School Reform: Thoughts?

driftingranger2 said:Drop some links here if you’ve found any decent websites your kids actually use to help with studying.
Specifically for school subjects...

Check out the publishers' digital platforms. https://hr.izzi.digital/#/. There's also E-sphere, though I think they can only log in if they’re using textbooks from Pearson.

hiddendriver34 said:Suddenly, everyone thinks they’re an expert educator.

Look, I get it. Divjakica and her crew can be incredibly grating because they try to flip everything upside down without actually having a solid plan. But let’s be real: this whole "life skills" approach isn't some revolutionary discovery. What they’re pushing is just standard modern pedagogy used in top-tier international systems—think Scandinavia—where actual experts designed and rolled out these methodologies.

Sure, a teacher needs to explain certain concepts to kids. But if a classroom consists of a teacher lecturing for forty minutes while students just sit there, nodding and scribbling notes every single day? That’s just bad teaching.

The truth is, that kind of lecture-style teaching is the lazy way out. Honestly, you don't even really have to prepare for it. If you've been in the classroom long enough, you’ve got all the facts stored in your head already. You can just show up, stand at the front, and talk at them.

I think people are confusing old-school dictation with actual engagement, like storytelling or getting kids involved in discussions during the lesson. It makes me sad when teachers treat those two things as the same thing. Instead of meaningful interaction, they swap it out for "collaborative learning," where kids just sit there reading a textbook and trying to figure things out alone before the teacher quizzes them. 👎

And honestly, forget about what they're doing in Scandinavia.
Has anyone ever stopped to wonder why Sweden imports our doctors and ITevcc professionals? Has anyone asked why they’re constantly facing a shortage of experts? Or why they’re okay with such massive waves of migration?
Has anyone wondered why major tech companies in the US are dominated by talent from India and Pakistan?
Why are Japan and China moving ahead so fast?
Why do we look at Americans (with their three core subjects throughout school) or Scandinavians as role models when they mostly just focus on philosophy? Though, to be fair, those kids at least get some hands-on experience since they learn manual skills starting in preschool, which prevents them from feeling totally frustrated early on.

But generally speaking, looking back over the last ten years, I feel like we're just producing kids who struggle to function.
It comes from a lack of actual instruction, a lack of accountability, a lack of homework, and then handing out grades like candy.
We take away their ability to deal with frustration, we cut back on practice and studying, yet we still have these massive textbooks filled with pictures and terrible writing—and most kids either check out completely or somehow end up as honor roll students anyway.

hiddendriver34 said:Check out the publishers' digital platforms. https://hr.izzi.digital/#/. There's also E-sphere, though I think they can only log in if they’re using textbooks from Pearson.

I actually saw him scanning stuff from the pages with his phone once.

There’s really no comparison there. If a teacher spends ten minutes laying out the core concepts and then kicks off a group discussion or a lively debate, that is a completely different beast than a teacher lecturing for forty minutes straight and tossing in five quick questions along the way—which barely eats up five minutes of class time.

And if you want my two cents on why we're seeing this, look at our dismal scores on the Microsoft tests compared to how incredibly well students in places like Finland are doing. But honestly, I don't even want to get sucked into a massive back-and-forth with you all about the "why" behind those numbers right now.

hiddendriver34 said:There’s really no comparison there. If a teacher spends ten minutes laying out the core concepts and then kicks off a group discussion or a lively debate, that is a completely different beast than a teacher lecturing for forty minutes straight and tossing in five quick questions along the way—which barely eats up five minutes of class time.

And if you want my two cents on why we're seeing this, look at our dismal scores on the Microsoft tests compared to how incredibly well students in places like Finland are doing. But honestly, I don't even want to get sucked into a massive back-and-forth with you all about the "why" behind those numbers right now.

Of course you did—you made them equal in your post. It was pretty clear.
It’s crystal clear to me that this is exactly how some teachers operate. I actually hear about it from my kids all the time, and honestly, I've even had some teachers admit that's just their way of doing things.
Does anyone else find it a little strange when parents turn to online forums to hunt for extra study materials for their kids? I was scrolling through some threads earlier and couldn't help but wonder if they realize just how much information is out there.

Susan James said:Of course you did—you made them equal in your post. It was pretty clear.
It’s crystal clear to me that this is exactly how some teachers operate. I actually hear about it from my kids all the time, and honestly, I've even had some teachers admit that's just their way of doing things.
Does anyone else find it a little strange when parents turn to online forums to hunt for extra study materials for their kids? I was scrolling through some threads earlier and couldn't help but wonder if they realize just how much information is out there.

