Posts by shadownomad4

Michael Moore3 said:I’ve looked into this quite thoroughly, trying to approach it without any judgment or doubt, just coming from a place of wanting to truly grasp what you're getting at

but honestly, all I see is a narrative that mirrors our own discussions here so closely that it feels as though you might have picked up certain threads from a guru and woven them into your own story

I’m also not buying what they're selling, mainly because that show where the guru was featured seems to have this odd habit of charging for God's word... for instance, in one episode discussing Messianic Jews (those who recognize Jesus as the Messiah), they were advertising this new "Power Bible," which was supposedly "free," yet you had to "donate" $5 just to cover production costs to actually receive it
for comparison, groups like the Rosenkreuzers share their teachings quite freely without demanding a fee to access their wisdom
generally speaking, any knowledge that comes with a price tag tends to be worthless to me

It is with a heavy heart that I have to admit you haven't convinced me, especially since it seems this particular guru hasn't actually read every religious text if he managed to skip over the Bible... it also appears his meditation was aimed at triggering specific feelings, which misses the whole point of meditation; those emotions are really just distractions that get in the way of true insight, and focusing on them only slows down the process

What matters to me is that you have heard the Truth, and it will find its way to your heart.

It is no coincidence that you noticed the similarity between me and that man. That is precisely why I sent you this clip, which I watched for several hours just before you did (please, believe me for my own sake, not yours, as I have nothing to gain from this). God is not a matter of coincidence; He works by aligning these things for us.
I leave you in peace and faith, trusting that you will become convinced of Him, just as both of us have in this instance.🙂

Michael Moore3 said:So, it seems it was actually possible to experience the Holy Spirit before Jesus arrived.
I suppose you can rationalize it however you like, though you seem to be admitting that Jesus' teachings aren't the only path to "heaven." If those leaders truly carried the Holy Spirit within them, wouldn't that make them teachers as well, given their success in spreading God's doctrine?

"Quote:"

Not knowing the Law doesn't really give you a pass when you go out and break it. That goes for human laws, sure, but it’s just as true for God's.
So, there’s actually a way to live in accordance with the law even if you haven’t been formally introduced to the Gospel. Those are the other truths I’ve been mentioning—the kind that don't strictly require a teacher for us to eventually grasp on our own, though having one around certainly makes the journey a bit smoother.

Well done.
You're only looking at it through that rigid lens because you've basically anchored yourself so firmly to the Gospel that you refuse to acknowledge anything else.
The answer you're looking for is that the Gospel isn't the only truth out there; if you look closely, it's pretty obvious there are plenty of different paths and truths to find.

See, I find myself agreeing with this entirely, though I wouldn't include "Satan" or your "Holy Spirit" in the equation, but rather the Ego and Divine energy
since I am quite aware of how vital faith is to manifesting what one perceives...

Whoa, hold on a second! 😲
Are you truly suggesting you are so pure and worthy that you can act as a mediator between someone—in this instance, me—and God????

"Greatness" is perhaps a term reserved for the naive who follow him. To me, he isn't great...
it reminds me of a curious fact I read recently, where for nearly a century, people believed humans had 24 pairs of chromosomes, even though many knew there were actually 23 pairs—it was even visible in early chromosomal photography—but no one dared to contradict the "great" scientific authority who discovered them and miscounted...
it goes to show how relative "greatness" can be... much like your "teacher" who took material things from you in exchange for giving you something "spiritual"

Just remember that you were the one who came to us here, not the other way around. How is it that you weren't able to simply ignore us?

No matter how you choose to spin it,
how on earth could you possibly know enough about me to even attempt a comparison?

And my friend Michael Moore3, you have misunderstood me.

Look, Jesus is the sole mediator between God and humanity, and all you need to do is invite Him into your life. If He is as real as I have been telling you all this time, He will prove it to you. That is how it works. Until then, here are the testimonies of a guru who did exactly that and was followed by 400 disciples. Please watch until the end; it is quite fascinating to see how Jesus entered his life, and how He eventually came to the disciples and told them that everything he had taught them up to that point was a lie.

http://www.godtube.com/view_video.ph...171cca8f8dbc5f

Sean Kelly52 said:🙂Look, the Father is LOVE. He loves all of us and actually enjoys our differences because that's how He made us, right? He’s a Father who loves us endlessly and watches over us no matter who we are or where we end up. He even loves our little games. At the end of the day, we're His children, aren't we? Everything else is just us doing our own thing. Satan (the EGO) is nothing more than something living inside our own heads.
Just chill out, man, and stop stressing so hard. There's no need to go around trying to save everyone. Everything happens for a reason and it's all good exactly as it is. 🙂

That is a very accurate way to view Hell, and it is exactly how Roman Catholics think. One day, they will all be caught off guard because they failed to take what Jesus told them seriously, and by then, there will be no chance left to change their circumstances.

Just imagine being stuck in a state of permanent unchangeability forever, with no end in sight. It’s a terrifying thought, isn't it? That is precisely why I am shouting it from the rooftops.

Kimberly Evans said:

shadownomad4:
You can go through all the motions and do everything Jesus commanded, but if you aren't doing it under His guidance—meaning, guided by the Holy Spirit—then you aren't actually a child of God. Essentially, being a child of God means you have truly accepted Jesus as your Lord, your Master, and your Savior...

But look, shadownomad4, according to what the Bible actually says, simply performing actions and declaring that they were done in the name of the Lord isn't some kind of guaranteed ticket to Heaven. 🙄
..they'll say: "Lord, didn't we perform miracles in Your name? Didn't we cast out demons?" And I'll have to tell them: "I never knew you. Get away from me, you evildoers."

