The correlation between mental health disorders and IQ

mellowjackal33 said:.

- having totally different interests
- spotting connections and patterns that everyone else completely misses
- being constantly shocked and let down because people just "don't get it"... blah blah blah
:

Yeah, exactly. And honestly? That deep, spontaneous realization of how everything actually connects and works can drive you straight into this painful, depressing state of resignation where you just... give up on trying to be proactive about anything.
Plus, once you realize you can do things faster and better than basically everyone else with half the effort, it opens the door to this incredibly toxic laziness and boredom. And we all know how dangerous boredom can be.😁

Why make things so complicated?
High intelligence doesn't mean you're some weird loner. That’s just an old stereotype with zero basis in reality. You can't judge everyone based on one outlier like Tesla.

There was actually a famous long-term study done on gifted children a while back. Truman tested a group of kids and then handpicked the top 1,400 most intelligent ones to follow throughout their entire lives. They were tested every ten years, and researchers tracked everything—family background, physical health, personality traits, career success, you name it. After Truman passed away, other researchers took over the study. It turned out that instead of being sickly or socially awkward like people assume, these kids grew up to be healthier, wealthier, more successful, and honestly, even happier than the average person. Interestingly, when they hit 60, most of them said their families were their greatest source of happiness, rather than money or status.

Walter Myers4 said:Yeah. And honestly, those sudden, deep realizations about how connections and systems actually work—it can lead to this painful, depressing sort of resignation where you just kind of "give up" on trying to be proactive about the world.
It’s the same deal with realizing you can knock things out faster and better than most people with way less effort—it opens the door to some seriously unhealthy laziness and boredom. And we all know that boredom is a dangerous game. 😁

Don't get me wrong: I'm no genius, and I totally reject any implication that I am—gross!!! 😍 (Though, I have had my fair share of moments where I felt "misunderstood" by everyone around me—which probably stems from those IQ tests I took a few times that came back pretty high.).

Laziness and boredom: I've actually learned to embrace them. 🙂 😎 🙏 Woohoo! But if I can be 😈—that's the honest truth.

All this "proactive" stuff feels a bit much to me. Why should I care, and why would I play judge? All I can really say is that I don't like something, or that I would do it differently. But what's my criteria? So—people can do whatever they want. As for suggestions or advice—I'll give them if someone actually asks for help, or if they realize on their own they're "out of their league" and reach out. Or, if our interests clash and we run into a conflict... then we'll go from there.

Bryan Jones82 said:Man, why make this so complicated?
High intelligence doesn't mean you're some weirdo or a loner—that's just a tired stereotype with zero basis in reality. You can't judge an entire group based on a single outlier like, say, Tesla.

.............. those kids (who grew up to be adults, obviously) actually turned out to be healthier, wealthier, more successful in their careers, and even happier than most people. Interestingly enough, when they hit 60, they were asked what brought them the most joy—and most pointed to their families rather than money, status, or career wins.

I don't know—I never really saw Tesla as a "weirdo." He was just who he was. Why should we force him to fit into some narrow, socially accepted box of what "success" looks like?

Intelligence just presents bigger hurdles, but it also gives you better tools to jump over them. So, personally, I find the idea that being smart automatically means a higher risk of mental health issues to be a bit of a stretch.

Kyle Nelson2 said:😕 🤔

Regarding the signatures:

I'm voting for Euros (way more sophisticated!)—though maybe I should just stick to my Chase checking account? 🙂

Look, I’m definitely no expert here, but just off the top of my head, it seems to me that the people most at risk are probably those who are more emotionally volatile.

Tichy said:Look, I’m no expert, but my gut tells me the people most at risk are the ones who can't keep their emotions in check.

Ugh, okay, sure. But the real question we should be asking is whether being emotionally unstable actually has anything to do with your IQ.😍

*_Spike said:Is there actually a link?

I’m thinking about this in a broad sense—is someone with a higher IQ more likely to develop any kind of mental illness? Or perhaps looking at specific cases, like how OCD seems to hit people with higher intelligence quite often. If anyone knows, I'd love to hear it.

And if you have any citations or studies to back it up, please share. 👋

Well, I'll try to answer based on what I've gathered from spending quite a bit of time studying psychology.

The window for personality development—specifically those first four years of life—is basically the same period that determines IQ. So, I don't think the connection is just some media myth; it's actually quite literal. If personality development goes off the rails in an unconventional way during those first four years, there's a much higher chance it will impact abstract reasoning, which is essentially what intelligence is.

Most people struggling with mental illness were somehow affected or shaped during that initial four-year period. A significant percentage of them—including those prone to depression—might have been forced into developing abstract reasoning capabilities because they weren't living carefree lives during those formative years, which resulted in mental health issues.

It seems pretty logical to me. Besides, I suppose no one can argue against statistics showing that people with mental illnesses don't necessarily have significantly higher IQs.

As for emotional instability, that's a separate issue. That falls under the umbrella of mental illness rather than intelligence... though the link between the two lies right back in that developmental stage.

Here is one more piece of data that supports my theory: I read somewhere that there isn't a specific profile predisposed to PTSD, and consequently, those individuals don't have a higher average IQ... mainly because PTSD can happen at any point in a person's life, not just during those first four years.

I hope I haven't made my thoughts too tangled and confusing. 😂

Walter Myers4 said:Sure, whatever. But the real question is whether emotional instability actually correlates with IQ levels.😍

It's not about being emotional. It's about mental stability.

