Posts by Drew Watson3

12 posts shown.

Why doesn't God share His knowledge? in Religion · Jun 15, 2012

goldentrucker11 As stated by...
I’ve personally never had anyone reach out to me with an offer like that... 🤷

Have you actually ever sat down and asked Him for guidance, or perhaps sought out His wisdom, or even just anything at all... just being completely honest with yourself? ☕

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

Anthony Perez9 said:This is the first time I've ever heard anyone claim Christian philosophers think free will is a chip used to program us for evil.[/I]

And who exactly said "any Christian philosopher" claims that? 😕

If we're talking technical terms, free will is just a 0 or 1 switch, and how you flip it is on you. At least you have the choice. Flip it toward good, and free will is great; flip it toward evil... well, again, that's your call.

You clearly aren't even reading what I wrote. You're just stuck in your own head...

Free will isn't some bug in the genetic code making humans malfunction; it's just the ability to choose: If - then - else.

Look, Anthony Perez9, I think you're totally misinterpreting Christian philosophy. You're right that harmony isn't slavery (in Christian terms, being tied to any evil would be considered slavery/sin), meaning anything out of sync with harmony—and Christians believe God is perfect harmony—is either slavery or evil. I don't see the contradiction in your view, except for your assumption that free will was designed specifically to predispose us to evil.

If we're talking technical terms, free will is just a 0 or 1 switch, and how you flip it is on you. At least you have the choice. Flip it toward good, and free will is great; flip it toward evil... well, again, that's your call.

You clearly aren't even reading what I wrote. You're just stuck in your own head...

Free will isn't some bug in the genetic code making humans malfunction; it's just the ability to choose: If - then - else.

Look, Anthony Perez9, I think you're totally misinterpreting Christian philosophy. You're right that harmony isn't slavery (in Christian terms, being tied to any evil would be considered slavery/sin), meaning anything out of sync with harmony—and Christians believe God is perfect harmony—is either slavery or evil. I don't see the contradiction in your view, except for your assumption that free will was designed specifically to predispose us to evil.

If we're talking technical terms, free will is just a 0 or 1 switch, and how you flip it is on you. At least you have the choice. Flip it toward good, and free will is great; flip it toward evil... well, again, that's your call.

You clearly aren't even reading what I wrote. You're just stuck in your own head...

Free will isn't some bug in the genetic code making humans malfunction; it's just the ability to choose: If - then - else.

Look, Anthony Perez9, I think you're totally misinterpreting Christian philosophy. You're right that harmony isn't slavery (in Christian terms, being tied to any evil would be considered slavery/sin), meaning anything out of sync with harmony—and Christians believe God is perfect harmony—is either slavery or evil. I don't see the contradiction in your view, except for your assumption that free will was designed specifically to predispose us to evil.

Did God plant that in Adam and Eve? Or did they just grab it for themselves when they ate the forbidden fruit?

Was God created them in harmony, and then they messed up by eating the fruit and gaining the power to decide (including deciding for evil)? God forbade it. So where does free will come from, and what actually is it?
If it's the power to choose between good and evil, what's the point? If the first humans were living in harmony, the only thing they could possibly "gain" was the capacity to choose evil..
It seems to me that our definitions of harmony are worlds apart, because you seem to think harmony means being completely oblivious to the existence of evil. But if there is no evil, then goodness can't exist either! And evil is real; it wasn't just something manufactured inside a person, but something that existed outside of humanity (and I know, you'll probably jump on the "where did external evil come from" argument... blah, blah, blah, but it doesn't matter), which would mean God was incredibly careless and likely guilty once again in our eyes for creating us without a warning that evil exists and that it appears
more than once. Anyway, enough of this, because I feel like you aren't seeing the truth and don't want to, just as you think the same of me, and the reality is we've both drifted far away from the actual topic. Bye bye