If you live with the mindset that there is only one earthly life to get through, you can certainly lead a righteous life within the boundaries of whatever religion or doctrine you've adopted. And hey, if that path happens to align closely with seeking Jehošua, then it’s a pretty good way to live, I suppose. 🙂

That is correct. You can certainly act in Jesus's name, but naturally, those actions lack efficacy if you lack the power of the Holy Spirit to heal—especially if they were performed without His guidance. 👎 Jesus stated, "...for you did not do the will of my Father." This implies that we, as Christians, must remain in step with the Holy Spirit and act according to His will rather than our own impulses.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

If we assume that God shows mercy to those who have never heard the Gospel, then we run into an insurmountable logical problem. If people who have never heard the Good News are saved... then we ought to ensure that no one ever hears the Gospel. In that scenario, preaching the Good News to someone who will ultimately reject it becomes the worst thing we could possibly do, because they would then be condemned. People who don't hear the message of the Gospel must be condemned; otherwise, there is no motivation for evangelism. Why would we expose people to the danger of rejecting the Good News and facing condemnation—when they were previously saved simply because they had never heard the Gospel?
I copied this to save time, but I agree with everything written here.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

I am not forcing you; perhaps that is just how it appears to you. However, having witnessed so many testimonies from people who have returned from Hell and Paradise, this conviction within me compels me to shout the Truth from the rooftops. Time is short, and the day is coming when there will no longer be any opportunity for salvation. If you disagree with me and refuse to accept anything I say, then please, just ignore me; I have nothing against you. I also know that it takes immense strength to tear down what Satan has spent years building within a person, and that process is painful until the old is destroyed and the true path is rebuilt.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

I do not respect anything that comes from the devil. If I were to respect paths that do not lead to Jesus, I would be suggesting there are multiple ways, and there are not.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

I didn't say "not even close to me" to elevate myself; I said it to describe how fiercely I used to oppose this science. I trust I am being clear.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

Of course they weren't; the leaders were guided by the Holy Spirit.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

A person possesses free will and acts by deciding which thoughts to follow and which to reject. Thought precedes action. A person without the Holy Spirit stands no chance of resisting Satan because they lack His power. You can possess a strong character and resolve, and you can succeed in doing so; furthermore, if you believe in what you are doing, you will find even greater success, as faith serves as the channel through which spiritual things materialize into the physical realm. Again, why would you care about earthly success when eternity is guaranteed? The only question is the destination you have chosen through your own free will.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

Satan gained authority over the earth the moment Adam and Eve sinned. He holds that authority today, but he has no authority over those who are in Christ. Yes, God is omnipresent, but His power manifests only where there is a conscious Christian serving through the Holy Spirit in the way He intends—and that is always for the good of the people. The issue is that there are very few Christians today filled with the power of the Holy Spirit, and consequently, God reveals Himself less on earth. Essentially, just as God gave us free will, He does not manifest His presence without our invitation, which must, of course, align with His perfect will as revealed in Scripture.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

Yes, because there is Absolute Truth.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

That is a deception from Satan. No one can approach God without an intermediary because your spirit isn't pure enough to stand before His holy presence. You would simply burn up if that were the case; however, since God knows this, He does not enter someone else's life without the Holy Spirit acting upon a person, serving as a mantle for us, through which God sees us just as He sees Jesus himself. Don't take this too literally. Therefore, the devil won't say, "Hey, it's me, not God," but rather he convinces you that it is Him and that you are "blessed."

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

It was like that for Maharishi, who is still cited today as a great figure in that field, but since that dream has passed, I am no longer interested, thank God.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

I won't, nor is it my intention to linger here.

Michael Moore3 said:But what about the people who live in total harmony with themselves and nature, folks who have never even heard of Jesus? Are they not "children of God" either? You still find tribes like that out in the remote islands of the Pacific Ocean...

Why are you trying to force me to accept your "God"? Where does this urge come from—this need to pull me, or anyone else, into this shared "holiness" with you? If you're really a follower of Jesus, then you should know He never used force; He simply shared the truth, and the truth was what drew disciples and followers to Him...
Can't you see that you're making a mistake here?

Just respect other people's right to choose, even if their choice looks wrong to you. Just respect it...

The ego—or Satan, if you prefer—is pushing you to act superior to me, but if that makes you feel better, I'll gladly concede that you have more "experience" than I do, whatever it is you think you gained from it.
because, as I've mentioned before:

So what about the people before Jesus? What about the people in the Old Testament? Moses? Were they ALL under Satan's control?

But where is the actual "person" in all of this? I mean, if you claim that a person receives thoughts either from the Holy Spirit or from Satan... then where is the individual? What even is a human being? Are we just robots being steered by these "forces"? Where does free will fit in?
plus, how can such a person do anything of their own volition that isn't pleasing to God if they seemingly can't help themselves because Satan has taken hold and is controlling them...
I honestly don't see how you can't hear how untrue that sounds...

Go ahead and give me a clear answer on this:
If God is supposedly everywhere and in everything, where exactly is He when Satan is busy pulling the strings and leading people straight into hell? Does He just hide away, or is He simply sitting back and watching the whole thing unfold in silence?

It’s basically just saying that things are what they are, and if they weren't, they would be, but since they are, well, they simply are—because that's just how it goes.
And most of what you say sounds exactly like that...

Thanks, but I don't really feel the need for some middleman to petition God on my behalf when He’s already providing me with direct insight myself.

Any knowledge that comes with a price tag is essentially worthless.
If your "teacher" was actually asking for money to pass on their wisdom, then they were never truly connected to spirituality in the first place; it’s hardly surprising you're dismissing other traditions when you haven't even been granted any real insight.

Please, spare me the comparisons between your little "insights" gained from paid meditation sessions and the truths I am discussing, because they don't even exist in the same universe.

Based on what I've gathered from books on the subject, various distractions like feelings of euphoria or supernatural abilities can arise during the meditative journey toward enlightenment, but they are merely things that pull a practitioner away from the true path of meditation...
It's quite clear that your perception of meditation is fundamentally flawed.

