Posts by Lawrence Bailey66

You’re talking about this whole thing like it was some massive brawl between American fans and Mexican fans, when really—it was just American fans versus the Canadian police.

The way you're claiming the security was top-notch—if we just ignore for a second that they weren't actually prepared for this specific game—is kind of like me saying the security for President Kennedy did an amazing job, even though the blame for the assassination lies with the assassin being too determined and the President just being in the wrong place at the wrong time. 🙄

massive29 said:Americans and Mexicans!

It honestly hurts to see all this hate flying back and forth between you guys—but seriously, just leave us Canadians out of it and focus your energy elsewhere. And hey, Lawrence Bailey66, tell me this: why should I be stuck paying taxes to train thousands of new cops just so you people can stop fighting each other? That money would probably cost more than fixing up the half-ruined stadium over in my neck of the woods. Honestly, until you guys settle your own business, even a whole battalion of Canadian police wouldn't be able to help. They just wouldn't have the motivation. I mean, what do you think goes through the mind of a SWAT officer when he’s staring down some animal screaming in his face, knowing he has a wife and kids waiting for him at home?

http://forumi.siol.net/topic.asp?TOP...50&whichpage=4
I can't really access that specific link—it looks like it might be a broken image gallery or a dead end. I guess if you were trying to show me some photos, they didn't quite make it through. Maybe try sending a different link? I'm happy to take a look once I can actually see what's going on.

🙂

Are you seriously telling me this like we forced you guys to host the European Water Polo Championship? I mean—if you weren't up for the task in the first place, why even bother volunteering to organize something like this? I guess it just seems like a lot of unnecessary trouble if you aren't truly capable.

You guys seriously have no clue what kind of infrastructure it takes to host a tournament where the finals feature teams like the USA and Yugoslavia. And then there's that comment—"Unless you settle things between yourselves, even a battalion of Canadian police won't help." I mean, come on. For people in Canada—which has a smaller population than Belgrade—is a police battalion really supposed to sound like some massive, intimidating force? I guess not.

Just some info for anyone interested—within the Belgrade area, there are five police brigades stationed. Two of them are more mobile—one handles crowd control during protests and the other is an armored mechanized unit. Then you have three non-mobile brigades made up of precinct officers and rapid response teams spread out across various city stations. Of course, you also have the Gendarmerie and the special counter-terrorism units to consider, but that’s a whole different conversation.

When there’s a massive high-stakes game coming up—say, a Yankees-Red Sox derby where you're expecting maybe fifty thousand fans, including ten thousand of those really intense, hardcore supporters—the police go into full high-alert mode. You've got specialized riot squads stationed right at the stadium and immediately around it, whose entire job is just keeping the peace. Then, you have regular patrol officers spread out all over the surrounding area, either stationary or on patrol, just tracking how the crowds are moving. All told, for a matchup like that, they usually deploy around 2,000 personnel—and if things get hairy, they can probably roll out another 3,000 fully trained, heavy-duty officers within an hour or so.

And one more thing—and I’m telling you this because I actually know what I’m talking about—it isn't just about the numbers involved, it's about the experience. Looking at those clips, I noticed right away that the security for the match was a total mess. The police didn't take any preemptive action at all. You had American fans climbing onto nearby rooftops, jumping over pool fences, getting into arguments with officers... and nothing. No proactive moves. Their response afterward was just slow, indecisive, and frankly, ineffective. It's honestly a miracle nobody died. If you've ever been part of a serious protest or a riot—or even just witnessed one—you know that before things actually boil over, the most aggressive groups will "test" the police. They're basically gauging how the cops will react once the chaos starts. In moments like that, decisive, preemptive action is everything. There shouldn't be any debating or talking it out; if someone refuses to move or won't drop to the ground immediately, they need to get a proper dose of a baton right there in front of everyone at the stadium. If the police establish who's in charge right at the start, you probably won't even get to a full-blown riot. Sure, it's harsh—innocent people might end up catching a blow too—but that’s just the risk you take when you align yourself with hardcore fans.

Let’s be real here—all of this happened because American fans clearly don't view the Canadian police as some major force, so they showed up in those numbers and acted accordingly. You said:

"...what do you think goes through the mind of a SWAT officer when he sees an animal screaming in his face, knowing his wife and kids are waiting for him at home?..."

I don't know, maybe—given the training your police force obviously receives—he just completely shuts down and imagines himself hiking up Mount Rainier while a light breeze hits his face? There isn't much for him to think about, my friend; his job is just to hold the line until the crowd settles down. Besides, in most decent police departments around the world, specialized units usually don't have wives and kids at home—they tend to start families after they quit that crazy line of work.

