The Armada

@Lawrence Walker27/">@@Lawrence Walker27 You've still got a few games left to play, but who cares.
Back in '96, we weren't even in your league, but now? We're out here holding our own on equal ground. Sometimes we take a hit, sometimes you do. Nobody stays undefeated forever.

edit..

I remember last year’s little mini-tournament down in San Diego. It was wild—you had California playing in the finals against the local crew, and then Cleveland fighting for third place against the coastal team. There were about 30 Hell-raisers showing up to the party, but you wouldn't know it because there wasn't a single sign of the Navy anywhere.

Hell... I have such great memories tied to those guys... Back in '96, that train trip from Denmark down to Miami was easily the most alive I’ve ever felt on a rail line... There were about 15 of us crammed in that space near the restroom, and five of them were Hell... man, the constant, non-stop howling and laughing from them was just unreal... we had this Hajduk fan from N. Gradiška we practically rescued from freezing to death, some boys from Krapina who actually convinced themselves they were part of the conductor crew, some random guy who spent half the journey hiding in the bathroom before we even realized he was in there, my own group of friends, and the Hell crowd, all fueled by endless amounts of bamboo... honestly, it was pure 🙏🙏🙏🙏

🙏Sending love to the guys wherever they ended up 🙏

Zachary Morris9 said:Even last year during that little mini-tournament down in San Diego—you know, when the California team was playing in the finals against the Navy crew, and Cleveland was battling it out for third place against the Atlantic squad—there were maybe 30 Hell-raisers showing up, but you wouldn't see a single sign of the Armada. Not a trace.

From what I gathered, there were maybe 15 or 20 people total at that little tournament on Sunday...

mellowhawk34 said:@Lawrence Walker27/">@@Lawrence Walker27, you’re still missing a few matchups, but whatever.
Back in '96, we were nothing to you guys, absolute nobodies. But now? I’d say we’re finally standing on level ground. Sometimes we take the hit, sometimes you do. Nobody stays invincible forever.

edit..

Look, back in the day, we were total trash compared to you guys, but over the last five or six years, the whole vibe has shifted. There’s actual mutual respect now, and honestly, having more equal powerhouses in the MLS is just better for the whole scene.
mellowhawk34 pretty much nailed it. The bottom line is that Hell and the Armada are playing on the same level now, and nobody's untouchable. No point in overthinking it anymore. ☕

Kenneth Campbell64 said:we were nothing compared to you guys, but things have shifted over the last five or six years. There’s mutual respect now, and honestly, having more equal groups in the MLS is just better for our whole scene.
mellowhawk34 wrote that the bottom line is this: Hell and the Armada are on level footing now and nobody is invincible anymore, so there's no point in overanalyzing it. ☕

And how exactly are the Armada and Hell "equal"? Is it because our younger crew took a beating in San Diego? Look, we’re a group that used to be respected all across the former Yugoslavia—one of the top five groups out there. We were the ones sparking those legendary riots at Maximir, we were the first ones to snatch a banner from the Delia at Marakana, and we’ve pulled away with thousands of people for away games. In San Diego, we showed up with 800 to 1,000 people three different times, and for the last thirteen years, we haven't dipped below 500. We introduced the double-spear flags, we’ve thrown flares by the hundreds, we traveled through Europe with the US national team, and we once took over twenty banners from the Torcida. We even went after the Kohort when they were stuck in that first police station downtown. From 1996 to 2002, we were easily the best group in the country, all while our club was fighting for its very survival more often than it was fighting for the championship. Back in '96, Cleveland couldn't win a game for six months straight; we’d lose 3-0 to Hajduk, and we’d still be singing non-stop with a hundred flares in hand. In '99, we lost 3-0 to Partizan—1-6 on aggregate—and the entire stadium was chanting the exact same song for forty-five minutes straight. I could go on forever; if I actually started listing examples, this entire forum wouldn't be big enough to hold them. In all the thirteen years I've been following Cleveland, we haven't missed a single away game, except for that one time when about 150 people, protesting a massive blowout with management, skipped the trip to Vinkovci and headed to Washington, D.C. instead for a handball match where Ćo_ _ _ _ slapped Boxsa right in the middle of the arena (though I think a car still made it to Vinkovci that day). Even now, the Boysi ask me about that old crew—Lju_ _, Mi_ _, Ši_ _i, and the rest—who between 2001 and 2004 couldn't pass through Washington, D.C. without causing some kind of chaos. It was like back in 2002 before the game against dinamo K_ _ _ , when fifty guys led a march through D.C. and just slapped whoever was in their way. That crew knew how to take a hit, but people definitely respected them.

