#1 ·
I posted this over on the Religion board, but I ended up having to walk my "wild scientist wife" through the exact same argument after she started giving me these totally dogmatic answers to some philosophical and epistemological questions.
I felt like this leaned more toward philosophy. Perhaps some actual philosophers would want to dive into this, offer their own commentary, or maybe provide a much stronger argument for accepting "reality" than my simple shrug of "we can't escape it anyway, so why bother?"
My hidden motive? It’s probably just so I always have a link to this thread ready to go whenever someone tries to call me a "scientific dogmatist" or something along those lines.
I mean, something is definitely there. 😉
Why bother drowning in complex math and graphs that don't even apply here, when you could just use pure logic?
Let me expand on that a bit: Nothing. There isn’t any concrete evidence to suggest that... What’s up? It’s entirely possible—everything we experience could just be a simulation, something straight out of The Matrix. My "brain"—and I put that in quotes because we can't even be certain if what we call a brain actually exists in the way we think—might simply be receiving sensory inputs that my... Consciousness. It’s one of those big, heavy concepts that we all experience every single second, yet most of us can't even begin to define it. What actually is it? Is it just a byproduct of neural firing in the brain, or is there something deeper at play? I find myself wondering if we're truly perceiving reality, or if we're just interpreting a very limited version of it. Is consciousness the driver, or merely a passenger? Whether we call it a program, the mind, or the soul—whatever it may be—we tend to interpret this as "the real world," even though that might not be the case at all. Is it possible that everything I perceive is simply my own imagination? It’s a valid question. Everything, absolutely everything. What exactly am I experiencing? It feels like I’m tapping into other "consciousnesses"—different minds that I believe I'm communicating with—and they all seem to be sharing this same illusion with me. But here’s where things get complicated...
Since these illusions are constant—and since there’s really no way out of them unless I decide to "terminate" my own consciousness—I simply treat them as a permanent fixture of my reality. Something real. (Since I can’t even begin to wrap my head around what a "true" reality might actually look like). In other words, if there is no way for me to break free from this universe, dimension, simulation, or whatever this headspace is, then isn't it only logical that I start acting as if this is all there is? Reality? How can one even begin to function within that? Reality? Based on the data currently available—assuming this upcoming "information" doesn't introduce any contradictions—everything remains consistent. This holds true for me and for those other minds I might still only be imagining. After all, they represent constant truths, much like the laws of gravity, thermodynamics, or evolution.
What happens when I run into a contradiction? Or better yet, what's my plan for when new information comes my way that completely challenges what I thought I knew? Is it steady enough? Should I start treating them as if they were actually real? The evidence. If I can’t find any other way to explain something besides calling it "divine intervention"—regardless of which deity we're talking about—then I’ll have to look at it, accept it as new data, and label it as reality. But there's a catch: for me to truly accept it, that force has to be as constant and predictable as gravity.
Since I’m fully aware of my own mental limitations, I can just tuck them away in a drawer. It lets me speak plainly, without all those constant "ifs," "buts," or the constant need to add disclaimers and asterisks. There's really no point in trying to shatter the illusion anyway. The real question is: are you aware of the boundaries within your own mind and consciousness? Or, if you happen to be just another facet of my own psyche—has that part become self-aware yet?
"Reality is nothing more than a very consistent illusion." — Albert Einstein
And that’s exactly why I can. It’s only logical. One could argue that consciousness exists—if nothing else, there is this singular awareness that I am a part of, the very thing through which I perceive my own existence.
This was just a little exercise in solipsism—and a study in how pointless such things can actually be. Reinstalling. Why ask a question like that when you've already provided an answer? Or at least, until some new information comes along to contradict everything we thought we knew. Once you can get past that hurdle, then maybe we can actually have a real conversation about the nature of consciousness—the kind of consciousness we believe surrounds us—and its overall consistency.
And if that still doesn't cut it, please just go ahead and kick the bucket 🙂 so you can haunt me as a ghost to prove there's actually some other dimension out there—though, since it would really just be another part of my own consciousness, I don't think I'll have much of a conscience about it. 😁
I felt like this leaned more toward philosophy. Perhaps some actual philosophers would want to dive into this, offer their own commentary, or maybe provide a much stronger argument for accepting "reality" than my simple shrug of "we can't escape it anyway, so why bother?"
