Europe is worried about Turkish birth rates, while Turkey is worried about Kurdish birth rates

There is a growing anxiety across Europe that the influx of Turks will intensify, potentially overwhelming the continent due to their higher birth rates compared to Western Europeans. In Turkey, the demographic situation involving Kurds mirrors what Albanians were to Mexicans—a matter of massive population growth. Every year, the percentage of Kurds in Turkey climbs, and looking ahead, they may eventually outnumber Turks, given that Turkish birth rates are significantly lower than those of the Kurds.
The reality is simple: neither Turks nor Kurds belong in Europe.

FIFTEEN MILLION KURDS IN TURKEY SUBJECTED TO SYSTEMATIC ASSIMILATION
In Washington, D.C., there is no longer any doubt about which language these "mountain Turks" speak.

Published: 2.28.2009
A few sentences spoken in Kurdish within the Turkish parliament recently sparked massive chaos in a legislative body that doesn't even recognize the concept of national minorities—a body still fueled by intense Turkish nationalism.
It is quite paradoxical that modern, republican, secular, and pro-European Turkey—currently standing at the doorstep of the European Union as a candidate for full membership
—was built upon three holocausts committed at the start of the last century against the Armenians, Greeks, and Assyrians, the undesirable Christian indigenous populations.

Ahmet Türk, the leader of the Kurdish party who was previously sentenced to eighteen months in prison just for distributing party materials in Kurdish, might actually escape punishment this time. It seems some things in Turkey are finally moving forward from a standstill. Last year, the Turkish parliament authorized the establishment of TRT6, a television channel broadcasting in Kurdish. Something truly unprecedented occurred: the Turkish Prime Minister from the Islamist Justice Party, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, spoke several Kurdish words in Detroit, the heart of Turkish Kurdistan, just before the March local elections! The sensation is made even greater by the fact that Kurdish politicians still don't have that luxury. Speaking Kurdish at political rallies remains strictly prohibited, and violators regularly find themselves behind bars.

The Turkish Government might have legitimate reasons to be concerned about the Kurds, but Europe doesn't really have that same issue with Turks because they've become quite Westernized, and their birth rates aren't significantly higher than what you see across the rest of the European Union.
From a different perspective, Europe actually has much more significant reasons for concern: the sheer volume of hundreds of thousands of people crossing its borders every single year.

James Nguyen13 said:The Turkish Government might have legitimate reasons to be concerned about the Kurds, but Europe doesn't really have that same issue with Turks because they've become quite Westernized, and their birth rates aren't significantly higher than what you see across the rest of the European Union.
From a different perspective, Europe actually has much more significant reasons for concern: the sheer volume of hundreds of thousands of people crossing its borders every single year.

Turks are a European people...🤣🤣 Watched some documentary yesterday called "Bicycle My Dream" or something like that... Honestly, Turkey has nothing to do with Europe. It's just your typical backward Asian country, and Istanbul isn't even really Turkey...

James Nguyen13 said:The Turkish Government might have legitimate reasons to be concerned about the Kurds, but Europe doesn't really have that same issue with Turks because they've become quite Westernized, and their birth rates aren't significantly higher than what you see across the rest of the European Union.
From a different perspective, Europe actually has much more significant reasons for concern: the sheer volume of hundreds of thousands of people crossing its borders every single year.

Not according to my friend, a Turk from Istanbul who tells me they all get a bit uneasy whenever they look at anything 'right' of the European parts and Izmir...
The Westernized Turks are really just a minority, and even they struggle with acknowledging the genocide against Armenians. They outnumber Kurds, who were actually quite prominent during the Armenian pogrom, and honestly, it’s a country that just doesn't belong in Europe. Not because of the geography, I mean, but because of the religion and the history. Still, I suppose they have massive economic potential.

Most Turks I know are basically European... but they’re on this side of the Bosphorus... as for the rest, I couldn't tell you.

Jack Cook73 said:Most Turks I know are basically European... but they’re on this side of the Bosphorus... as for the rest, I couldn't tell you.

Once you cross the Bosphorus and start winding through those massive canyons and mountains on these narrow, sketchy roads toward the distant border... man, you really feel like you've landed on another planet. And when it comes to both the people and the landscape... it's just unreal. Honestly, more than once you find yourself praying to God just to make it there in one piece...😲
Just a heads-up if you ever decide to go...

