Posts by shadownomad4

wearyowl29 said:But why?

I mean, what exactly is the Holy Spirit? Was He not already present here all along???

Who is the Holy Spirit?

Question: Who is the Holy Spirit?

Answer: There are many misconceptions regarding the identity of the Holy Spirit. Some view the Holy Spirit merely as a mystical force. Others perceive Him as an impersonal power that God imparts to Christ's followers. What does the Bible say about the identity of the Holy Spirit? To put it simply—the Bible states that the Holy Spirit is God. The Bible also teaches that the Holy Spirit is a Person, a Being possessing His own mind, emotions, and will.

The fact that the Holy Spirit is God is clearly demonstrated in many parts of Scripture, including Acts 5:3-4. In these verses, Peter confronts Ananias because he lied to the Holy Spirit, stating that he "has not lied to men, but to God." From this statement, it is evident that lying to the Holy Spirit is simultaneously lying to God. Furthermore, we know the Holy Spirit is God because He possesses the attributes and characteristics of God. For instance, in Psalm 139:7-8, we see the reality of the Holy Spirit's omnipresence: "Where can I go from your Spirit? Where can I flee from your presence? If I ascend to heaven, you are there; if I make my bed in the Underworld, you are there." Additionally, in 1 Corinthians 2:10-11, we observe the attribute of the all-knowing Holy Spirit: "these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit, for the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. For what person knows the things of God except the spirit of a man in him? So also no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God."

We can conclude that the Holy Spirit is indeed a Person because He possesses a mind, emotions, and a will. The Holy Spirit thinks and knows (1 Corinthians 2:10). We can grieve the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 4:30). The Holy Spirit intercedes for us (Romans 8:26-27). The Holy Spirit makes decisions according to His own will (1 Corinthians 12:7-11). The Holy Spirit is God, the third Person in the Holy Trinity. As God, the Holy Spirit truly functions as the Comforter and Counselor whom Jesus promised to send (John 14:16, 26; 15:26).

Adapted from the website www.gotquestion.org for the American version.

The Holy Spirit has been present on earth for 2,000 years and is omnipresent; however, He is a gentleman and only comes when called. He does not force Himself upon anyone, unlike evil spirits that attack people's thoughts and drive them toward various evils, making them believe they came up with those ideas themselves.

Essentially, without the Holy Spirit, no one stands a chance against the attacker (Satan and his demons). No one can grasp the depths of divine Truth except Him; therefore, it is for this reason that without Him, we cannot reach revelation concerning God's will or come to know it through the Bible.

Kimberly Evans said:shadownomad4, I’m having a hard time following your take on the teachings and spirituality of Joshua Messiah. Could you walk me through what you actually mean by "the desire to remain with Him"? Does anything specific happen when that desire is present?
Well, surely you realize that desire alone isn't enough. It’s also about the quality of that desire. Most importantly, and most vitally for salvation, is the act of following the Messiah's commands—which means guarding the Word. In plain terms, it means making a serious, heartfelt effort to stop sinning.
The idea of "unconditional forgiveness" as you've described it can actually be challenged by quite a few of Joshua Messiah's own words.
(Yes—If anyone sins, we have an advocate with the Father,
but—Go, and sin no more,
and—Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do.)

Of course, you should carry the command to "sin no more" within your heart, but if you do stumble, the crucial thing is to avoid falling into self-condemnation. That is exactly what Satan wants; he tries to pull you back under the Law, under which no one has ever succeeded in remaining righteous before God. This is precisely why Christ came—to liberate us from that burden. The process of conversion takes time, so through the forgiveness and grace that Christ provided via His Cross, a person can move forward without being crushed by condemnation. "There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ." I don't recall the exact verse location, but the sentiment is clearly written.

Regarding desire: you can only want things up to a certain point. True desire flows from Him once you receive Christ through the working of the Holy Spirit and prayer, asking Him to stir up the will and the volition as He speaks the Word. He opens up a genuine longing to be with Him constantly—in your thoughts, and eventually through your actions. In doing so, sinful habits spontaneously fall away because they are replaced by a relationship with Him (through the Holy Spirit).

