Atheism vs. Spirituality: Zero Tolerance
in Spirituality ·
It’s not immaterial. It’s more like chemical-based signaling between biological entities, all driven by the basic need to survive and pass on their genes.
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Michael Castillo said:Fair enough, but where do the people in this thread actually fit?
(The ones who seem totally outgoing and socially adept to everyone else, yet subjectively feel completely alone?)
Thomas Nelson25 said:Psychology would argue everyone craves attention, though—what would Freud say about sublimation here? There’s definitely some truth to that...
But you gotta consider that some people just don't care for small talk or mindless socializing. Maybe they're just wise, or maybe that stuff drains them instead of fueling them... obviously, for others, it's a total necessity—like their brain needs it to function.
Adam Ross6 said:I don't think you even grasp what junk food actually is. It’s just a creative—read: fake—imitation of the real thing.
Basically, it’s total garbage.
It's a bold way to ignore the truth.
That "junk food" you're talking about? It’s just a concept of food, not actual nourishment.
Total spin doctoring.
Just plain old lies.
Pure poison.
Maria Robinson2 said:You picked up on a sharp detail there—comparing him to Jesus Christ.
I only pulled a few quotes from my book on Buddhism, but if I were to write out every comparison, it would be painfully obvious how much they try to frame Buddha through the canon. It seems like Buddhism tried to latch onto the Old and New Testaments—a rather clumsy attempt, really—specifically targeting that influence tied to the Pharisees during the early era.
It looks like modern Buddhists aren't particularly concerned with original teachings. It’s the standard story you see in just about every global religion, I suppose; what else is there to conclude?
Maria Robinson2 said:?
Look, what I cited in my previous post came from a Buddhist text, not a Hindu one.
You know what’s actually quite bizarre? Take the whole story regarding the Buddha's reincarnation—around 623 BCE—where "the same guy" has a son when he's 29, an event he finds deeply troubling because it's only then that he realizes everyone, without exception, is subject to birth, sickness, and death.
Does a person really need thirty years of life to reach that conclusion? Not really—it’s honestly pretty unbelievable, even considering how many centuries passed before or after the era, that someone with that level of (lack of) emotional maturity would come to such a realization. Because it was only then, at that age, that he actually began his wandering search in the style of a truth seeker (concerning suffering and all that).
I wonder, what would modern psychology make of a personality like that? I mean, given that Buddhism is treated somewhat like a psychological method in this day and age.
Anyway, I guess I'm curious about your take...
Thomas Nelson25 said:Can you give me a quick rundown on what Tantra is actually about? You mentioned it’s mystified—I get the whole magic through mantras thing, but it sounds more like a vehicle to steer the mind toward a specific state, right? I know a little bit—probably less than anyone else here, so bear with my "Tantric" questions—from reading some books written specifically for Americans. That’s not necessarily a bad thing if the author actually knows their stuff.
I read somewhere that Buddhists—like how Tibetans handle remains and leave them for vultures (saw a documentary once)—will sit near a corpse to cultivate awareness of impermanence and non-attachment. It's one of those key practices to free up the mind and body... honestly, it makes total sense.
Maria Robinson2 said:Exactly, there is symbolism involved—symbolism representing transferred meaning or significance for those who established it—which certainly suggests I didn't just invent these terms, don't get me wrong.
The Gospels, however, aren't really the "secret" part; rather, the mystery until then was the Messiah himself—his total role, which caught humanity by surprise (people weren't exactly expecting that specific performance).
But, that isn't really the point here, though perhaps it serves as a general answer to your question...
Actually, mystics wouldn't necessarily be the ones receiving divine revelation, but rather those who philosophized about God or the gods—more or less on their own, yet also influenced by an environment that believed mystics understood these matters better. Consequently, someone obviously had to step into the role of spiritual leadership, since humanity has been crying out for it throughout history. It's that whole "explain our universal suffering to us because we can't find the causes ourselves" thing.
There is an interesting point regarding Buddhism. Essentially, the teachings identified as authentic weren't entrusted to the written word, but were passed down through the memory of disciples. Because of that, sacred Buddhist texts had to wait quite a long time before being recorded. Generations later, it’s more than fair to ask how much of it became diluted or started taking on different forms. Today, Buddhism has so many branches that, in principle, none of them specifically address the question of "suffering"—because, honestly, everyone knows that suffering is just a built-in part of life, regardless of Buddhism; it isn't like Buddhism is the only one trying to answer that question.
Thomas Nelson25 said:hm, haven't seen that specific episode, but I do watch those kinds of documentaries.
Like, Zen definitely works in the West (Westernized Koans would be pretty wild), just modified to fit our headspace... the core of Buddhism stays intact. It's super hard to turn Nirvana (satori) into some New Age thing... you can speculate, sure, but then it's not really it... we're talking about the mysticism of reality itself... it's easy to see through the Thomas Nelson25 types. 😉
Thomas Nelson25 said:Look, if we're treating it as philosophy—since it seems like us Americans are just better at applying Buddhism when we lean into it as a sort of practical psychology (especially if we've got that moderate temperament)—then sure, it works. But if it's religion...
...well, then it's connected (like Hinduism, for instance). But that kind of stuff—totally detaching from the world and crushing all willpower and desire? That just doesn't sit right with the American mindset or how we view the purpose of life.
Susan Price30 said:Honestly, that sounds like one of the worst ways to exist. I’d much rather endure suffering and learn something from it than just live like a vegetable. It’s better to love and lose than to never have loved at all—isn't that basically what Kant argued? It certainly feels that way right now.
Does Buddhism actually teach people to just live like plants—just vegetating without any drive and drifting aimlessly through life? 😁
Or am I totally misinterpreting what Buddhism is about?
Michael Gonzalez77 said:If you haven't truly grasped the core principles, they're right—Buddhism can feel just as much like a cage as any other religion, especially since certain doctrines have become quite dogmatic.
I didn't just become who Siddhartha was on my own. It’s the same for Jesus, or anyone else who reached liberation. Everyone needs an initiation to get there, even if they don't realize it at the start—guided by the perfect teachers of that era.
Progress stops exactly where an individual stops. Doctrine is one thing, but direct spiritual experience is an entirely different beast. You simply can't extract Truth just by reading words on a page; those texts are merely signposts that you have to encounter personally through your own spiritual growth—assuming, of course, they were passed down correctly in the first place.
I wasn't trying to look at this through anyone's specific lens. I was just pointing out a universal phenomenon that gets overrated in Buddhism—mostly because so many people fail to take that final step toward their actual goal, mistakenly thinking Nirvana itself is the finish line. In other mystical traditions, this state is correctly viewed as just a stepping stone toward true Liberation. This is something all humans experience throughout history; you and I actually enter a version of "Nirvana" every single night while we sleep, we just aren't conscious of it. When someone enters that state of pure Consciousness, they are aware of nothing else, and that’s the bottom line.
Taylor Brown13 said:And why wouldn't I care? What kind of joke is that? As someone paying into the tax pool, I have every right to ask questions and flag any irregularities if an inspector finds them. Does transparency bother you? If so, explain yourself—not just to me, but to my readers too.