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

wearyowl29;38722813 said:
Drew Watson3 said:God gave humanity nothing but Goodness, but people turned their backs on that and embraced Evil instead. The state of the world today is the consequence of human choices driven by darkness, rather than any divine design. Or perhaps we need to circle back to the fundamental question: why did God grant us the freedom to choose in the first place? Why didn't He just create us as mindless robots, or simply wave a magic wand to fix everything the moment someone breaks the harmony of this perfect stage? Why give us the capacity to earn our own way, instead of creating us as finished products who never have to make a decision, living in a state of effortless perfection where everything just works without us ever having to lift a finger???
Or, if we want to push the logic even further, why did God decide to create anything at all? He really should have asked us for permission first—asked if we even wanted to exist, what kind of beings we wanted to be, and what we actually intended to do with our lives! I still haven't heard an answer to my question regarding what you believe a truly perfect world would look like for everyone, rather than just for those "finished products" who seem to want someone else to constantly smooth over every single life challenge they encounter...

Well then, great, if He did ask us, I suppose we're entirely responsible for everything that happens to us in that case too...

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

Anthony Perez9 said:Whether you call it Tao, the universe, the divine, or God—whatever—you used the word "dissonance" correctly to describe striking out against or moving away from Perfection. And sure, you can use your free will to act in harmony or dissonance with the "divine." I don't see how that contradicts Christian theologians.[/I]

You dodged the question. Is the concept of "free will" inherently good or bad? ☕

God creates this dissonance—this so-called free will—and builds it right into us, just so half of humanity can spend eternity in hell. It doesn't add up.

Personally, I think freedom is a positive thing; it’s basically living in the Tao, metaphorically speaking. Being in sync with the universe. Harmony isn't slavery. Christian theologians keep arguing that humans would just be robots if they lived in harmony with the Tao, so God had to install a "choice chip" for evil, aka free will. Seems pretty contradictory to me.

This is honestly the first time I've ever heard anyone suggest that Christian philosophers view free will as some kind of programming chip designed to push us toward evil. If we want to use technical language, free will is essentially just a binary switch between 0 and 1, and how you choose to flip that switch is entirely up to you! At the very least, you have the right to choose, so if you flip it toward the good, then free will is a wonderful thing, but if you flip it toward evil... well, that's your call again. Free will isn't some glitch in our genetic code that prevents us from functioning properly; rather, it's simply the capacity for choice: an "if-then-else" logic gate...
Overall, Anthony Perez9, I really think you might be misinterpreting Christian philosophy here, though I completely agree with you when you say that harmony isn't slavery (in Christian terms, slavery would be sin, or being bound to any form of evil)... basically, anything that stands in opposition to harmony—which Christians believe is God's perfect harmony—is considered slavery or evil. I don't see where the contradiction lies in your stance, other than your belief that free will was specifically designed to predispose us toward evil...

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

feralorca2 said:That’s exactly where the whole thing falls apart... you’ve got this one all-powerful, infinitely noble Creator supposedly running the show, yet He crafts a world filled with starvation, sickness, and endless wars—and the kicker is, He does it on purpose by design... It just makes zero sense to me, honestly. How can His supposed goodness coexist with the absolute chaos we see every single day as a direct product of His "grand design"... it’s totally contradictory...

Look, just listen to me... it’s all coming from the same place, straight from God... 😁

God gave humanity nothing but Goodness, but people turned their backs on that and embraced Evil instead. The state of the world today is the consequence of human choices driven by darkness, rather than any divine design. Or perhaps we need to circle back to the fundamental question: why did God grant us the freedom to choose in the first place? Why didn't He just create us as mindless robots, or simply wave a magic wand to fix everything the moment someone breaks the harmony of this perfect stage? Why give us the capacity to earn our own way, instead of creating us as finished products who never have to make a decision, living in a state of effortless perfection where everything just works without us ever having to lift a finger???
Or, if we want to push the logic even further, why did God decide to create anything at all? He really should have asked us for permission first—asked if we even wanted to exist, what kind of beings we wanted to be, and what we actually intended to do with our lives! I still haven't heard an answer to my question regarding what you believe a truly perfect world would look like for everyone, rather than just for those "finished products" who seem to want someone else to constantly smooth over every single life challenge they encounter...

