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Why does every other psychiatrist act like Freud?

Started by shadowtiger · · 👁 6 views · 39 replies

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Participants shadowtigerNicole JamesAlex Foster6Robert Diaz7Olivia Carter25Carol Lee4gentlemoose3redbison65Harold Adams5mistymoose57
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#21 ·
Carol Lee4 said:A good psychotherapist shouldn't "immerse" themselves in a patient's problems (and I don't mean empathy), because then they lose their objectivity. They become subjective, which significantly diminishes their professional approach—the very foundation of therapy.
It is actually impossible to be 100% objective at all times. For instance, during a session, a certain bond forms between the therapist and the patient, which a skilled clinician eventually reshapes into a different kind of connection—one that is healthy and beneficial for the patient.
In any therapeutic practice, you’ll naturally have patients you like more or less, or people you feel more empathy for than others. That level of subjectivity doesn't ruin the professional process, but if you start truly "living" through a patient's trauma, the therapy veers off course toward self-therapy. You start thinking, "What would I do in this situation?" or making subjective comparisons to your own life. These thoughts might be unavoidable sometimes, but you can't let them turn into full-blown immersion.

-I've mentioned before that choosing this career as a form of self-therapy is a mistake; most people who do this end up being poor therapists because what they really need is their own sessions (looking at you, psychiatrists).
-Truly great therapists (psychiatrists) usually emerge once they have worked through their own "diagnoses" before they ever begin treating patients.

I also agree that people with past struggles often make better therapists, provided they have fully processed those issues, gained control over them, and waited several years after their own recovery before starting to practice professionally. This applies to everyone in the field.
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#22 ·
Sorry if things seem a bit glitchy on my end; my system keeps crashing, or I get those annoying notifications saying a message failed to send, only to find out later that everything actually posted twice.
I ended up catching some kind of virus—a Trojan—that apparently loves scavenging through data, and it managed to linger in one part of my computer (which isn't really important to me), so I'm currently tackling that issue alongside my posts.
Alex Foster6 Alex Foster6 Active Member
54 messages
joined Feb 2004
#23 ·
Carol Lee4 said:I am admittedly out of the loop regarding the current state of affairs at the Harvard Psychology Department. My understanding is limited to the fact that prior to the 90s, their programs didn't hold much weight in Western Europe, though I have no idea what the landscape looks like today.

The system is moving toward the Bologna standards, so I assume credentials will be recognized all across Europe...
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#24 ·
Robert Diaz7 said:I think I misspoke earlier. It’s not that they’re actually "too healthy," it’s more that they’ve just never had to truly confront their issues. Their problems haven't reached that breaking point where they feel the need to sit down with a therapist to work through deep-seated conflicts. Because they've never hit that wall, they haven't even realized there's an underlying issue to begin with. So, from that specific perspective, they seem "perfectly fine" simply because they haven't done the inner work to become aware of what's actually going on beneath the surface.

I’m honestly convinced that if you've dealt with your own mental health struggles in the past and actually worked through them, it ends up being a massive advantage when you eventually become a great psychotherapist. It gives you a level of empathy you just can't teach. To me, choosing to enter this field isn't a negative at all; what's actually much more dangerous is that "never diagnosed" syndrome—where people walk around completely disconnected from their own pathologies and never bother to face them.

If you’ve never personally experienced pathology, how can you truly grasp what it looks like?
There’s a little bit of pathology in everyone, really. I truly believe that every psychiatrist should have to go through their own phase of confronting the "illness" within themselves.

It seems like we're really diving into the issue of how much people just don't know.
Psychiatrists, psychologists, and therapists all have mandatory requirements to follow. Supervision. so-called. Guided psychotherapy and ongoing support. Depending on where they’re based, support sessions would happen at least once a month—though more often, it’d likely be once a week or every couple of weeks. These wouldn't be conducted by anyone within the organization itself; instead, an independent therapist from outside the institution would come directly to them. It would be a mandatory part of the job requirements, so there wouldn't be any skipping out on those sessions.
I’ve already shared quite a bit about why I chose my major for personal reasons, so we're actually on the exact same page here. We might be using different words to say it, but our core perspectives are identical.
I’ve also written quite a bit regarding the distinction between what we consider "normal" versus "abnormal." Of course, you have to realize that pathology exists within the therapy profession itself as well; after all, therapists are only human. We all carry a little bit of pathology within us. Honestly, I don't think that's the issue at all; the real challenge lies in how we manage and become aware of those darker impulses—which is exactly why things like clinical supervision are so vital.
This theory...If you’ve never personally experienced pathology, how can you truly claim to understand it? That’s how it looks.It doesn't really hold water—to put it another way, for example...
Is it true that the most exceptional pediatricians, teachers, and educators are women who have raised plenty of their own children, while those without any experience of motherhood struggle to connect? Or am I just overthinking things?
I’ve always felt that the absolute best family doctors are the ones who have actually dealt with a whole laundry list of health issues themselves. I mean, how can you truly understand how to treat someone if you haven't lived through the struggle firsthand? It just makes sense to me—there's a certain level of empathy and practical insight you only get when you've been in the patient's shoes. Or maybe I'm just being overly optimistic about the whole thing.
Is it better to have a mom with a massive brood, or...
If you’ve never actually experienced a migraine attack, how on earth are you supposed to know how to manage one? It’s a bit of a Catch-22, really. And don't even get me started on oncology... it works the exact same way.😲
It’s all about...
I’m just checking in to see what everyone thinks about this.College life.
2.It’s all about putting theory into practice.
3. I’m a big believer in lifelong learning—constantly keeping up with the latest scientific breakthroughs and global advancements. Literature is really all about that constant, relentless cycle of learning and staying engaged. It’s not just about reading a book once; it’s about that continuous, steady commitment to growth and deep work.
Attending key seminars, specialized courses, major conferences, and professional workshops...
Let’s open up the floor for a little knowledge sharing. I'm thinking we could use this space to swap stories from our daily practice, dive into those pesky professional hurdles we all run into, or chat about any fresh perspectives and insights that have come our way lately. It’s really just an open invitation to exchange ideas, brainstorm new approaches, and see where our collective heads are at. Feel free to jump in!