That is why I maintain that all effort is in vain until you receive the Holy Spirit.

mistygull16 said:Look, shadownomad4, I think you're a good guy and I believe Jesus loves you, but honestly? What you're saying feels pretty naive, almost like something out of a kid's book. It's not like Jesus or Satan are comic book villains where we're just waiting to see which hero wins the fight. That's not how you read the Bible; it doesn't line up with science or even just basic common sense. We know dinosaurs existed, we know about evolution... the idea that everything popped into existence overnight from Adam and Eve is more of a metaphor. Reading things that way just breeds fear and makes people hate other religions. It ends up making God look like some kind of tyrant, which is exactly what you're preaching. But God is love. He isn't out to torture anyone for eternity. Take it easy!

That sense of comfort is fleeting, and soon enough, you will find yourself haunted again by the question: "What about eternity? What becomes of me?" I speak from experience, having walked that exact path myself before finally finding peace. The Truth can be bitter when a person first encounters it, primarily because we have integrated so many falsehoods into our identities just to keep moving forward. The fear of losing those comforts, coupled with the resentment felt toward those who misled us with faulty teachings, keeps us from the light. Fortunately, Jesus grants us the power to forgive everyone—including those people—because they weren't acting out of malice, but rather out of the profound ignorance that currently dominates the world. As it says in Hosea 4:6, "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge."
However, once a person places their trust in Jesus, surrenders their life to Him, and casts aside everything that conflicts with His word, they achieve a level of freedom and joy unlike anything else. This isn't some flight of fancy; it is a living reality within you, a conviction that no one can strip away. That is why Jesus is the ONLY WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE; anything else is simply incomplete.

What you perceive as totalitarianism is actually a reflection of the fullness I feel within my own soul, not fanaticism. I truly hope that one day you will realize this, and only then will you understand me. If you seek the Truth with a sincere heart, Jesus will enter your life to guide you, just as He has done for all of us.🙂

Michael Moore3 said:Jesus simply wouldn't do that, and He never would.
Jesus isn't some bully looking to take pleasure in tormenting an "enemy."
shadownomad4 👎
It seems you have a fundamentally flawed perception of Jesus. To you, He’s just some "victorious warrior," a general of goodness who exists to
destroy evil—but that isn't the Truth. Jesus wasn't sent to fight; He was sent to teach the kind of love that produces peace, understanding, and goodness...

If Satan acts through the subconscious, then we aren't responsible for our own actions; it would mean Satan is merely acting through us. That isn't the Truth.
The responsibility for both our conscious and unconscious actions rests entirely with us.
If you kill someone during a momentary lapse of sanity—a state where you aren't even aware of your own movements—is it Satan within you who did it, or is it you?

1. God hasn't passed any judgment. God isn't a judge.
2. God didn't create "hell"—God cast Satan out to Earth, and that "casting out" wasn't an act of force, but one of profound sorrow, much like a father having to watch his son, a thief and a murderer, being led away to prison... because God would much rather that Lucifer had never sinned against Him.
Every other version of the story where God and Satan are angry enemies is just the result of Satan's own teachings, which have corrupted most religions. Satan hates God and wants to portray Him to all of us as vindictive and vain, lying to us by claiming that God fights against Satan.
Satan is clever; if he can convince us that God is vengeful, warlike, and intolerant of sinners, people will begin to fear God (which is exactly how they view Him). And fear is Satan's weapon... because how can you truly love someone you are afraid of?

He was merciful enough to forgive all our transgressions. He wiped away the debt that stood against us—the one that, by law, should have been our undoing—and effectively canceled it. He didn't just dismiss it; He nailed that entire record of our failings right to the cross. They have stripped away the facade of supremacy and authority, making it clear for all to see: he leads them in a triumphant procession.
Colossians 2:13-15

Here is the evidence regarding the ultimate victory. When you study the Bible, it becomes clear that Supremacies and Authorities are nothing more than spiritual realms belonging to dark forces.

Yes, that man committed murder with his own hands, but at that moment, he was merely an instrument used by an evil spirit. He was acting under the influence of a mind that simply could not defend itself against such a force because he lacked the Holy Spirit. I am writing all of this so that you might understand that without Him, you stand absolutely no chance—none at all. The devil is cunning, and as a spiritual entity, he is incredibly ancient and experienced, but thanks be to God, we have been given the weapons necessary to stand against him.
As Christians, we function as the extended hands of Jesus, provided we possess the Holy Spirit through baptism. Ultimately, you are either serving God or serving Satan; the only variable is whether you are consciously aware of which side you have chosen.