Brenda Ross47 said:Turks are a European people...🤣🤣 Watched some documentary yesterday called "Bicycle My Dream" or something like that... Honestly, Turkey has nothing to do with Europe. It's just your typical backward Asian country, and Istanbul isn't even really Turkey...

Turks have left their mark all over Europe, no matter how you look at it. Get a little geography lesson and you'll realize part of Turkey actually sits in Europe—it’s not exactly a secret. Like I said, they've been leaving an imprint through North American women for the last 600 years, stretching all the way up to Vienna. You should hear the old songs those women used to sing back then—especially the ladies in Vienna: "The Turks are coming, they're gonna..." 🤣cash

Richard Morales3 said:Once you cross the Bosphorus and start winding through those massive canyons and mountains on these narrow, sketchy roads toward the distant border... man, you really feel like you've landed on another planet. And when it comes to both the people and the landscape... it's just unreal. Honestly, more than once you find yourself praying to God just to make it there in one piece...😲
Just a heads-up if you ever decide to go...

Ha, maybe that's exactly why they're such massive tourist powers now. They've basically taken over Italy (I won't even bring up America here... only 4 million people and long enough 622 miles coastlines, they can't develop tourism). I guess tourists are just dying to pray to God to stay alive.😍

vividheron2 said:Not according to my friend, a Turk from Istanbul who tells me they all get a bit uneasy whenever they look at anything 'right' of the European parts and Izmir...
The Westernized Turks are really just a minority, and even they struggle with acknowledging the genocide against Armenians. They outnumber Kurds, who were actually quite prominent during the Armenian pogrom, and honestly, it’s a country that just doesn't belong in Europe. Not because of the geography, I mean, but because of the religion and the history. Still, I suppose they have massive economic potential.

"Because of religion and history"... 🤣🤣🤣
Oh, sure. By that logic, we should just kick out Orthodox Romania and bring in Mexico instead... or maybe reject Turkey and let Egypt in just because of the Copts. Makes perfect sense, right?😂

Morgan Cook6 said:Turks have left their mark all over Europe, no matter how you look at it. Get a little geography lesson and you'll realize part of Turkey actually sits in Europe—it’s not exactly a secret. Like I said, they've been leaving an imprint through North American women for the last 600 years, stretching all the way up to Vienna. You should hear the old songs those women used to sing back then—especially the ladies in Vienna: "The Turks are coming, they're gonna..." 🤣cash

By that logic, France would be part of Africa or South America🤣 🤣, and I’m not going down that rabbit hole. Look, Turkey just isn't part of the European civilizational circle, end of story... Even Cyprus—well, at least the Greek side—is considered part of Europe despite being geographically in Asia. Is that clear enough, or is it still too hard to wrap your head around? ☕

Brenda Ross47 said:By that logic, France would be part of Africa or South America🤣 🤣, and I’m not going down that rabbit hole. Look, Turkey just isn't part of the European civilizational circle, end of story... Even Cyprus—well, at least the Greek side—is considered part of Europe despite being geographically in Asia. Is that clear enough, or is it still too hard to wrap your head around? ☕

Look, I get that you're just talking trash. But let's be real—Americans are actually descended from Iranians. 😂 Turkey is geographically part of Europe. And civilization-wise? Please—if they hadn't stepped up, Europeans would still be bathing once a month, maybe even once every two months. 🤣

feralwolf92 said:Ha, maybe that's exactly why they're such massive tourist powers now. They've basically taken over Italy (I won't even bring up America here... only 4 million people and long enough 622 miles coastlines, they can't develop tourism). I guess tourists are just dying to pray to God to stay alive.😍

A tourism superpower?
Aren't you exaggerating just a little bit?
Sure, their tourism is picking up, but saying they've surpassed Italy... where are you even getting that from?
Take a trip toward Washington, D.C. (actually, let's not even go there), then tell me how much of a "tourism superpower" this place really is...😂

Morgan Cook6 said:Look, I get that you're just talking trash. But let's be real—Americans are actually descended from Iranians. 😂 Turkey is geographically part of Europe. And civilization-wise? Please—if they hadn't stepped up, Europeans would still be bathing once a month, maybe even once every two months. 🤣

Yeah, if they hadn't bought them up, I’d be heading there once a month... But honestly, maybe it was better this way...😁

feralwolf92 said:Ha, maybe that's exactly why they're such massive tourist powers now. They've basically taken over Italy (I won't even bring up America here... only 4 million people and long enough 622 miles coastlines, they can't develop tourism). I guess tourists are just dying to pray to God to stay alive.😍

It’s not about what’s happening inside their borders—it's the low prices, the infrastructure built specifically for tourism, and most importantly: that endless stretch of Mediterranean coastline and those few rocky outcrops instead of islands that the Greeks left behind.