Ona007 said:It’s not an emotional thing, it’s a mental health issue.

Are you actually positive it isn't just being emotional?😁

I guess the technical term would be psychological instability or emotional lability, if you want to get all fancy about it.

Lawrence Robinson11 said:Most people dealing with mental illness—and I mean a huge chunk of them, including those prone to depression—were essentially shaped by whatever trauma they went through during those first four years of life. It’s like, because they were forced into situations where they couldn't just be carefree anymore, that early stress actually triggers the development of abstract thinking.

....
I hope I didn't make that sound too confusing or messy 😂

No you didn't 🙂

Can you explain what you mean by "at a certain point when they weren't carefree... they develop abstract thinking"?

Kyle Nelson2 said:I think the technical term is psychological instability or lability.

"Emotional" definitely isn't the right word.😁

Exactly... that’s just what Walter Myers4 said... 😉

Kyle Nelson2 said:you aren't 🙂

can you explain this part about how 'at a certain age when things aren't carefree... they develop abstract reasoning'?

Well, I guess a huge chunk of what we call issues—and I mean things like schizophrenia, manic depression, tendencies toward depression, alcoholism, addictions, or even personality disorders... honestly, who knows what else is baked into our personalities and mental health during those first four years? It's all so complex. But basically, these conditions, or at least the predisposition toward them, can manifest if the environment, the circumstances, or some perceived event—something the child views as totally abnormal—or maybe just an internal psychological shift goes sideways. So, if a kid hits a stressful situation and life stops being carefree... well, that might be it. That's one way to put it, I suppose... and naturally, that kind of pressure might force them to develop abstract reasoning as a way to cope.

You think you're forcing him to actually use his brain too much, like maybe making him develop some actual intelligence?

Kyle Nelson2 said:You mean he’s forcing him to think too much, maybe pushing his intelligence further than it needs to go?

Hmm... I suppose you could put it that way, I guess.🙂

Though, if you ask me—and I might be wrong here—I wouldn't really define intelligence as this conscious ability to sit and ponder things. It feels more like an unconscious capacity for abstract reasoning that eventually manifests as that measurable IQ score we see later on.🙂

When a kid is thrown into an unpredictable situation, they're forced to react to that stress through abstraction. I’d argue that whole process is subconscious at first... and then it just becomes deeply rooted.

...So, does that not seem perfectly logical to you?

Ona007 said:From what I can tell, these kids notice stuff like little kids—they pick up on details and vibe on a much higher level than "normal" kids. Their interests are always "somewhere else," too—like they're totally obsessed with one specific thing and just ignore everything else. Because of that, they struggle with regular day-to-day life... and they end up stressing everyone out
with how intense their knowledge and focus can be. That’s why they don't really fit in socially... they're usually loners..

Maybe Hans Asperger???

left here said:hm... yeah, I guess you could put it that way🙂

except I wouldn't define intelligence as this conscious ability to think. To me, it’s more like an unconscious capacity for abstract reasoning that eventually manifests as that visible IQ score we see later on.🙂

In an unpredictable situation, a kid is forced to react to stress using abstraction—and honestly, I'd say that process is subconscious... before it becomes deeply ingrained.

.... so, isn't that all pretty logical to you?

Partially, sure, but not entirely...
Personally, I don't buy that there's a direct link between being "forced" to think at some stage in life and having psychological issues down the road...
Before you even get to that, there's the connection between self-esteem development and how someone perceives the world during those sensitive years... I'd argue that things like depression actually stem from a deep-seated sense of abandonment, ingrained defeatism, or specific circumstances that caused that mindset in the first place... or maybe even just learned behaviors (yawning is contagious, right? So are mental illnesses).

Intelligence might just be a byproduct, because someone had to think a little harder and—most likely—neglect other parts of their life in the process...
That's why (in my opinion) these types of people aren't just smart, they often seem overly serious or prematurely mature... almost like they had to skip a chapter of their childhood.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Taroth said:partially, though I wouldn't say entirely...
I personally don't think there’s a direct line between being forced to overthink at some point in your life and developing psychological issues later on...
well, at least not before considering how self-esteem and one's perception of the world develops during those sensitive years...

...I mean, I suppose self-esteem and how you view the world around you are essentially mirrors of mental health, because if those things are missing, then in most cases, you're dealing with some kind of mental illness.

I'd probably lean toward thinking that, say, depression stems from a deeply rooted sense of abandonment, an ingrained defeatism, or specific situations that triggered that mindset... or maybe even just learned behavioral patterns (since yawning is contagious, and I guess mental illnesses can be too).

And that's pretty much how it works. Almost all mental illnesses stem from a deep-seated feeling of something—on an unconscious level, rooted right into our personality structure... and a learned pattern is basically just part of that personality structure... in a way.🙂

intelligence might just be a byproduct, since someone had to think a bit more deeply and therefore (probably) neglected other aspects of life...
that's why (in my opinion) such people are often not just intelligent, but also somewhat serious or mature... almost as if they had to skip a stage of life...

correct me if I'm wrong.

We mostly agree on this: intelligence, to me, feels like a side effect, because maybe someone had to think more intensely or was under higher levels of stress at some point... but then again, plenty of official "crazy" people are actually geniuses rather than just serious... so I really don't know about the exact ratio... if you are mentally ill, you might actually seem a bit more "alive"... but those are all different manifestations, and things can certainly take a darker turn, etc.!