In my opinion, Hell might be among the top six groups in the US today, but you guys are nowhere near our level. I mean, you guys end up in Luxembourg in the middle of a work week during peak tourist season with over 200 people, and that’s even when we aren't at our best. Sure, the truth is the Armada can't just stroll through San Diego like I did back in 2004, walking to the game with Bartić and a buddy, wearing scarves and carrying a banner in our bag, but your original crew hasn't even gone head-to-head with our younger generation when we’re at full strength (around 20-25 people), let alone against our older members. Plus, in the last five or six years, you've bolted ten minutes early from Cleveland alongside the national team twice.

Lawrence Walker27 said:You really think the Navy and the Equal Rights Movement are on our level just because our younger crew took a beating in San Francisco? Give me a break. We’re talking about a group that was respected across the entire former Yugoslavia—easily top five. We’re the ones who caused those legendary riots at Yankee Stadium. We were the first ones to rip a banner down from the Maracanã while the Yankees fans watched in shock. We’ve pulled away thousands for away games, and back in San Francisco, we showed up with 800 to 1,000 people three different times. For the last 13 years, we haven't dropped below 500. Ever. We used to roll with flags on dual spears. We’d pull off pyrotechnic shows with over 200 flares. We traveled through Europe backing the US. We snatched over 20 banners from the Fandom. We even stormed the Cohort when they were stuck in that first police station downtown. From '96 to '02, we were the undisputed best group in the country, all while our club was fighting for its damn life just to stay relevant instead of fighting for titles. Remember 1996? Cleveland couldn't find a win for six months straight. We’re getting thrashed 3-0 by Hajduk, and what do we do? We chant non-stop with a hundred flares going. Or 1999? Getting crushed 3-0 by Partizan, losing 1-6 overall, and the entire stadium is singing the exact same song for 45 minutes straight. I could go on forever; this whole forum wouldn't be big enough to hold all the examples. In the 13 years I’ve been following Cleveland, we haven't missed a single away game. Well, except for that one time when 150 people skipped the trip to Indianapolis to head to Chicago for a handball match instead—you know, the one where Unknown slapped Boxer around the arena? (Even then, I bet at least one car still made it to Indianapolis). To this day, the Boysi ask me about those old crews—Unknown, Unknown, Unknown—who between 2001 and 2004 couldn't pass through Chicago without causing absolute mayhem. Like that time before the game against Dinamo Chicago in 2002, when 50 guys rolled through the city and slapped anyone in their path. That crew knew how to take a hit, sure, but man, did they command respect.

In my book, the Demons are easily one of the top six teams in the country right now, but let’s be real—you guys aren't even in our league. We’re pulling in over 200 people to head out to Luxembourg in the middle of a regular work week during peak tourist season? And that’s even when we aren't even playing at our best! Sure, maybe the Navy doesn't get to roam around San Francisco quite like I did back in '04—back when I was walking to the game with Bartić and a buddy, scarves around our necks and banners tucked in our bags—but your old-school crowd hasn't even gone up against us younger guys when we're all together, and don't even get me started on how we handle the veterans. Besides, in the last five or six years, you guys have practically bolted from Cleveland ten minutes before the whistle twice now. What happened to that toughness?

Look, man, you’re living in the past. Seriously, get a grip—you can't pay the bills with "glory days" and old reputations. You think people don't remember? Just tell me one thing: who exactly was standing there by the Walmart or over at Monte Carlo when you guys got absolutely laid out in both those fights? Don't even try to pull that crap about everyone being just some "kids." We all know exactly who was there. It’s better to just be honest for once and own up to what happened instead of spinning these fairy tales about being teenagers. I mean, how are you gonna claim the oldest guy was only 24? We all know the exact birth dates for every single one of those 35 people. And please, stop with the pathetic stories about how you were actually protecting people from the Demons. It's embarrassing. 🙏Seriously, what else could we possibly be missing? A few heavy hitters to actually show up? Let me say this one more time: I’m not talking about the 90s. I’m talking about the last five or six years where we haven't won a single damn fight. We started failing right from that ridiculous "friendly" match between Uljanik-Rijeka 2003 and Milwollov—if you know, you know. And don't even get me started on everything leading up to Monte Carlo. Honestly, why bother even mentioning it? You guys didn't even show face for the last two friendlies against them!

