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Discussion about Ukraine

Started by granitefalcon26 · · 👁 6 views · 36 replies

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Participants granitefalcon26fadedmason3Paul Kern12William Bennett53crimsoncyclist71Sam Alvarez4Frank Moore4Ryan Gomez4Charles Fox10Jerry Rogers6slybison8rustydrifter10Christian Torres3Brenda Cook4Nathan Brooks4Kate Gonzalez11
granitefalcon26 granitefalcon26 Active MemberOP
193 messages
joined Jan 2015
#1 ·
I'm really wondering how long we're going to let Konev get away with trolling and breaking the Reddit rules.
He’s been dropping links to these Russian tests written in Cyrillic over and over again.
1.
2.http://general-ivanov.livejournal.com/2169319.html
3.
4.
5.1.
In these, he's calling Ukrainian soldiers and the legitimate Ukrainian government fascists. Where is Charles Fox10 hiding now??
1.
2.
granitefalcon26 granitefalcon26 Active MemberOP
193 messages
joined Jan 2015
#2 ·
A Reddit user Sorin has decided to jump on the bandwagon, calling the legitimate Ukrainian government fascists.

What on earth happened to this thread?? It’s getting pretty wild.🙄
fadedmason3 fadedmason3 Member
11 messages
joined Oct 2015
#3 ·
I’d like to call out Ringa10, who is being incredibly disrespectful by claiming I’m just talking nonsense.

And then there’s the way he went after american, actually calling him a complete jerk.

It's all happening in this thread where you aren't allowed to say a single word against Putin or the Russians without being immediately swarmed by a pack of regulars—a mindless horde that camps out there 24/7 just to launch these incredibly rude, mob-like attacks.
Paul Kern12 Paul Kern12 Active Member
106 messages
joined Feb 2018
#4 ·
granitefalcon26 said:I am honestly wondering how much longer we are going to allow user Konev to troll and violate the forum rules.
In a series of posts, he keeps posting links to Russian tests written in Cyrillic.
1.http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4563
2.http://general-ivanov.livejournal.com/2169319.html
3.http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4571
4.http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4578
5.1.http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4588
In these, Ukrainian soldiers and the legitimate Ukrainian government are being labeled as fascists. I wonder—where is Charles Fox10 now??
1.http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4580
2.http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4582

Well, the text in those links uses Cyrillic because that is what is used in Russia, and most of them are Russian links. I suppose there is nothing controversial about that?🤷
William Bennett53 William Bennett53 Regular
491 messages
joined Sep 2016
#5 ·
@crimsoncyclist71/">@@crimsoncyclist71, there simply isn't any room on the PŽK for people with zero posts. If you want to air your grievances, you actually have to be an established member first. And if all your contributions were supposedly made here—or if you haven't even started yet—then you're either not a real participant or just some special PŽK clone. Neither scenario is going to fly.

As for everyone else, we can discuss the moderation team if you like, but let's leave Russia and Ukraine out of it. For those topics, please head back over to Politico.
fadedmason3 fadedmason3 Member
11 messages
joined Oct 2015
#6 ·
William Bennett53 said:@crimsoncyclist71/">@@crimsoncyclist71, look, there isn't any room on the PŽK for random people from Reddit with zero posts. If you want to vent here, you actually have to be an established member of this community. If all your contributions were made elsewhere—or if you haven't even started yet—then you’re either a complete stranger or just some specialized PŽK clone. Neither of those options is going to fly here.

As for everyone else, we can certainly debate the moderation team, but let's leave the discussions regarding Russia and Ukraine out of this. For those topics, please head back over to Politics.

My deleted post was specifically addressing the blatant hate speech coming from Konev, providing direct links where he was essentially cheering for liquidations in a total Stalinist fashion and talking about nuclear mushrooms, yet I wasn't sanctioned. So why exactly was my post wiped?

Meanwhile, I see the exact same user calling another member a psychopath in a different thread, and they haven't been carded at all.
crimsoncyclist71 crimsoncyclist71 Active Member
175 messages
joined Aug 2016
#7 ·
My bad. I’ll admit I didn't check the subforum rules before jumping into this thread.
fadedmason3 fadedmason3 Member
11 messages
joined Oct 2015
#8 ·
http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=3281

Take a look at this post by Konev; it is blatantly obvious that he's just trolling at this point, yet it hasn't even been removed despite clearly violating the Reddit rules.