Wait, how did I equate them? I specifically wrote that "the teacher talks for most of the period." How does that possibly apply to a ten-minute lecture followed by thirty minutes of student debate? 🤷

No, I don't think it's normal. But I guess that’s usually the kind of thing parents look for—the ones whose kids aren't getting A's but want them, rather than the parents whose kids are failing and just hoping for a passing grade.

Besides, I wasn't even offering links to random extra study guides; I was talking about the digital supplements that come with the textbooks.

Susan James said:I think people are confusing old-school dictation with actual engagement, like storytelling or getting kids involved in discussions during the lesson. It makes me sad when teachers treat those two things as the same thing. Instead of meaningful interaction, they swap it out for "collaborative learning," where kids just sit there reading a textbook and trying to figure things out alone before the teacher quizzes them. 👎

And honestly, forget about what they're doing in Scandinavia.
Has anyone ever stopped to wonder why Sweden imports our doctors and ITevcc professionals? Has anyone asked why they’re constantly facing a shortage of experts? Or why they’re okay with such massive waves of migration?
Has anyone wondered why major tech companies in the US are dominated by talent from India and Pakistan?
Why are Japan and China moving ahead so fast?
Why do we look at Americans (with their three core subjects throughout school) or Scandinavians as role models when they mostly just focus on philosophy? Though, to be fair, those kids at least get some hands-on experience since they learn manual skills starting in preschool, which prevents them from feeling totally frustrated early on.

But generally speaking, looking back over the last ten years, I feel like we're just producing kids who struggle to function.
It comes from a lack of actual instruction, a lack of accountability, a lack of homework, and then handing out grades like candy.
We take away their ability to deal with frustration, we cut back on practice and studying, yet we still have these massive textbooks filled with pictures and terrible writing—and most kids either check out completely or somehow end up as honor roll students anyway.

Weather forecast: scattered axe showers nationwide.
Sarah Hall53 is backing nosorog all the way.

I’d add that part of the problem is how reforms cater to parents. And let's be real—with very few exceptions—parents just want schools to be as friction-less as possible for their kids. They want that "oh, he's so brilliant, he remembers everything instantly" feeling without any actual effort, and straight A's without the grind.
Since parents are voters, every new educational reform ends up being designed just to give them exactly what they want.
Who cares how much damage that does to the kids or society in the long run? Around here, nobody thinks further ahead than the next four-year election cycle.

hiddendriver34 said:Wait, how did I equate them? I specifically wrote that "the teacher talks for most of the period." How does that possibly apply to a ten-minute lecture followed by thirty minutes of student debate? 🤷

No, I don't think it's normal. But I guess that’s usually the kind of thing parents look for—the ones whose kids aren't getting A's but want them, rather than the parents whose kids are failing and just hoping for a passing grade.

Besides, I wasn't even offering links to random extra study guides; I was talking about the digital supplements that come with the textbooks.

Hold on a second. Do you honestly believe an eleven-year-old or a fifteen-year-old has the cognitive capacity to jump into a full-blown debate right after listening to a ten-minute lecture on something they're hearing for the first or second time?
Do you really think a student has enough foundational knowledge or the specific skills to learn about the fall of Rome just because a teacher gives a quick ten-minute overview and then expects the whole class—which is a mixed bag of abilities—to just sit around and discuss it? 🙏

😕
It’s honestly no wonder our scores on Microsoft tests are so low.
And things are likely going to get even worse once this becomes the norm.

Project-based learning and collaborative teaching have basically become a joke for teachers who don't want to put in the work. They'll just pass the buck to the parents to download stuff from the internet, and then blame "lazy" or "uninterested" kids when they don't know the material.

hiddendriver34 said:Check out the publishers' digital platforms. https://hr.izzi.digital/#/. There's also E-sphere, though I think they can only log in if they’re using textbooks from Pearson.

My first grader mentioned her teacher uses E-sphere. Does that mean we can log in at home to grab some materials too?

Susan James said:Hold on a second. Do you honestly believe an eleven-year-old or a fifteen-year-old has the cognitive capacity to jump into a full-blown debate right after listening to a ten-minute lecture on something they're hearing for the first or second time?
Do you really think a student has enough foundational knowledge or the specific skills to learn about the fall of Rome just because a teacher gives a quick ten-minute overview and then expects the whole class—which is a mixed bag of abilities—to just sit around and discuss it? 🙏

😕
It’s honestly no wonder our scores on Microsoft tests are so low.
And things are likely going to get even worse once this becomes the norm.

