CheckEmoji Community · the emoji forum
🏠 Home 🆕 What's new ❓ Unanswered 🔥 Popular 📡 RSS Members 👥 0 online log in · register
Home › Society › Law › Scam, deception, or what?

Scam, deception, or what?

Started by Justin Palmer45 · · 👁 4 views · 10 replies

📡 Subscribe to replies

Participants Justin Palmer45Nathan Gomez3crimsonsailor7placidgull21Daniel Roberts72Jerry Flores75John Adams4
Justin Palmer45 Justin Palmer45 MemberOP
12 messages
joined Jul 2004
#1 ·
My father is currently living with his second wife, whose son and daughter-in-law have essentially been living in his apartment—which he owns outright—as tenants for over twenty years.
He’s now settled into an assisted living facility; while his memory isn't perfect, he remains quite lucid regarding certain matters.
I just discovered the claim that he supposedly sold that apartment to his daughter-in-law.
Apparently, this was done through his current wife, though it seems they’ve been lying to me, given how smoothly I’ve been able to cooperate with them and visit my father until now.
However, my father insists—and I actually have an audio recording of him saying this—that he never sold anything, never received a single cent, and never signed a single document.
When I asked to see the contract, the situation shifted instantly; suddenly, I’m the one being "insulted," and they’ve cut off all communication with me, refusing to deal with me at all (mind you, we had a perfectly good relationship up until this point).
My intention is to report this to the Department of Homeland Security as suspected criminal activity under specific sections of the Penal Code regarding fraud and embezzlement.
What does the process look like, and if I move forward, will I be liable for any legal costs? I am doing this solely for my father’s sake and have zero personal interest in the property; besides, he maintains that his stay in the facility is merely "temporary" for medical checkups and that he was brought here against his will through some sort of deception.
I would truly appreciate any advice.
Nathan Gomez3 Nathan Gomez3 Newcomer
1 message
joined Jun 2010
#2 ·
Go find yourself a lawyer—unless there aren't any legal pros hanging out here—and just ask them. These people are clearly trying to snatch up the whole apartment while he's still around, or they'll just grab your share the second, God forbid, your dad passes away.
Justin Palmer45 Justin Palmer45 MemberOP
12 messages
joined Jul 2004
#3 ·
Nathan Gomez3 said:Go find yourself a lawyer—unless there aren't any legal pros hanging out here—and just ask them. These people are clearly trying to snatch up the whole apartment while he's still around, or they'll just grab your share the second, God forbid, your dad passes away.

Thanks for getting back to me... but my point was that I'm actually looking to report this to the FBI as a formal complaint.
I have absolutely no desire to see fraud or theft succeed—not because I’m looking to profit from such shady business, and certainly not because I want to deal with the headache of a potential courtroom drama later on. Naturally, I'm not interested in any outcome that involves legal fallout.
As a citizen—and, by a stroke of unfortunate coincidence, the son of the victim here—I feel compelled to step forward and report what appears to be a blatant case of theft, fraud, and the systemic exploitation of an elderly person.
I decided to put this question out there because I figured someone might have navigated similar waters and could offer some actual guidance.
As far as I can tell, this is supposed to be a legal forum.
Regardless, I really appreciate the quick turnaround on that response.🙂
crimsonsailor7 crimsonsailor7 Active Member
214 messages
joined May 2010
#4 ·
Look, you can just file the report if you want to, nobody's stopping you... based on what you've actually written here, though, it’s honestly pretty tough to tell if there’s enough substance to actually justify a formal complaint or a lawsuit...
Justin Palmer45 Justin Palmer45 MemberOP
12 messages
joined Jul 2004
#5 ·
crimsonsailor7 said:Look, you can just file the report if you want to, nobody's stopping you... based on what you've actually written here, though, it’s honestly pretty tough to tell if there’s enough substance to actually justify a formal complaint or a lawsuit...