Yes, that was revealed to me. As for meditation, I have never experienced it in its full capacity because it operates strictly on a psychological level rather than a spiritual one. The spiritual plane is where one communicates with God; the psychological level remains confined to the mind and one's emotions.
🙂

Sean Kelly52 said:Yeah, buddy, you went way too far with that fanatic, closed-minded attitude.
Both mistygull16 and Michael Moore3 really tried to help you out, so I won't bore you by repeating everything they already said—I'm with them 100%.
I want to touch on this last point: laying on hands. It's funny you didn't even mention Reiki—that technique the Catholic Church loves to bash.
At the end of the day, it's always about ENERGY—God's energy—whether we're talking about laying on hands, bioenergy, or Reiki (which is also laying on hands). And here's a little reality check: if you want to permanently heal someone using any of these methods, your heart has to be totally pure. Every single cell in your body needs to be overflowing with pure love and compassion. When that happens, you don't even need to invoke anyone's name. At that point, you become like Jesus = Buddha = Krishna = Babaj and all those other enlightened masters who, in some other reality, are working together for ALL of us through their endless love. They don't care about sorting us by race or whatever group you belong to. If you were actually connected to Jesus Christ, He wouldn't let you spit on everything else, and He definitely wouldn't let you threaten everyone who isn't ready to follow your specific interpretation of the Bible.
I'm probably a lot older than you, so I'll give you a tiny bit of advice: work on yourself, and you'll see that all of this looks completely different than how you see it now.
Take care🙂

God is exclusive, and what kind of Father would He be if He ignored the sacrifice of His Son and allowed things to be done in other ways that He performs through the Holy Spirit—which is only possessed by those who have accepted Jesus? That power (strength) you refer to as "energy" is what I have always called strength. The trap lies here: the force (energy) used in all various healing techniques originates from the spirit of dark forces, yet it feels remarkably similar to the power of the Holy Spirit. This leads everyone to believe they are the same, when they are not. With dark forces, the stronger demon displaces the weaker one, and when it comes to healing someone, the spirit of sickness displaces the spirit of religiosity through an action that is felt energetically (the religious spirit is that which acts through all techniques and devotions that do not act exclusively in Jesus's name). This is because such a spirit will lead a person to Hell forever, which is Satan's ultimate goal. It may grant you health or material blessings (did the devil not offer Jesus dominion over the whole world, implying the devil is the master on earth for those not with Jesus?), providing earthly comforts for the rest of your life, only to leave you facing unimaginable torment for all eternity.
The devil imitates God, and one must be extremely careful to recognize him. I will say it again: only when you possess the Holy Spirit do you receive the gift of discerning spirits. Otherwise, you have no idea what is actually happening to you, even while you think you do. This is based on my own experience.

Anything that is not done in Jesus's name is not from God, but from the devil! Amen.

mistygull16 As stated by:
Question for shadownomad4
How many years have you been practicing meditation—if I recall correctly, you mentioned Transcendental Meditation—and just how consistent has your practice been?
I believe we all understand that one size doesn't fit all when it comes to spiritual practice; as human beings, our needs are inherently diverse. If a particular technique isn't resonating with you, it simply suggests a need for a different approach—it doesn't mean the original method was flawed. In your specific case, it seems your inclinations might lean more heavily toward the bhakti component, which would naturally call for meditative techniques that align with that devotion. However, I must offer a word of caution: what is most likely to distance you from God is your own exclusivity.
Let me try to illustrate this point by sharing a story.
There was once a student who was taught by his guru that God resides within the heart of every living being, and he was instructed to live his life in accordance with that truth. This sentiment echoes the teachings of Jesus, who pointed out the hypocrisy of anyone claiming to love God while failing to love their neighbor. After all, how can someone claim to love a God they cannot see if they are unable to show love to the person standing right in front of them?
There was once a student who lived strictly by the instruction to honor every living creature, believing that God resides within every single heart. On one occasion, he traveled into a bustling city, only to find the streets deserted. People were fleeing in terror because a massive elephant had gone rogue, charging through the streets and demolishing everything in its path. Despite the chaos, the student remained unmoved. He ignored the frantic warnings of the locals, refusing to seek cover simply because he held fast to the conviction that God dwelt within the heart of that very elephant. The citizens continued to shout at him, pleading with him to get out of the way before the beast reached him, but he found little reason to listen to mere mortals when his Teacher had already declared that God is present in all things. Ultimately, his unwavering devotion offered him no protection. When the elephant finally closed the distance, his singular focus proved useless. As it turned out, even the elephant seemed amused; it appeared quite content to find that it wasn't the only mad thing in town—there was now a student even more irrational than itself, standing his ground against a rampaging beast.
What else could one possibly expect? Our naive little student barely managed to escape with his life before fleeing in a rage to his teacher, demanding to know why he had been told that God resides within all living things. He was, quite understandably, livid after the ordeal he had just endured with that elephant. To this, the teacher simply replied that he had failed to recognize God in the very people who had tried to warn him, choosing instead to acknowledge the divine only through the lens of a maddened elephant.

Common sense always takes precedence over written doctrine; that is where true wisdom begins.
The concept of scripture is fundamentally irrational; it is nothing more than a mechanism for exclusivity.

I’ve been dedicated to this practice for two years now, only missing a single evening because something urgent came up. I have always been an incredibly disciplined student, and my goal was to move on to the advanced course, but at the time, I simply didn't have the funds to make that happen—you might be familiar with the Flying technique. It was honestly discouraging to realize I needed to shell out $1,100 just to advance my spiritual journey when I was so hungry for growth. In reality, though, I’ve learned that chasing spiritual phenomena is a distraction. Miracles, whether they seem to come from God or from the devil, don't actually lead us closer to Him. What truly matters is a devotion to the truth; once you establish that, everything else naturally follows. Don't fall into the trap of thinking a Christian can't have profound spiritual experiences at a higher level, or that someone can only experience out-of-body sensations through meditation. I have had those experiences myself, as have many of my friends who remain open enough to receive them, and such moments are never without purpose. However, that sensation itself isn't the ultimate goal, nor is anything similar to it. The true objective is His presence through the Holy Spirit—a state where you can simply sit in one place for hours, abiding in Him, and receiving everything you need directly from the Lord.