Fear is nothing more than one of Satan's primary weapons used against us. This is precisely why God offers unconditional forgiveness for all our transgressions; Jesus paid the full price for our sins upon the cross. Because of His sacrifice, we are granted mercy every single time we stumble—whether those mistakes are made consciously or unconsciously—provided our hearts remain truly committed to staying with Him.

Elizabeth Lewis11 said:Hey there, shadownomad4.
Reading through your posts, it’s pretty clear you actually know your way around the Bible—which, let's be honest, is becoming a rare find these days. It’s genuinely refreshing to see someone actually trying to build their life on the Bible and God's will rather than just drifting along. I've jumped into various discussions on this forum before, and frankly, most people tend to be incredibly shallow and simple-minded. I don't mean to imply that your current interlocutors are shallow—not in the way some others have been, at least—but rather that people searching for answers often lack the courage to truly "surrender" to God. They haven't reached that level of intimacy with Him where they can actually extend real trust, or faith, you know? So, instead, they stick to what's comfortable: trusting themselves—their own opinions, their fleeting feelings, and their limited life experiences.
Best,

You are absolutely correct!
There is one crucial point you overlooked: if those of us who possess certain insights into the Truth fail to convey them—whether through media or by witnessing through our own lives—then others will never gain insight into the Truth, and the Holy Spirit will have no medium through which to work in their lives.
God looks upon and sees a people thirsty for the Truth, and the Holy Spirit comes with His presence into the life of such a person.
I have personally experienced this many times when witnessing the Truth face-to-face; people have undergone various forms of mercy and true liberation.
Therefore, let us write and speak the Word, for it is the only thing that penetrates where nothing else can or will. After all, it was that very same Word that created the world; surely it can do anything else.🙂

Michael Moore3 said:Be honest with me, straight from the heart: if you were facing that kind of judgment, would you actually double down? Or would you swallow your pride, admit your mistakes, and finally face the music?

Don't you see that by talking about Satan as if he were himself Satan, you're essentially just passing judgment? Jesus said it plenty of times—He spoke of forgiveness and loving your enemies.
It seems clear to me that both Jesus and God don't want you harboring hatred toward Satan; rather, they want you to forgive his transgressions. After all, the only true sin Satan committed was pride—which happens to be the exact same pride that keeps us from being able to forgive others...

It’s only when you find it in yourself to forgive your worst enemy that the gates of heaven truly swing open for you.

And please, don't get me wrong—forgiving Satan doesn't mean you have to follow him; it just means making peace with the reality of who he is. Even he came from God, and God chose not to destroy him, because God’s love is so vast that it encompasses even His own opposite.

God has already judged Satan, and this has already taken place in the spirit; we are simply waiting for the fullness of time for it to be realized physically, otherwise God would not have created hell for him and the others.
I have no reason to hate him because he is defeated. For three days, Jesus dragged him through hell until the Resurrection, so that everyone could see WHO THE KING OF KINGS is. He took the keys of death, and there is absolutely no authority over a Christian who is aware of their authority in Christ.

As for forgiving him, I have nothing to forgive. Regarding what he did to me for years, I wasn't even aware of it—I wasn't aware of his influence. That gives you the answer: he operates through the unconscious, which is why Christians are equipped with the Holy Spirit, who awakens people through His voice speaking through them.

In the same way, he carries out his work, but once he sees he can do nothing to you, he retreats because the force within a Christian is almighty.
Every person should ask themselves how aware they are of their own unconsciousness. Once you receive Christ, His consciousness comes alive within you and shows you EVERYTHING, and you begin to live within His consciousness, which is the Beginning and the End, the Alpha and the Omega.🙏

Sean Kelly52 said:Look, buddy, you can quote the Bible all day and claim you BELIEVE in it, in Jesus's resurrection, and in mercy.
That’s your right, but don't go calling it YOUR OWN REALIZATION. You weren't there on your deathbed experiencing it firsthand, so it's not YOUR experience.
Get this straight: BELIEF is one thing, but realizing the Truth is something else entirely.
I'm telling you again, once you actually REALIZE the Truth, you won't need to drop quotes—people will start quoting you instead.
Take care🙂

The Bible contains the Word of God, backed by God Himself who fulfills it, which is why a Christian quotes the Word and builds their life upon it.

No, I was not on my own deathbed, but I was present when a man accepted Christ in a hospital room at his bedside. That was sufficient for me. It didn't have to be my own experience to witness the profound peace that man received; he could barely speak, but it was enough.