Project-based learning and collaborative teaching have basically become a joke for teachers who don't want to put in the work. They'll just pass the buck to the parents to download stuff from the internet, and then blame "lazy" or "uninterested" kids when they don't know the material.

Our test results were already pretty dismal long before these modern teaching trends started making a mess of things. 😉

As for the bolded part—hey, fair enough. This is a forum. Everyone’s entitled to their own take.

Susan Martin4 said:My first grader mentioned her teacher uses E-sphere. Does that mean we can log in at home to grab some materials too?

Oh, absolutely. You can find just about anything on there. It’s great for grabbing practice quizzes before a big test. Plus, anyone can jump in and use it—it isn't restricted just to kids using McGraw Hill textbooks.

Susan Martin4 said:My first grader mentioned her teacher uses E-sphere. Does that mean we can log in at home to grab some materials too?

Here's the link

https://www.google.com/classroom

Thanks 👍

As far as the sphere goes, I don't have anything besides an app on my phone, which she uses for her English practice

Susan Martin4 said:Thanks 👍

https://www.razredna-nastava.net/stranica.php?id=541

Worksheets.
They've got stuff for every subject.

If they need English, check out Dip in 1.

Susan James said:I think people are confusing old-school dictation with actual engagement, like storytelling or getting kids involved in discussions during the lesson. It makes me sad when teachers treat those two things as the same thing. Instead of meaningful interaction, they swap it out for "collaborative learning," where kids just sit there reading a textbook and trying to figure things out alone before the teacher quizzes them. 👎

And honestly, forget about what they're doing in Scandinavia.
Has anyone ever stopped to wonder why Sweden imports our doctors and ITevcc professionals? Has anyone asked why they’re constantly facing a shortage of experts? Or why they’re okay with such massive waves of migration?
Has anyone wondered why major tech companies in the US are dominated by talent from India and Pakistan?
Why are Japan and China moving ahead so fast?
Why do we look at Americans (with their three core subjects throughout school) or Scandinavians as role models when they mostly just focus on philosophy? Though, to be fair, those kids at least get some hands-on experience since they learn manual skills starting in preschool, which prevents them from feeling totally frustrated early on.

But generally speaking, looking back over the last ten years, I feel like we're just producing kids who struggle to function.
It comes from a lack of actual instruction, a lack of accountability, a lack of homework, and then handing out grades like candy.
We take away their ability to deal with frustration, we cut back on practice and studying, yet we still have these massive textbooks filled with pictures and terrible writing—and most kids either check out completely or somehow end up as honor roll students anyway.

Well, then. To start things off:
I was reading through some recent business reports, and it really got me thinking about how we handle our work-life balance here in the States. It’s one of those things that seems simple on paper, but when you actually dig into the data, it gets pretty complicated. Apparently, there's this study by Expedia showing that American workers, on average, don't even use ten of their allotted paid vacation days. I mean, I guess that makes sense given how much the culture here pushes the whole "hustle" mentality, but it still feels a bit heavy. We're all so busy trying to stay ahead that we forget to actually step away. And it leads to a weird paradox, doesn't it? You'd think if people were taking more breaks, they'd be sharper, but the numbers suggest otherwise. In fact, the US has the lowest productivity among G-7 nations. It’s a bit of a head-scratcher, really. Maybe we aren't resting enough, or maybe we're just working inefficiently because we're too burnt out to focus. I suppose it's a bit of both. It's definitely something worth looking into more deeply, perhaps even checking out the OECD Compendium of Productivity Indicators to see how we stack up against everyone else. But for now, I guess my takeaway is just to try and actually use my PTO. It might be more productive than I realize.

An interesting study just came out from IBM, an employability assessment firm, and the results are a bit of a wake-up call. It turns out that only about 4.77 percent of candidates actually possess the ability to write correct logic for a program—which, I suppose, is really just the bare minimum requirement for any kind of programming role. It makes you wonder, though, about how we got here. Maybe the training isn't quite hitting the mark, or perhaps the standards have shifted in ways we haven't fully realized yet. Regardless, those numbers seem incredibly low.