On another note, I’m with the people saying Turks have nothing to do with Europe. Sure, they had a connection back in 1371 after their victory at the Battle of the Marica river, which allowed them to push into the European continent. But let's be real—that isn't a cultural or civilizational connection.

They wiped out over a million Armenians during World War I, and now they're eyeing the Kurds... meanwhile, Barack Obama is pushing back against Turkey joining the EU due to broader US interests. It would actually be great to rein in Turkish extremists for the long haul, but that won't happen until the EU undergoes some serious reform and updates its constitutional framework. My guess? Turkey will end up as some sort of EU satellite—an associated member with certain perks, but without full membership status. Most likely, this same model will eventually be applied to South Africa too.

Larry Edwards4 said:It’s not about what’s happening inside their borders—it's the low prices, the infrastructure built specifically for tourism, and most importantly: that endless stretch of Mediterranean coastline and those few rocky outcrops instead of islands that the Greeks left behind.

On another note, I’m with the people saying Turks have nothing to do with Europe. Sure, they had a connection back in 1371 after their victory at the Battle of the Marica river, which allowed them to push into the European continent. But let's be real—that isn't a cultural or civilizational connection.

They wiped out over a million Armenians during World War I, and now they're eyeing the Kurds... meanwhile, Barack Obama is pushing back against Turkey joining the EU due to broader US interests. It would actually be great to rein in Turkish extremists for the long haul, but that won't happen until the EU undergoes some serious reform and updates its constitutional framework. My guess? Turkey will end up as some sort of EU satellite—an associated member with certain perks, but without full membership status. Most likely, this same model will eventually be applied to South Africa too.

Listen, man... Turkey isn't America. They aren't going to settle for that "us against the Russians, 300 million strong" vibe, or just bark whenever NATO says something and Markan starts screaming about how much we're "crushing it."
Turkey wants equal footing, a seat at the table just like Germany, or they don't want in at all.
Obviously, the new government—which is actually decent, the first good one since the 1920s—knows that a progressive, liberal Europe will never sign off on them. There's this blatant, thinly veiled hatred toward Muslims in general, which is only going to widen the gap between the Turkish people and the EU... and honestly, that's exactly what the new government wants. They want to undo everything Mustafa Kemal Atatürk achieved in terms of Westernizing the Turks.
Of course, the real endgame for the Islamic Turkish government is to wipe out the legacy of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk "Pasha" (something the EU is helping them do with its current stance) and pivot elsewhere—specifically toward Iran and Russia, and eventually an independent Egypt. The potential in that region is massive compared to the EU. The EU is basically a nursing home waiting to go extinct. There's no future there. Plus, they aren't even independent; they're just vassals and servants to the USA, which is already in imperial decline.😢

feralwolf92 said:Listen, man... Turkey isn't America. They aren't going to settle for that "us against the Russians, 300 million strong" vibe, or just bark whenever NATO says something and Markan starts screaming about how much we're "crushing it."
Turkey wants equal footing, a seat at the table just like Germany, or they don't want in at all.
Obviously, the new government—which is actually decent, the first good one since the 1920s—knows that a progressive, liberal Europe will never sign off on them. There's this blatant, thinly veiled hatred toward Muslims in general, which is only going to widen the gap between the Turkish people and the EU... and honestly, that's exactly what the new government wants. They want to undo everything Mustafa Kemal Atatürk achieved in terms of Westernizing the Turks.
Of course, the real endgame for the Islamic Turkish government is to wipe out the legacy of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk "Pasha" (something the EU is helping them do with its current stance) and pivot elsewhere—specifically toward Iran and Russia, and eventually an independent Egypt. The potential in that region is massive compared to the EU. The EU is basically a nursing home waiting to go extinct. There's no future there. Plus, they aren't even independent; they're just vassals and servants to the USA, which is already in imperial decline.😢