Sean Kelly52 said:Sorry... but I honestly don't see how that's YOUR personal realization.

Once you actually grasp the Truth...
there’s zero need to just copy-paste stuff...
you don't even need to argue AGAINST anything...it's all about being FOR...
FOR love... FOR bliss... FOR mercy.
There's no point trying to convince people you've found the Truth...
because... you can just feel it... a divine fragrance starts radiating from you.
LIGHT spreads around us... you don't have to fight the darkness because it
just vanishes the moment we show up.🙂

Realization is about the MERCY that God provided through Jesus, allowing a person to be saved so simply—even on their deathbed—regardless of how they lived their entire life.

"I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life; no one comes to the Father except through me." John 14:6 This is the realization of the Truth.

mistygull16 said:So, does that mean if there were no Satan, everyone would just be saved automatically?
I mean, which version of Satan was sent our way?

Satan is fundamentally opposed to everything that belongs to God (it is to those who receive Him—the Holy Spirit—that He grants the authority to become children of God), and he stands against anyone who possesses the Spirit. Those with the Spirit hold the power to resist Satan and his predatory spirits (fallen angels) who strive to destroy everything. This destruction encompasses humanity and the entire world, as both were created by God. The reasoning here is quite logical and straightforward: because Satan and all his demons are already condemned to eternal torment in hell, they have nothing left to lose. Their only remaining objective is to inflict as much evil as possible while they still can. Imagine someone who knows they are doomed and realizes there is absolutely no hope for mercy. What do they do? They go all the way, don't they?

Satan was originally an angel, but he was consumed by pride and turned against God with the intention of seizing His throne. Consequently, he was cast out along with the other angels he led astray. This means that no one sent him; he chose this path himself.

That is precisely why Jesus came: to grant us the authority to act in His name—much like how lawyers operate, to make the concept clearer—so that we may cast out evil spirits from ourselves and others. These spirits are often the root cause of many illnesses, yet they possess no authority over the children of God. This stands in stark contrast to those who have no defense against Satan because they lack the Almighty Holy Spirit.

The most profound realization of mercy I have ever personally experienced is this: a person lying on their deathbed—acting solely upon the grace by which they are saved, rather than through their own works—simply by believing in their heart that Jesus rose from the dead and confessing with their lips that He is their Lord (the one who takes full responsibility for them), departs to Him, to God, at the very moment their breathing ceases.
"For if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved." Romans 10:9
It is truly beautiful how He remains faithful to His Word in the Bible. I am certain that when a soul comes to Him, He shows mercy for all those days spent in ignorance and helplessness; moreover, when one is with Him, the joy is so overwhelming and His forgiveness so absolute that a person finds it possible to forgive themselves, as well as others who failed to share the Truth. Therefore, we who have come to know the Truth strive to spread it wherever we go, knowing that whoever stands firm upon His Word will return with a testimony.

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations..." Matthew 28:18,19

Roger Smith5 said:You have expressed yourself beautifully once again! My sincerest compliments.

Not only did Jesus provide us with the ultimate example, but God Himself demonstrated His love by offering us the Lamb... truly, He serves as the bridge.
Jesus acts as both the Shepherd and the Lamb simultaneously.

Humanity did not cease committing sins even immediately following the death of Jesus... yet, original sin carried its own heavy price!

I maintain my belief that there exists both a place called Heaven and a state of being known as paradise.
Perhaps such a place is where souls go after achieving a certain level of enlightenment and spiritual evolution.
For it is not a northern or southern sin, but rather the Eastern original sin.
I cannot bring myself to accept the idea I heard that some locate Eden on Venus, though it might make sense given that the planet lies to the east. While Venus is currently a landscape of sulfurous fire, that matters little when one considers the spiritual archetype of that location. I am uncertain how I phrased that final thought... do you happen to know the origin of the term "Eastern"?