Kenneth Campbell64 said:Man, you’re living in the past, and honestly, you can't pay the bills with old glory. Just tell me straight—who actually showed up at the Walmart or at Monte Carlo where you guys caught hands in both those scraps? Don't try to sell me that line about everyone being just kids; we all know exactly who was there. It’s better to just be honest and own it than to make up these fairy tales about "kids" when the oldest guy was supposedly 24 (even though we could pinpoint anyone's exact birth date out of those 35 people if we wanted to). You're spinning stories about being protectors alongside the Demons 🙏, which is even worse because, frankly, we were already short on heavy hitters as it was. I’ll say it again: I’m not talking about the 90s; I’m talking about the last five or six years where you haven't won a single scrap, starting from when things were nothing more than Milwollov's balls (that friendly Uljanik-Rijeka 2003). Anyone in the loop knows exactly what I’m talking about, and don't even get me started on Monte Carlo—you guys didn't even show up to the last two friendlies between us!

I am not living in the past. I was one of the first to take the Demons seriously, mostly because our scene isn't what it used to be. Back in the day, maybe a few hundred people would show up to wait for the Fandom in Cleveland, but nowadays, with so many fans following the bans, a tight-knit group of forty people who actually know each other and stick together can easily be at the top when it comes to fighting. You keep harping on about how old everyone was, but let me ask you: out of those 35 people, who was actually older than Ž_ _ _t, who was born in '84? Take, for example, the guy you guys beat on the ground; Pa_ _ _ doesn't even travel for away games, and before that San Francisco trip, he probably hadn't been anywhere for two or three years. He's 24 at most, but he looks 15. Then there are at least ten guys people told me were there that I have never laid eyes on. You had guys like Č_ _ _ _ who was 24, I_ _ _ _ _ who was 23, and Z_ _ _ who was 22—they're the core crew—but I'm certain nobody was older than Ž_ _ _t. As for the "protector" thing, I know that kind of stuff isn't foreign to you. How do I know? Well, I was once heading back from an away game and got stopped by a San Francisco resident near Chicago. We started talking, he asked where I was coming from, and he ended up telling me that while he doesn't go to matches, he once jumped a Cohort group alongside the Demons (I think it was at the station). The guy is a security guard and trains kickboxing. From what he said, it sounds like there were a few other random dudes like him who have nothing to do with the Demons. As for what happened at Monte Carlo, I don't know; I wasn't there. Again, our main fighting squad of 20-25 hasn't even crossed paths with your primary group yet to see who's actually tougher. At Monte Carlo, there were ten guys from that crew, but the heaviest hitters were missing. And we couldn't make the friendlies once because of the national team, and the second time I'm not sure, but look, we aren't obsessed with you, and you aren't obsessed with us. It's hard to motivate people—especially the older guys—to show up to matches that happen on a weekday around two or three in the afternoon.

Lawrence Walker27 said:Look, I’m not stuck in the past. I was one of the first people to actually take the Demons seriously. Our scene isn't what it used to be when a few hundred guys would show up in Cleveland just to wait for the Fandom, you know? Nowadays, you’ve got these organized groups—groups of forty guys who actually know each other and travel together constantly—who can easily hold their own in a fight. You keep harping on about how old everyone was, but let me ask you: out of those 35 guys, who was actually older than the guy born in '84? Take that guy you guys beat into the pavement, for instance; he doesn't even travel for away games much. Before that San Francisco trip, he probably hadn't been anywhere for two or three years. He's maybe 24 at most, but he looks like he's 15. And honestly, there were at least ten guys people claimed were there that I’ve never even laid eyes on. You had guys like the 24-year-old, the 23-year-old, and the 22-year-old who are the core crew, but I’m telling you, nobody was older than the '84 kid. As for the security detail, I know you guys are familiar with that setup. How do I know? Because I was heading back from an away game once and got picked up by a San Francisco local near Chicago. We started talking, he asked where I was headed, and he ended up telling me how he doesn't usually go to games, but he once jumped a Cohort group alongside the Demons (I think it was at a train station). The guy’s a security guard and trains kickboxing. From what he told me, there were a few other lone wolves like him who have nothing to do with the Demons. I don't know about what happened at Monte Carlo; I wasn't there. Again, our main heavy hitters—the 20 to 25-year-olds—haven't crossed paths with your original crew yet, so we'll see who's actually tougher. There were ten guys from that group at Monte Carlo, but the heavy hitters were missing. One time we didn't show up for a friendly because of the national team, and another time... I don't know, but we aren't looking for trouble with you guys any more than you are with us. It’s hard to motivate people, especially the older guys, to travel to games that might involve the Demons, especially when they fall on a weekday around two or three in the afternoon.

