Interesting read... totally worth checking out

It’s an interesting point—mostly because I was starting to think I was just imagining things, or that I was the one who was actually out of the loop and failing to grasp reality... then this article surfaced on the front page

I don't get it either, but honestly, it's still an upgrade from five or ten years ago. I'd much rather see Elemental and Ramirez pull off a joint show for a crowd than have Time being pushed on every street corner as this top-tier, high-quality band.

Interesting point, and you're spot on. That goes for both the audience and Mocvara. As for the crowds, I think they'll always be like that—just easily swayed by whatever the media pushes—and I guess that's just how it is. Regarding the other part, I've been thinking the same thing for a while now, but every time I bring it up, people try to tell me I'm wrong. Turns out, I was right all along. 😢

Fair point, but that’s just how the social machine works. The promoters putting on an Elemental or Ramirez show are going to pack the arena and pull in $17 per ticket—plenty of cash to keep the whole cycle spinning. Meanwhile, if you’re booking someone like Tiger Beer, you aren't filling seats, and you'll be lucky to clear $6.75 a head, which barely scratches the surface of the production costs. I know, I know, I probably sound like some grumpy old guy shouting at clouds, but the whole capitalist setup is basically designed to prevent anything from changing the status quo.

The text is a bit (okay, a lot) overblown—I wouldn't even call it anything less than crude.

First off, the people putting up posters don't actually make that little. In a city like Chicago, doing this is practically a full-blown profession for about 20 different people. So, sorry, but while they might earn the same as everyone else, they work far fewer hours than most employees and usually do it whenever they feel like it. Very often, these poster crews end up better off than the concert promoters themselves, yet here they’re being described like cotton pickers working for plantation owners.

Second, an Elemental and Ramirez co-headlining show doesn't share much in terms of musical programming, but since they're both under the same booking agency, it makes sense. I highly doubt either of them could sell out The Factory on their own. At the end of the day, look at our college spring break festivals—you've got hip-hop, rock bands, and DJ sets all on one bill, and nobody describes that as "low-tier" crowd draws. No sane person views that as some weird fusion of styles.

As for Mocvara, I think they put on a solid program. If some journalists can't wrap their heads around why Mocvara isn't running an Attack show, that's their problem. In emergency situations—which is what you get with an outdoor venue—opening acts usually get cut, especially when a concert strictly has to wrap up by 11 PM, not just because Mocvara feels like it. The reporter fails to mention the crowds swearing because they were stuck waiting at the entrance for two hours. Let’s be real: those people showed up to hear let 3, and if they were given an extra hour of opening act after waiting two hours in line, I doubt they’d be thrilled. Again, we're talking about an emergency situation; it's not like Mocvara runs outdoor shows every single day, so of course things didn't go perfectly. Given the circumstances, they either did what they did, or they could have shortened let 3's set to squeeze in the openers. Mocvara chose the former. It reminds me of the last time I saw The Ramones at Aquarius; the show had to end by midnight, and Transistor was supposed to open for them. However, there was a bomb threat, the entire club had to be evacuated, and it took over an hour to get everyone back inside. As a result, Transistor only played two songs instead of six. In that situation, you simply couldn't play more.

All this talk about Vesna Pisarovic sounds like nothing more than the journalist's conspiracy theories and Russians in his head (c) by leb ...

That’s a great read, though I really feel the need to set the record straight regarding Stephen—the sub-groups actually decided against playing at the metal swamp, though honestly, they probably wouldn't have anyway since everything had become such a drag 😁
As for Ramirez and Elemental, I think I'd much rather sit through some decent country music than endure bad urban tracks 😈

banderas said:Regarding Mocvara—I believe their programming is high quality. If certain journalists can't stop whining that Mocvara isn't Attack, that’s their own damn problem.

Look, my take is simple—Mocvara’s programming is steadily declining. It has less to do with actual quality and everything to do with the bottom line. That’s their choice, and I respect it—but it's still a choice. As for that journalist in question, I’m certain he isn't losing any sleep over the fact that Mocvara has abandoned its roots. They aren't running a show like Kseta anymore; they're running something much more like Attack.

