let her sit in a classroom during religion class. There's always an alternative, and I truly believe the health guidelines and the SEC mandates are just convenient excuses for some principals to get rid of non-religious kids the easiest way possible.

They really messed up with the remote learning setup by making every single lesson, assignment, and homework task fully accessible via Microsoft Teams. Once I caught a glimpse of how they actually handle religion class and the curriculum they’re pushing, I became 10,000 times more certain that my child won't be listening to a word of it.

I’ve tried to push some things aside, but one of the most egregious examples is this: telling kids to pray to God before bed just so they might get better grades tomorrow.

So, I want to hear from you people who actually support religious education—tell me, what exactly is "good" about this, and what are we supposedly teaching these children? Is praying for high marks really enough? And what happens if God doesn't answer the prayer? Does that mean the kids were being naughty or just didn't pray hard enough?

Did any of you actually sit down and read through it? I haven't even glanced at the whole thing, and honestly, my daughter hasn't either—well, except for when she was curious about what some random greeting acronym meant, and we barely managed to decode 😂
As for the rest, I know it’s just a mountain of nonsense that clashes with everything I believe in and how we live our lives. So, why bother wasting precious time or energy overthinking what they think? A colleague of mine actually came to me all worked up over this absolute garbage (she ended up venting her frustrations by writing out the kid's homework in the process), while I just find myself thinking how lucky I am that I don't have to deal with that bag of stupidity myself. There are already plenty of headaches in this country that affect me directly, so there's no need to load up on extra stress over things that don't concern me one bit...

Michelle Nelson4 said:Did any of you actually sit down and read through it? I haven't even glanced at the whole thing, and honestly, my daughter hasn't either—well, except for when she was curious about what some random greeting acronym meant, and we barely managed to decode 😂
As for the rest, I know it’s just a mountain of nonsense that clashes with everything I believe in and how we live our lives. So, why bother wasting precious time or energy overthinking what they think? A colleague of mine actually came to me all worked up over this absolute garbage (she ended up venting her frustrations by writing out the kid's homework in the process), while I just find myself thinking how lucky I am that I don't have to deal with that bag of stupidity myself. There are already plenty of headaches in this country that affect me directly, so there's no need to load up on extra stress over things that don't concern me one bit...

I just wanted to make sure I wasn't losing my mind here. I didn't spend the whole time reading—just the first few pages.
That’s exactly the kind of argument I throw back at anyone trying to convince me that this stuff is harmless or that you can't walk away with some dangerous ideas.

I don't have any issue with how religious education instructors are hired in our public schools. For the vast majority of cases, everything is handled by the book.

If certain administrators or teachers act inappropriately toward specific students, those are isolated mistakes—the kind of lapses you see from teachers or professors in any subject matter. We all know that happens sometimes.
No sane person would suggest stripping all subjects from the curriculum just because an occasional teacher in any discipline might mishandle a situation with a student.

As for the actual content of the Catholic elective programs, I think they're excellent. The topics are well-chosen and logically structured. Beyond that, though, the quality really comes down to the individual instructor.
Personally, I’m glad that the vast majority of kids in our school system have access to this material if their parents want them to, or if they choose to take it themselves once they hit high school.

In a country like America, where out of roughly 330 million citizens, nearly 240 million identify as Christian (with about 220 million being Catholic plus other denominations), it feels perfectly natural that school events in predominantly Christian communities include certain religious elements. I’m all for it.

I’m confident that, for the most part, things will continue to work out fine for the students who don't enroll in the religious elective. Of course, we all realize it won't always be possible to schedule that class during the first or last period of the day. It's common sense, and there's really no need to make a fuss about it. Everything will turn out okay.

Susan James said:We haven't heard anything official from the school district yet, but if it were up to me, I'd advocate for the community and suggest scheduling it during zero period, first, second, fourth, fifth, and so on.
From a scheduling standpoint, it's totally doable.
If it turns out to be too much of a headache, then it's an elective—let them take the course online.
If we can manage to combine classes for something like Spanish, there's no reason why Religious Studies couldn't be offered online, even if the classes aren't being merged.

I’ll be asking for them to be either first thing in the morning or last thing in the day, or even just held in the hallway. Honestly though, I've decided that if it doesn't happen because of current circumstances, I'm not going to start any drama or try to spark a revolution.😁
Of course, if someone is wearing headphones and listening to music during class, that's definitely grounds for discipline.

The SEC said they’ll be setting up supervised spaces within the school for kids who don't take religion classes, just like how things were handled before the pandemic.

I can't quite recall when, but I definitely saw this in an article last week—some statement from the Secretary regarding how schools are supposed to handle students skipping religion class.