My hidden motive? It’s probably just so I always have a link to this thread ready to go whenever someone tries to call me a "scientific dogmatist" or something along those lines.
I haven't seen any posts from r0nin yet. Is there something specific you'd like me to address? kaže:
Can someone provide a mathematical proof that consciousness actually exists? I want more than just theory—I want you to measure it. Give me a specific numerical value and map out exactly where consciousness is located on a spatial diagram... right this second.
Without any actual evidence, what you’re laying out here is nothing more than pure speculation. Isn't it just guesswork at this point? 😉
I mean, something is definitely there. 😉
Why bother drowning in complex math and graphs that don't even apply here, when you could just use pure logic?
Let me expand on that a bit: Nothing. There isn’t any concrete evidence to suggest that... What’s up? It’s entirely possible—everything we experience could just be a simulation, something straight out of The Matrix. My "brain"—and I put that in quotes because we can't even be certain if what we call a brain actually exists in the way we think—might simply be receiving sensory inputs that my... Consciousness. It’s one of those big, heavy concepts that we all experience every single second, yet most of us can't even begin to define it. What actually is it? Is it just a byproduct of neural firing in the brain, or is there something deeper at play? I find myself wondering if we're truly perceiving reality, or if we're just interpreting a very limited version of it. Is consciousness the driver, or merely a passenger? Whether we call it a program, the mind, or the soul—whatever it may be—we tend to interpret this as "the real world," even though that might not be the case at all. Is it possible that everything I perceive is simply my own imagination? It’s a valid question. Everything, absolutely everything. What exactly am I experiencing? It feels like I’m tapping into other "consciousnesses"—different minds that I believe I'm communicating with—and they all seem to be sharing this same illusion with me. But here’s where things get complicated...
Since these illusions are constant—and since there’s really no way out of them unless I decide to "terminate" my own consciousness—I simply treat them as a permanent fixture of my reality. Something real. (Since I can’t even begin to wrap my head around what a "true" reality might actually look like). In other words, if there is no way for me to break free from this universe, dimension, simulation, or whatever this headspace is, then isn't it only logical that I start acting as if this is all there is? Reality? How can one even begin to function within that? Reality? Based on the data currently available—assuming this upcoming "information" doesn't introduce any contradictions—everything remains consistent. This holds true for me and for those other minds I might still only be imagining. After all, they represent constant truths, much like the laws of gravity, thermodynamics, or evolution.
What happens when I run into a contradiction? Or better yet, what's my plan for when new information comes my way that completely challenges what I thought I knew? Is it steady enough? Should I start treating them as if they were actually real? The evidence. If I can’t find any other way to explain something besides calling it "divine intervention"—regardless of which deity we're talking about—then I’ll have to look at it, accept it as new data, and label it as reality. But there's a catch: for me to truly accept it, that force has to be as constant and predictable as gravity.
Since I’m fully aware of my own mental limitations, I can just tuck them away in a drawer. It lets me speak plainly, without all those constant "ifs," "buts," or the constant need to add disclaimers and asterisks. There's really no point in trying to shatter the illusion anyway. The real question is: are you aware of the boundaries within your own mind and consciousness? Or, if you happen to be just another facet of my own psyche—has that part become self-aware yet?
"Reality is nothing more than a very consistent illusion." — Albert Einstein
And that’s exactly why I can. It’s only logical. One could argue that consciousness exists—if nothing else, there is this singular awareness that I am a part of, the very thing through which I perceive my own existence.
This was just a little exercise in solipsism—and a study in how pointless such things can actually be. Reinstalling. Why ask a question like that when you've already provided an answer? Or at least, until some new information comes along to contradict everything we thought we knew. Once you can get past that hurdle, then maybe we can actually have a real conversation about the nature of consciousness—the kind of consciousness we believe surrounds us—and its overall consistency.
And if that still doesn't cut it, please just go ahead and kick the bucket 🙂 so you can haunt me as a ghost to prove there's actually some other dimension out there—though, since it would really just be another part of my own consciousness, I don't think I'll have much of a conscience about it. 😁