I truly believe that anyone can be helped; it really just comes down to knowing how to actively listen. You have to approach things with a positive mindset, communicate on equal footing, and keep things civilized. It’s all about showing genuine respect for the individual—because, at the end of the day, every living being deserves that. Instead of judging, we should focus on offering support. For me, there is nothing more rewarding than helping someone find their way back to themselves.
Sometimes things move fast, sometimes they crawl, and there are days when everything feels like an uphill battle—but the important thing is that we keep moving forward. Progress is happening, and honestly, that's all that matters.
I’ve always felt that "letting someone go" is a lot like watching birds—something I absolutely adore. You gently lift them up, give them just enough strength to find their wings, and then you let them soar. They head off in their own direction, chasing whatever path they truly believe is best for them.👋
We all know our own path exists out there somewhere; it's just that sometimes, we get a little spooked wondering if we're actually on the right one! 😕
Don't just hand someone a fish; teach them how to cast their own line and reel it in!🤔
Best regards,🙂
Robert Diaz7 Robert Diaz7 Member
21 messages
joined Feb 2007
#25 ·
Carol Lee4 said:It’s honestly kind of wild how much people just operate in total ignorance lately, like they’re just drifting through life without ever actually checking if what they believe is even remotely true.
Psychiatrists and psychologists—all those therapists out there—they’ve got mandatory requirements they have to meet. supervision I guess you could call it "so-called." Guided psychotherapy and support. It really just depends on where they’re stationed, but you're looking at support sessions at least once a month—though honestly, most places pretty much do them weekly or maybe every couple of weeks. It’s always handled by an outside therapist, someone totally independent who doesn't actually work for the organization itself. So, instead of the staff having to trek out to a clinic, the therapist comes right to them on-site, which is a mandatory part of the job that you just can't skip.
I’ve already gone on at length about why I chose my major for totally personal reasons, and honestly, we’re basically on the exact same page here—we might be using different words to say it, but the heart of the matter is identical.
I’ve also spent a lot of time posting about the whole "normal" versus "abnormal" thing; honestly, you have to realize that even therapists aren't immune to pathology, because at the end of the day, they're just human too. Look, let’s be real, everyone carries a little bit of pathology under the surface, and honestly, that isn't even the issue; it’s more about whether you actually have the control and the self-awareness to manage it, which is exactly why things like supervision are such a massive deal.
So, about this whole theory thing...If you’ve never actually dealt with your own mental health struggles firsthand, how are you even supposed to wrap your head around what that feels like? That’s how it looks.It doesn't really hold water—meaning, for example...
I honestly feel like the best pediatricians, teachers, and educators are always the women who actually have kids of their own, you know? There’s just something about that lived experience that makes them better at what they do, whereas the ones without any children of their own seem to struggle more with connecting or truly getting it. Or maybe I'm just overthinking things.
I honestly feel like the best family doctors are the ones who have actually dealt with a bunch of different health issues themselves, because I mean, how can you really know how to treat someone if you haven't gone through the struggle firsthand and felt it on your own skin? Or maybe I'm just overthinking it.
Honestly, I’ve always felt like the best moms are the ones who have a whole house full of kids; or maybe that's just me being a sucker for the chaos.
I mean, if you’ve never actually dealt with a migraine before, how are you even supposed to know how to handle one when it hits? It just goes on like that forever, honestly... and don't even get me started on oncologists.
It’s all about...
I'm honestly just kind of over it all today, feeling pretty drained and just trying to find some peace in the middle of everything.College life.
2.I guess I’m just out here trying to figure things out as I go, honestly. It feels like I'm constantly stumbling through these half-baked ideas, just hoping that if I stick at it long enough, some kind of actual substance will finally start to show up. It’s a bit embarrassing how much I overthink everything, but I suppose that's just how I'm wired, isn't it? Just keeping my head down and hoping for the best.
3. I'm all about that lifelong learning thing, just constantly keeping tabs on all the latest scientific breakthroughs happening around the world. Honestly, if you really want to get anywhere with literature, you can't just dabble; you have to be all in, constantly absorbing everything and putting in that relentless, nonstop work to actually engage with the craft.
So, I’ve been thinking about putting more effort into hitting up those big-deal seminars, specialized workshops, and national conferences... you know, the kind of professional gatherings that actually move the needle instead of just being a way to kill a Tuesday.
Just looking to open up a space where we can all swap some real-world stories, whether that’s venting about those annoying hurdles we hit during a session, sharing some fresh insights from new research, or just tossing around ideas on better ways to approach our work—basically, a spot for us to trade experiences, talk shop, and figure things out together.

I truly believe that anyone can be helped, you just have to master the art of active listening and approach things with a positive vibe from the jump. It’s all about communicating on equal footing—keeping things civilized and showing genuine respect for the person in front of you, because at the end of the day, every living soul deserves that. Instead of jumping in to judge, you should be there to offer support, and honestly, you just have to love what you do; for me, that means helping someone find their way back to themselves.
Sometimes things move at lightning speed, other times they feel like you're wading through molasses, and some days everything just feels heavy and impossible while other days it's smooth sailing, but the main thing is that it’s actually happening, and honestly, that's all that really matters.
I’ve always felt that "letting someone go" is best understood through the lens of birds—which, if you know me, you know I'm absolutely obsessed with them. It’s like when you gently lift them up, giving them just enough strength to catch the wind, and then you just let them fly off toward whatever horizon they feel is right for them, chasing down their own version of what works best.👋
We all know our own path, it's just that sometimes we get stuck wondering if we're actually on the right one. 😕
You shouldn't just hand someone a fish; you really need to show them how to land one on their own.🤔
Hey there.🙂

Your comparisons are pretty weak and your logic is just totally off base.

If you’re really going out on a limb saying that everyone carries at least a little bit of pathology inside them, then honestly, none of these comparisons even hold water. It feels like you didn't quite catch my drift and were just looking for a fight instead of actually hearing me out. 😁

As for those points you laid out—1, 2, 3, and 4—I guess I’d just say that none of that really matters if you don't have any actual intuition, you know?
Look, regarding what you've been posting in the BPD threads, I’m really not trying to be offensive when I point out stuff that seems pretty obvious to anyone who actually knows even a little bit about personality disorders, let alone your "colleague" (and yeah, we are colleagues).🙄, look, I can tell you aren't really grasping the core issue here... This isn't just about us having different perspectives. When you say "BPD isn't like a broken arm that just heals on its own," it honestly just shows me you don't have a handle on the subject at all. I could sit here and list things like that forever, but I really don't have the energy for it. It’s hard to admit when you don't know enough, especially when you don't even realize how much you're missing 🙄 but if you actually looked through the massive amount of threads on the BPD topic, everything would be crystal clear