Yes, thank God, he did.
The term "original sin" is used because all other sins flow from that primary transgression, which is how God holds humanity accountable.
The first sinner was an angel who was beautiful, perhaps the most beautiful of them all. He led the worship in the spiritual kingdom, where they sang praises to our creator. Unfortunately, pride got the better of him; he became arrogant and claimed he would sit on God's throne and be just like Him. In doing so, he deceived one-third of the angels, and God cast them out of His kingdom. Today, that fallen angel is known as Satan, and his followers are called demons. Hell was created for him and his followers, not for mankind, yet unfortunately, people end up there simply due to their own spiritual inclinations, failing to accept the merciful gift of salvation.
Satan approached Adam and Eve—specifically, he targeted Eve—deceiving her with the thought that they could become gods themselves if they ate from the forbidden tree. That was the moment sin entered the world, as divine law was broken, causing an immediate separation between Adam, Eve, and God. Consequently, their bodies became subject to sin, their spirits died, and we are all their descendants, inheriting that original sin. To maintain a relationship with God, they had to offer animal sacrifices; that blood merely covered their sin so they could remain in fellowship with a God who always longed for His children and offered second chances. They weren't permanently redeemed from sin until Christ arrived. Therefore, those who are in Christ are no longer descendants of Adam through sin, but are instead part of Christ, who was without sin.
Some people struggle to grasp the purpose of these sacrifices, trying to rationalize everything through logic. But that is a bottomless pit, for He is unknowable. One can only please Him by placing one's trust in Him—through faith. And really, who are we to judge God?

Ultimately, Satan is the original culprit behind sin, and he remains the architect of evil today. He uses his spirits to tempt people by influencing their thoughts toward wrongdoing. Often, a person is unaware of this influence; they believe these impulses are their own thoughts, making it difficult to even recognize or resist them. However, someone who possesses the Holy Spirit can sense when something is being imposed upon them from that side, because the Spirit bears witness to everything through that internal voice we now call intuition.
I may have wandered off on a tangent, but I believe there is great value in dismantling Satan's tactics.

mistygull16 said:Deep down, what I told you at the start... you actually agree with me.

If Jesus has to give His life for us, then His Father isn't exactly great, right? It's like He's looking for a sacrifice or something. Nobody's really given me a straight answer on that yet.

Sure, questions exist, but if you actually find an answer, please, just share it for the sake of the other people on these forums.

I guess I mostly reacted to that link you posted—the part where it says if people experienced just two minutes of hell, everyone would turn to faith. Personally, I don't think an argument like that comes from God.

Regarding the topic of sacrifice, along with several other fascinating subjects, I believe you will find the relationship between the spirit, the soul, and the body particularly compelling. You should head over to the "Spiritual Literature in PDF" thread; I have provided a link to a book there that covers everything in great detail. It contains all the answers you are looking for.🙂

Brian Thomas612 said:Actually, I think this one hits even harder:

It’s kind of like baking cookies—you just gather up all your ingredients and then, well, let's go, Jesus, where art Thou?

Do you even realize what you're saying here?...

"I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life; no one comes to the Father except through me." John 14:6

These aren't my own words; they belong to Him, the King of the entire universe. I simply follow Him. His words are eternal, so you aren't judging me—you are judging Him and everything He accomplished for us on the Cross.

mistygull16 said:shadownomad4, you totally dodged my question!

1) If God basically sets a deadline for when we need to accept Jesus, can you even call that "great love"?
2) And what’s our deal with Adam’s sin anyway? (Which, let’s be real, isn't even real—just some parable from the Bible)
3) What about little kids who pass away? Are they kind of getting the VIP treatment since they don't have to deal with all this earthly suffering?
4) Then there are people born with disabilities or mental struggles... why do they have to go through that hell? Is that just God's whim?
5) Isn't it a little twisted that God sent His son because of our sins, but at the same time sent Satan to do the dirty work? I mean, someone's gotta handle the hell part, otherwise everyone would just be chasing Paradise and nobody would want anything to do with hell, right?

Be a pal and answer these if you can, but don't skip any. If you actually sit down and chew on them for a second, you'll see that the stuff you're preaching is pretty contradictory. Thanks

Your issue is that you believe you "know everything," and because of that, you aren't open to anything else. You're closed off due to some bitterness you picked up a long time ago. Everything I wrote previously should have been enough to give you insight into God's plan, but feel free to argue if you must; debating isn't my intention and it's ultimately pointless. By the way, all the answers are right there in the Bible. No offense intended.🙂

Michael Moore3 said:shadownomad4
Since you seem to believe that Jesus' death on the Cross was truly meant to redeem our sins, let's take a moment to look at this more closely:

Why did Jesus have to die on the Cross?
To pay for our sins.

And what exactly are these sins of ours?
It isn't really about individual sins, but rather sin itself—Original Sin, which occurred when Adam and Eve failed to follow God's command regarding the fruit from the tree of the "knowledge of good and evil."