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

Jesus existed as both fully human—body and soul—and fully divine, being the Son through His spirit. A profound part of His suffering was actually His voluntary choice to forgo the chance to manifest His divinity at the very last second to save Himself, even though such a thing would have been entirely possible for Him as God; instead, He consciously chose to embrace the fullness of the human experience, surrendering every fiber of His being to the will of God the Father. This was Jesus' deliberate decision: to remain truly human until the very end, to endure everything any person would face while dying on a cross, feeling utterly abandoned by everyone, even by the Father who required this sacrifice so that we might all be saved. In those darkest, most agonizing moments, it’s only natural that any human being—including the man that Jesus was—would cry out to God and question why there was so much agony, whether it truly mattered, or why He felt so distant and forsaken from His Father, yet on the other hand, Jesus God accepted this path because He knew exactly why He was doing it...

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

Anthony Perez9 said:If you live by the Tao, your will aligns with the universe. 😁
Going against the Tao isn't an act of freedom; it's just being out of sync with the "divine." As for free will, the way Christian theologians spin it feels like total nonsense—just some desperate apologetics meant to justify that snake in the Bible and the Creator.

Whether you call it the Tao, the universe, the divine, or God—whatever terminology you prefer—you hit the nail on the head by using the word "disharmony" to describe striking out against or drifting away from Perfection... And honestly, I don't see any contradiction with how Christian theologians view things, because you absolutely can use your free will to either align with or rebel against the "divine"...

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

feralorca2 said:I mean, doesn't everyone have potential, right? Isn't everyone supposed to be equal in His eyes? 🤷

God? Look, if He’s truly all-powerful, then He knows the beginning from the end, which means He consciously chose to design the world exactly like this.

But I have to ask, what would a "perfect" world actually look like to you? Would it be a world where humans function like programmed robots, incapable of ever making a mistake, or would it be a world where we possess true free will—where we stumble and fail, but possess the capacity to learn from those errors, guided by a God who offers eternal forgiveness and a fresh start every single time we mess up? Or perhaps you have some other vision entirely?...

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

feralorca2 said:Look, if He’s truly all-powerful, then what is there even to prove to Lucifer? I mean, he's stuck way beneath Him anyway... so why even bother?

Just, "righteous" and "love"? Give me a break... He didn't design this world to be like that. Honestly, it feels more like He built this whole place as a playground full of little dolls just for His own twisted, kinky entertainment...

That might hold some water if he hadn't also gone and invented the concept we call Free Will

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

feralorca2 said:Look, if He’s truly all-powerful, then what is there even to prove to Lucifer? I mean, he's stuck way beneath Him anyway... so why even bother?

Just, "righteous" and "love"? Give me a break... He didn't design this world to be like that. Honestly, it feels more like He built this whole place as a playground full of little dolls just for His own twisted, kinky entertainment...

That might be true, if He hadn't also seen fit to create what we call Free Will

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

bluebison25 said:God being all-powerful? Fine. But that "perfect order" He supposedly created? That's clearly only working for Him. It certainly isn't working for the rest of us. Take people living in the freezing tundra of Alaska who can barely think straight because of the cold, or families in drought-stricken parts of the Southwest struggling to find a single drop of water to grow crops. It's hard to swallow the idea that God provides perfection for everyone when they're just trying to survive. I can easily see why, for them, God doesn't seem all-powerful, just, or loving at all.

You’re describing the world as it exists today, rather than how it looked when the Creator first brought it into being... and I wonder, if you stop to think about it, who exactly is responsible for the way things have spiraled since then?

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Why did Jesus die? in Religion · Mar 30, 2012

God is indeed all-powerful, but more importantly, He is fundamentally just, always upholding the essential Law that He Himself established—which is essentially perfect love and an absolute sense of order and harmony woven into everything He created... this means that everything within the universe follows a clear pattern of cause and effect (just look at the story of Adam and Eve for a classic example). However, because God is Love, He chose to take the consequences of our failure to follow His perfect Law upon Himself, ensuring that we humans could still be His children while still honoring the justice required by the Law

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