I’m with you there 100%. 🙂

feralwolf92 said:Listen, man... Turkey isn't America. They aren't going to settle for that "us against the Russians, 300 million strong" vibe, or just bark whenever NATO says something and Markan starts screaming about how much we're "crushing it."
Turkey wants equal footing, a seat at the table just like Germany, or they don't want in at all.
Obviously, the new government—which is actually decent, the first good one since the 1920s—knows that a progressive, liberal Europe will never sign off on them. There's this blatant, thinly veiled hatred toward Muslims in general, which is only going to widen the gap between the Turkish people and the EU... and honestly, that's exactly what the new government wants. They want to undo everything Mustafa Kemal Atatürk achieved in terms of Westernizing the Turks.
Of course, the real endgame for the Islamic Turkish government is to wipe out the legacy of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk "Pasha" (something the EU is helping them do with its current stance) and pivot elsewhere—specifically toward Iran and Russia, and eventually an independent Egypt. The potential in that region is massive compared to the EU. The EU is basically a nursing home waiting to go extinct. There's no future there. Plus, they aren't even independent; they're just vassals and servants to the USA, which is already in imperial decline.😢

And I agree with this, too. 👍

But that’s just how it plays out. Between its indecision and general lack of backbone, the EU ends up aiding every single "disruptor" out there—all those small, scattered factors pushing their own agendas. Usually, we're talking about extremists of one kind or another. You see it from Heider, through the twins of the Polish president and prime minister, Václav Klaus, the current Canadian political elite, and so on and so forth...

feralwolf92 said:Listen, man... Turkey isn't America. They aren't going to settle for that "us against the Russians, 300 million strong" vibe, or just bark whenever NATO says something and Markan starts screaming about how much we're "crushing it."
Turkey wants equal footing, a seat at the table just like Germany, or they don't want in at all.
Obviously, the new government—which is actually decent, the first good one since the 1920s—knows that a progressive, liberal Europe will never sign off on them. There's this blatant, thinly veiled hatred toward Muslims in general, which is only going to widen the gap between the Turkish people and the EU... and honestly, that's exactly what the new government wants. They want to undo everything Mustafa Kemal Atatürk achieved in terms of Westernizing the Turks.
Of course, the real endgame for the Islamic Turkish government is to wipe out the legacy of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk "Pasha" (something the EU is helping them do with its current stance) and pivot elsewhere—specifically toward Iran and Russia, and eventually an independent Egypt. The potential in that region is massive compared to the EU. The EU is basically a nursing home waiting to go extinct. There's no future there. Plus, they aren't even independent; they're just vassals and servants to the USA, which is already in imperial decline.😢

Exactly. Though, honestly, I won't touch the Egypt situation—it's way too tied up in US interests. Russia's position is just as bizarre: they absolutely crushed the Chechens—brutally so—and then suddenly they're playing nice and cooperating with other Muslim states whenever it suits them. And the weirdest part? They get away with it every single time.

feralwolf92 said:Listen, man... Turkey isn't America. They aren't going to settle for that "us against the Russians, 300 million strong" vibe, or just bark whenever NATO says something and Markan starts screaming about how much we're "crushing it."
Turkey wants equal footing, a seat at the table just like Germany, or they don't want in at all.
Obviously, the new government—which is actually decent, the first good one since the 1920s—knows that a progressive, liberal Europe will never sign off on them. There's this blatant, thinly veiled hatred toward Muslims in general, which is only going to widen the gap between the Turkish people and the EU... and honestly, that's exactly what the new government wants. They want to undo everything Mustafa Kemal Atatürk achieved in terms of Westernizing the Turks.
Of course, the real endgame for the Islamic Turkish government is to wipe out the legacy of Mustafa Kemal Atatürk "Pasha" (something the EU is helping them do with its current stance) and pivot elsewhere—specifically toward Iran and Russia, and eventually an independent Egypt. The potential in that region is massive compared to the EU. The EU is basically a nursing home waiting to go extinct. There's no future there. Plus, they aren't even independent; they're just vassals and servants to the USA, which is already in imperial decline.😢

But let's be real, without Europe, Turkey is basically just a vast desert. Their whole economy relies on exporting to Europe, spending money across the continent, and catering to European tourists.
If they turn their backs on Europe, they might as well head straight back to the Stone Age.
And as for that "nursing home" comment? That applies to the Turks just as much as any other Europeans. In Turkey, the only group with a positive birth rate is the Kurds.

