When does life actually begin?

To us, "life" only kicks off once we all decide it’s time to start.
But honestly? Whether we actually agree on that doesn't even matter.
I mean, once we've settled on what life is supposed to be—it’s not really about how we're gonna negotiate it from here on out.
Some people will say one thing, others will say another—fighting, clashing, warring—and in the end, it's just raw power that wins out.
While someone else watches it all unfold from way up high, pulling the strings, playing the game, and making sure everything lands exactly where it belongs...🙂

Ivory said:lol....wow....it’s been a long time since I laughed this hard...

There’s this old idea that a person's life truly begins with the spark of consciousness. But what actually is consciousness?
When do we actually start perceiving the world? And how do we process it?
If consciousness starts at birth, why don't we remember being born? Or even most of our childhood up until age four or five? There’s probably some medical explanation out there, but that’s not what we're looking for here... or is it?
Bottom line for me: abortion is the killing of a person. It’s taking away a life after it has already been gifted at conception.
@nobody
Just my Friday thoughts... go ahead and give it another read...😉

Life at a cellular level begins much earlier than life at the level of consciousness 🙂. Being asleep or unconscious doesn't mean you're dead 🙂, though that might be getting into questions regarding the Spirit and the soul.

And sure, a little humor is fine. For instance, atheists and materialists can't really be witty, but they can certainly be funny just because they're alive—meaning their brain cells are firing and having all sorts of neural misfires... heh. When they sleep, they aren't funny. But when they're awake, they get the chance to slip back into that ridiculous state of "self-knowledge." When they try to put that into words, Jack Wood43 can't help but laugh.

hehe 🙂

It starts at birth... because if it didn't, spontaneous would just be called death. Deep stuff, I guess, but whatever. 🙂

gentlebear13 said:It starts at birth... because if it didn't, spontaneous combustion would just be called death. Deep stuff, clearly. Go screw yourself. 🙂

Biologically speaking, it starts at conception, not birth. I rest my case. 🙂

Butterfly Night said:Does life start at conception or birth?

From birth... basically once the kid actually arrives. If an ultrasound shows the baby has some terminal condition where they aren't going to survive infancy, then abortion should be advised as the best path forward...

I support abortion. Not because doctors tell me to, just because that's what I believe.

From the very beginning.
But real life actually starts when you realize it’s a gift.
And that you actually know how to live it.

I once heard an old joke—one told by someone with a truly massive beard:

Life doesn't actually begin until your dog passes away and your kids finally move out.😁

🙂

A foolish question.
Life begins even before conception, given that both sperm and egg cells are living entities. 😬

However, once conception occurs, whether that mass can be called a human being... that remains a difficult question.

Consciousness really kicks in at birth—or more accurately, at that exact moment a child enters the world.

The fact that we don't have any memories from our earliest years doesn't actually prove anything about our awareness back then. Sure, occasionally a random fragment of a memory might surface, but I don't think that’s a sign of early consciousness; it’s more about how our brains process (or fail to process) memory as we age.

If I recall correctly, psychology suggests that people can start retaining actual memories around the age of two or three.

Take the laws in England, for instance. I believe they allow for abortions up to the 20th week of pregnancy. Does that imply that life starts later there?

Or perhaps the true definition of a living human being begins with the formation of the brain and the beating of a heart—around the sixth week of pregnancy? As far as I understand it, those are the two fundamental pillars that define a human life.

In the US, abortion is legal up to the 10th week of pregnancy.
I'm all for reproductive rights, and I don't think anyone should be treated like a criminal for making that choice, regardless of what some people say...
When does life actually start? It’s a tough one to pin down, especially since sperm and eggs are technically living cells too, right?

swiftcobra15 said:"a human being is a living creature possessing human DNA" ...

A person truly becomes human when they are taught how to live—when their environment instructs them in walking upright, speaking, behaving, and thinking. Without that, one is merely a "human-like animal" (which seems to be proven by cases of individuals raised entirely among animals). It is quite fascinating how members of our society must constantly teach a child (a human infant 😛) how to truly be human...

swiftcobra15 said:"a human being is a living creature possessing human DNA" ...

The whole "When does life begin?" debate is just... pointless.

Look, a human is a *being*. So the question should really be—when does a zygote with human DNA become a human?🙂 A zygote is just the starting point for any life, just like any other living thing. If you want a biological answer, it’s pretty straightforward: human life as a distinct entity kicks in once embryogenesis wraps up (around 12 weeks after conception... or should we say fertilization?). That’s when the embryo becomes a fetus. It isn't some deep philosophical, legal, medical, or ethical riddle. It's just pure biology.