Large companies are essentially massive corporations, and if someone is absolutely killing it there—whatever that looks like in practice—it just means they’ve mastered that specific corporate culture. It involves a certain kind of maneuvering, I guess. Like, once you climb the ladder to a management position, you start hiring people who you feel are "your" kind of people, or at least people who fit your specific vibe. That sort of thing.

I’ve been hearing this firsthand lately, but it seems like the caste system from India is starting to bleed into those massive IT corporations here in the States.
It seems like we’re looking at some pretty heavy data regarding how much time people actually take off from work. I was reading this piece about how many vacation days go unused, and it really makes you think about our work culture here in the States. According to findings from Expedia, American workers, on average, don't even use ten of their paid vacation days. It’s a bit startling, I guess. You’d think with all the talk about burnout and mental health, people would be rushing to hit those PTO limits, but maybe there's just this unspoken pressure to stay glued to the desk. The article points out that, in fact, the US has the lowest productivity among G-7 nations. It feels a bit counterintuitive, doesn't it? One might assume that working more hours would lead to higher output, but perhaps the lack of rest is actually what's dragging us down. If you're constantly running on fumes, you aren't exactly performing at your peak. Maybe we're just working harder, not smarter. I don't know, it's a complex issue, for sure. It's worth considering whether we should be prioritizing downtime if we actually want to get things done efficiently.
It seems like I’ve stumbled upon an interesting piece from ZDNet regarding the shifting landscape in Silicon Valley. It really makes you wonder about the long-term implications of how tech giants are restructuring their workforce. I was reading through the details, and I can't help but feel that we are seeing a massive pivot in how corporate culture is being handled in the States. There’s a certain tension there between the old way of doing things—that high-growth, "burn the midnight oil" mentality—and this newer, more cautious approach that seems to be taking hold. Maybe it’s just a seasonal correction? Or perhaps the era of unchecked expansion is finally hitting a wall. I guess it's hard to say for sure without seeing how the next few quarters play out, but the momentum definitely feels different lately. It’s a lot to process, honestly. One might argue that the industry is maturing, though I suppose "maturing" is often just a polite way of saying things are getting a bit more stagnant. Regardless, it's certainly worth keeping an eye on.

Susan James said:I think people are confusing old-school dictation with actual engagement, like storytelling or getting kids involved in discussions during the lesson. It makes me sad when teachers treat those two things as the same thing. Instead of meaningful interaction, they swap it out for "collaborative learning," where kids just sit there reading a textbook and trying to figure things out alone before the teacher quizzes them. 👎

And honestly, forget about what they're doing in Scandinavia.
Has anyone ever stopped to wonder why Sweden imports our doctors and ITevcc professionals? Has anyone asked why they’re constantly facing a shortage of experts? Or why they’re okay with such massive waves of migration?
Has anyone wondered why major tech companies in the US are dominated by talent from India and Pakistan?
Why are Japan and China moving ahead so fast?
Why do we look at Americans (with their three core subjects throughout school) or Scandinavians as role models when they mostly just focus on philosophy? Though, to be fair, those kids at least get some hands-on experience since they learn manual skills starting in preschool, which prevents them from feeling totally frustrated early on.

But generally speaking, looking back over the last ten years, I feel like we're just producing kids who struggle to function.
It comes from a lack of actual instruction, a lack of accountability, a lack of homework, and then handing out grades like candy.
We take away their ability to deal with frustration, we cut back on practice and studying, yet we still have these massive textbooks filled with pictures and terrible writing—and most kids either check out completely or somehow end up as honor roll students anyway.

It seems like the US just isn't making much headway lately. Honestly, we haven't even really recovered from that massive real estate bubble burst back in the 90s, I guess.The concept of a "Lost Decade" is such a heavy, sobering thing to think about. It’s that period where an entire economy just... stalls. You look at history and see these long stretches where growth hits a wall, stagnation sets in, and it feels like the momentum everyone was banking on just evaporates overnight. I guess you could say the engine stalled, but instead of a quick jumpstart, the whole car just sat idling in the driveway for years. It usually starts with a massive bubble bursting—think of those wild real estate or stock market surges that feel unstoppable until they aren't. Once that bubble pops, you're left dealing with a mountain of bad debt and a sudden, sharp loss of confidence. People stop spending, businesses stop investing, and suddenly, the whole system enters this weird, sluggish limbo. It isn't always a dramatic crash, either; sometimes it's just a slow, agonizing grind where nothing seems to move forward. I suspect it’s incredibly difficult for a society to recover once that sense of optimism is gone. Even when the numbers start looking better on paper, the psychological weight of those lost years lingers. It makes me wonder how much of a nation's future is tied to its ability to maintain that collective belief in progress. If you lose that, you might find yourself staring down a very long, very quiet decade.Their wages have just been sitting there, completely stagnant, for twenty years now. I guess it’s hard to wrap my head around that kind of stagnation.