Mocvara used to actually have a decent lineup. Now? It’s been two years since I even bothered to step foot in there. Maybe if they had something happening at KUM 😬

Basically, it’s just the same old listening rooms over and over, plus the occasional concert where the band has already played the same set twenty times. I'm just not feeling it. I could go on about it, but honestly, why bother? Since I feel the need to vent my disappointment though, tomorrow I'll 😁

I'm with you on the Mocvara thing—it’s a shame, I guess. 😢

Tyler Grant86 said:And regarding that specific journalist—honestly, I’m certain he can’t complain that the swamp isn't running a lineup similar to Kset anymore instead of an Attack one...

He took the words right out of my mouth. 😁

banderas said:The text is a bit (okay, a lot) overblown—if I don't say something even harsher.

First off, people who put up posters don't actually earn nearly as little as you'd think; there are about 20 of them in Chicago making it a legitimate profession—so, sorry, but despite the "equal pay" argument, they work far fewer hours than most employees and usually just whenever they feel like it. Very often, those poster crews actually fare much better than the concert promoters themselves, yet here they’re being described almost like cotton pickers working for plantation owners.

Secondly, the joint concert featuring Elemental and Ramirez doesn't have anything in common programmatically, but both are under the same talent agency—and frankly, I doubt either of them could fill The Factory on their own. At the end of the day, even at our university freshman week, we have everything from hip-hop to rock bands and DJ sets, and nobody describes that as "lowering the standards" for the audience. No sane person would view that as a fusion of styles.

As for the swamp, I think they produce a quality program, and if some journalists can't complain that the swamp isn't an Attack venue, well, that’s their problem. In emergency situations—and since this was an outdoor show, it was exactly that—opening acts usually get cut, especially when a concert strictly has to wrap up by 11 PM, not because the swamp wants it to. The journalist doesn't mention at all the swearing from people who waited two hours at the entrance, and let's be real, those people came to hear let 3; if they were given an extra hour of opening acts after waiting two hours, I doubt they would have been thrilled. And again, I'll repeat, this was an emergency situation—it's not like the swamp holds outdoor concerts every single day, and naturally, things didn't go according to plan. Given the circumstances, they could have done what they did, or they could have shortened the let 3 set to allow the openers to play—the swamp chose the former. It felt similar to me during the last Partibrejkers concert at Aquarius; the show has to be over by midnight, and Transistor was supposed to open for them. However, there was a bomb threat, the whole club had to be evacuated, it was only repopulated after more than an hour, and the result was that Transistor played only 2 songs instead of 6; in that kind of situation, playing more simply wasn't possible.

As for these theories about Vesna Pisarovic, I think they are just the journalist's conspiracy theories and Russians in his head (c) by leb ...

banderas, no offense intended, but once again, you've completely misinterpreted the situation. Freshman weeks are organized to entertain the broad tastes of a large number of young people, not to elevate consciousness about "the scene" or promote someone's specifically defined musical style. On the other hand, the paragraph about the poster crews is a sort of metaphor and serves as an introduction to criticizing the state of the concert scene and as an illustration of the conflict between the "big players" and the "small guys." As for Vesna Pisarović, writers, journalists, and essayists have been using the method of exaggeration for centuries to express their passionate disgust and contempt for a particular issue. Lastly, but certainly not least importantly, let 3 proved to be total trash in this situation, and dear people, the great altruists and enthusiasts from the swamp—much like following certain newfound habits—simply shrugged their shoulders to the sound of Prljin and Mrletov's garbage truck. This isn't the swamp I used to know. Goodnight and sweet dreams.🙂

Mocvara is just a glorified old swamp.... You really have to ask yourself why, out of all the original founders of URK, the only ones still active are the Matosic family and that guy from the forestry department? I'll give you the answer that the street level is shouting, and if you look at their actual program, it's pretty obvious: it’s basically just a private club for those specific families. 👋

boldscout72 said:The guys in let 3 acted like total trash during this whole thing, while those self-proclaimed big-hearted enthusiasts from Močvara just shrugged their shoulders—basically following the lead of Prljin and Mrletov’s garbage truck.