But "becoming human" isn't something you can just check off with a single biological fact and call it a day. I get the feeling the title wasn't even intended to be answered that way...🙂

Or was it?😕

Regarding the connection between the fetus and the soul—I'll leave it to you all to decide when life truly begins:

Q. At what point during pregnancy does the soul (“life”) enter
the body of the unborn child?
A. Around the fourth week, the soul establishes an energetic thread
to begin vitalizing the developing vessel. The soul's development in the womb
reaches a turning point where it fully engages with the fetus, powerfully activating
its physical existence. This corresponds to the "quickening" that mothers
feel. After this stage, the movements of the baby become much more
distinct.

Of course, there's no scientific proof for this—since science hasn't even proven the existence of the soul yet (though that might change 🙂 ), let alone studied this specific area deeply. This excerpt comes from the Q&A section of Share International.

Here is some perspective on abortion, too.

Q. Doesn't an abortion prevent a soul from inhabiting a body?
A. A. Obviously, yes. However, it is crucial to recognize that far too many
souls are pulled into incarnation prematurely due to the magnetic
pull created by an overabundance of available bodies. This surplus
is, naturally, a byproduct of how humanity mismanages the sexual function.

At least, that's the esoteric view—which seems to be becoming increasingly mainstream.

PS: Sorry for bumping this old thread; I didn't realize how dated it was until I started typing.

Taylor Campbell4 said:Regarding the connection between the fetus and the soul—I'll leave it to you all to decide when life truly begins:

Q. At what point during pregnancy does the soul (“life”) enter
the body of the unborn child?
A. Around the fourth week, the soul establishes an energetic thread
to begin vitalizing the developing vessel. The soul's development in the womb
reaches a turning point where it fully engages with the fetus, powerfully activating
its physical existence. This corresponds to the "quickening" that mothers
feel. After this stage, the movements of the baby become much more
distinct.

Of course, there's no scientific proof for this—since science hasn't even proven the existence of the soul yet (though that might change 🙂 ), let alone studied this specific area deeply. This excerpt comes from the Q&A section of Share International.

Here is some perspective on abortion, too.

Q. Doesn't an abortion prevent a soul from inhabiting a body?
A. A. Obviously, yes. However, it is crucial to recognize that far too many
souls are pulled into incarnation prematurely due to the magnetic
pull created by an overabundance of available bodies. This surplus
is, naturally, a byproduct of how humanity mismanages the sexual function.

At least, that's the esoteric view—which seems to be becoming increasingly mainstream.

PS: Sorry for bumping this old thread; I didn't realize how dated it was until I started typing.

That "any day now" bit (for those of us following along) has been dragging on since the Victorian era.

My favorite part has to be 😁

it is important to remember that many (too many) souls are drawn into incarnation ahead of time by the magnetic attraction set up by the overproduction of bodies.

"Let's not forget" (as if it were some self-evident truth) the magnetic properties of the soul 🤣

If we’re operating under the assumption that the soul is actually susceptible to magnetic forces—and that human mating somehow triggers the Northern Lights... wouldn't magnetic resonance imaging pick up on this "soul" without any trouble?

Or perhaps we're talking about some parallel, unmeasurable magnetism that "leaks" out of a string theory dimension—which, by the way, has also been "on the verge of being proven" for years now without much to show for it?

So, that's what esotericism claims—though it seems to be becoming increasingly exoteric.

Or maybe proponents of esotericism just have a slight deficit in basic science knowledge and a massive surplus of desire to believe in magic and miracles?

sorry for stirring the pot a bit, I didn't realize how heated this would get until I started typing.

It doesn't matter how old the thread is... the bigger issue is that now I'm worried about my own soul every time I walk past a massive speaker. I'm terrified a permanent magnet might just snatch it right out of me.🙂

Life doesn't just start; it never really stops. If you're only talking about the physical body, you already know the answer. But if you mean the soul, it isn't tied to the flesh.
If you consider the whole package, it seems to me that consciousness emerges during brain development—around three months in. And no, the soul and consciousness aren't the same thing.
Everything else we're debating boils down to ethics and morality. Medicine won't give you an answer because it only looks at things through one lens, and luckily, there are plenty of others.

They aren't really all that common anymore... there’s basically just one way to look at it. Life truly kicks off the moment you start accumulating memories—that’s what we call the "soul." Your body actually *is* your soul. It’s this incredible integration where different cognitive abilities merge into a single consciousness, coupled with the way we adopt language symbols to organize those conscious capacities—which, funny enough, is also the very tool we use to communicate.

