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How to get started with agtech and farming investments?

Started by gentlecanyon65 · · 👁 13 views · 509 replies

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redwolf91 redwolf91 Newcomer
1 message
joined May 2007
#161 ·
So, if you want to snag any kind of government subsidy for planting anything, there’s a massive list of hoops you have to jump through first. You need fences up to 6 feet high just to keep the deer out—and that’s assuming you're doing hazelnuts, almonds, pears, whatever. Plus, you need hail protection, which basically means netting over everything. It’s an insane upfront cost—honestly, the price of all that protective gear alone can end up being more than the actual saplings for a whole acre. Then there's the labor—say you're doing hazelnuts—you're looking at maybe 20 workdays for harvest, meaning you need 20 people on deck to get it done in under a week, and yeah, you gotta pay them hourly too. Toss in spraying three times a year, needing a tractor, plus all the specialized harvesting gear... when you actually sit down and crunch the numbers, you're staring at a deficit. I was seriously thinking about starting my own orchards—hazelnuts, walnuts, the whole bit—but it just doesn't make sense. My advice? Find someone to run a real feasibility study for you. It all sounds great on paper until you realize you need enough hail protection for 75 acres to even qualify for the good stuff, and the profit margins are tiny compared to what you sink into it. Not to mention you need a massive water supply, pumps, generators, and all that fun stuff for those drought years that seem to be getting worse every single season. And don't forget mowing and all the other busywork. Protecting 75 acres against hail costs so many zeros you'll run out of paper. On top of that, you won't see your first real yield for five years, so if you're already 30, you'll never see the payoff yourself—maybe your grandkids will. Unless the macroeconomics or how the government views farming completely flips, most people living out in the sticks are fleeing the industry because the losses are just brutal. I know plenty of folks who own over 250 acres and can barely cover their tractor loans, let alone feed their families, all while cheap imports undercut them because of bad policy. And don't even get me started on disease—if just one out of 1,000 saplings is infected, the whole thing can go south fast and you might have to burn the entire field. That happened to some orchards a few years back that used imported stock, where a single Grade A sapling was going for $17... so yeah, do the math yourself. Of course, you also have to worry about soil quality—you can't just plant anything anywhere regardless of how much fertilizer you throw at it. Getting a decent soil test costs around $267; they dig about 15 holes a foot deep and take buckets of dirt from each just to tell you if the ground is even fit for hazelnuts
.
And honestly, most people will just look at your hard work and try to steal your crop. If you're a city kid who's never even held a shovel, just forget it. Your chances are even slimmer. Prepare to move out to the middle of nowhere and spend your nights guarding your fields so someone doesn't mess with your yield—keep a shotgun handy. Most people don't think about this, and nobody talks about it unless you've actually worked the land. If you haven't, you'll regret it immediately and feel like an idiot for wasting all that money planting things in a field. It’s just a loss. Everything looks beautiful on a spreadsheet or some fancy blog post, but nobody counts the massive annual overhead that eats your profits alive. It just isn't worth it. Welcome to America
Rachel Ruiz39 Rachel Ruiz39 Member
21 messages
joined Jun 2008
#162 ·
redwolf91 said:So, if you want to snag any kind of government subsidy for planting anything, there’s a massive list of hoops you have to jump through first. You need fences up to 6 feet high just to keep the deer out—and that’s assuming you're doing hazelnuts, almonds, pears, whatever. Plus, you need hail protection, which basically means netting over everything. It’s an insane upfront cost—honestly, the price of all that protective gear alone can end up being more than the actual saplings for a whole acre. Then there's the labor—say you're doing hazelnuts—you're looking at maybe 20 workdays for harvest, meaning you need 20 people on deck to get it done in under a week, and yeah, you gotta pay them hourly too. Toss in spraying three times a year, needing a tractor, plus all the specialized harvesting gear... when you actually sit down and crunch the numbers, you're staring at a deficit. I was seriously thinking about starting my own orchards—hazelnuts, walnuts, the whole bit—but it just doesn't make sense. My advice? Find someone to run a real feasibility study for you. It all sounds great on paper until you realize you need enough hail protection for 75 acres to even qualify for the good stuff, and the profit margins are tiny compared to what you sink into it. Not to mention you need a massive water supply, pumps, generators, and all that fun stuff for those drought years that seem to be getting worse every single season. And don't forget mowing and all the other busywork. Protecting 75 acres against hail costs so many zeros you'll run out of paper. On top of that, you won't see your first real yield for five years, so if you're already 30, you'll never see the payoff yourself—maybe your grandkids will. Unless the macroeconomics or how the government views farming completely flips, most people living out in the sticks are fleeing the industry because the losses are just brutal. I know plenty of folks who own over 250 acres and can barely cover their tractor loans, let alone feed their families, all while cheap imports undercut them because of bad policy. And don't even get me started on disease—if just one out of 1,000 saplings is infected, the whole thing can go south fast and you might have to burn the entire field. That happened to some orchards a few years back that used imported stock, where a single Grade A sapling was going for $17... so yeah, do the math yourself. Of course, you also have to worry about soil quality—you can't just plant anything anywhere regardless of how much fertilizer you throw at it. Getting a decent soil test costs around $267; they dig about 15 holes a foot deep and take buckets of dirt from each just to tell you if the ground is even fit for hazelnuts
.
And honestly, most people will just look at your hard work and try to steal your crop. If you're a city kid who's never even held a shovel, just forget it. Your chances are even slimmer. Prepare to move out to the middle of nowhere and spend your nights guarding your fields so someone doesn't mess with your yield—keep a shotgun handy. Most people don't think about this, and nobody talks about it unless you've actually worked the land. If you haven't, you'll regret it immediately and feel like an idiot for wasting all that money planting things in a field. It’s just a loss. Everything looks beautiful on a spreadsheet or some fancy blog post, but nobody counts the massive annual overhead that eats your profits alive. It just isn't worth it. Welcome to America