It’s a heavy subject, but I suppose we have to face it: the US has one of the highest suicide rates in the world. On top of that, the work culture here is just incredibly toxic. It feels like everyone is constantly burnt out.It’s actually quite fascinating how much work needs to be done regarding our approach to labor. I was just reading this piece about how productivity levels are shifting, and it really makes you think. According to data from Expedia, American workers on average don't use 10 of their paid vacation days. It seems like there's this unspoken pressure to just keep grinding, even when you're clearly burnt out. In fact, the US has the lowest productivity among G-7 nations, which is a bit of a wake-up call, isn't it? You would think that working more hours would lead to better results, but the math just doesn't seem to add up that way. Maybe we've been looking at efficiency all wrong. Perhaps taking that extra time off isn't a luxury, but a necessity if we want to actually get things done effectively. I guess it's worth reconsidering how we balance the hustle with actual rest.)

According to a government survey from 2016, nearly a quarter of American companies actually require their employees to clock more than 80 hours of overtime every single month. I suppose the most frustrating part is that those extra hours often go completely unpaid.

It seems like Americans aren't really taking enough time off, either. I mean, according to a study by Expedia, American workers on average didn't use 10 of their paid vacation days. And, I guess, about 63 percent of American respondents actually felt guilty just for using the time they were allotted. It's a bit much, isn't it? Maybe we all just need to learn how to unplug.

But honestly, putting in endless hours at the office doesn't always equate to getting more done. It’s kind of a misconception, I guess. In fact, the US has the lowest productivity among G-7 nations, if you look at the data from the OECD Compendium of Productivity Indicators.

hiddendriver34 said:So, I just asked my kid which textbooks they're actually using in class, and he said it's the Google one. He hasn't complained much yet—says it's "fine"—but hey, that's just a student's perspective.

I’m not so sure about mine—Geo and Clio are basically in a coma over their studies. Biology seems alright, and I can see she’s handling Chemistry and Physics okay for now... she doesn't complain about the textbooks, either. Says they're interesting, or something like that.

Regarding teaching methods, I find the philosophy curriculum for high school seniors to be quite an interesting subject. On one hand, there’s the textbook by Boris Kalin, which follows a strictly historical approach—essentially just tracing the timeline of philosophy from the ancient era forward. On the other hand, you have Tomislav Reškovac’s textbook, which utilizes a more problem-based framework. In that version, the book is organized into chapters centered around specific philosophical dilemmas, and then within each topic, you'll find various texts from philosophers spanning different eras.

Susan James said:Not everyone is laughing, though. For some, it’s actually nice to take a breather while the kids dive into the texts themselves. If they don't get something, honestly, it's often on them—they're either being lazy, disinterested, or struggling to focus because they've been glued to their phones at home.
Any excuse that shifts the responsibility onto the kid is a convenient one.
And then you shouldn't be surprised by a flood of IP Corp complaints.

One of the silver linings (if you can call it that) during the pandemic era was the return to in-person learning where students weren't allowed to sit in little groups of four (where half the class ends up with their backs to the board) or cluster together by neighborhood to work on group projects.
Suddenly, the same people who had to start looking students in the eye again (and now doing it through masks, which makes eye contact even more vital) are yelling that infection rates are too high and we need to switch back to online learning. And since recording sessions isn't always an option for various reasons, they just send instructions to parents or students telling them which page of the textbook to cover independently.

And that's the "education reform" that parents supposedly asked for.

Of course, there are things kids simply need explained, demonstrated, or told through a story. It's not just limited to math or language grammar; it applies to history through anecdotes, biology, geography, technical skills... you name it.

This whole group research/project-based/collaborative learning thing—whatever they're calling it these days—is actually fantastic for interdisciplinary topics and connecting what's already been learned across different subjects. Language classes are probably the best place for this; you can practice grammar and expand vocabulary while simultaneously reviewing science or history, tossing in some civic education and real-world life skills... plus, it helps build a sense of community in the classroom through actual communication.