The fundamental difference is this: when you walk with Him, you have the absolute certainty that you are on the right path. He is the only one who declared Himself to be the Way. When you operate through Him, you carry His power within you; you lay hands on the sick in His name, and they are healed. But after you meditate, you find you can no longer simply lay hands on the suffering in some arbitrary name just to see what happens—you can only look upon them with compassion, realizing you have no power of your own. Now, go ahead and try to tell me that "bioenergy" is a viable alternative. I’ve actually practiced it myself; I worked with people and they genuinely felt better, right up until the moment the illness struck them again. Because they had relied on a mere energy rather than a Name, they had nothing to stand against the sickness when it returned, leaving them without healing. It simply doesn't work that way. Attempting to heal through such means only breeds dependency on the practitioner instead of reliance on God. The ultimate goal for any Christian is to help others become self-sufficient—to ensure they are reliant solely on God, rather than on any mere human being.

I am quite far from there, my apologies.

Michael Moore3 said:Perhaps I haven't offered anything entirely novel, though it seems you've only just begun to grasp these concepts through Jesus' teachings—likely because they come in a much more "appealing" package.
Realizations like these are similar to learning to view each new day as a gift; some people don't start doing that until a tragedy strikes and forces their eyes open, while others arrive there simply by observing the flow of life. I wonder which of them has "better" or more "correct" understanding? Or perhaps, in the end, they both understand just as deeply.

The issue is actually that I am NOT contradicting you; rather, I am pointing out that we are discussing the exact same thing, just using different terminology—you call it by your terms, and I call it by mine. There is no fundamental difference in our interpretations, except that I recognize we are talking about the same reality, whereas you stubbornly insist yours is the only true version.
You see, these are those many truths I have mentioned before; they are like colors in a spectrum... all of them constitute a single truth, but the distinction between your color and mine is merely a matter of hue. Furthermore, I acknowledge your color (if you look closely at my posts, I have never claimed Jesus was wrong), yet you refuse to acknowledge mine, insisting instead that ONLY Jesus holds the truth.

Regarding the idea of "helping" someone: I am not trying to help you, nor has that ever been my intention. I am simply dismantling the prejudices you’ve voiced to everyone here. I am not attempting to defend what you attacked; I am merely asserting the Truth regarding what you attacked.
On the other hand, you walked in here acting like a sheriff, telling us all we were wrong and attempting to lead us onto the "right path" with your ultimate truth. And there it is—that is how religion begins... you've created a divide between us even though we are both advocating for love and peace. Was such a division necessary? Do we truly need "help" just because we don't refer to Jesus as the "Son of God," even though we live in accordance with His teachings?

It all sounds rather abstract and fairy-tale-like, doesn't it? Christ lives within you.I suppose if you said that to someone who wasn't in on the joke, they might take it the wrong way. It would probably remind them of that scene in the movie *Alien* where the creature bursts out of someone's chest—because apparently, there’s "something" living inside me.
It’s pretty obvious that phrases like these feel completely foreign to anyone who doesn't quite grasp the nuance, making them incredibly difficult to accept since they can be interpreted in just about any direction you care to look at them.
It feels more accurate to say that once we finally get a handle on our material Ego, we achieve a true awareness of our various parts—their morality and their integrity—which naturally manifests as a sense of harmony with everything around us, both physically and spiritually.

I suppose I am here. You’re proving it. Truth.?
I honestly can't wrap my head around how you don't see just how incredibly nonsensical that sounds. Truth doesn't exactly need to provide its own credentials to prove it's the Truth. Truth carries its own weight, existing as its own proof without needing anyone else to validate it.
And there you have it—the classic move of washing one's hands clean by simply dismissing inconvenient realities as nothing more than "delusions sent by Satan." It’s quite a convenient way to dodge the facts, isn't it? But it makes me wonder: who exactly is this Satan we keep hearing about? What is his actual motive for doing any of this?

It seems there are quite a few of us who find ourselves placing our faith in the various teachings of many different instructors.

I will continue to say the same thing over and over until your mind finally accepts the realization.
Jesus is the only Way, and there is no other way!!!!!

I believed in everything you did, which makes me your ally. Don't try to tell me what I believe, because the details are irrelevant now.

When I was in your position, I didn't struggle even half as much as I did against what I advocate for now. I was even the leader of a New Age community, but once I experienced the freedom found in Jesus—that fullness of fullness—I realized You are the King of the Universe and the only one who truly exists; everything else is just delusion and spiritual coddling.

You can go through all the motions and do everything Jesus commanded, but if you aren't doing it under His guidance—specifically through the Holy Spirit—then you aren't truly a child of God. This means being a child of God is reserved solely for those who have accepted Jesus as their Lord, Master, and Savior...

The Holy Spirit is our gift here on Earth; He is the one who executes God's will in this world. Without Him, you are connected only to one entity, and that is Satan. Whether you are aware of it or not, he maintains his influence over you until you choose to let Jesus into your life. Only Jesus holds authority over Satan; no one else does.

Satan is a spiritual being who commands a kingdom of dark forces—spirits that are entirely subject to him and carry out his work. This includes spirits of lust, spirits of addiction, spirits of religiousness, spirits of sorrow, and spirits of depression. Each of these specializes in exerting pressure on human thoughts. Essentially, the thoughts you receive come from either God—via the Holy Spirit or angels—or from Satan and his spirits. They attempt to steer your thinking toward their own counsel or push you to act in ways that are not pleasing to God.