I really don't think we need to be this gloomy... it feels like that heavy pessimism is just built into the DNA of people from the Midwest.🙂
If I remember correctly, Mexicans are actually ranked third or fourth globally when it comes to raspberry production, so if hazelnuts aren't turning a profit right now, raspberries definitely are—our neighbors are living proof of that.
To be perfectly honest, I’m not quite sure why there’s such a massive narrative about everyone abandoning agriculture... and even if there is some truth to it, I wonder if it's really an industry problem at all. It seems to me that while there are certainly certain individuals who see nothing but darkness no matter where they look, generally speaking... maybe we're just looking at a group of people who lack the drive and expect everything to be handed to them on a silver platter.

The idea of fleeing to the city... moving from the countryside to an urban center🙂 is a tough climb; honestly, only the most incredibly ambitious souls tend to make it, and then you're left wondering if all that grueling effort was even worth it just to say you 'made it' in the city.

We really ought to learn how to just be content and happy... chasing money endlessly doesn't actually make a person better.
cosmicpuma15 cosmicpuma15 Member
24 messages
joined Jul 2010
#163 ·
Rachel Ruiz39 said:I really don't think we need to be this gloomy... it feels like that heavy pessimism is just built into the DNA of people from the Midwest.🙂
If I remember correctly, Mexicans are actually ranked third or fourth globally when it comes to raspberry production, so if hazelnuts aren't turning a profit right now, raspberries definitely are—our neighbors are living proof of that.
To be perfectly honest, I’m not quite sure why there’s such a massive narrative about everyone abandoning agriculture... and even if there is some truth to it, I wonder if it's really an industry problem at all. It seems to me that while there are certainly certain individuals who see nothing but darkness no matter where they look, generally speaking... maybe we're just looking at a group of people who lack the drive and expect everything to be handed to them on a silver platter.

The idea of fleeing to the city... moving from the countryside to an urban center🙂 is a tough climb; honestly, only the most incredibly ambitious souls tend to make it, and then you're left wondering if all that grueling effort was even worth it just to say you 'made it' in the city.

We really ought to learn how to just be content and happy... chasing money endlessly doesn't actually make a person better.

Tell me about it. I've actually made some decent money lately, and you know what? I already feel different. I feel misunderstood, and my head is spinning with worries. I can't even sleep at night.😬
A Anonymous Veteran
3.6K messages
joined May 2005
#164 ·
Maybe I'm a bit off base here...

I’m not really up to speed on what land is going for out in the Midwest lately... but I'm looking into it...
Does anyone have an idea of the rough prices per acre?
Also, how much can you actually make if you decide to lease the land out?
Sam Murphy Sam Murphy Active Member
94 messages
joined May 2012
#165 ·
So, basically, if you want to qualify for any kind of agricultural grant, regardless of what you're planting, there are certain baseline requirements you have to hit... for instance, you need to put up fencing at least six feet high to keep the local wildlife out, and when it comes to things like timber, almond groves, or pear orchards, you’ve got to have hail protection in place—meaning netting over everything—which honestly turns into such an incredibly expensive investment...

Actually, none of that is true; neither the fencing nor the netting are mandatory requirements to receive the subsidies.
Sam Murphy Sam Murphy Active Member
94 messages
joined May 2012
#166 ·
We really need to learn how to just be content and find actual happiness... because constantly chasing a paycheck doesn't actually make a person better...