There were definitely more guys over 25, unless they all faked their birthdays to look older ☕. Regarding the Cohort, there were three clashes during the Uljanik-Osijek quarterfinals, and if I remember right, two games during the Pula-Osijek match. Honestly, I don't know who you're talking about, but I guarantee you that at Monte Carlo, it was strictly DP92 members. So, your main crew wasn't even at Monte Carlo. Who was it that you saw near Walmart? Probably the same guys who rarely travel for away games, right? Come on, man, what exactly do you mean by "older"...

You two are gonna regret this constant back-and-forth, seriously! My suggestion? Why don't you just grab a slice of pizza somewhere and hash it out like adults instead of acting like this?👍,Is Istra actually playing down in San Francisco now, or are we heading over to Kantrida?

Just having a regular conversation with the guy, even if we don't see eye to eye on everything—that’s what this forum is actually for, right? ☕ Regarding the match against Hajduk, here's how things stand: it's being played at Kantrida, and the DP92 crew isn't budging an inch on our stance.
THE FOOTBALL FEDERATION ARE TOTAL LOSERS, YOU COMPLETELY SCREWED THE SPORT!

I mean, honestly, can these clowns over at the Football Federation actually start serving the sport for once? Instead of just constantly whining and making life difficult, they’re already back at it, claiming games are going to be held at Kantrida—as if we haven't heard this nonsense before. Someone actually had the guts to say that these absolute bottom-feeders running the Cup are basically meeting their requirements on a damn cow pasture, and hey, I guess Istria doesn't meet their "expert" standards today, as per usual!🤷

I honestly don't get who thinks it's a good idea to play out in Cleveland with maybe 300 or 400 people watching. If the Football Federation actually gives a damn about the sport, they’ll just let the match happen in San Francisco instead...

There’s no way we’re seeing just 300 people because there’s gonna be at least 500 of us showing up, though I wouldn't push it past a million unless you count all those bandwagoners who care more about Hajduk than their own damn club, and honestly, there are enough of those losers around here to fill an entire stadium if you really think about it!😍

@Kenneth Campbell64/">@@Kenneth Campbell64 and @Lawrence Walker27/">@@Lawrence Walker27, quit bickering already. Neither of you is actually listening because your minds are already made up, end of story.
@ER, let me be clear: since 2000, there hasn't been a single conflict where we weren't backed by Demons. Sure, some people only show up for home games or hit a couple of away matches a year, but they aren't kickboxers or fighters.
The truth is, there are people in this group who train in all sorts of sports but you're the one showing up to every single game.

All this back-and-forth and you listing out names of your own people? It’s just going to get you in trouble with the cops.

And regarding your little rant about being the first to accomplish things back in Yugoslavia—honestly, you can't live in the past forever.

mellowhawk34 said:@Kenneth Campbell64/">@@Kenneth Campbell64 and @Lawrence Walker27/">@@Lawrence Walker27, seriously, just stop fighting. Neither of you is actually going to listen to a word the other says because you've both already made up your minds, and that’s that.
@ER, look, I can tell you right now, in any clash since 2000, there hasn't been anyone involved who wasn't a Demon. Sure, you have people who only show up for home games, or maybe hit a couple of away matches a year, but they aren't kickboxers or some kind of combat athletes.
The reality is there are guys in this group who train in all sorts of sports but you're the one showing up to every single game.

And honestly, all this bickering and you listing out names of your own people... it’s just going to get you in trouble with the cops.

Also, just to touch on your little comment about being the first ones to do this or that back in the Yugoslavia days—for real, you can't live in the past.

I don't know why everyone is getting so worked up, acting like we're out here trying to kill each other. I was just trying to set the record straight because the way the Demons were portrayed online regarding that 13 to 11 score made it look like a win when it wasn't. We weren't even arguing; I actually took some of his points into account, and he did the same for me.

Do you honestly think some dumb cops are going to figure out people's identities based on a single letter? Besides, most of those incidents are ancient history anyway.

As for that kickboxer guy, let me tell you what a friend of mine actually said to me.