And honestly, neither has this one: http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=2241

I have to ask, why isn't this forumaš being sanctioned at all in this thread?
William Bennett53 William Bennett53 Regular
491 messages
joined Sep 2016
#9 ·
@fadedmason3/">@@fadedmason3, your post was removed because you quoted another thread that had to be taken down. But hey, since you restored the links, there's no harm done.
@crimsoncyclist71/">@@crimsoncyclist71, no worries at all; I figured it was just an honest mistake.
fadedmason3 fadedmason3 Member
11 messages
joined Oct 2015
#10 ·
fadedmason3 said:I’d also like to point out Ringa10, who is being incredibly disrespectful by claiming I’m just spouting nonsense http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4681.

He even went as far as calling the user american "drkatorum" http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4686.

It’s a thread where you aren't allowed to say a single word against Putin or the Russians without being immediately swarmed—pack mentality at its finest—by a horde of those permanent users who camp out here twenty-four hours a day.

So, let me get this straight: calling another user drkatorum—which, by the way, is a direct mutilation of their handle—isn't considered an insult, but merely a minor
pdf rule
violation worth a measly 30 points? And when someone tells me I'm posting stupid garbage
http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4673
, the post is simply left untouched, let alone getting a ban for insults, even though the moderator clearly saw it? Am I supposed to just accept being called stupid without any consequences whatsoever?
Sam Alvarez4 Sam Alvarez4 Regular
303 messages
joined Sep 2014
#11 ·
Paul Kern12 said:The links are in Cyrillic because that's how they're written in Russia, and most of those links are Russian sites anyway. What's the big deal?...🤷

It’s honestly pretty questionable when a commenter clearly doesn't know a single thing about the Russian language or even recognize their Cyrillic script... they have absolutely no clue what the text in that link actually says. Just fire up Google Translate to get an English version, then slap on a headline that only makes sense to them: "take over Peter the Great"... 😂
To be honest, I didn't have a clue what he was even trying to say, even in English...
That wasn't the only one either... though that last one definitely gave me a good laugh!

If you don't understand the language, the alphabet, or even how Google Translate is handling it... just don't post the link! ...
On the contrary...
Let's dive into some Chinese links—which we definitely don't understand. Then, we can throw the titles into Google Translate to see them in Basque... which we also won't know. Just keeping things on topic, day after day, across all these different threads...
Frank Moore4 Frank Moore4 Active Member
195 messages
joined Oct 2008
#12 ·
fadedmason3 said:It’s basically a thread where you aren't allowed to say a single word against Putin or the Russians without being swarmed by this pack of permanent users who camp out there 24/7, attacking you with zero decency.

Exactly. And if you actually call them out by their real names, or try to report their toxic posts, you’re the one who ends up getting penalized while they just keep on spitting venom. 🙄
granitefalcon26 granitefalcon26 Active MemberOP
193 messages
joined Jan 2015
#13 ·
Paul Kern12 said:The links are in Cyrillic because that's how they write in Russia, and most of those sites are Russian anyway. What’s the big deal?🤷

It’s honestly pretty frustrating when people ignore the rules here on Reddit. We have a clear policy about foreign languages: if you're posting links to articles in other languages, they need to be in English. If they aren't, you've got to provide a translation. Otherwise, it starts feeling like we're hanging out on some random Russian forum instead of an American one.
It’s pretty obvious that some people think the Reddit rules don't apply to them, especially since their behavior keeps getting a pass.
Just a heads-up: calling legitimate Ukrainian government institutions "fascists" isn't allowed here either. We've already mentioned that this kind of talk will result in a ban.
granitefalcon26 granitefalcon26 Active MemberOP
193 messages
joined Jan 2015
#14 ·
granitefalcon26 said:I’m honestly wondering how much longer we’re going to let Konev troll the place and ignore the Reddit rules.
In a whole string of posts, he keeps dropping links to those Russian tests written in Cyrillic.
1.
2.http://general-ivanov.livejournal.com/2169319.html
3.
4.
5.1.
He’s even calling Ukrainian soldiers and the legitimate Ukrainian government fascists here. Where is Charles Fox10 hiding now??
1.
2.

granitefalcon26 said:The whole parade has joined in, including reddit user Sorin who is labeling the legitimate Ukrainian government as fascists.

