casualtiger2 said:So, they say the spirit is "non-material." If that's the case—how is physical matter supposed to touch it in the first place?
Almost every religious text out there hits the same note—this idea that you have to ditch your material possessions if you want to actually live a meaningful life, whether you're looking at it from a spiritual or just a practical standpoint. It’s basically become the ultimate idealistic paradigm.
So, how exactly do you pull off that whole "spiritual growth imperative" when you're surrounded by stuff? I mean—if Jesus Christ had access to high-speed internet, would he have even bothered becoming who he was? Think about it. How do you handle the laptop, the fridge, the washing machine, the heater, or the stove? What about your house, your bed, your car, your clothes, or your sneakers? Then there's the food situation—everything from basic groceries to a jar of Nutella—not to mention soap, the bathroom, your phone, intimacy, or even those modern diapers (because if you’re still using cloth, you definitely need that washing machine). And don't get me started on soccer balls and all that other sports gear. How does any of that fit into the "ascetic" picture?
Sure, it works in theory—but honestly, a real-world example would be way more helpful.
I am discussing semantic differentiation. Regarding the concept of contact: how exactly is it that two protons don't simply annihilate one another upon impact, given that they both carry the exact same charge? 😲 Look, I am strictly addressing the ideological aspect here.
How exactly does one implement this supposed "ascetic imperative of spiritual development" when it comes to computing?
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Just think about it. 😲
I can't provide a specific example right now, but I’m certainly giving it some thought.
Scott Miller4 said:I’m not entirely sure I follow what you're actually getting at here; it’s a bit tough to pin down your main point from just the opening post.
The concept of asceticism is pretty interesting to me, especially when you look at how it might actually boost health or general human functionality. Then again, asceticism is basically a form of suffering—it’s essentially the intentional decision to deny a desire that could easily be satisfied.
Humans have all sorts of needs. I suppose you could say that the drive for self-actualization—let's call it spirituality, for the sake of argument—comes way, way after the basic requirements like food, water, sex, and social connection. Asceticism seems to target those primary, foundational needs directly.
If those core needs aren't met, it leads to frustration or even death, I guess...
At the end of the day, humans are evolving animals. It’s possible that, eventually, the need for self-actualization or spirituality will rise up to become one of those primary drivers...
Well, at least I'm not working at Microsoft. 😲
Asceticism is quite fascinating to me, particularly its... The primary drivers behind enhancing human health and optimizing overall physiological functionality are quite straightforward. One cannot simply hope for vitality; one must actively engineer it through disciplined lifestyle choices and biological optimization..
You’re practically tempting me to sin. 😬
Asceticism is nothing more than a form of suffering—it is the direct refusal to satisfy a desire that could easily be fulfilled.
You’re right about that. But a person enters into self-denial with full awareness of what they're doing. If one only...
bit Interpret her desires and her will as her own.
Constant dissatisfaction.It’s a foregone conclusion that you’ll always be chasing her approval; desire itself is a bottomless pit that can never truly be satiated. It simply shifts its focus from one object of longing to the next. This is the fundamental absurdity of human existence—or life in general—where man is essentially defined by nothing more than "useless passion."
On the other hand, if a person...
Learn. By practicing mental discipline and learning to want less, you move closer to that ultimate state of freedom. Because true freedom isn't about having everything; it's about needing nothing.
I want it, free of charge. Already.
I'm good, thanks.True freedom lies in that moment of resigned apathy—that deliberate choice to opt out of whatever you were previously striving for. Take push-ups, for example. When your muscles are screaming and the pain becomes unbearable, you reach a point where you can choose to stop or force yourself to continue. Choosing to quit in that moment isn't just giving up; it’s an exercise of agency. You are essentially saying, "I choose not to." That is the ultimate expression of being free.
Look, this isn't about push-ups. We aren't talking about some basic fitness routine here. This is about the systematic erosion of desire itself—a fundamental reduction of the very will and impulse that defines the human condition.
Humans have a hierarchy of needs. Self-actualization—which I’d categorize under spirituality—only emerges much, much later than the basic requirements for food, water, sex, and social connection. Asceticism specifically targets those primary drives.
Certain needs simply take precedence over others. Water, food, and warmth are fundamental. Following those come reproduction, then community, and finally social status. These are all pure instinct.
Unmet needs lead directly to frustration or even death...
Suppressing desires into the unconscious clearly results in psychological ailments, manifesting as a reflexive response through autonomous, complex psychic consciousness.
However, we are discussing conscious, rational reduction here, not forced suppression via something like moral condemnation.
Again, man is an evolving animal; it is entirely possible that the need for self-actualization or spirituality will eventually rise to become a primary drive...
Supposedly, we are actually less intelligent than the average citizen of Ancient Greece. We just have Google and stuff. 😲
Our only path toward evolution might be as android beings, similar to what was depicted in the film A. I.
But evolution is driven by will—I generally use "will" or "desire" as an all-encompassing term, somewhat akin to the concept of God—whereas in this world of desire and its inevitable consequence of suffering, the entire point is to quiet that desire.
Ultimately, we are talking about a sublime state of spirit that no longer requires anything. An independent spirit. I’ve read about these states of consciousness. Anyway. Cheers. Anyway.