Anyway, I think my debate with you is done and 😉 👋 👋
Olivia Carter25 Olivia Carter25 Member
37 messages
joined Oct 2005
#26 ·
Carol Lee4 said:This piece is all about how people just don't know what's actually going on.
Psychiatrists and psychologists—all those therapists out there—are required to have mandatory... Supervision. so-called. Guided psychotherapy and ongoing support. Depending on where they're stationed, support should happen at least once a month—though ideally, we’re looking at once a week or every couple of weeks. This shouldn't be handled by anyone within the organization itself; you need an independent therapist from the outside. It’s not about employees seeking out therapy on their own time; it’s about the therapist coming directly to them. This needs to be a mandatory, non-negotiable part of the job description. No exceptions.
Regarding the choice of fax, I’ve already gone into quite a bit of detail about my personal reasons. It seems our stances are essentially identical—we might just be using different words to say the exact same thing, but the core point remains unchanged.
I’ve also written quite a bit regarding the distinction between what we label as "normal" versus "abnormal." It stands to reason that pathology exists within the field of therapy itself—after all, doctors aren't exempt from being human. Every single person carries a bit of pathology within them. That’s just human nature. The real issue isn't the presence of those flaws, but rather whether you have the discipline to control them and the self-awareness to acknowledge them—which is exactly why professional supervision is so vital.
This theory...If you’ve never experienced pathology firsthand, how can you possibly claim to understand it? That’s how it looks.It doesn't exactly "hold water"—to put it this way, for example...
Is it actually true that the best pediatricians, teachers, and educators are the women who have plenty of children of their own, while those without kids are somehow less capable? Or is that just a tired old assumption?
The best family doctors are the ones who have actually dealt with a laundry list of their own health issues. I mean, how can you honestly claim to know how to treat someone if you haven't lived through the struggle yourself? You need that firsthand experience—you need to have felt the symptoms under your own skin to truly understand the patient's reality. Otherwise, you’re just reading from a textbook.
Is it better to have a mother with a huge brood, or...
If you've never actually dealt with a migraine, how on earth are you supposed to know how to manage one? It’s a circular logic trap that just goes on forever. It's like expecting someone to treat a condition they've never even experienced. And don't even get me started on oncologists...😲
It’s about...
1.faxu-College life.
2.praxi
3. Lifelong learning, keeping a constant pulse on global scientific breakthroughs... Literature is nothing without constant, relentless engagement. You can’t just skim the surface and expect to actually grasp anything meaningful; true mastery requires a commitment to continuous learning and a deep, ongoing work ethic. It’s about the grind—staying engaged with the material day in and day out until it becomes second nature.
4. Participating in major seminars, specialized courses, national conferences, and industry summits...
Let’s get into it: an open floor for sharing real-world experiences, practical case studies, and those recurring headaches we deal with on the job. This is the space to dive into new methodologies, fresh insights, and a genuine exchange of ideas. Whether you want to vent about a specific hurdle or pitch a breakthrough approach, let's hear it.

I truly believe anyone can be helped; you just have to master the art of active listening. You have to lead with positivity, communicate as equals, and keep things civilized. It comes down to respecting the individual—every living soul deserves that. Instead of judging, you should be offering support. For me, it’s about loving what you do, which in my case means helping someone find their way back to themselves.
Sometimes things move fast, sometimes they drag, sometimes you’re hitting a wall, and other times it feels like you're cruising on autopilot. But the bottom line is this: it moves. It's happening. And that's really all that matters.
I’ve always felt that "letting someone go" is best understood through the lens of birds—something I’m absolutely obsessed with. It’s like taking them in your hands for just a moment, giving them that little bit of extra strength they need to find their rhythm, and then simply letting them take flight. They head off in their own direction, following whatever path they believe is best for them.👋
We all claim to know our own path, but let’s be honest—sometimes we’re just too terrified to admit whether we're actually on it. 😕
Don't just hand someone a fish; teach them how to land their own catch.🤔
Hey there.🙂

So, if all we really need is to find ways to actually help people...

College.
Supervision and hands-on practice.
3. Professional literary adaptation and...
Conferences and stuff like that.

I’m genuinely curious why so many people in America struggle to find a decent psychologist or psychiatrist. It seems like everyone in the field just follows that exact same playbook you laid out, but it leaves a massive gap. Why is it so impossible to find anyone who actually offers effective solutions for their problems instead of just handing out a prescription pad and calling it a day?

In my view, this list is miles away from what actually makes someone a psychotherapist. I don't think patients give a damn about the diplomas hanging on the wall; they care about whether someone can actually help them. And that ability often hinges on factors beyond just the credentials listed here, such as
1. a genuine desire to help (for people who have been through hell, that drive is usually much stronger than for those who haven't)
2. empathy (not just identifying with a patient, but truly feeling with them) and
3. "intuition," as Robert Diaz7 puts it—that's absolutely vital to the whole process

When you look at the reality of how this plays out in America, I can tell you that the actual chance of finding someone who can help is incredibly slim. I don't know what it looks like from inside your office, but let me tell you what I see from "the other side"—I see
a massive crowd of people who, despite trying everything to find support—bouncing from psychiatrist to psychiatrist, psychologist to whoever else will listen—end up with wrong diagnoses, collect a stack of labels, or get an accurate diagnosis but unfortunately receive zero actual help. They end up meeting more unstable individuals who clearly need treatment themselves than sane ones, and over the years, what happens?
- they become totally embittered by the entire system, cursing psychiatry and psychology and fleeing to some cult or esoteric movement that actually helps them more than any doctor ever could
- or they spend years and years cycling through medications without their problems ever actually vanishing
- or they simply snap and decide to take matters into their own hands, educating themselves to try and fix their own lives

Now, I don't know exactly where the breakdown is happening. It’s certainly tied to the fact that the general state of things in this country is a mess, making modern training or a younger generation of therapists feel like an abstract concept. Maybe it's because people can't afford a decent private therapist, or maybe there are so few qualified professionals in America that you could count them on one hand, or perhaps the entire healthcare system is so broken that it can't even provide adequate staffing, let alone sufficient time per patient.