I’m asking the admins to please step in and issue warnings for these posts.
Frank Moore4 Frank Moore4 Active Member
195 messages
joined Oct 2008
#15 ·
I'm jumping on board with what granitefalcon26 said in his appeal.
Paul Kern12 Paul Kern12 Active Member
106 messages
joined Feb 2018
#16 ·
granitefalcon26 said:I am asking the administration to please step in and issue warnings for these posts.

I find myself wondering why everyone seems so worked up—especially since most of you aren't even participating in this thread unless you're using burner accounts, I suppose. 🤷
And if you’re going to demand sanctions against "fascists," then—if we're being consistent—why aren't you demanding them against "Nazis" too?
http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4865

perhaps for those labeled as "brainwashed."
http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=5...postcount=4896

or for the "fanatics." http://www.reddit.com/showpost.php?p=51366036&postcount=4918

and then there are the slurs used against anyone who isn't strictly pro-Ukraine—not to mention the comments about Mexicans.
So, my friends, if you are going to be this zealous about reporting one side, I think it would be much more honorable to report the other side as well. It might actually come across as fair, in my opinion.
Ryan Gomez4 Ryan Gomez4 Active Member
112 messages
joined Feb 2013
#17 ·
granitefalcon26 said:It’s pretty ridiculous how people just ignore the Reddit rules. If you're posting links to articles in foreign languages, make sure they're only in English.The rest needs translating. Right now, this looks more like a Russian forum than an American one.
Clearly, some people think they're above the Reddit rules since everyone just lets them get away with it.

Where does it say that links to articles in foreign languages aren't allowed? It's gotta be in the rules somewhere.

The only rule I could find in the PDF regarding links and foreign language text says:

Article 6.
If you're posting stuff in a foreign language, you have to include an English summary. Just give us the gist in one or two sentences so we know what's going on. If you don't, your post might get nuked.
Links aren't a substitute for actual writing. If you drop a link, you need to include a quick summary—title, gist, or a key quote. Make it obvious why that page even matters to the conversation.
Charles Fox10 Charles Fox10 Regular
352 messages
joined Mar 2009
#18 ·
granitefalcon26 said:The forum rules are being ignored. Links to content in foreign languages should only point to English sources; everything else needs a translation. At this rate, it feels less like an American community and more like some Russian message board.
It seems certain people think the Reddit rules don't apply to them, yet somehow, they're still being tolerated.
Calling legitimate Ukrainian institutions "fascists" isn't allowed here either. Apparently, that's also going to result in a ban.

A colleague already linked the section of the PDF rules regarding foreign languages and links. I’ll just add that it’s worth reading the intro post again—we went into more detail there to make the discussion a bit easier to follow.
The topic at hand involves Ukraine and, by extension, Russia. Given that these aren't exactly English-speaking regions and they don't use the Latin alphabet, things get complicated. Because of that complexity, we've updated the PDF rules. We modified the policy specifically for this thread, since it’s practically impossible to ban links to texts written in Cyrillic.

From the opening post:

If it's a photo, please label it as a photo. If it's a video, call it a video. If you're providing a summary or a key quote alongside an online translation—perhaps via Google Translate—just note that. Also, if any photos or videos contain disturbing content, please give us a heads-up.

Don't bother responding to cardboard posts, and don't waste your breath arguing with gray ones either.

Ladies and gentlemen, you wouldn't believe it, but this thread is actually about Ukraine—not Mexico, the US, Germany, or the Baltic states.

Keep the topics on track. We've been somewhat tolerant up to this point, but let's not push it any further.

Stop throwing around terms like fascism, Nazism, or Chetniks without any actual context. It’s pointless.

Mocking the fallen or inciting further violence will be met with sanctions.
Supposedly, I heard, they claim, word on the street is—they shot down a plane, a bridge, etc. Without any actual links, it’s just trolling by definition. Just be careful.
Respond to an insult with an insult. Provoke a fight (trolling) and/or respond to a provocation with a provocation. Otherwise, all parties involved in such exchanges will be sanctioned, regardless of who started it.
Report inappropriate posts using the icon and then ignore them; leave the rest to the moderators.