Lawrence Bailey66 said:Was it thirty people, or was it closer to 300 including the staff with credentials?

I mean, what if a few dozen Mexican fans were placed in the ceremonial parade just because the organizers ordered it? All day long, the American media and politicians have been pushing this narrative—suggesting that having a small group of Mexican supporters in the procession was actually the root cause of everything.

Instead of downplaying responsibility or trying to cover up an unprecedented incident—not to mention constantly comparing it to that other situation in Mexico—what Americans should really be doing right now is taking decisive action against all the different types of extremism that seem to be popping up everywhere lately.

Our hooligans showed up in full force too—basically a representative sample of the crowd—alongside Ministers Svilanovica and Tadica. 🙄

Man, I honestly haven't seen anything quite like yesterday in my entire life. I've witnessed plenty of hooliganism over the years—sports riots and all that—but seeing fans turn on their own national team like that? That was a first for me. I actually felt pretty bad for the US water polo players; they were getting pelted by plastic seats, and apparently, some of the insults flying at them from the US fans were... well, pretty intense.

Right from the jump, you could tell from the US ambassador's speech that this whole thing was turning into a massive conspiracy:

"...I’m begging you, please don't act like this. Don't let this ruin the game. Please, just calm down and cheer like decent sports fans. We can't have ourselves disqualified—we can't miss the World Cup. THEY ARE JUST WAITING FOR THAT TO HAPPEN. Please, don't do this to us. If the match gets called off, we lose..."

The whole situation had these moments that were almost darkly comedic. During the breaking news segment on PBS, the studio anchor tried to loop in our unfortunate reporter on the scene:

"Joe, what's going on over in Madison?"

"The US national team lost the match, but the real disappointment was the US fans—except they aren't even real fans! They're just thugs, just..."

*Crash, bang, boom, smash, crash, smash!* "Screw you! Kill the Mexicans!" *Bang, boom, bang!*

"Joe, can you hear me? Folks, it looks like we're having some technical difficulties!"

It got even more ridiculous when you read the report in The Washington Post:

"...During the clash between US and Mexican fans in the press box after the game, PBS commentator Joe Ozmec was also caught in the fray. He was reportedly assaulted by a Mexican fan who struck him in the back with a chair..."

Interestingly, Ozmec himself later told PBS—probably trying to avoid saying outright that he was jumped by the US fans—that, "I don't know who hit me, I didn't see, and honestly, does it even matter?"

"...Furthermore, the organizers' decision to allow Mexican fans into the press box was completely unacceptable. They were able to provoke the US fans while using journalists as a shield. This is precisely why PBS commentator Joe Ozmec was attacked..."

So, the Culprit behind the chaos has been identified: about thirty Mexican fans, waving flags and heckling from the media area where they were sequestered by order of the organizers, are directly responsible for what the US fans did—especially the part where they violently attacked Joe Ozmec, dragging him out of the press box and into the stands.

"...As for working in an environment where you have crazed Mexican fans jumping at your throat while waving some flag representing the old Yugoslavia right in your face... well, there's not much to say about that."

Those damn Mexicans—do they really have to wave their national symbols at every single game, even when they're playing for their own team?

The peak of cynicism—or maybe just stupidity—from the US media was an article, I forget which one, claiming that the chant used by the US fans was "nonsensical" because there weren't enough Mexicans or willow trees in Madison to make sense of it. I guess if there had been more Mexicans or more trees, the author thought the chanting would have made more sense? Pretty ridiculous logic.

There was also this strangely "charming" piece in another US paper where the writer emphasized three different times that the incident happened right under the nose of the Canadian Defense Minister, Boris Tadić. Of course, he was talking about the Mexican Defense Minister, Boris Tadić, not some Canadian official.

The only person who seemed to keep it together was the US Prime Minister, Račan; he was very firm and composed. I couldn't tell if that's just his personality, or if he finally realized just how messy this whole thing really was.

Cufo said:Greetings from Washington, D.C. Look, nobody actually died—one American just got impaled on some fence wire while climbing it. And that guy who fell from the press box? He just injured his spine, that's all. Fourteen guys are probably going to survive five days stuck in a hole.

I’m honestly just counting down the days until the Handball European Championship, so you guys can come over and tear our whole country apart. 😢

Since you guys come from such a highly developed nation, maybe by the time the Handball European Championship rolls around, you'll manage to train ten more specialists—that way you might actually have forty security guards on duty at the games.