If you ask me, it’s a complete joke 😈 — Mrle va Haag!
(And he might just drag en faca down with him, too 🙂 )

What an absolute clown. What a complete moron. His supposed "facts" and whatever "insight" he thinks he’s providing in this article are buried under such a layer of the most obnoxious, sticky, and malicious garbage that it's actually impossible to read. 🙄

Douglas Barnes13 said:Man, what a joke. What an absolute moron. He tries to sprinkle in some "facts" or whatever insight he thinks he's providing in this article, but it's all just buried under such a thick, sticky layer of pure, unadulterated malice that you can barely even get through it without feeling gross. 🙄

So, care to actually back up those claims with a little bit of logic?

silvereagle132 said:Mocvara is nothing more than a glorified, old-fashioned swamp...

👍

The writing here feels incredibly forced, almost like a high school assignment penned by some pretentious teenager who just can't get over the fact that a club—oh, heaven forbid—actually wants to turn a profit...

Look, our music scene isn't perfect; it has its holes and its flaws, and personally, I think the idea of pairing Elemental and Ramirez together is pretty lame, but hey, I hate to be the one to say it—but we live in the real world...

The commercial scene is never going to function quite like the alternative scene, nor vice versa, and honestly, it’s perfectly normal, even desirable, to have both existing side-by-side...
It is completely standard that Tiger Beer doesn't get the same level of hype as let 3—so let's all just sit here and weep because Močvara isn't treating them with the exact same reverence as let 3 🙄.... and shall we throw stones at Močvara just because they want to sell tickets? As if an outdoor let 3 concert is organized out of pure altruism or a selfless desire to promote unproven indie bands...

Give me a break... grow up, author!
And please, spare us the cheap sentimentality, like that bit about Vesna Pisarović appearing on posters for Močvara....

Just as it is normal for there to be both mainstream and independent cinema, it is equally normal for there to be this kind of music and these kinds of clubs... and let us have our Best and Kseta... you have every right to visit one and skip the other, don't you?

Goldberry, 🙏

Spot on. 👍

Maria Peterson said:And of course, it’s perfectly logical that Tiger Beer (never heard of them, I admit) doesn't get the same level of worship as let 3—let’s all have a good cry about how the swamp isn't treating them with the same reverence as let 3 🙄....

I happen to be one of those people who showed up at the swamp and spent two agonizing hours waiting in line just to get through the entrance.
If, after that long wait, the opening act had rolled out onto the stage instead of let 3... the swamp would have been all over the local news by the next morning.

Are we actually debating the lineup for the swamp, the chaos of let 3, someone slapping up posters, or just the fact that Elemental and Ramirez absolutely rocked The Factory?
Or maybe we’re just dissecting the writing style over at Icon?

The writing here is a joke. From what I can tell, everyone's just arguing about 😁

The posters, Let 3, Elemental, or Ramirez—none of that matters. The point is, the whole thing turned into one massive dumpster fire. 😁

Maria Peterson said:So, Best and Kseta are both looking at us... I guess it’s your call whether you want to show up for one or the other—or neither, really. It's your right, isn't it?

Totally. Now, I guess you'd have to count how many clubs in America are actually like Best—and then see how many are more like Kset. That’s really the whole point.

Ipanema said:I was one of those people who showed up at Marsh—standing there with a massive crowd, just waiting around the entrance for two hours.
If those opening acts had actually walked out on stage instead of Let 3 after all that waiting—man, I guess the Marsh would’ve been all over the local news by the next morning.

A few of us headed over toward the Marsh, but once we heard there wouldn't be any opening acts—well, we just turned around and called it a night. 🙂 Who's actually looking out for us? I guess. 🙂 😁