Honestly, I couldn't help but laugh because my kid, who's starting 4th grade now, has spent the last three years basically hanging out in hallways or the library. It's fine, I guess; he's got friends so he's okay, and some of the other kids even tell him, "Man, you're lucky you don't have to go to religion class."

Daniel Chase13 said:I don't have any issue with how religious education instructors are hired in our public schools. For the vast majority of cases, everything is handled by the book.

If certain administrators or teachers act inappropriately toward specific students, those are isolated mistakes—the kind of lapses you see from teachers or professors in any subject matter. We all know that happens sometimes.
No sane person would suggest stripping all subjects from the curriculum just because an occasional teacher in any discipline might mishandle a situation with a student.

As for the actual content of the Catholic elective programs, I think they're excellent. The topics are well-chosen and logically structured. Beyond that, though, the quality really comes down to the individual instructor.
Personally, I’m glad that the vast majority of kids in our school system have access to this material if their parents want them to, or if they choose to take it themselves once they hit high school.

In a country like America, where out of roughly 330 million citizens, nearly 240 million identify as Christian (with about 220 million being Catholic plus other denominations), it feels perfectly natural that school events in predominantly Christian communities include certain religious elements. I’m all for it.

I’m confident that, for the most part, things will continue to work out fine for the students who don't enroll in the religious elective. Of course, we all realize it won't always be possible to schedule that class during the first or last period of the day. It's common sense, and there's really no need to make a fuss about it. Everything will turn out okay.

Wait, what exactly is "by the book" about this? The reality is that the religion teacher is basically the only staff member who doesn't even go through a standard job application process—instead, the local diocese just assigns someone to the school, and the administration can't say no, can't ask for someone else... plus, if they actually find a great teacher they love working with, there's absolutely nothing they can do to keep them if the diocese decides to shuffle them off to a different school next year.
Is that really how things should work? 😵 😵 😵

Sarah Hall53 said:Wait, what exactly is "by the book" about this? The reality is that the religion teacher is basically the only staff member who doesn't even go through a standard job application process—instead, the local diocese just assigns someone to the school, and the administration can't say no, can't ask for someone else... plus, if they actually find a great teacher they love working with, there's absolutely nothing they can do to keep them if the diocese decides to shuffle them off to a different school next year.
Is that really how things should work? 😵 😵 😵

They should also add a streamlined way to move up the pay scale based on much simpler criteria.

And they shouldn't lose their teaching hours if the number of kids in a class drops below 14; they don't need to be merged by section (so in this situation, they won't have to switch to online learning, unlike the German teachers).

@summer, my little one definitely wasn't sitting around waiting for religion class. Unlike her language or music instructors, since this was basically a virtual/correspondence school setup, the teacher didn't message her directly. Instead, everything went through her teacher, so we all received the updates together (English, Math, History, Religion).
Of course, while I was working, I wasn't hovering over her; I was mostly just forwarding messages. Most of the time she didn't even realize I was watching, so she just handled her reading and assignments on her own, sometimes even checking out some videos. It didn't really hurt her progress, except around Easter when she was being grilled more about death and where people go, and during the lockdown via Skype, she got pretty anxious about sickness and mortality—plus, the earthquake certainly left its mark... later on, she actually loved having one less subject to deal with, especially when deadlines were looming, particularly since it usually meant one less essay to write, which isn't insignificant time 🤣 (when you have plenty of extra time to spare).
They might as well let them play with math or find ways for kids to stay home if they aren't allowed to hang out in the library or the hallway anyway.

Joseph Sanchez10 said:The SEC said they’ll be setting up supervised spaces within the school for kids who don't take religion classes, just like how things were handled before the pandemic.

I can't quite recall when, but I definitely saw this in an article last week—some statement from the Secretary regarding how schools are supposed to handle students skipping religion class.

Honestly, I couldn't help but laugh because my kid, who's starting 4th grade now, has spent the last three years basically hanging out in hallways or the library. It's fine, I guess; he's got friends so he's okay, and some of the other kids even tell him, "Man, you're lucky you don't have to go to religion class."

On the flip side, I’ve seen plenty of cases where most of the students are actually counting down the days until their next religious studies period.

Kill it, don't feed it. 🎉

Joseph Sanchez10 said:The SEC said they’ll be setting up supervised spaces within the school for kids who don't take religion classes, just like how things were handled before the pandemic.

I can't quite recall when, but I definitely saw this in an article last week—some statement from the Secretary regarding how schools are supposed to handle students skipping religion class.

Honestly, I couldn't help but laugh because my kid, who's starting 4th grade now, has spent the last three years basically hanging out in hallways or the library. It's fine, I guess; he's got friends so he's okay, and some of the other kids even tell him, "Man, you're lucky you don't have to go to religion class."