From what I saw last year, Google studies and science curricula overlap quite a bit in many places. If a topic has already been covered in science, you can assign a project for them to tackle during geography. But if it hasn't, then you're basically just dumping extra homework on a student that the teacher should have handled.

Absolutely.
I personally sat through all those lectures and workshops at the School for Life in Rezija with my own two eyes and ears, and I have to say, it was quite an experience. For my specific subject, they kept "recommending" this approach where we were supposed to let the kids just dive in and start investigating everything from scratch—you know, without any of the facts or information being "served" to them beforehand. I guess that’s the idea, though it felt a bit much at times.
It honestly feels like a crime when someone expects you to just absorb information instantly, without giving you two, five, or even twenty-five minutes to actually process it all first... I guess it’s just how the prefrontal cortex works, maybe.
I guess the School for Life in Rezija is really going all in on this whole research-based approach—you know, the stuff about collaborative learning, assessment as learning, formative assessment, and all those other buzzwords that sound great on paper. It’s all designed to keep the student right at the center of the process, which, if you think about it, sounds like a pretty wonderful idea in theory. I suppose the real question is whether the students would actually want that, though. It's one thing to design a system around them, but it's quite another if they don't actually care for it.🤣

I guess there isn't much to say about a rhino, really... just sort of sits there, existing in its own heavy, quiet way. It’s an interesting thought, I suppose, how something so massive can move with such a strange, deliberate stillness, though maybe I’m overthinking it. Just a rhino. driftingranger2 says:

Honestly, I've just about had it with Scandinavia.

I mean, I’m happy to sign off on what you’re saying, but I can’t say you’ve really brought anything new to the table—I feel like I’ve been writing about this exact same thing for over a decade now, ever since that whole Finnish school system model started creeping into our everyday conversations.🙄🙂

I guess, looking back over the last decade or so, I’ve started to get this lingering impression that we’re just continuously churning out idiots when it comes to the younger generation.
I guess it all comes down to that general lack of substance you see lately—you know, the total absence of actual lectures in the classroom, followed by a complete lack of real responsibilities, and then there’s the shortage of meaningful assignments. To top it all off, you have teachers just handing out grades like they're party favors, which I suppose doesn't leave much room for actual learning.
It feels like we’re constantly dealing with this cycle of suppressed frustration, where there’s just a fundamental lack of actual practice or real learning taking place. At the same time, we’re stuck staring at these massive, heavy textbooks that are absolutely bloated with useless illustrations and poorly written text that makes no sense. Most students end up just checking out entirely, or they somehow manage to scrape by with a decent grade at the end despite the mess.

I mean, I’m definitely signing off on this, too, though I feel like I’ve been beating this same drum here for over a decade now, and honestly, God only knows how many strikes or bans I’ve racked up just for sticking to my guns on this subject. 🥳
Well, I guess if you say so, then I suppose it must be true.

Betty Wood54 said:Regarding teaching methods, I find the philosophy curriculum for high school seniors to be quite an interesting subject. On one hand, there’s the textbook by Boris Kalin, which follows a strictly historical approach—essentially just tracing the timeline of philosophy from the ancient era forward. On the other hand, you have Tomislav Reškovac’s textbook, which utilizes a more problem-based framework. In that version, the book is organized into chapters centered around specific philosophical dilemmas, and then within each topic, you'll find various texts from philosophers spanning different eras.

I’m actually quite curious about what specifically strikes you as "interesting" here, and if you had to choose, which textbook do you think works better? 🍿

I feel like Reškovac is just posturing, honestly. He reminds me a bit of someone like Nikola Jokić, in a sense.
Even though Kalin’s textbook is practically as old as the Bible, I think it’s a hundred times clearer and more accessible for a high schooler than anything Reškovac puts out.
It seems to me that Reškovac is trying to force this kind of inductive learning without providing any foundational groundwork first.
Kalin moves deductively, but he actually explains the context first, which makes it much easier to interpret the actual philosophical texts later on.