Satan's greatest victory is when a person has absolutely no idea he even exists. God said, "My people perish for lack of knowledge."
Therefore, Satan’s strategy is to keep you trapped in delusions and behaviors that dishonor God so that he may maintain control over you. His ultimate goal is to ensure you do not find salvation through Jesus, leading you to a place where God does not want you: Hell.

There it is. That is the reality of the matter. If I am not being perfectly clear, it is simply because I am speaking from my own personal insights; I don't possess the specific gift that some of my friends have to articulate these things in a way that is effortlessly accessible to everyone.

I will say it again: one cannot enter into divine mysteries without the Holy Spirit guiding them. There is often a counter-pressure from a spirit whose sole purpose is to prevent you from understanding. In those moments, the Holy Spirit is not acting as your guide; rather, that other spirit is exerting influence. That spirit has the power to cloud your mind and block spiritual insight. It doesn't even matter which specific spirit it is—all that matters is that it is not from God.
Why? Because children of God exist only within the shelter of Jesus. Why only through Jesus? Because God is one, and he who has no Son has no Father. That is what the Bible says, and it is what I have become convinced of after a long period of searching through various alternative paths and such.

I bless you in Jesus's name, and I pray that the Lord Jesus grants you all the knowledge of Him that you need to live out the fullness of life that God intended for us—both here and in Heaven with Him forever. Amen.

Angela Hall30 said:And how exactly do you "prove" it? Through arguments? Rhetoric? If that were the case, I could prove just about anything. Besides, isn't this desperate need to provide proof really just a reflection of one's own insecurity?

My proof lies in the written Word within the Bible and the lived testimony of Jesus in my own life.

Angela Hall30 said:Sure, we can label it that way if it helps, but the fundamental issue remains: you all continue to interpret what you call the Holy Spirit as something external, something separate, and that is precisely the perspective from which you are writing. It is entirely possible—and quite a real possibility, frankly—that you have merely constructed a mental entity that you've labeled the "Holy Spirit," which then proceeds to dictate your thoughts and actions.
The danger in the path you're taking is that you might just become a victim of your own fascination.

It makes your head spin and leaves you feeling sick to your stomach when you consider the possibility that you've been deceived all along—and that's not even an option you want to entertain. "I can't just throw away everything I've invested so much in!" you tell yourself. Yet, another part of you whispers, "But what if the Truth shadownomad4 is talking about is real? What if I've messed up?" And then, predictably, you revert to your old habit: "Oh, please, what 'Truth'? I'm on the right path; there's nothing to think about."
This cycle continues until you finally realize that there is only one Truth. If you truly love the Truth, you will inevitably find your way to Jesus, because He has always had a special interest in people like that, drawing them toward Him.

I have walked the very path you are on, and I can tell you, letting go of the doctrines I spent years absorbing through alternative studies was no easy feat. But now? Thank God, I no longer find myself plagued by these endless questions about eternity.🙂

I am convinced that everything else is a delusion except for Jesus—having explored those "other paths" myself—so feel free to say whatever you like about me.

It seems to me that you are more preoccupied with proving your path is correct than actually walking it. Something to ponder.

The Holy Spirit is a Person, and He was given to us on this earth to serve as our guide.

I am here to demonstrate the Truth, which is Jesus. Nothing more and nothing less; He stands alongside the Truth as the only Way and the only Life. Anything else is merely a delusion provided by Satan.

Michael Moore3 said:What you're describing is the Ego

And the Ego is an inherent part of who we are. The real issue lies exactly where you're pointing: people allowing their Ego to take the driver's seat. Since the Ego is rooted in matter, it behaves in a materialistic way, constantly striving for power.

So, it wasn't some external "Satan" pulling your strings or any other nonsense; it was simply you yielding to your own desires. And desire is the root of all suffering, as one of Christ's followers once spoke the Truth.
Essentially, your thought that you "received the Holy Spirit" only when you realized you aren't just "you"—but rather a combination of your true spiritual self seeking God's energy and your material self (the Ego) seeking worldly things like power—is quite telling.

Looking at what was written above, it's clear you've only just mastered the first step of understanding—recognizing your Ego. In other words, you're only at the very beginning of your Spiritual development and the pursuit of Truth.

It's hardly surprising that you haven't achieved anything through meditation while your Ego was running wild with thoughts and creating total confusion in your mind.

And you truly believe you’ve shared some profound revelation that I didn't encounter years ago while meditating myself. Honestly, I don't know what more could be said than a simple proverb: "One who cannot be advised cannot be helped." Or perhaps even better: "One who refuses to seek help cannot be helped." That is why I shared my perspective with you; I have walked the path you are currently stepping onto, yet you choose to contradict me once you arrive at my level.

By the way, a person who has sincerely surrendered their life to Jesus no longer lives for themselves, because it is no longer they who live, but Christ who lives within them.

wearyowl29 said:So, we're supposed to host this presence within ourselves???

Why is it always so much easier to go looking for something external rather than realizing everything we actually need is already tucked away inside us???

Is it just plain laziness?

A hidden lack of trust in ourselves?

Or maybe just this nagging idea that the Truth is always something separate from who we are?

I wonder... what would the Holy Spirit even say to all that...???

The Truth isn't truly within you until the Holy Spirit resides within you. Right now, what you're experiencing is a lie because you are being guided by a spirit that provides a "functional delusion"—it makes you believe in your own actions just to keep you going. That is precisely why Sin came: to reveal the Truth to you. But let's be honest, it is much easier to live a lie than to accept the Truth, because accepting it means you have to walk away from the lifestyle you've built. So, you simply refuse to accept it.

It makes your head spin and leaves you feeling sick when you consider the possibility that you've been deceived all along. You can't even fathom it. You tell yourself, "There is no way I'm throwing away everything I've invested my whole life into!" Yet, a small part of you whispers, "But what if the Truth spoken by shadownomad4 is right? What if I've messed everything up?" And then, just like before, you shut it down: "Whatever, this isn't 'Truth,' I'm on the right path and I don't need to overthink it."