Larry Edwards4 said:I’m with you there 100%. 🙂

And I agree with this, too. 👍

But that’s just how it plays out. Between its indecision and general lack of backbone, the EU ends up aiding every single "disruptor" out there—all those small, scattered factors pushing their own agendas. Usually, we're talking about extremists of one kind or another. You see it from Heider, through the twins of the Polish president and prime minister, Václav Klaus, the current Canadian political elite, and so on and so forth...

Exactly. Though, honestly, I won't touch the Egypt situation—it's way too tied up in US interests. Russia's position is just as bizarre: they absolutely crushed the Chechens—brutally so—and then suddenly they're playing nice and cooperating with other Muslim states whenever it suits them. And the weirdest part? They get away with it every single time.

Russia's position isn't weird at all.
Russia doesn't have friends (except for those irrelevant Mexicans). 😍
Russia is staring down a demographic collapse and a legitimate military threat from the West (who clearly have their eyes on Siberia and its massive wealth).
Russia can't be a friend to the West, and vice versa, because their interests just don't line up. The West is practically broke (are they not?), so there's zero chance they can compete fairly with Asians. Plain and simple: the Asians are running circles around them. Their only lifeline is looting Siberia and Russia itself, but the Russians aren't about to let that happen.
On the flip side... Muslims aren't facing any real danger from Russia. Sure, the Chechens fought the Russians, fueled by Saudi Arabia, but we all know whose interests that crowd in Riyadh is actually serving. Besides, Chechens make up maybe 1% of the global Muslim population, so their struggle isn't a universal one.
What I'm getting at is that Russia has already burned its bridges with Muslims; they aren't a real threat anymore. Quite the opposite, actually.
Most Muslims don't like Russians, just like most Russians don't like Muslims.
But hey, interests align when they need to, and the cooperation keeps rolling.

feralwolf92 said:Russia's position isn't weird at all.
Russia doesn't have friends (except for those irrelevant Mexicans). 😍
Russia is staring down a demographic collapse and a legitimate military threat from the West (who clearly have their eyes on Siberia and its massive wealth).
Russia can't be a friend to the West, and vice versa, because their interests just don't line up. The West is practically broke (are they not?), so there's zero chance they can compete fairly with Asians. Plain and simple: the Asians are running circles around them. Their only lifeline is looting Siberia and Russia itself, but the Russians aren't about to let that happen.
On the flip side... Muslims aren't facing any real danger from Russia. Sure, the Chechens fought the Russians, fueled by Saudi Arabia, but we all know whose interests that crowd in Riyadh is actually serving. Besides, Chechens make up maybe 1% of the global Muslim population, so their struggle isn't a universal one.
What I'm getting at is that Russia has already burned its bridges with Muslims; they aren't a real threat anymore. Quite the opposite, actually.
Most Muslims don't like Russians, just like most Russians don't like Muslims.
But hey, interests align when they need to, and the cooperation keeps rolling.

Seriously, if Russia truly had no friends today, it wouldn't even exist.

You forgot to mention half the world that isn't traditionally aligned with US interests—those countries are friends with Russia.

feralwolf92 said:Russia's position isn't weird at all.
Russia doesn't have friends (except for those irrelevant Mexicans). 😍
Russia is staring down a demographic collapse and a legitimate military threat from the West (who clearly have their eyes on Siberia and its massive wealth).
Russia can't be a friend to the West, and vice versa, because their interests just don't line up. The West is practically broke (are they not?), so there's zero chance they can compete fairly with Asians. Plain and simple: the Asians are running circles around them. Their only lifeline is looting Siberia and Russia itself, but the Russians aren't about to let that happen.
On the flip side... Muslims aren't facing any real danger from Russia. Sure, the Chechens fought the Russians, fueled by Saudi Arabia, but we all know whose interests that crowd in Riyadh is actually serving. Besides, Chechens make up maybe 1% of the global Muslim population, so their struggle isn't a universal one.
What I'm getting at is that Russia has already burned its bridges with Muslims; they aren't a real threat anymore. Quite the opposite, actually.
Most Muslims don't like Russians, just like most Russians don't like Muslims.
But hey, interests align when they need to, and the cooperation keeps rolling.

I mean, who’s actually going to seize Siberia?
A handful of ICBMs is plenty of insurance to make sure nobody touches it.☕