I completely agree with this sentiment; having some money in the bank is certainly helpful, but if you're spending every waking hour grinding just to stay afloat, you're barely getting by... plus, even if you move out to the countryside to live off the land, you can't exactly survive on nothing but a backyard garden if things go south...
Jeremy Fowler5 Jeremy Fowler5 Newcomer
2 messages
joined May 2007
#167 ·
I recently stumbled upon a theory about a specific type of walnut tree that can supposedly be ready for harvest in just 8 to 10 years. According to the idea, these trees don't focus on spreading out with a wide canopy; instead, they grow tall and slender. They’re planted quite close together—maybe about 10 feet apart—to keep that footprint as small as possible.
Does anyone here have any actual experience with this, or is it just an orchardist's fairy tale?
cosmicpuma15 cosmicpuma15 Member
24 messages
joined Jul 2010
#168 ·
Anonymous said:Maybe I'm a bit off base here...

I’m not really up to speed on what land is going for out in the Midwest lately... but I'm looking into it...
Does anyone have an idea of the rough prices per acre?
Also, how much can you actually make if you decide to lease the land out?

The cheapest plot I ever saw was around $1,600 an acre... though it sold, obviously.
Sam Murphy Sam Murphy Active Member
94 messages
joined May 2012
#169 ·
The government is putting up some state-owned land for sale right now, and honestly, if you’ve got the capital to move on it, it might actually be a pretty solid investment opportunity...
A Anonymous Veteran
3.6K messages
joined May 2005
#170 ·
check out

www.jurkovic-farms.com

JURKOVIĆ
A Anonymous Veteran
3.6K messages
joined May 2005
#171 ·
Edward Newman77 said:I’ve been chewing on this idea for quite a while now—though I haven't quite managed to track down the hard data yet... Does anyone actually know what the current market rate is for walnut timber? How many years does it take for them to reach maturity? And what are we looking at for the price of saplings these days? ...

God. This is my first time posting on this forum, so sorry in advance if I mess anything up. This topic caught my eye, so I figured I'd jump in. I've been working in orchards for a few years now, and I have a walnut grove of my own. I've got 200 trees that are about 9 years old and another 300 that are 4 years old. I actually planted these back before there were any government grants or subsidies available for this kind of investment. I spaced the walnuts at 8x8 meters, though looking back, I probably could have gone even wider. I also planted some plum trees in between the walnuts. I plan to harvest those plums for about 15 years until they start competing with the walnuts for space, then I'll clear them out. Last year, I sold a few pounds of walnuts at $12/lb. It seems like small change at first, but it becomes pretty lucrative over time. A price of $12/lb is basically the floor for shelled walnuts on the market, but you can see prices climb as high as $20/lb. It doesn't take much math to see the potential. If 500 trees yield just 1 lb each, that’s 500 lbs times $12/lb, which comes out to $5833. Keep in mind, that's only after the tenth year—it gets way better than that later on. Even if you have a bad year and nothing grows, you still have the value of the timber. A cubic meter of walnut timber goes for about $850, and if you mill it into boards, you can get up to $1,000/m3. With 500 trees at $850 per cubic meter, you're looking at $425,000. I have a steady job, so I have plenty of patience to wait for the trees to mature and pay off. Those 500 trees are spread across about 3 acres.
A Anonymous Veteran
3.6K messages
joined May 2005
#172 ·
cosmicpuma15 said:The cheapest plot I ever saw was around $1,600 an acre... though it sold, obviously.

Thanks for the input.
So, if I'm looking for some decent land right off a main road, I should probably budget somewhere between $3,200 and $4,300 per acre...
Assuming you can even find anything like that out in the Midwest...
Maria Jackson6 Maria Jackson6 Newcomer
1 message
joined May 2007
#173 ·
So, here's the deal
I've got my own little vineyard going, and I've been obsessing over how to design my own wine labels. It’s mostly just for my own stash since my vineyard isn't exactly huge, but I really want that custom look. I've been scouring the internet for ideas, but honestly, I haven't found much that clicks. I was thinking about just designing them myself and printing them out at home, but then I hit a wall—I have no clue what kind of paper I'd even need or if it's actually doable to get a good result in a home setup.
Any advice?👍
Charles Ramos7 Charles Ramos7 Regular
529 messages
joined Jul 2010
#174 ·
Maria Jackson6 said:So, here's the deal
I've got my own little vineyard going, and I've been obsessing over how to design my own wine labels. It’s mostly just for my own stash since my vineyard isn't exactly huge, but I really want that custom look. I've been scouring the internet for ideas, but honestly, I haven't found much that clicks. I was thinking about just designing them myself and printing them out at home, but then I hit a wall—I have no clue what kind of paper I'd even need or if it's actually doable to get a good result in a home setup.
Any advice?👍