This cycle continues until you finally realize that there is only one Truth. If you truly love the Truth, you will inevitably find your way to Jesus, because He has always had a special interest in those seeking Him and has always drawn them close.

I have walked the very path you are on, and I know how difficult it was to strip away the doctrines I spent years absorbing through alternative studies. Now, thank God, I no longer have those nagging questions about eternity or God.🙂

I am fully convinced that everything else is an illusion except for Jesus, having personally explored all those "other ways." You can judge me however you like.

Elizabeth Lewis11 said:Nastavak:

Your consciousness and mine—they aren't exactly cut from the same cloth. You see, your perception is anchored to a specific set of "truths" you’ve gathered from the books on your shelf—books that seem to validate themselves through certain religious practices and those intense, emotional surges you hit during meditation. Essentially, you’ve placed your faith in what you feel while you're sitting there in silence. In short, you believe. I suppose I should start by being honest with myself—though that’s always been a bit of a struggle, hasn't it? It’s easy to get lost in the noise of everything else, drifting through the day without really checking in on what’s actually happening under the surface. I tend to wander off on these long, winding paths—much like my own thoughts, which rarely follow a straight line—and I often forget that the most important work happens internally. It's a slow process, a measured one, and frankly, a bit exhausting at times. But I'm trying. I'm trying to be more intentional, even if my attempts at being "composed" usually end up feeling a little bit ridiculous..
I believe in God—period. It doesn’t matter that I don't feel anything particularly special, nor do I go around chasing some sort of profound spiritual epiphany or "peak experience." My faith isn't rooted in myself—not in my fleeting emotional highs, nor in whatever transient mental states I might be cycling through at any given moment. If God says something, I do it. Plain and simple. Because I trust Him. I’m not out here hunting for internal validation or looking for some sign within my own "consciousness levels" to tell me I'm doing it right. Faith isn't an emotional rollercoaster; it's just following what He said.

My own consciousness stands as a witness to the Bible being the absolute truth. It’s my conviction that Jesus is truly "the way, the truth, and the life." Honestly, I can only attribute this clarity to the work of the Holy Spirit—because if it weren't for Him, I’d just be stuck believing in "myself"—relying on my own misguided opinions about God, piety, or what a Christian life ought to look like. I'd be lost in the whims of my own emotions or those fleeting, pious feelings one gets during a church service or similar rituals.

Regarding what shadownomad4 claimed about being able to translate various languages back into his native tongue—well, frankly, that just doesn't square with the Bible. In his particular Christian community, they treat the "gift of tongues" as this singular, extraordinary gift from God, even though if you actually look at Scripture, it’s listed as just one among many different gifts. To them, it serves as their ultimate "proof" that God is present among them. They fall into these trances during worship services, and once they feel some force taking hold—which they insist is the Holy Spirit—they start shouting, jumping around, making all sorts of noise, and speaking in unknown tongues. But in my view, that isn't the work of the Holy Spirit. After all, there's no practical value to it.
"The spirits of prophets are subject to the control of prophets, because God isn't a God of chaos—He's a God of order." So, look—when the Holy Spirit truly takes hold of a person, it’s not some frantic, chaotic whirlwind that just tosses them around in a fit of mindless shouting or manic frenzy. That's not how it works. Instead, the Holy Spirit actually submits to the prophet. He doesn't overpower them; rather, He guides them—providing that specific inspiration needed to grasp or "see" a particular divine revelation or word from God.
When you look at what actually happened during Pentecost in Acts chapter 2, people tend to get it all twisted. They jump straight to the idea of speaking "angelic" tongues—which, let’s be honest, sounds much more poetic than the reality—but that isn't what the text is actually describing. It wasn't some mystical, celestial dialect; it was about speaking foreign languages. Plain and simple. You had these uneducated fishermen and rural folks suddenly gifted by the Holy Spirit with the ability to speak the native tongues of the surrounding nations. Why? Because there was a practical purpose behind it. It wasn't just for show; they were given this specific gift so they could effectively deliver the Good News about Jesus Christ to everyone listening. It was a functional, purposeful gift from the Holy Spirit, designed to bridge a communication gap, not just to sound impressive.

To "believe in God" basically just means you accept that He exists—that He’s the Creator, the one who penned the Bible, and all that. It’s essentially believing a few things *about* God. Honestly, if we're being real, it's a pretty shallow way to look at it—just sitting there on this superficial, "informational" level.
To "believe in God" means trusting Him as your Father, as the Creator, and as a Friend. When He issues a command—well, you follow it simply because you trust His heart. When you dig into the Bible, you aren't just reading old ink; you're searching for the good He intends to teach you—the specific kind of character He wants to forge within you. You read that God is love, yet also justice. And honestly, it’s the only way it makes sense. Through love, God sustains life; He provides His children with everything necessary for happiness and success. But at the same time, He shields them from the evil that exists in this world—evil that persists solely because of human choice. It makes you love Him even more, knowing He doesn't just hand out life, family, and joy, but that He is watching over you every single moment to ensure evil doesn't overtake you. And in those inevitable moments where He allows evil to touch you—you see it as a "test" of your loyalty to Him. You end up loving Him even more, because He is guiding you through life with such steady, gentle hands. Why can you trust Him unconditionally, even when He allows us to be tested by darkness? Because: "«No temptation has overtaken you except what is common to mankind. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can endure it.» 1 Corinthians 10:13
The God of the Bible is magnificent. Personal. The Creator. The Redeemer. The Judge of evil. The Friend of all that is good.

Jesus' own words are merely the "peak" of the wonderful biblical truths. From the first page to the last, the Bible is a magnificent divine revelation to humanity. Anyone sincerely searching for meaning and purpose in life will surely find it in the Bible. "For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds" (Matthew 7:8)
It's a tragedy, really, that Christian churches have established a "monopoly" on Christianity. Now, when we look at the institutions and the believers they have shaped, we find ourselves recoiling from the Bible, from Christianity, and from the God of the Bible. All because they have distorted clear and beautiful biblical truths. In doing so, they misrepresent God. Much like Satan does.