I stumbled upon this great piece on an old Navy forum once (back when you guys were all giving me grief about living in the past). It’s meant for the younger kids in the group to help them carry the name with some dignity, and for the older crowd to stir up some memories:

Lately, over the last few weeks or months, I've been scrolling through all sorts of posts on this forum and reading comments from just about everyone. But honestly, very few of them actually know anything about the Navy or the history surrounding our formation since the official start. There’s way too much mindless chatter and not enough actual facts.

The Navy was officially founded in '87, sparked by that trip to Podgorica when our bus headed out for the Cup, but the group had really started coalescing a year before that. We spent a few months debating what to call ourselves... until one rainy day when Rauher and I were walking home from school, stopping in front of the local radio station on the way toward what was then the legendary Cleveland, and Rauher just dropped the name "Navy" on me.

Who was there, and how did things stand between us and "them"... Back in Cleveland, we had fans from the legendary Rubes, but the first time the younger generation really organized—the traveling, the banners, the whole scene—was around '86 when this intense sense of pride for the city and this region finally woke up. And if you were there, you know the names: Shark, Max, Donkey, Rauher, Fucak, Svenda, Miro, Misel, myself, Coro, Ricardo, Pupe, Guzo, Ante Grm, Crveni, Javor, Brother Mitar, the crews from Potok, G. Vezice, Skurinja, and then in '87/'88, Smajla, Kospic, Zuna, Marin, and plenty of others whose faces I can still see perfectly clearly... Did they all love Cleveland? Yes. Did they all support the team from birth? No. There were a handful of guys who suddenly found their roots and flipped their loyalty overnight, while others later turned into die-hard Chicago fans... So, that brings us to the whole saga of our relationship with "them." In the old days, the first big organized group was the Fandom, and they started off with a lot of nonsense. Our relationship with them was fine until that infamous match at Kantrida. I was down in San Francisco a few times back then, hanging with Ice, Camil, Bebeli Joso, Mis, who were all part of that younger crowd alongside Morrison, Armando, Parangal, and those other few jokers. Armando was actually the leader of a certain group once, and when he climbed up on a pole wearing camo pants, the entire North Stand just stood there listening...
That’s how the Navy vs. Fandom rivalry kicked off, and it burned out fast...

The Fandom used to bring the flares, so most of the heavy artillery used in the 80s could be credited to their mom and a few students from the islands who were studying here in Cleveland. Mate actually got hammered by the cops after the Cup in Belgrade because he didn't bring enough flares... Mate worked at Victor Lenc, which is where he got his knack for stuff, but he was also a total jerk who worked for the cops, which led to me meeting one of his buddies—that tall, dark inspector who eventually got replaced by Bozo in the 90s. The real issue was that two nights before the Cup, Martin and I, along with the Drenov boys, swiped 60 flares, 30 rockets, and 20 smoke canisters from the harbor for the trip to Belgrade. A chunk of it went up in flames right at the train station in Chicago. If you want to know how bad it looked, the Chicago locals and the Chicago fans could tell you themselves... the entire train car was engulfed in fire from the moment we entered until we left the city. That was the Fandom for you; they aren't around anymore. But getting back to the Fandom... everything was cool until that game in Cleveland, then Armando and his crew got all stuck-up, and well, you know the rest. The collective trips to Belgrade stopped, the fan scene fractured, and we ended up feeling like "us against the world"...

Setting aside Cleveland and the Navy for a second, but keeping it relevant to all of us... the relationship between the Fandom and the BBB back then revolved around Ice and Parangal. Ice was, and remains, the most famous Chicago fan ever, but he was a total traitor to his own people and the cops, so the Fandom gave him hell and banned him from coming to the stadium. I think he's pretty much persona non grata in Chicago now too. As for Parangal, he took a hit from Zaret and his crew, and that was pretty much the end of it. We never really liked the Chicago fans particularly much; most people saw them as just another version of the Belgrade crowd. They weren't really a presence in Cleveland, and matches were always high-voltage... The first massive clash in the old days happened
against them, including the longest flare display in history. Flares were going off for 35 minutes in the first half and another 42 or 43 in the second. The West Stand was lost in smoke and flame like nothing you've ever seen. The weekly news reported it all, though the final score ended up being 0:0... Meho had been walking around town three days before that game looking like a butcher in a white apron, and in Chicago, the crew consisting of Konj, Stariji, Mitrovici, Zganja, and Ostoja was out in full force.
Man, it was wild back then—just a bunch of rebels and about 500 of us, so honestly, the vibe stayed solid... I remember after that game in Cleveland, an American news van got absolutely trashed (first time you ever saw something like that in the old US territories), and me and Misel just sat there watching the chaos unfold like a scene from *The Godfather*... We only really played nice with the Chicago crowd when we faced those triple-threat teams in places like Ljubljana or Chicago, but I can get into that later... As for the rival factions—we were just 9 guys facing off against the Stars and somehow pulled off a 2:3 win; Mladenovic bagged two goals while they just crumbled, and we were out there lighting flares... Later on, they actually showed up in Cleveland to buy flares from us, and their ultra leader was running the chants; those guys had Pampia and Zareta, and since Pampia’s old man used to be a high-ranking police inspector, he acted like he owned the place, but after that Dinamo match in Cleveland, about 130 of us headed down to Chicago, and after the game, under heavy pressure from Svende, Pampia ended up beating his own people and used Zareta to "escort" us all the way down to Indianapolis... we made it back bruised and battered... just how both sides
used to deal with each other in Cleveland, everyone knows that, and they even talked about it themselves in the papers, which I think appeared in our local news too...