I'm sure all these factors play a role, but the core issue remains. And to me, it’s a massive issue that extends far beyond your specific profession. I get it—you’re going to fight tooth and nail to keep outsiders from meddling in your field, but if a profession fails to actually help the people suffering, it’s a bit ridiculous to start shouting when those same people decide to step in and do it themselves.
Harold Adams5 Harold Adams5 Active Member
102 messages
joined Feb 2008
#27 ·
Carol Lee4, even if you hadn't mentioned you were working remotely, I would have figured it out myself.
...that whole idea regarding mandatory supervision,
( specifically once a week )
is pure fantasy in our field, especially
for private practices like ours, which basically operate without any oversight..
( aside from the "inspectors" who show up when you're "registering a small business" or moving offices.
They just want to see if the space is adequate.
( They check the square footage, whether there are two restrooms, and look for a bunch of useless equipment—stuff you might just borrow from a local hospital for the day )
Those officials "know" you borrowed it.
But they can't prove it. And frankly, they don't care. It’s irrelevant.
You don't actually need that gear for psychotherapy (according to the regulations).
The most important thing is whatever circus act happens during that "inspection" process.😍>
( Just like at those big medical conventions. ) 😍>
I won't even get into the rest of it; it's just incredibly unprofessional.
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#28 ·
Olivia Carter25 said:So, if all you need to actually help people consists of

1. a college degree
2. supervision and clinical hours
3. staying up to date with literature and
4. conferences and stuff like that

then I’m genuinely curious why so many people in America can’t find a decent psychologist or psychiatrist (even though everyone in the field is doing exactly what you listed). Honestly, why is it so hard for them to find anyone who can effectively tackle their issues through anything other than just handing out a prescription.

In my view, that list is a far cry from what actually makes someone a psychotherapist. I don't think patients care about the diplomas hanging on the wall; they just want to know someone can actually help them. And that ability comes from extra qualities alongside those credentials, such as
1. a genuine desire to help (for people who have been through hell, that motivation is usually much stronger than for those who haven't)
2. empathy (not in the sense of identifying with the patient, but truly feeling for them) and
3. that "instinct," as dear Lila puts it—which is absolutely vital to the whole process

When you weigh all that against the reality of the mental health landscape in America, I can tell you that the chance of finding someone who can truly help a patient is honestly quite slim. I don't know what it looks like from inside your office, but let me tell you what I see from "the other side"—I see
a massive crowd of people who, despite trying everything to find help, bounce from one psychiatrist to the next, from one psychologist to whoever else, only to end up with wrong diagnoses, collecting labels, or getting an accurate diagnosis but zero actual relief. They end up meeting more therapists who probably need treatment themselves than sane people, and over the years, what happens?
- either they become totally cynical about the entire system and write off psychiatry and psychology altogether, turning instead to esoteric sects that might actually provide more comfort than doctors ever did
- or they spend years and years cycling through medications without their problems ever actually resolving
- or they simply hit a breaking point and decide to take matters into their own hands by educating themselves to try and fix things on their own

Now, I don't know where the disconnect lies. It’s certainly possible that because of the general state of the country, modern training or a younger generation of therapists remains an abstract concept. Maybe people just can't afford a good private therapist, maybe there are so few qualified ones in America that you could count them on one hand, or maybe the entire healthcare system is in such bad shape that it can't even provide adequate staff, let alone give them enough time per patient.

I’m sure all those factors play a role, but the core issue remains. And to me, it's a huge issue that reaches far beyond your specific profession. I understand that you all will fight tooth and nail to keep outsiders from interfering with your work, but if the profession itself isn't helping people solve their problems, it seems a little ridiculous when those same people start poking their noses into your business.

It's interesting that out of this entire post, you only highlighted four factors😕 which are merely the requirements to technically work as a therapist—you can't legally practiceas a therapist
The last part of my post , either wasn't read, or you just didn't want to mention it, but I think it's the most important part of the whole thing.

I have absolutely nothing against people "interfering" in the field, but if they are going to do it, it needs to be competent and argumentirati based, rather than being backed solely by personal experience (since every single person's lived experience is unique and not identical), media snippets, and a few books—especially that "pop psychology" nonsense that Americans launched just to make a quick buck.
I have to admit, most literature in that specific niche makes my skin crawl—with a few exceptions, of course. No offense to anyone who enjoys reading them, but I’d categorize most of it as nothing more than "romance novels" rather than serious work.
That said, I always welcome any well-reasoned suggestions, not just within a specialized field, but in general.
One of the absolute essentials for effective therapy is maintaining objectivity. You shouldn't get swept up in the emotions; instead, you need to keep as much professional distance as possible. The more objective a therapist can remain, the more successful the treatment will be. It’s essentially a fundamental rule of therapeutics.
Of course, this doesn't mean a therapist shouldn't show empathy toward a client. However, a therapist should never—under any circumstances—act as a "shoulder to cry on." That is precisely where objectivity ends and subjectivity begins. There shouldn't be a friendship between the client and the therapist; at a certain stage, a type of "connection" does emerge, but a skilled therapist knows how to manage that and keep it in its proper place.
Sometimes clients might feel frustrated by this approach, but it is strictly for their own benefit. If a patient is saying, "Everything is so hard right now," and the therapist responds with, "I know, times are tough," that isn't therapy—that's just grabbing coffee and chatting with a friend. Again, I want to emphasize: a therapist cannot escape feeling empathy, but they absolutely cannot serve as a "shoulder to cry on." It is incredibly detrimental to the patient. I realize that sounds a bit harsh when written out like this, but explaining the nuance would honestly take me several pages.

Best regards,🙂
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#29 ·
Robert Diaz7 said:you're generalizing so much 🙄 you've clearly lost your grip on reality 👎 based on everything you post here!

I mean, there is definitely a specific profile of doctors who struggle with mental health issues themselves... ☕ you can imagine... it isn't something you just sense out of thin air.

When you make a generalization, you don't use terms like most of the time or usually; instead, you tend to use words like always, constantly, or something similar.
Robert Diaz7 Robert Diaz7 Member
21 messages
joined Feb 2007
#30 ·
Carol Lee4 said:If you're making a generalization, you don't really use specific terms; you usually stick to things like most of the time rather than saying always or constantly or whatever.

That's total nonsense, because most times that's just how generalizations work anyway. ☕
Robert Diaz7 Robert Diaz7 Member
21 messages
joined Feb 2007
#31 ·
Carol Lee4 said:When a client comes in looking for a shoulder to cry on, saying "everything is just so hard," and the therapist just responds with, "I know, times are tough right now"—that’s not actual therapy, it’s just grabbing coffee and venting with a friend.
[/B]Cheers🙂

honestly, it really depends on which psychological school of thought you follow, you know? different schools have totally different takes on this kind of thing 😉

because when you're dealing with someone with BPD, simply bringing their processes to light isn't enough, and it doesn't matter if the therapist explains all those unconscious patterns to them... you can become fully aware of every single one of your defense mechanisms and still be stuck with BPD.