So, Jesus died to redeem us from Original Sin so we could return to paradise?
Essentially, yes...

If he died so we could return there, why aren't we in paradise right now?
Because paradise doesn't exist as a physical location. It is a state of being within the spirit.

Did Jesus die because of our spiritual state?
Jesus died to demonstrate an infinite level of love and sacrifice, which allows one to achieve that spiritual state known as paradise. The idea is that he provided the ultimate lesson in selflessness and devotion—a lesson we humans are supposed to learn to find our way back. He didn't just flip a switch and unlock the gates for everyone automatically; those gates were always open, but people simply lost the "key" to entering. That’s essentially what happened with Adam and Eve; they forgot they were in paradise and wandered out of it.

Okay, so paradise is a spiritual state. And God cast Adam and Eve out of paradise... but couldn't they have returned through a selfless act of love, much like the one Jesus showed?
In truth, God didn't cast them out; rather, by gaining the knowledge of good and evil, they lost the capacity to perceive paradise. People have misinterpreted this, treating paradise like a physical destination, and the easiest way for them to explain why Adam and Eve were no longer there was to claim God had expelled them.

Then why do we say that Jesus "redeemed" our sins?
Because religion grew out of Jesus' teachings. Religion began to misinterpret his message—whether intentionally or by accident, it doesn't much matter. The end result was that humanity lost the "key" to paradise all over again, which is evidenced by our modern civilization being so deeply rooted in materialism.

Is Jesus the only way to enter paradise?
No. That's a concept imposed by the religions that emerged from following his teachings. That specific mindset is actually proof that religion has strayed from its path; it has become more about "who is right and who is wrong" instead of serving as a vessel for wisdom and teaching. If it were just about sharing knowledge, people could listen if they wanted or walk their own path if they didn't. You can see the deviation in the aggression and coercion practiced by religions worldwide to force their doctrines on others. However, Truth always sounds good; if these teachings were pure and true, people would seek them out naturally. In other words, over time, religion has tainted the original teachings revealed by Jesus and other Christs throughout history.

Other Christs? Isn't there only one "Christ"—Jesus?
That is exactly the kind of thinking religion imposes. To suggest there is only one "Christ" teacher is a product of religious dogma. There have been many Christs, all providing the wisdom that serves as the key to paradise. It's quite absurd to condemn someone for offering you the keys to *their* version of paradise rather than yours—it just shows that the person doing the condemning doesn't truly understand what paradise is or how to reach it, but is instead clinging to a rigid image they feel they must fanatically follow.

So why do people fight so hard for these different versions of paradise offered by various religions?
Usually, it's because they are lost themselves and have built their entire reality on such shaky foundations. Because they are insecure, the vision of paradise constructed by others feels safe to them. They embrace it wholeheartedly because that borrowed vision of paradise is the only certain thing in their uncertain lives, giving them a foundation upon which to build their world.

Is it bad to build one's world on such a premise?
It is, and it isn't.
It isn't bad in the sense that it allows them to find some stability, even if it's based on a misunderstanding of the truth.
Generally speaking, things go south because people tend to judge the world based on their own subjective lens—which is perfectly human. But when someone’s perspective is inherently unstable, they mistakenly assume everyone else is operating from that same shaky ground. Once they settle into a specific vision of paradise, they start trying to force that exact image onto everyone around them, convinced that everyone else is just lost. Naturally, that kind of pressure breeds resistance, making such people counterproductive; they end up causing far more harm than good.

So, if following Jesus' teachings is the answer, why don't people just instantly reach that spiritual state of paradise?
Well, some do, and some don't. The thing is, Jesus' teaching is quite direct and abrupt, skipping all the middle steps. That bluntness works fine for some, but others prefer a slower, more gradual process of learning through things like meditation and incremental realizations.
The main difference is that Jesus' way heads straight for the target, leaving behind a massive void and plenty of unanswered questions about the world at large, whereas meditative techniques and gradual insights slowly build a framework that fills those gaps on the way toward that spiritual state—paradise.

In that case, which approach is better? The path of Jesus or these other methods?
It really depends on the person. The advantage—and the pitfall—of the other methods is that they unlock a whole series of insights that can easily lead to distractions along the path to paradise; however, they also build a much sturdier foundation that doesn't crumble easily when you hit the inevitable spiritual trials that come with the journey.
With Jesus' teaching, you're essentially jumping straight to the finish line, but the risk is that even the slightest trial can trigger intense stress, potentially knocking a person off course and sending them spiraling down the wrong path entirely.