I realize it’s a gray area, but... any reasonable, honest person would have nothing to hide; they’d gladly produce the contract or a copy of it. Even if someone was just voicing a suspicion, let alone being the son of the very person they supposedly bought the apartment from. I should point out that my father—despite being 83 and perhaps a bit foggy—is adamant that he never sold anything and certainly never received a dime for it.???
So, if anyone here has dealt with similar reports filed with the Department of Homeland Security, I’d truly appreciate some advice... and before anyone suggests it, I’m not looking to hire a lawyer right now, mostly because my current legal budget consists of a single basket of trash.😁
placidgull21 placidgull21 Member
17 messages
joined Feb 2012
#6 ·
Honestly, you’re probably better off just digging through the county property records to see who actually holds the title on that apartment. Maybe also check with the IRS or local tax assessor to see if there's any paper trail regarding a recent sale.
Daniel Roberts72 Daniel Roberts72 Newcomer
7 messages
joined Dec 2009
#7 ·
First, check the property records at the County Recorder's office. From there, you’re looking at two possible scenarios:
1. If the apartment is already registered in their names, then your father clearly signed some kind of contract. In that case, you might be able to void the agreement based on his limited legal capacity. You would need to petition to have his capacity revoked, request legal guardianship over him, and then initiate the legal proceedings to annul the contract.
2. If the apartment is still legally in your father's name (which is much more likely):
you need to act now to ensure they don't end up seizing the property down the line.
There are several ways to handle this—ranging from a deed of gift with a life estate reserved for him, to a life care agreement. It all really comes down to what you and your father decide is best...
Justin Palmer45 Justin Palmer45 MemberOP
12 messages
joined Jul 2004
#8 ·
The situation is quite complicated
To lay it all out: my father lives with his second wife in an apartment—which I assume belongs to her—that he owns
He also owned a second property where his son and his wife live
Just to be helpful, he let them move in and make themselves at home
Since I’m somewhat distant from him, and it was never my intention to
aggressively assert any "rights" of mine, I simply stepped back and let my father manage his own golden years
I operated under the assumption that he had handled the legalities to ensure they could stay there indefinitely
Knowing my father, I knew there was absolutely no way he would ever agree to go into assisted living
However, out of nowhere, they are moving him into a nursing home—under false pretenses, essentially, by tricking him into thinking he was just going for medical checkups
And THAT is when I discover that his current wife's daughter-in-law (not his son, but his wife's daughter-in-law)
actually bought the apartment from him back in 2005. I have asked countless times for her to show me the contract
but she refused every single time... and now, suddenly, they have cut off all contact with me
Which means I have no way of accessing my father's documents
Through the IRS, I managed to confirm that the apartment is indeed registered in her name and that a sale took place in 2005, but I can't get a copy of that contract without the consent (SSN, etc.) of either the buyer or the seller
As I mentioned, my father is very old and has his own "philosophy"—he says he never has and never will sign anything, and he doesn't keep any paperwork at the facility... you know how it goes, he's effectively powerless
Why am I suspicious? Because whenever I ask to see a copy of the deed, they refuse, even after I warned them that I would report this... and even after I sent them an audio recording of my father stating he has no idea about any sale or money involved... they don't react at all
Any sane person would realize that if everything were above board, they would gladly produce documentation proving the property is legally theirs
I suspect forgery, or perhaps the apartment was sold for a ridiculously low price with a verbal agreement that they would care for my father in the home, only for them to dump him in a nursing home once they finished waiting for a vacancy
That is why I suspect manipulation and fraud
Naturally, every time I visit, my father asks when he'll be "home" and if the investigations are finished yet
placidgull21 placidgull21 Member
17 messages
joined Feb 2012
#9 ·
Honestly, this whole situation is way too messy and complicated for some random advice on an internet forum.
My best bet? Go see a lawyer. They'll be able to walk you through the specifics and actually have the legal standing to take the right steps to fix this...
Jerry Flores75 Jerry Flores75 Newcomer
1 message
joined Jun 2010
#10 ·
Daniel Roberts72 said:First, check the property records at the County Recorder's office. From there, you’re looking at two possible scenarios:
1. If the apartment is already registered in their names, then your father clearly signed some kind of contract. In that case, you might be able to void the agreement based on his limited legal capacity. You would need to petition to have his capacity revoked, request legal guardianship over him, and then initiate the legal proceedings to annul the contract.
2. If the apartment is still legally in your father's name (which is much more likely):
you need to act now to ensure they don't end up seizing the property down the line.
There are several ways to handle this—ranging from a deed of gift with a life estate reserved for him, to a life care agreement. It all really comes down to what you and your father decide is best...


this is definitely

+

if you're dead set on filing criminal charges, you send that report over to the District Attorney's office.
they pass it along to the police, and then you'll eventually get a decision on whether or not they're actually going to prosecute—if they decide there aren't enough elements of a crime, they'll give you a window of time to decide if you want to pursue it privately.

but hey, you also have to keep in mind that for a huge chunk of property crimes, the whole thing is handled via a private prosecution.

that said, having someone held criminally liable is mostly just useful as a foundation if you want to sue for damages down the road (so, if the place is in her name, you can go after the apartment itself, but if it isn't... well, if she's acting in good faith, you won't be getting the apartment back, you'll just be looking at monetary compensation).

if your main goal is just protecting the apartment, those suggestions I mentioned earlier are the real way to go—because with the county land records, everything hinges on the date the contract is filed. So, if the place is still in your dad's name and there isn't some kind of lien or cloud on the title showing someone else is claiming rights to it, you can just sign a contract, file it with the county, and boom—done.

seriously though, hire a lawyer.

good luck!
John Adams4 John Adams4 Member
13 messages
joined Jul 2010
#11 ·
I suppose you could head down to the local county clerk's office—specifically the land records department—and request an inspection of the property deed for that apartment. You'll likely need either the parcel number or the specific lot ID to find it. Once you're in there, look for the recorded purchase agreement from 2005 and ask for a certified copy.
Just make sure to bring some cash for the filing fees 😉

You must log in or register to reply here.

Log in Register

🔗 Similar threads