We don't moderate based on personal whims, but according to the pdf rule, so why are these discussions about other users open on the PŽK?

One last thing: report improper posts and move on. With a daily flood of posts that can exceed 500, it's simply impossible to see everything.
Jerry Rogers6 Jerry Rogers6 Active Member
223 messages
joined Feb 2014
#19 ·
If I may, I’d like to take this opportunity to ask whether there are any plans in the near future to beef up the moderation presence regarding policy—honestly, it feels like we’re seriously lacking senior oversight at the top right now.

As for candidates, I’d put my money on Division and Žalac.
slybison8 slybison8 Active Member
162 messages
joined Oct 2011
#20 ·
granitefalcon26 With all due respect to you as a fellow Redditor and an online friend, I suppose I will only address your grievances regarding the moderation of Ukraine if the Administration explicitly instructs me to do so, whether that be publicly or through Reddit's internal messaging system.

The reason I feel this way is because you don't actually participate in the Ukraine discussion thread at all. You simply aren't there. Since I started moderating that specific topic more intensively, I haven't seen you contribute even a single post. I suppose my position is that if you aren't active in the Ukraine thread, you shouldn't be making such detailed objections, let alone demanding that another Reddit user be sanctioned—especially when that person is actively contributing to the conversation unlike yourself.

However, I suppose your objection was further elaborated by... Sam Alvarez4 I suppose I should acknowledge the active Reddit user participating in this discussion regarding Ukraine; I am taking their objection into account and consider it to be quite legitimate.

Sam Alvarez4 said:It seems rather questionable that this commenter possesses neither a grasp of the Russian language nor an understanding of their Cyrillic script, seemingly having no idea what is actually written in the text they linked. I suppose they just ran it through Google Translate and then composed a headline that only makes sense to them: "take over peter the great." 😂
To be honest, I don't think he has any idea what he actually wrote, even in English.
That wasn't the only instance, I suppose. However, that last one was probably the only thing that actually gave me a good laugh.

If you don't actually understand the language you're linking to, nor the script it uses, or even the specific language that Google Translate is targeting, I guess it might be best not to post the link at all.
I suspect the opposite might actually be the case.
I suppose we could just start dropping links to Chinese sites that none of us can actually read. Then, maybe we could try using Google Translate to turn those headlines into Basque, which I guess we don't understand either. It would essentially be a constant stream of various topics being posted day after day.

Now that you have provided such a detailed explanation of everything happening, I suppose some things are starting to feel a bit more clear and logical to me as well. 😁

I believe Konev has been cautioned on several occasions, both by myself and by other colleagues, regarding the necessity of providing a brief explanation alongside any shared links. It seems necessary to clarify what content is actually hosted on the destination page, particularly in instances where the link leads to a site written in a foreign language.

I suppose I didn't quite realize that Konev might not be proficient in the languages used for the links he posts; perhaps he is simply churning them out to keep the discussion moving by relying on Google Translate. 😁

I suppose I simply couldn't have conceived of such a thing, as my own mind has never quite operated in that manner, and it seems I wasn't even capable of imagining that anyone else's brain might function that way.

I suppose I will perform some additional technical verifications regarding the claims you have made. If those checks happen to confirm what you have said—and I am starting to think that might actually be the case, as I have had my own lingering doubts about those posts for quite some time now—then Konev will find himself facing a significant issue. If this accusation turns out to be true, I would likely view it as a very serious violation of the Reddit rules, perhaps even as a deliberate attempt to manipulate the discussion.

Before any concrete actions are taken or any final decisions are reached, I suppose it is only reasonable that Konev be given an opportunity to clarify certain matters—though, for that to happen, we likely have to wait until his temporary suspension from the platform ends.

I suppose I should thank you for your contribution to the discussion regarding Ukraine, as well as for pointing out this particular occurrence which—I really must emphasize—if it proves to be true, would constitute an incredibly serious violation of the Reddit rules and the established customs that govern our conversations here.

PL

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