I'm glad we can exchange thoughts so calmly and openly. And I truly hope that your trust in the Biblical God grows—not based on my little text here, but through your own personal study of the Bible as the magnificent Word of God. Warm regards

Tihica, this isn't the Truth. Don't speak about things you haven't personally experienced.

4 He who speaks in a tongue edifies himself, but he who prophesies edifies the Church. 14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will also pray with the understanding.

1 Corinthians 14:4, 14, 15

There is a distinct difference between the gift you mentioned and the gift given for one's own edification. There is another verse—though I can't recall the exact location—that states "when our spirit prays, it speaks the mysteries of God..." which implies that our spirit knows exactly what needs to be requested. When we pray in tongues prior to our conscious prayer, we receive answers in the Spirit. This differs from when we begin with our intellect (our native language); in those cases, we are limited by our reasoning. Instead, we should be guided by revelation coming through the Spirit, which sometimes may seem nonsensical given a difficult situation, yet the peace that descends upon our spirit tells us to press on toward the fulfillment of that prayer.

In our community, anyone who has been baptized in the Holy Spirit has automatically spoken in tongues; there is no one among us who hasn't. Some received this gift while praying with the Pastor or with brothers and sisters, while others experienced it privately at home. Tongues are an expression of our spirit rising within us when we decide to stand against Satan and his works. The Holy Spirit dwells in everyone who has prayed the prayer of salvation, though He does not manifest His power to those who do not believe in His gifts.
As we know, everything is dictated by our faith, and everything that happens to a Christian—or fails to happen—is reciprocal to their knowledge of who they are in Christ.

If we limit the operation of the Holy Spirit within ourselves, that is exactly what happens.
Would the Father give a snake if we asked Him for bread? You remember that verse, surely.
So, if you pray in Jesus' name for the expansion of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, and you already possess them within you, He will not give you anything from the devil.
If you are afraid, it means your faith is not complete and Love does not fully reign.
Therefore, relax and ask the Holy Spirit, who is within you as I can see, to fill you with His strength and reignite His gifts within you. You will witness His faithfulness, and in doing so, you will live in the full abundance of His blessings—not to mention how much more the Lord will be glorified through the use of your gifts for His glory.

I know you will tell me again that He gives the gift of tongues to some and the gift of interpretation to others. That is true; that gift becomes evident when God speaks in tongues through someone possessing the gift of interpretation for the entire Church. It never happens without the presence of the person holding that gift, and I have experienced this countless times myself. 1 Corinthians 14:5 "...that it may profit the Church."

Essentially, there is a difference between the gift of tongues for personal edification and the gift used to build up the Church.
Please, ask the Holy Spirit to grant you revelation on this before you move forward.
Blessings.

There have been many posts here intended to touch upon everyone's interests, but one specifically caught my eye—the title "Amen." The literal translation of that word is "let it be so," and it is used exactly that way when you are in agreement with someone.

The Holy Spirit is a person, and His power can be felt physically, much like an electric current that restores everything within the body, heals, and creates anew; meanwhile, through the soul, one experiences joy, peace, and so on.

God is omnipresent, yet He does not manifest everywhere at once. He manifests where a person is filled with the Holy Spirit, and through prayer and that individual's calling, He faithfully reveals Himself in various ways.

Back when I was practicing meditative techniques, I achieved various results similar to what Tihica experienced, finding a sense of satisfaction on a soulful level. However, I never had an answer regarding what would happen to me after death, so I sought comfort in the idea of reincarnation. Yet, the thought of reincarnation never truly brought me peace, which drove me to keep searching. When I finally encountered Biblical teaching, which is the only source that speaks to the three-dimensional nature of man, I felt a deep desire to understand the fate of my spirit. Upon realizing that my spirit had no connection to God, I was stunned; I realized I had been living in a delusion. Like many of you, I resisted for about a month, but eventually, I began attending sermons where these truths were preached. It was there that God spoke His one true Truth to me. I asked myself, "What do I have to lose?" God had already shown Himself to me in various ways, calling me, so I placed my trust in Him. I have never regretted that decision, as my understanding of the divine has expanded immensely. I have experienced the power of the Holy Spirit so profoundly that people have been healed through my prayers, which has been a profound joy, among many other things.

Therefore, I invite all of you to receive the Holy Spirit, and He will lead you into all the things you do not yet perceive.

Consider this: if you were a father and the only way your children could reach you was by believing in your son—who bore all their sins on the Cross—would you say to them afterward, "Just relax, my son isn't the only Truth; you can find your way to me through various other methods, even though my son suffered so much just to redeem you from the curse"?

I believe you wouldn't. So, please, reflect on God and the One who stands behind Him, for He is faithful.🙂

Michael Moore3 said:Oh, naturally!
It’s that classic, quintessential Christian fallback—the ultimate way they've managed to rubber-stamp centuries of suffering and misery, always used by those calling themselves "spiritual" as a convenient shield whenever they run out of actual arguments.

So, if I'm following your logic, you're suggesting that without something completely undefinable (the Holy Spirit), it's impossible to grasp something else that is also entirely undefinable (spiritual realities)...
And where does that leave you, claiming to possess this thing (the Holy Spirit) that the rest of us apparently can't perceive? You claim to be translating these concepts from the spiritual realm into our language, yet the things you "translate" still sound like nonsense to us... and then you just shrug and say we can't understand because we lack the Holy Spirit. If that's the case, what exactly is the point of your translation? What purpose does it serve?

shadownomad4, you’re essentially peddling pseudo-philosophy under the guise of quoting the Bible. Your grasp of Scripture seems more like memorizing lyrics to a song without actually understanding what the songwriter meant; it shows in your interpretations, which tend to circle aimlessly around vague terms, twisting quotes to fit your own narrative just because they contain a word that suits your moment, even when the broader context suggests something else entirely.