There you go. That’s your "soul" right there. And that’s exactly why it’s scientifically "invisible." It’s essentially just your own internal idea, and ideas have this annoying habit of being invisible to everyone except the people they actually land with.

We are energy. It’s always been here, it’s everywhere now, and it isn't going anywhere. It just shifts shape.
Just because you don't believe in something doesn't mean it isn't real. I won't get into why you prefer thinking nothing matters, but everything has purpose. We're here to evolve, and we certainly won't finish that job in this one lifetime. Once you balance the ego with the higher self, you remember who you actually are and finally kick that ego off the throne it uses to run your life.
I brought a lot of knowledge into this world without ever being taught or hearing it from anyone else. You did too. Everyone did. We're just wired differently. It serves a purpose.
Honestly, it doesn't even matter if you remember all that or accept that you're "just" a vibration of energy. What matters is fulfilling what you set out to do in this life. You'll get help along the way.
Have a good one.

bluewolf0 said:We are energy. It’s always been here, it’s everywhere now, and it isn't going anywhere. It just shifts shape.
Just because you don't believe in something doesn't mean it isn't real. I won't get into why you prefer thinking nothing matters, but everything has purpose. We're here to evolve, and we certainly won't finish that job in this one lifetime. Once you balance the ego with the higher self, you remember who you actually are and finally kick that ego off the throne it uses to run your life.
I brought a lot of knowledge into this world without ever being taught or hearing it from anyone else. You did too. Everyone did. We're just wired differently. It serves a purpose.
Honestly, it doesn't even matter if you remember all that or accept that you're "just" a vibration of energy. What matters is fulfilling what you set out to do in this life. You'll get help along the way.
Have a good one.

Personally, I see myself as something more than just raw energy—I mean, I’m pretty familiar with the laws of thermodynamics and the whole concept of entropy. Energy isn't lost, per se, but over time, it tends to become less "organized."

Just because you don't believe in something doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

And just because you *do* believe in something doesn't mean it actually exists, either. But look—when you say you "believe," it implies there's uncertainty there. If you truly knew, you wouldn't need faith to begin with.

To me, there's an honest strength in saying "I don't know." It feels a bit cowardly to cling to belief just because you're trying to deny your own mortality.

I won't get into why it suits you to believe that nothing matters.

Actually, everything makes sense to me. Why is it that you feel the need to believe in an "immortal soul" just to give your life purpose? That’s a question you probably can’t quite answer for yourself.

Everything has plenty of meaning to me, even without leaning on the idea of "immortality." 😉

We are here to progress.

Where did you read that?

I'm here to enjoy the ride! How can you possibly know my purpose? Who told you what *your* purpose is? Why do you assume anyone has the authority to tell us why we're here?

and we certainly can't achieve that in this short life.

Life is plenty long as it is. It's only "short" to someone who was too afraid to actually live while they were alive.

When the ego and the higher self are brought into balance and harmony, a person remembers who and what they truly are, stripping the ego of the throne it uses to rule our lives and claim it is everything.

Hold on a second... consciousness, the ego, and the higher self... do all three of them live in the same head, or are they just occasional visitors?

Who are this "ego" and "higher self"... are they just some roommates you've taken in? 🤷

Quote:
Yeah, I mean—it’s just genetics. It’s this incredible biological information system that passes down everything your ancestors knew to every single new generation. Honestly, it’s one of nature's most mind-blowing feats, but let's be real... it has nothing to do with the soul. It's pure, hardcoded DNA.

Look, it isn't even vital that you remember specific things, or that you agree with the idea that you're "just" some vibration of energy.

Why would I ever limit myself to being "just a vibration"? What's the actual benefit there? I don't even follow what you're getting at.

The real thing is fulfilling what you've set out to do in this life—and you'll find help along the way.

When you set strict goals like that, you're basically just setting yourself up for disappointment. Personally, I don't "set" anything—instead, I just try to make the best possible choices given whatever circumstances land in my lap. Plans are usually just excuses we use to justify bad decisions, all because we're clinging to some fiction about how the future *should* look.

Have a great day.

You too. By the way, you should check out the spirituality subforum over on Reddit... you'll find plenty of like-minded people there, plus some really solid critiques. Philosophy is a bit more substantial than just "vibrating," after all. Around here, we actually try to tune and modulate those frequencies.

After death at Calvary. That's what it says..