BPD is like a missing piece of a puzzle that a psychotherapist just can't force back into place using the usual methods they try to use... and I think that's why so many people find therapy such a failure.
Olivia Carter25 Olivia Carter25 Member
37 messages
joined Oct 2005
#32 ·
Carol Lee4 said:It’s pretty interesting how, out of that entire post, only four factors actually ended up being singled out.😕 So, what does it actually take to work as a therapist? What are the baseline requirements just to get your foot in the door? You can't juggle a law degree and a full-time job at the same time. It’s just not happening. As a therapist—
The final part of my post.
, Either they skipped over it entirely, or they just didn't want to bring it up. And honestly, I think that’s the most critical point in the entire post.

Look, I don’t have a problem with people sticking their noses into professional fields, but if you’re going to do it, you better actually know what you're talking about. You need to bring real competence and solid arguments to the table. It shouldn't just be based on your own anecdotal experiences—everyone’s life story is different, and your personal perspective isn't some universal truth. You can't just rely on a few news clips or a couple of those "pop psychology" books that American corporations churn out just to grab a quick buck. If you want to weigh in, back it up with more than just your feelings and some trendy media buzzwords.
I honestly can't stand that entire genre of literature. Aside from a few rare exceptions, most of it belongs in the same category as cheap romance novels—no offense intended to anyone who actually enjoys reading them, but that’s exactly where it sits on the scale of literary merit.
Well-reasoned proposals are always welcome—not just within a specific field, but in every aspect of life.
One of the absolute essentials for effective therapy is objectivity. You can't get swept up in the emotions; you have to maintain as much professional distance as possible. It’s pretty simple: the more objective the therapist stays, the more successful the treatment becomes. That’s just the fundamental rule of the game.
Look, this doesn't mean a therapist lacks empathy for their client. It just means a therapist should never—and I mean never—act as a shoulder to cry on. The second you step into that role, you lose all objectivity and slip straight into subjectivity. There is no such thing as a friendship between a client and a therapist. At a certain stage, a specific kind of "bond" inevitably forms, but a skilled professional knows exactly how to manage that connection and keep it strictly within its proper boundaries.
Clients get angry sometimes, but that friction is actually for their own good. If a patient comes in looking for a shoulder to cry on—expecting a therapist to just nod and say, "I hear you, things are really tough right now"—that isn't therapy. That’s just grabbing coffee with a friend. Look, I'm not saying therapists shouldn't have empathy; you can't just switch that off. But acting as a mere emotional crutch is incredibly damaging to the patient. I know that sounds harsh written out like this, but explaining why it's so toxic would honestly take me several pages.

Hey there.🙂

Look, it’s interesting how you keep trying to frame one specific therapeutic method—and the theoretical framework behind it—as if it’s the only valid way to operate. I don't subscribe to that kind of narrow-minded approach, so let's just agree to disagree and leave it at that. By the way, your little "debate technique" is pretty predictable. It’s a classic move: when you run out of actual substance or logical arguments, you pivot to personal jabs and provocations. Unfortunately, in any serious discussion, that’s considered a bottom-tier tactic. Honestly, I don't even see the point in engaging with it. I could just as easily start picking apart your credentials or your degree if I wanted to, but I’m not going to stoop to that level. 😉I’ve defended my points just as much as you’ve defended yours; I don't see why I should have to sit here and lecture you on psychoanalytic literature.

Regarding empathy, you completely misread my point—take another look at what I actually wrote. I said a therapist needs to empathize with a client’s struggles, NOT identify with them. Even then, the specific dynamic between therapist and client that you described is just one single way of doing things. It’s certainly not a one-size-fits-all solution, and it definitely doesn't work for every type of mental health disorder.

Look, I think this entire debate is a waste of breath. Your fundamental understanding of how the human psyche actually works is miles away from what I believe is reality—and honestly, we've already established that we aren't going to see eye-to-eye on that. So, let's just leave it at that. I'll step back for now, but don't expect me to stay quiet; I'll jump right back in the moment I feel you've missed something crucial. 😁 😛
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#33 ·
Robert Diaz7 said:It’s nonsense. Most of the time, it's just a sweeping generalization. ☕

Dear Lila,
Generalization is basically what happens when people start throwing around terms like "always," "constantly," or "never."
You don't have to agree with me, and honestly, you certainly don't have to.👍
We’re all here to swap perspectives, hash things out, and hopefully find some common ground somewhere in the middle.
I went ahead and introduced myself as a therapist, fully aware that I’m essentially inviting a storm of resistance, endless questioning, and a whole lot of overly personal inquiries my way.😠 👋
At the end of the day, we’re all just learning from one another, and honestly, I think that mutual exchange is the most important part of this whole thing.
Let’s be real: therapists aren't walking encyclopedias of human psychology, they can't fix everyone, and honestly, their personalities might not click with every single person walking through the door.
My only real motivation here is to share some of my own experiences with you all and to learn from yours.
I completely understand that some clients are going to push back against their therapists, and honestly, that’s just part of the job. We aren't all going to be everyone's cup of tea, whether we're looking at it from a personal standpoint or purely through our professional roles.
I really feel a strong desire to share some of my life experiences with all of you, especially those I've gathered through my years working as a therapist.
Of course, I’m genuinely happy if I was able to nudge someone toward seeking help.
Like I mentioned right at the very start, I truly care about people moving past those old prejudices against anyone living with certain disabilities. I really want to see a world where anyone who feels like they need a hand reaches out and asks for it—completely unapologetically and without an ounce of shame.🙂
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#34 ·
Olivia Carter25 Olivia Carter25 said:It’s interesting how you seem determined to frame one specific therapeutic method—and its underlying theory—as the only valid way to approach this. I honestly can't get behind that kind of narrow view, so I think we’ll just have to agree to disagree on that one. By the way, that "debate tactic" of yours is pretty recognizable—one of the classic moves where, when the actual arguments run dry, you pivot to personal jabs instead. Unfortunately, it’s also one of those tactics that people generally consider pretty cheap. I don't really feel like getting dragged into that, especially since I could just as easily start questioning the validity of your diploma if I wanted to, but I won't. 😉I’ve put just as much effort into defending my points as you have yours, so there’s really no need for me to start quoting psychoanalytic textbooks here.

Regarding empathy, I think you might have misread my point—give it another look. I was saying that a therapist should empathize with a client's struggles, but certainly NOT identify with them personally. Besides, the specific therapeutic dynamic you described is really just one single way of doing things. It’s definitely not a one-size-fits-all solution, especially since it won't work effectively for every type of psychological disorder.