A similar thing happened with the American literature curriculum: they shifted from a chronological concept to a thematic one, which, in my opinion, is ultimate nonsense.
Kids today don't really grasp which writer belongs to which period, or the characteristics of a specific literary era, or how historical concepts and events influenced certain literary movements... instead, they mostly just focus on... well, women characters in the works.
So they end up with this weird mashup ranging from Antigone to Judith, then Laura, all the way to Madame Bovary and Anna Karenina.
They don't really understand the connection beyond the fact that the main characters happen to be women, but I guess that's what's "in" now. 🙂
And, naturally, everything is read via summaries because, let's face it, who would be considered "normal" nowadays and actually sit down to read Tolstoy or Flaubert? Good luck with that. 🙂
It's just required reading to check a box. 🙂

urbantinker8 said:Absolutely.
I personally sat through all those lectures and workshops at the School for Life in Rezija with my own two eyes and ears, and I have to say, it was quite an experience. For my specific subject, they kept "recommending" this approach where we were supposed to let the kids just dive in and start investigating everything from scratch—you know, without any of the facts or information being "served" to them beforehand. I guess that’s the idea, though it felt a bit much at times.
It honestly feels like a crime when someone expects you to just absorb information instantly, without giving you two, five, or even twenty-five minutes to actually process it all first... I guess it’s just how the prefrontal cortex works, maybe.
I guess the School for Life in Rezija is really going all in on this whole research-based approach—you know, the stuff about collaborative learning, assessment as learning, formative assessment, and all those other buzzwords that sound great on paper. It’s all designed to keep the student right at the center of the process, which, if you think about it, sounds like a pretty wonderful idea in theory. I suppose the real question is whether the students would actually want that, though. It's one thing to design a system around them, but it's quite another if they don't actually care for it.🤣

I guess there isn't much to say about a rhino, really... just sort of sits there, existing in its own heavy, quiet way. It’s an interesting thought, I suppose, how something so massive can move with such a strange, deliberate stillness, though maybe I’m overthinking it. Just a rhino. driftingranger2 says:

Honestly, I've just about had it with Scandinavia.

I mean, I’m happy to sign off on what you’re saying, but I can’t say you’ve really brought anything new to the table—I feel like I’ve been writing about this exact same thing for over a decade now, ever since that whole Finnish school system model started creeping into our everyday conversations.🙄🙂

I guess, looking back over the last decade or so, I’ve started to get this lingering impression that we’re just continuously churning out idiots when it comes to the younger generation.
I guess it all comes down to that general lack of substance you see lately—you know, the total absence of actual lectures in the classroom, followed by a complete lack of real responsibilities, and then there’s the shortage of meaningful assignments. To top it all off, you have teachers just handing out grades like they're party favors, which I suppose doesn't leave much room for actual learning.
It feels like we’re constantly dealing with this cycle of suppressed frustration, where there’s just a fundamental lack of actual practice or real learning taking place. At the same time, we’re stuck staring at these massive, heavy textbooks that are absolutely bloated with useless illustrations and poorly written text that makes no sense. Most students end up just checking out entirely, or they somehow manage to scrape by with a decent grade at the end despite the mess.

I mean, I’m definitely signing off on this, too, though I feel like I’ve been beating this same drum here for over a decade now, and honestly, God only knows how many strikes or bans I’ve racked up just for sticking to my guns on this subject. 🥳
Well, I guess if you say so, then I suppose it must be true.

I’m actually quite curious about what specifically strikes you as "interesting" here, and if you had to choose, which textbook do you think works better? 🍿

I feel like Reškovac is just posturing, honestly. He reminds me a bit of someone like Nikola Jokić, in a sense.
Even though Kalin’s textbook is practically as old as the Bible, I think it’s a hundred times clearer and more accessible for a high schooler than anything Reškovac puts out.
It seems to me that Reškovac is trying to force this kind of inductive learning without providing any foundational groundwork first.
Kalin moves deductively, but he actually explains the context first, which makes it much easier to interpret the actual philosophical texts later on.

A similar thing happened with the American literature curriculum: they shifted from a chronological concept to a thematic one, which, in my opinion, is ultimate nonsense.
Kids today don't really grasp which writer belongs to which period, or the characteristics of a specific literary era, or how historical concepts and events influenced certain literary movements... instead, they mostly just focus on... well, women characters in the works.
So they end up with this weird mashup ranging from Antigone to Judith, then Laura, all the way to Madame Bovary and Anna Karenina.
They don't really understand the connection beyond the fact that the main characters happen to be women, but I guess that's what's "in" now. 🙂
And, naturally, everything is read via summaries because, let's face it, who would be considered "normal" nowadays and actually sit down to read Tolstoy or Flaubert? Good luck with that. 🙂
It's just required reading to check a box. 🙂

As much as I believe we shouldn't have messed with the old ways in the first place, I absolutely stand by that bolded part.👍