People talk on this forum about the crews and the individuals who defined that era and shaped the generations to come, but if you ask me, there wasn't one specific "crazy group" from our side because the sheer numbers were insane and everyone was fired up; you can't really single anyone out, though at the same time, amidst everyone else, one name always stands out: Magarac...

Everyone knows where we headed in '91, and everyone knows that the largest number of volunteers for the service came from Cleveland, and everyone knows that the Navy was the first crew to head out there. War changes everything and it takes a lot away... Magarac died for that spirit, for the music, and for the Navy, because when Mitar tried to take his own life, Magarac lunged to grab the rifle and
things went south fast; he turned the barrel on himself and left us forever... There just weren't people like those guys, or groups like them, in terms of what they sacrificed for the Navy, for Cleveland, and for America, and I honestly don't believe we'll ever see a crew like that again.
Magarac was the very first one to hop the fence at Yankee Stadium to grab a banner, which kicked off the whole thing with Kospic, Smajla, and the rest of us, and you can find the rest of it on old VHS tapes and in the archives... In Cleveland or anywhere else, he was always the first one through the door, and he was even one of the first to get a Navy tattoo... He was a true legend, a real one, and it's rare to find someone who could ever live up to him.

As for the Navy or being patriotic, or who lives in Cleveland, I couldn't care less, because anyone who actually saw what our scene was really about knows exactly what the Navy represented.

mellowhawk34 said:@Kenneth Campbell64/">@@Kenneth Campbell64 and @Lawrence Walker27/">@@Lawrence Walker27, seriously, just cut the crap and stop fighting. Neither of you is actually going to listen to a single word the other says because you’ve both already made up your minds, end of story.
@ER, let me set you straight: since the year 2000, there hasn't been a single conflict where we weren't backed by Demon supporters. Sure, maybe some guys only show up for home games, or they hit a couple of away matches a year, but those guys aren't kickboxers or MMA fighters. They're just fans.
The reality is, there are people in this group who train in all sorts of sports but they still show up to every single game.

And all this back-and-forth bickering, plus you calling out specific names of your own people? That’s just asking for trouble with the cops. You're basically handing them a roadmap.

Also, just to touch on that little comment about how you guys were the first to do this or that back in the Yugoslavia days—look, I respect history, but nobody lives in the past.

Look, man, let's drop the fighting. If you ask me, this was actually an interesting debate, even if we did get a bit too bogged down in the weeds without trying to provoke each other.
You know what kind of situation I'm dealing with right now, so bear with me if my thoughts are coming out a bit scattered. 🤣

Kudos to the facts laid out by Lawrence Walker27, because let's be real, a huge chunk of those old-school legends used to hang out in the local fandom back in the day... honestly, looking at the name East River, I’d bet anything you’re from the Susak area, so why on earth don't you have any love for Orijent? It’s common knowledge that the North side never really had much going for them and you guys never fielded a squad worth respecting, though I'll give credit where it's due to the individuals👍

You’re bringing up those so-called Boxers from the Demon again, and honestly? I think that’s a hell of a lot more honorable than the pathetic little groups you guys have loitering in front of buildings. If you’ve spent any time hanging out near Vegas, you probably know exactly who I’m talking about, because even though I can't stand those Chicago fanatics, what they do is actually respectable for any sane fan or decent human being—unlike the absolute bottom-of-the-barrel trash you guys pull.👎