Honestly, I feel like this whole discussion is going nowhere. Our fundamental views on how the human psyche actually works are just too far apart for us to find common ground, which is pretty clear at this point. So, let’s just leave it there for now; I'll be sure to jump back in whenever I feel like you've missed something important. 😁 😛

I am truly sorry if you interpreted anything I said as being personally provocative. I’ve been away for a little while, so I’m not quite sure which parts you're referring to.
When it comes to therapy, I’ve always been a firm believer in the individual approach. When you really start digging into the nuances of psychology, you eventually find yourself standing at this fascinating crossroads between Gestalt therapy and cognitive approaches. It’s one of those intellectual tug-of-wars that feels almost poetic once you get into the weeds of it. On one hand, you have the Gestalt perspective, which is all about that immediate, holistic "here and now." It’s less about dissecting your past like a biology project and more about how you’re actually experiencing the world in this exact moment. It’s visceral, it’s sensory, and it’s deeply focused on making sense of the whole picture rather than just staring at individual pieces of a puzzle. There's something incredibly grounding about that, isn't there? Then, you pivot over to the cognitive side of things, and the vibe shifts entirely. This is much more about the architecture of the mind—how we process information, how we categorize our experiences, and how our internal logic (or lack thereof) shapes our reality. It’s analytical, structured, and focuses heavily on those mental patterns and thought loops that keep us stuck. If Gestalt is about feeling the wave, cognitive therapy is about studying the mechanics of the tide. I often find myself wondering if they are truly opposing forces or just two different lenses looking at the same human soul. One looks at the flow, and the other looks at the plumbing. Personally, I think we need a bit of both to really understand what makes us tick. Behavioral therapies.I’m just going to jump in here regarding the group discussions. Psychodrama..
Of course, different therapeutic approaches tend to overlap, and they aren't nearly as strictly segregated as I initially laid out in my previous post. In practice, I find myself frequently integrating various methods—for instance... I’ve been diving into autogenic training lately, and honestly, it’s been a game-changer for my stress levels. It’s one of those things where you just sit there, focus on specific physical sensations, and let your body catch up with your mind. It sounds a little woo-woo at first, I know—I was definitely a skeptic myself—but once you get into the rhythm of it, the relaxation is incredibly deep. If you haven't tried it yet, I highly recommend giving it a shot during your downtime. Well, I suppose we're finally getting there. Deep breathing through the diaphragm—it’s one of those things you hear about constantly, but actually getting it right can feel a little awkward at first. I've been trying to incorporate more diaphragmatic breathing into my daily routine lately, mostly because I realized I spend way too much time taking those shallow, chest-only breaths when I'm stressed out. It’s a simple concept, really: instead of just moving your upper chest, you focus on expanding your belly to let your lungs really fill up. It sounds easy enough, but once you actually sit down and try to focus on that deep, steady rhythm, you realize how much tension you were carrying in your shoulders without even knowing it. It's definitely a work in progress for me, but I'm finding that taking a few intentional, deep breaths helps settle my nerves and keeps me a bit more centered throughout the day.I guess you could call them some sort of "exotic methods" that I’m still essentially "borrowing" from elsewhere, though unfortunately, they aren't quite part of our standard playbook yet. Buddhism, yoga, Reiki—it’s all part of that holistic wellness journey we’re all constantly navigating.... and so on.
Every single one of my therapy sessions is unique because I make it a point to collaborate with my clients to find the specific approach that feels most accessible to them—the one where we both feel we’ll see real progress quickly. However, there is one fundamental principle of traditional therapy that I simply won't budge on: the "here and now." I always insist on focusing on the present moment, as I believe it's the only way for a client to truly grasp the core of their struggle and take ownership of certain aspects of their life (though, to be fair, I'm not suggesting they take responsibility for absolutely everything).
It also turns out that the group dynamic plays a major role in this. Psychodrama. It’s incredibly effective because, in my experience, it’s the fastest way to help someone truly see where they fit into the middle of a problem and determine if there's actually a way out.
I truly believe there is always a way out. It just takes an immense amount of love, unwavering support, and a massive dose of courage and inner strength. You can definitely break free from that vicious cycle—it’s possible. A great therapist knows how to dig deep to uncover the specific triggers that finally push someone toward meaningful change.
What really gets under my skin when we talk is the specific terminology you lean on—specifically that whole "debate technique" thing. Poor thing.It seems like one specific therapeutic approach serves as a theoretical framework that—since I actually use it myself, according to what you supposedly believe—is essentially the only method worth considering.
I honestly don't quite follow this terminology being thrown my way—it feels like it's directed at me personally rather than at my work as a therapist. After all, you can't really know which specific therapeutic methods I choose to employ. I’ve been intentionally vague in my responses because, as I mentioned from the get-go, my goal isn't to lecture anyone on specific clinical techniques. My real mission here is much simpler: I just want to encourage people who feel they need support to reach out and find help without any shame, prejudice, or fear of being judged by those around them.
Any kind of professional support can be a game-changer, and once you start looking, you'll eventually find the right therapy or specialist that actually works for you. The most important thing is just to take that first step—to get moving and start reaching out for help. Personally, I don't really care what specific type of treatment it is, as long as it gets the job done!
One thing I will always passionately and clearly argumentirati against—and quite loudly among my colleagues—is the outdated reliance on old-school psychoanalysis, which proved itself ineffective for real-world issues over twenty years ago, and the cozy little marriage between psychiatry and Big Pharma!!!
I know this firsthand, and it isn’t just an issue here in America, though the trend is definitely creeping from the West toward more developing nations.
Every single day—and I mean truly every day—in places like Germany, there are multiple offers flying around, promising massive kickbacks—we're talking huge sums of money—if a doctor prescribes specific medications from certain pharmaceutical giants.
I know this is happening right here in the States too; based on my conversations with peers, ranging from primary care physicians up the ladder, this phenomenon is starting to take on epidemic proportions.
I am going to fight this as long as there is a single ounce of strength left in me, because I find it absolutely unethical and immoral... I'm almost running out of words to describe it, but especially over the last 15 years, this "trend" has been migrating toward lower-income countries. It makes sense, unfortunately, because specialists in those regions aren't paid nearly as much as their Western counterparts.
Best regards🙂
Olivia Carter25 Olivia Carter25 Member
37 messages
joined Oct 2005
#35 ·
Carol Lee4 said:I am truly sorry if you interpreted anything I said as being "driven by personal provocations." I was away for a while, so I’m not entirely sure what you’re referring to.
Regarding therapy—on an individual level, I lean toward Gestalt and cognitive behavioral therapy. For group work, I utilize psychodrama.
Of course, different modalities overlap; it isn't as strictly compartmentalized as my summary might suggest. I frequently incorporate various other methods—ranging from autogenic training to diaphragmatic breathing. Some of these might still be considered "exotic" in our field, but I often borrow techniques from Buddhism, yoga, and Reiki... etc.
Every therapeutic approach I take is unique. I try to collaborate with the client to select the most accessible method where we believe progress can be made quickly. The one cornerstone of classical therapy I refuse to compromise on is the "here and now"—I insist on that, so the client can recognize the core of their problem and take responsibility for certain things (though, again, not everything, I should clarify).