Who is the Holy Spirit?

Question: Who is the Holy Spirit?

Answer: There are many misconceptions regarding the identity of the Holy Spirit. Some view the Holy Spirit as a mystical force. Others believe He is an impersonal power that God bestows upon Christ's followers. What does the Bible say about the identity of the Holy Spirit? Simply put—the Bible states that the Holy Spirit is God. The Bible also teaches that the Holy Spirit is a Person, a Being possessing His own mind, emotions, and will.

The fact that the Holy Spirit is God is clearly evidenced in many Scriptures, including Acts 5:3-4. In these verses, Peter confronts Ananias because he lied to the Holy Spirit, stating that he "did not lie to men, but to God." From this statement, it is clear that lying to the Holy Spirit is simultaneously lying to God. Furthermore, we know the Holy Spirit is God because He possesses the attributes and characteristics of God. For instance, in Psalm 139:7-8, we see the reality of the Holy Spirit's omnipresence: "Where can I go from your Spirit? Where can I flee from your presence? If I ascend to heaven, you are there; if I make my bed in the Underworld, you are there." Later, in 1 Corinthians 2:10-11, we see the characteristic of the all-knowing Holy Spirit: "For God has revealed it to us through the Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man within him? Even so, no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God."

We can know that the Holy Spirit is truly a Person because He possesses a mind, emotions, and a will. The Holy Spirit thinks and knows (1 Corinthians 2:10). We can grieve the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 4:30). The Holy Spirit intercedes for us (Romans 8:26-27). The Holy Spirit makes decisions according to His will (1 Corinthians 12:7-11). The Holy Spirit is God, the third Person in the Holy Trinity. As God, the Holy Spirit can truly act as the Comforter and Counselor that Jesus promised to send (John 14:16, 26; 15:26).

Copied from gotquestion.org

Michael Moore3 said:So, what you're suggesting is that you possess the gift of translating the spiritual into our native language,

but I have to wonder—who exactly are you translating it for? Us? Isn't it written in Scripture that we should all be able to understand it? It seems to me that those who act as intermediaries between the Scripture and the people are often the very ones introducing misunderstandings into the interpretation of the Word.

Forgive me, shadownomad4, but you're just rambling; there's a lot of noise here, but very little substance...
Which "skeptics" are we talking about? What exactly are they afraid of, and what is this unbelief directed toward?
And why would one need to pray to the Father in Jesus' name in that specific way? Does Jesus truly need to act as an intermediary for us to petition the Father in His name? And what is the nature of these requests—are we asking for material things or spiritual ones?
For someone claiming to provide a "clear and understandable" interpretation of the Bible, your points are rather confusing and vague.

Without the Holy Spirit, gaining insight into spiritual realities is impossible, which explains why everything seems so confusing to you.

nimblemaker30 said:Since you claim to have this direct experience with the Holy Spirit, why don't you try explaining to me—in your own words, rather than just hiding behind a Bible quote—exactly how speaking in tongues serves as evidence that the Holy Spirit is actually speaking through you?

Which specific languages are you speaking, anyway? And, if you aren't too busy, maybe you could prove your authenticity by translating this post into one of the languages you use.

This is simply one of His gifts; it is our spirit that speaks, while He is the one providing the inspiration. You don't possess a gift to translate this native tongue into a spiritual one—it works the other way around. For instance, there are people gifted with the ability to interpret tongues, where they translate what someone else has said, and that is the extent of it. When you pray to the Father in Jesus' name asking for something, He won't grant you something from the devil. Therefore, when skeptics try to force the concept of language into the conversation, they are merely exposing their own unbelief and fear.

bluetiger23 said:Which specific community are you part of?

And just a thought, but if we follow that logic, I guess certain rituals from primitive tribes in Africa involve making all sorts of sounds and falling into trances to prophesy—does that mean they're under the influence of Satan, then?🙄

Anything performed in Jesus' name comes from God, provided it aligns perfectly with the Letter; otherwise, it does not.

Kimberly Evans said:http://www.biblegateway.com
Regarding this whole self-condemnation thing... could you please point me to an example from the four Gospels where the God-man speaks in a way that encourages negativity, or rather, useless self-judgment?

Isn't the verse stating there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ sufficient for you? Doesn't that clearly establish that you have been justified and cleared of all condemnation?

nimblemaker30 said:Are you trying to be a missionary with those quotes you just Googled...😵😵 😵

You missed the right subforum. Your posts belong in the religion section. This specific subforum supports free-form spirituality—you know, introspective spirituality outside of religious organizations.

Aside from you saying in your own words that the Holy Spirit is a gentleman and not evil like the bad spirits, everything else you just copied and pasted. Anyone can Google what you pasted. And that bit you said in your own words? It was a little childish.

The issue isn't that you don't know what or who the Holy Spirit is. Nobody truly knows. It's not a problem that you explained the unknown to someone else—meaning you said the Holy Spirit is God. Since everyone knows God, they'll immediately understand what the Holy Spirit is... But nobody truly knows God; God cannot be known... So the problem isn't your lack of knowledge regarding God or the Holy Spirit; the problem is that you have this urge to preach here and try to convert and save people. It’s irritating, infantile, and honestly, kind of funny.👎

I provided an answer regarding the Holy Spirit and referred to that page because it is more comprehensive than my own comment and is supported by biblical verses.

Furthermore, the Holy Spirit resides within me, so I am well aware of who He is. The proof of His presence in my life is my ability to speak in tongues, if you are familiar with the concept. "Those who believe... shall speak in other tongues..." If you desire that same experience, you can look through other similar posts, or I can guide you right here.

Everything that is spiritual follows a spiritual path.