That is quite a lot to unpack at once, but I will do my best to help you reach the heart of the matter.

God operates according to His own spiritual laws, and those laws are immutable.
Sin is anything that creates a separation between you and God. The Bible details these transgressions—things like idolatry, adultery, theft, and lying, among others.
Looking at the lifestyles of people living before Christ, and even those today who do not live in fellowship with Christ, the moment someone tells a lie, they have separated themselves from God. In ancient times, this required offering unblemished animals as sacrifices to cover that sin so that God might continue to bless them. This same pattern persists within the Roman Catholic Church today, where people judge one another based on their works; consequently, many have turned away from Christ because they were taught incorrectly.
The Truth is that humanity is saved from eternal separation from God (hell) by grace (and grace is something that cannot be earned) through what Jesus accomplished on the Cross. It was a perfect sacrifice, offered once and for all. This means that from the moment a person consciously—not merely as a child, but with intention—invites Jesus into their life, they are saved forever. He carried all future sins upon the Cross as well. Therefore, when a person slips up unintentionally or out of ignorance, they simply confess to God and continue walking in His forgiveness and His fullness.

Ultimately, without the Holy Spirit filling a person who is sincerely thirsty for unity with Him and His fullness, one cannot truly grasp what is written in the Bible. The Holy Spirit is its author, but He can also inspire a seeker to pursue the Truth if they truly hunger for it, ultimately leading them to that Truth.

Brian Thomas612 said:Honestly, guys... you’ve wandered so far away from true spirituality when you start bickering about it like this. 👎

To the person who kicked off this thread and everyone else jumping in... I have to wonder, what’s actually the point of these kinds of conversations—or rather, these debates? What's the practical benefit? You all seem so busy defending your version of spirituality (some people are even bringing up their own "personal experiences"), yet it feels like there isn't an ounce of actual faith in the things you're defending...

Don't get me wrong, I'm not claiming to be more enlightened than any of you. If I were, I probably wouldn't be sitting here typing this out. It's nice, really, seeing people try to bridge the gap between spirituality and philosophy (and hey, debating and making arguments is a huge part of philosophy, after all). There’s nothing wrong with chasing truth and wisdom... but I just don't think it works this way. Look how far we've gone with it. We're searching for answers in all the wrong places, when the truth is always found in just one spot—deep in the heart, in the soul!

I have my own spiritual path, and I feel like it’s the right fit for me. When I can just quiet my mind, let go of the raw thoughts and the endless mental loops, I feel myself moving toward the truth, toward God. But the moment I start arguing about it with other people, doubt and insecurity start creeping back in. It’s like I end up further away from where I started than before I even spoke...

Anyway, that's just my two cents,
Take care!

The moment doubt and uncertainty take hold, it means you aren't truly rooted in the Truth (no offense intended); otherwise, it wouldn't happen. There is only one Truth, and it is what keeps you free, now and forever.

mistygull16 said:Look, sorry, but you totally dodged my question! 😢
Who's deciding I haven't accepted Jesus? And for the record, Jesus recommended I read the Bhagavad Gita, unlike that Buddhist guy who listened to the ruler of hell and led a bunch of people astray. Who says I'm not in the Spirit? I was baptized and confirmed!
Can you honestly claim I don't love the Truth?
I wish you'd give me a real answer instead of just pooping out some vague response. This is heavy stuff for me. Talking about hell right off the bat just scares people away from God—so maybe be a little more responsible when discussing these things.

Don't let my edge trip you up, though. I really do respect people. 🙂

As you can see, I am using a new username because I was banned for violating the forum rules. If I get banned again and disappear, please understand that it is due to those circumstances and not a lack of desire to participate.
You accept Jesus when you consciously and willfully invite Him into your life; if you have a copy handy, read Romans 10:9-10 and focus on following what the Bible prescribes. Proof that the Holy Spirit resides within you is found in speaking in other tongues: "They that believe on me shall speak in new tongues; they shall cast out devils; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."
I am not claiming that you lack a love for the Truth. If you truly possess it, it will inevitably lead you to Christ, for He is the Truth—"I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life." Throughout history, no one else has ever dared to make such a claim.