Look, my view is that for someone to actually be present in the "here and now," they first have to resolve everything preventing them from doing so. You aren't going to achieve that just by treating the symptoms; you have to address the root causes that led to those consequences in the first place.
That is why I am a proponent of psychoanalysis; I find it far more effective than cognitive-behavioral approaches. But ultimately, a lot of it comes down to the therapist.

What offends me in our communication is the terminology you use—calling my discussion technique pathetic. You're treating one specific therapeutic direction as if it were the only valid one simply because you assume that's what I use.
I don't understand this line of reasoning directed at me personally rather than my professional practice. You can't possibly know which specific methods I employ, and I tend to be quite general in my responses because, as I stated at the start, my goal isn't to lecture people on specific methodologies. My goal is to encourage people who feel they need help to seek it without shame, prejudice, or fear of judgment.

No, I simply meant it is pathetic when you start making assumptions about what I've read—using such a condescending tone, no less—when you actually know nothing about it, purely because you disagree with my arguments and can't seem to find a solid rebuttal. I stand by my point: it is pathetic. 😛
Furthermore, this is also what bothers me about debating you—I notice that whenever an argument doesn't suit you, you immediately turn it into a personal attack. Suddenly, everyone has "resistance to the therapist," or we aren't educated enough, or we have "stupid" explanations. That isn't actual counter-argumentation.
I don't care for people who use their profession and "altruism" as an excuse to look down on others. This is a forum, not your private office; there is no reason to treat any of us like your clients. If I decided to play that game, I could easily start psychoanalyzing your posts, and I doubt you'd enjoy that very much.

Any type of professional help can be useful, and a person will eventually find the right therapy or the right provider... The key is just to start, to take action, and to reach out for help. Personally, I don't care which specific therapy is used, as long as it works!
I will always be prepared to clearly and logically, and quite loudly among my peers, argue against the outdated methods of long-term psychoanalysis—which proved ineffective for specific issues over twenty years ago—and the cozy relationship between psychiatry and Big Pharma!!!
I know this from the inside, and it isn’t just an issue here in America, though the problem is migrating from the West toward Eastern nations.
Every single day—and I mean truly every day—in places like Germany, there are multiple instances where kickbacks are offered, involving massive sums of money, if a doctor prescribes specific medications from certain pharmaceutical companies.
I know this is happening here too, and based on conversations with colleagues—ranging from primary care physicians upward—this phenomenon is slowly reaching epidemic proportions.
I am going to fight this as long as I have a single ounce of strength left, because I find it absolutely unethical and immoral... I'm running out of ways to describe this trend, especially since, over the last 15 years or so, this "phenomenon" has been moving toward developing nations. It makes sense; specialists in those countries are paid significantly less than their Western counterparts.
Best regards🙂

Regarding the pharmaceutical industry, I'm right there with you. As for everything else, I will also continue to fight against such a narrow, limited view of the human psyche. 😉
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#36 ·
Olivia Carter25 said:Look, my take is that if someone actually wants to be present in the moment, they first have to resolve everything that’s keeping them stuck. You can't just patch up the symptoms; you have to dig deep into the root causes that triggered them in the first place.
That's why I lean toward psychoanalysis—I find it much more effective than CBT. Though, obviously, at the end of the day, a lot comes down to the therapist themselves.

No, what I meant was that it's honestly pretty pathetic when someone starts making assumptions about what I've read, using this condescending tone, all because they don't know the material and can't find a solid argument to actually counter mine. It feels cheap to me. 😛
Besides, it's frustrating to argue with you because whenever an argument doesn't fit your narrative, you immediately turn it into a personal attack—suddenly we all have "resistance to the therapist," or we aren't educated enough, or our explanations are "stupid." That isn't really a counter-argument.
I'm not a fan of people who use their profession or their sense of "altruism" as an excuse to look down on others. This is a public forum, not your private office in Manhattan, so there's no reason to treat any of us like your patients. If I started doing that, I could easily start psychoanalyzing your posts too, and I doubt you'd enjoy that one bit.

Regarding the pharmaceutical industry, I'm with you there. As for everything else, I'll always stand against such a narrow view of the human psyche. 😉


It honestly feels like you're predisposed to dislike anything I write before I even type it. But hey, that's really your issue to deal with. Most people reach out to me privately; I handle plenty of inquiries and discussions via PDF files, so you're actually quite a rarity in being someone who takes issue with everything I say or discuss beforehand.
I already wrote most of my response to you on the BPD PDF, and I truly see no point in going back and forth with you over nothing.
Once you decide what you actually want to communicate or debate, then maybe we can have a real conversation. So far, it seems like everything I write is just something for you to push back against for whatever reason. Go ahead and keep contradicting me if it makes you happy. At this rate, you might as well try to argue that the moon is made of green cheese.
If you're a fan of those long, drawn-out sessions, then Dr. Gruden is probably your guy—he loves that approach even more than you do. Maybe you'll find common ground there. Either way, you seem more aligned with psychiatry than psychology, and that's perfectly fine.
Every famous figure in the world has a couch available at least once a week, so if they haven't solved their problems after all these years, I have to wonder: is the issue the choice of therapy, or is it just a status symbol?
I can only offer my own perspective on long-term psychoanalysis: if I'm struggling, I need help right now, not a marathon session debating whether my mother brushed my hair too hard or if she did it on purpose. I'm speaking from the viewpoint of a client who needs immediate relief, rather than someone stuck wondering if they're still living in the past because of something that happened forty years ago, looking for excuses in their parents, grandparents, or even the weather during their first stroller ride.
My personal belief is that we can't change the past, but we can certainly live in the here and now instead of letting our days slip away analyzing things we can't influence or alter.

I never expected us to agree on a single sentence, and frankly, I don't care if we do.
Maybe someone out there will find this a little helpful!
Best regards,😎
Sorry, I keep mixing you up with Lilu. Since your takes are so similar, it’s no wonder I occasionally swap you two in my head.
Carol Lee4 Carol Lee4 Active Member
58 messages
joined Jul 2006
#37 ·
Olivia Carter25 said:Look, my take is that if someone truly wants to be present in the moment, they first have to resolve everything that’s keeping them stuck. You can't just fix the symptoms; you have to dig into the underlying causes that created them.
That’s why I lean toward psychoanalysis—I find it much more effective than CBT. Though, obviously, a lot of it comes down to the therapist's skill.