Yeah, and our kids are "adequately supervised" too. 😂
But hey, they often went outside or stayed in the library with the teacher to do extra math or play chess...
Either way, those twice a week when they weren't in their first or last period, the kids used that time pretty wisely, regardless of whether there was any actual supervision or not.

I honestly wonder how many kids would actually show up for religion class if it was just another elective offered during the afternoon shift instead of the morning one.
Or, you know, if getting access to sacraments wasn't tied directly to whether they sat through those classes.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard parents say, "Ugh, let them just power through this year since they need their First Communion... once that's out of the way, we're done."

Joseph Sanchez10 said:I honestly wonder how many kids would actually show up for religion class if it was just another elective offered during the afternoon shift instead of the morning one.
Or, you know, if getting access to sacraments wasn't tied directly to whether they sat through those classes.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard parents say, "Ugh, let them just power through this year since they need their First Communion... once that's out of the way, we're done."

Like, imagine if they organized some really solid alternatives instead—you know, maybe a foreign language course, advanced math, or something actually useful.

That would basically just be a living nightmare 😁

Jason Ortiz5 said:Whether this fits here or not, the way religious instructors are hired and how irresponsible they can be toward principals really bugs me.

We had a situation once where a very "pious" instructor teaching religion would punish kids running in the halls by banning them from going to snack time. Since she didn't target my little girl, there wasn't much I could do, but it was such a dirty move to deny a kid a meal that, by the way, parents are paying for. Only two or three parents complained, and even then, it was pretty weak because they cared more about keeping good relations for the sake of grades. That instructor only left once they found her a "proper" replacement.

On top of that, school assemblies have turned into religious services. Half the content—choirs, short plays, essays, whatever—mentions Isis, deities, angels... My daughter used to love participating in school events, but since I forbade her from being involved in anything religious, her teacher just stopped letting her participate in anything at all.

I've already posted about kids being stuck hiding in the bathrooms during religion class. They got kicked out of the library because it was small and needed space for the younger grades. Then the principal chased them off the hallway because "there's a draft, they'll catch a cold." They couldn't go to Van because leaving campus during class is banned, the cafeteria was closed, and they weren't allowed in the locker rooms either. So, they were just left to spend 45 minutes enjoying a smelly restroom.

My girl is in high school now, but there's no way I'd let her sit in a classroom during religion class. There's always an alternative, and I truly believe the health guidelines and the SEC mandates are just convenient excuses for some principals to get rid of non-religious kids the easiest way possible.

If we're talking about something like a Christmas pageant, why is it such a big deal if there's religious content in it?
If your kid was happy participating in the play, why did you stop her?

I’m genuinely curious to see how they plan to handle religious education under these "new circumstances." In my kid's class, it’s just him and one other boy who opt out, and even then, they just ended up hanging out in the library with kids from other grades. That’s going to be my very first question for the teacher next week. I have absolutely no intention of letting my child sit through a religion class when we’ve already made it clear we aren't interested. We're talking about second grade in an after-school program here, so there should be a better way to manage this.

Jason Ortiz5 said:Like, imagine if they organized some really solid alternatives instead—you know, maybe a foreign language course, advanced math, or something actually useful.

It would be such a win if someone finally stepped up and organized a real alternative for students whose parents prefer they skip the elective religious studies classes.
Now, full disclosure: I’m someone who wholeheartedly supports our current model of offering faith-based electives in public schools—I really do—but honestly, I think providing a meaningful alternative is a fantastic idea.

Joseph Sanchez10 said:I honestly wonder how many kids would actually show up for religion class if it was just another elective offered during the afternoon shift instead of the morning one.
Or, you know, if getting access to sacraments wasn't tied directly to whether they sat through those classes.
I can't tell you how many times I've heard parents say, "Ugh, let them just power through this year since they need their First Communion... once that's out of the way, we're done."

The reality is that almost every student who attends religious education in elementary school through their First Communion (around 3rd grade) tends to stick with it year after year.
In fact, the number of students dropping out of these programs after 3rd grade is incredibly small—nearly everyone who starts in 1st grade continues all the way through 8th grade without missing a beat.
Most parents who choose this elective for their children aren't actually struggling with the curriculum or the content; they genuinely want their kids to participate in these school-based religious classes consistently from 1st through 8th grade.

Joseph Sanchez10 said:That would basically just be a living nightmare 😁

😁

I don't think so—mostly because we already have plenty of alternatives available in high schools. In fact, about 82% of students in American high schools choose religious studies as their elective, while only 18% opt for an Ethics course instead.

So, if you look at what's actually happening on the ground, there isn't really any fear surrounding religious education in our schools. Honestly, I’m all for introducing more diverse elective options.