You can actually buy pre-cut adhesive sticker sheets. Just design your layout in Word or some business card software, adjust the dimensions to match the stickers, and you're good to go.
Jeremy Fowler5 Jeremy Fowler5 Newcomer
2 messages
joined May 2007
#175 ·
Anonymous said:God. This is my first time posting on this forum, so sorry in advance if I mess anything up. This topic caught my eye, so I figured I'd jump in. I've been working in orchards for a few years now, and I have a walnut grove of my own. I've got 200 trees that are about 9 years old and another 300 that are 4 years old. I actually planted these back before there were any government grants or subsidies available for this kind of investment. I spaced the walnuts at 8x8 meters, though looking back, I probably could have gone even wider. I also planted some plum trees in between the walnuts. I plan to harvest those plums for about 15 years until they start competing with the walnuts for space, then I'll clear them out. Last year, I sold a few pounds of walnuts at $12/lb. It seems like small change at first, but it becomes pretty lucrative over time. A price of $12/lb is basically the floor for shelled walnuts on the market, but you can see prices climb as high as $20/lb. It doesn't take much math to see the potential. If 500 trees yield just 1 lb each, that’s 500 lbs times $12/lb, which comes out to $5833. Keep in mind, that's only after the tenth year—it gets way better than that later on. Even if you have a bad year and nothing grows, you still have the value of the timber. A cubic meter of walnut timber goes for about $850, and if you mill it into boards, you can get up to $1,000/m3. With 500 trees at $850 per cubic meter, you're looking at $425,000. I have a steady job, so I have plenty of patience to wait for the trees to mature and pay off. Those 500 trees are spread across about 3 acres.

I'm actually interested in growing walnuts specifically for the timber. What do you think—are your 9-year-old trees mature enough to harvest, or should you hold off a bit longer?
Henry Newman9 Henry Newman9 Newcomer
2 messages
joined May 2007
#176 ·
Hi there,
I won't go so far as to brag about having read every single post in this thread... but I do have a question.

Lately, I've been seeing a lot of talk regarding bamboo for mass timber construction.

Does anyone know if it’s actually feasible to grow bamboo here in the Midwest? If it is... is there any kind of market for buying it back?
A Anonymous Veteran
3.6K messages
joined May 2005
#177 ·
Jeremy Fowler5 said:I'm actually interested in growing walnuts specifically for the timber. What do you think—are your 9-year-old trees mature enough to harvest, or should you hold off a bit longer?

If you're aiming for high-quality lumber, you're realistically looking at a 25 to 30-year wait. The trick is that the nuts start paying the bills long before the wood is ready; think of the trunk as your retirement fund or some kind of long-term insurance policy. Most people plant these for their kids or even grandkids. There's actually a great book on walnuts you can pick up on Amazon for about $29. It covers everything regarding walnuts and hazelnuts.
Lawrence Price88 Lawrence Price88 Newcomer
1 message
joined Jun 2007
#178 ·
Hi everyone!
Could someone walk me through what kind of equipment I'll actually need to get started with growing and producing hazelnuts?

Thanks in advance!
Dana Robinson4 Dana Robinson4 Active Member
181 messages
joined Jul 2010
#179 ·
http://www.armbell.com/traktori/view...forum=traktori

It seems everyone is preoccupied with those hazelnut orchards lately, though I find myself much more content just picking up my chocolate at Trader Joe's, wouldn't you agree?
velvetsailor12 velvetsailor12 Newcomer
1 message
joined Jun 2007
#180 ·
gentlecanyon65 said:..... so I've been doing some deep thinking and scrolling through a ton of stuff lately ....

The price for farmland out here is actually pretty reasonable, so since I’ve got some decent cash sitting around and I’m definitely not the type to just sit on my ass all day, I started wondering why the hell I wouldn't just dive into agriculture
..... My big idea is to set up some permanent walnut orchards.... once they're established, they don't require an insane amount of daily grind, which means this doesn't even have to be my main hustle, yet it could still pull in some serious profit after a few years.... so my plan is to snag maybe 12 to 25 acres of land and plant a massive WALNUT grove ....

Now look .... I'm no professional farmer, but I know how to handle a shovel, and with a bit of reading and some solid advice, I think I could make it work .... but honestly, I just can't get the math to make sense in my head ....

I heard that USDA subsidies for walnut orchards can go up to about $13333 per acre ....

Come on, let me hear what you guys think about this!!! ☕ 🙄

Walnut prices aren't actually that high right now. Most people plant them more for the long-term value of the trees themselves.
I remember hearing about some legend who planted half of a huge stretch in the Midwest and expects to be sitting on millions in about ten years.
To me, agriculture is a great move, you just really need to get trained and specialize. 👍

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