No, I’m simply saying it’s pretty pathetic when you start making assumptions about what I’ve read, using this condescending tone, all because you don't know the material and can't find a solid argument to actually debunk mine. I still think it’s quite low 😛
And honestly, it’s frustrating debating with you—I’ve noticed that whenever an argument doesn't fit your narrative, you immediately make it personal. Suddenly, everyone has "resistance to therapy," or we aren't educated enough, or our explanations are "stupid." That isn't really a counter-argument.
I don't care for people who use their profession or their sense of "altruism" as an excuse to look down on others. This is a message board, not your private practice in Manhattan, so there’s no reason to treat any of us like your clients. If I started doing that, I could easily start psychoanalyzing your posts too, and I doubt you'd enjoy that one bit.

Regarding Big Pharma, I'm with you there. As for everything else, I’ll always advocate against taking a narrow view of the human psyche. 😉

Regarding being "present"—we all carry baggage from the past, and everyone should ideally address those root causes (not talking about extreme cases here). It’s usually much easier to go hunting for reasons in the past than it is to actually take responsibility for the "here and now."🙂

Personally, I don't know anyone who is entirely free of issues or childhood frustrations. Some people have the strength to move forward, while others find it easier to walk backward. Moving forward requires shifting your entire mental framework, and ultimately, it feels safer to "escape" into the past and find someone to blame rather than facing yourself.
I'm certainly not judging people who struggle; taking that step forward is incredibly difficult. It takes massive courage and strength to stop standing still, let alone to actually advance. 🙂

I view this forum as a mutual learning experience—I learn from you, and you learn from me, regardless of how you choose to perceive it. 🙂
But, I have to admit, this is my first time encountering so-called "know-it-alls" in America.
Why didn't you just go to grad school to become a therapist instead of showering us with half-baked information? I'm genuinely stunned by how everyone here thinks they're an expert on everything, from the NFL coach to psychotherapy. It’s incredible how smart we Americans are. I just wonder where we've all been hiding all these years?
Unfortunately, the statistics don't lie—over 40 percent of the population in the US struggles with basic literacy. 🙂

I know that people dealing with mental health issues tend to read a lot, especially professional literature, but reading doesn't automatically make you an expert. By pure circumstance, I’ve spent a lot of time studying and researching carcinomas; I devoured every medical text I could get my hands on, but that doesn't mean I'm an oncologist. I might know more about cancer than the average person on the street, but I’m certainly not delusional enough to pretend I'm an expert in oncology.🙄

There is one really vital point I want to make here. I make it a point never to smear anyone or judge them; the idea of labeling someone else’s opinions or lifestyle as stupid, ignorant, or whatever else you might have listed simply doesn't cross my mind. I expect that same level of respect in return when people interact with me.👋

Also, here is a little, handy little psychological exercise for everyone to try—right now, actually;
-What am I doing?
-What am I feeling?
-What am I thinking?
-How am I breathing?

At the end of the day, we are all our own ultimate lawmakers, judges of honor and status, the architects of our own lives, and the ones who hand out both the rewards and the punishments!

Resisting a therapist is actually a completely normal part of the process, even in your favorite style of psychoanalysis.😲

And just one more important thing—if this were my actual private practice, there would be a fee schedule involved, and believe me, it wouldn't exactly be affordable for most people around here!!!

My involvement here serves as a break and a rest sometimes, and hard work at other times, but it is always driven by pure altruism!!!!
I genuinely just love people!!! No matter what you might think about that.😘
Olivia Carter25 Olivia Carter25 Member
37 messages
joined Oct 2005
#38 ·
Look, for someone who claims they hate bickering, I have to say you sure do love a good argument. Though, I suppose there might be some sort of altruistic motive driving all this 🤣

As for the resident know-it-all, here’s a little psychological riddle just for you 😁. But honestly, I’m sure you covered this in your grad school courses—if you’re constantly attacking "us know-it-alls," there must be something about us that deeply attracts you. Hmm, I wonder what that could be? 😉

Anyway, we aren't going to see eye-to-eye anytime soon. To wrap this up—like I said before, it isn't hard to figure out why I push back. I will always react to people who try to cram the human soul into the tiny, cramped confines of a little box. Unfortunately, it seems to me you're missing a vital piece of the puzzle. I also react to those who use their professional titles as a shield to claim they are the sole authority on a subject, spreading misinformation about things that I believe are essential for people to truly understand.

I view the human soul and its mental states in a completely different way than you do. To me, a "patient" isn't just a clinical case; they are a human being. I don't think you can draw conclusions as a therapist the way you do. In my view, there is absolutely no place for moral judgment in psychotherapy, and frankly, it really bothers me when therapists act like that—something I've noticed from you multiple times. (I could go into detail about where and how, but I really don't feel like wasting any more energy on this debate.) I see a therapist as someone meant to heal the human soul, not lecture people or force them to conform to society. Furthermore, I see a therapist as someone who has walked a similar path themselves, not some narcissistic God sitting on a throne looking down on a patient. I detest that attitude within the profession, and you embody it more than enough. I'm sure that contributes to my "resistance toward the therapist," but maybe we should ask ourselves what caused your "countertransference" and why you never mention that 😛

And please, keep acting like you know more than me; you can keep trying to prove it through your posts until you've hung three or four diplomas on your wall.

All of this is exactly why I find myself countering you. But actually, I'm starting to doubt if these debates even serve a purpose beyond obvious bickering. The psychological approach you advocate for and psychoanalysis have never really shared much common ground anyway, and it's clear we aren't on the same wavelength.

So, that's all from me. I'll catch you on another thread.
mistymoose57 mistymoose57 Member
37 messages
joined Sep 2006
#39 ·
HR123 said:You’ve probably noticed that every other psychiatrist acts like they're Freud. Personally, I think over 80% of them haven't the slightest clue about psychology.


I suppose psychiatrists deal with psychiatry, not psychology... 🙏

No, I know too many of them to say that. None of them act like him.

And yeah, in 90% of cases, they actually know what they're doing.
Nicole James Nicole James Regular
313 messages
joined Dec 2010
#40 ·
Folks, I’d like to ask everyone to dial back the tension just a little bit... if you really need to go at each other, please just take it to the PMs.

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