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Posts by shadowangler50

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You claimed those foreign shows are irrelevant just because they get remade in the States. You're wrong.
And that non-American films are boring to audiences? Wrong again.

Those are just your assumptions. I said they get watched sixty times more. I never said they were boring; I said they don't offer the same kind of entertainment as American productions, which is why the numbers differ.

An American series will never surpass a British one. They can only dream.

Which current British series are actually better than American ones?

We aren't splitting hairs here; we are discussing films and series, which means discussing authorship.

It isn't the same thing.
Theft is theft, but for a remake, the rights were bought legally and the deal was signed and sealed. There is a massive difference.

What, you can't prove that True Detective is a bad series, so you just label it worthless instead?
Does anyone actually care if an idea was stolen or purchased when they sit down to watch? They watch the quality of the show, not its origin story.
This is a question of art, not legalities.
Zachary Nguyen2 said:Doesn't every single show focus on human relationships?
What other shows are actually about animal interactions?

The show is about zombies, but the action and the undead elements are secondary—unlike those zombie movies where mindless action is the whole point. Given the subject matter, those human dynamics are naturally going to be front and center.

If you find that boring, that's your problem, not mine. And as for those comedies on your list? I've watched them, and I didn't laugh more than three times in an entire movie. You gave them a 7; I wouldn't even give them a 4. If you think they're funny, fine, but I don't.
Just like how you think any movies filmed outside the USA aren't worth a "person's" time.
No. By that logic, a plagiarism is still a plagiarism.

That’s not what I said. I said American films and series get watched more than foreign ones.
Furthermore, I stated that foreign films beat American ones, while American series beat foreign ones.

A remake is a remake, and theft is theft. Watch it and see for yourself.

We aren't debating legality here; we're talking about the quality of the show.
And if you want to be pedantic about whether it's a remake or straight-up plagiarism, the core issue remains: it isn't an original work.
bluenomad2 said:Interpersonal relationships are poorly written too. The Walking dead turned into a total soap opera ages ago. The pilot was the peak—it was directed by Darabont before he was forced out. No wonder the show fell apart.

Between the ratings and the quality... people were watching Vampire Diaries and other shallow nonsense.

Interpersonal dynamics only truly matter when you're facing extreme circumstances.
Zachary Nguyen2 said:Wow, they actually did a remake? 🤣
Let me tell you how much the Spaghetti Western genre blew up because of copying.
Go watch Yojimbo, then go watch A Fistful of Dollars.

How much more could they possibly rip off from the absolute legends? Even the Koreans aren't pushovers.
Zachary Nguyen2 said:☕

That show is built on interpersonal drama, not just mindless zombie killing.
Maybe your expectations for the series are just misplaced.
James Garcia50 said:Which ones are we talking about?

So? Isn't that exactly what I've been talking about?
Another remake, another adaptation... Does anyone even remember what the original was anymore?

Stolen. It’s more than just an idea; it's way more than that—kind of like True Detective.

I've only given you one adaptation.
So you're claiming an idea was stolen? That’s nothing more than your own assumption. By that logic, wouldn't every single detective movie or series be based on a stolen concept?
Even if it was stolen, does that actually make a series bad? If we're going to talk about originality, let's not forget that South Koreans remade Three Bad Men. Is that how it works?

There's still Boardwalk Empire, The Walking Dead, Fargo, True Blood, and Once Upon a Time on the list. Sure, they aren't all absolute masterpieces, but they definitely have their charms. Don't they?
James Garcia50 said:Besides, most of their ideas are just ripped off from European series or Asian films. They can't come up with anything original on their own.

Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad, True Detective, Mad Men. Which one of these supposedly has a stolen idea? House of Cards is an adaptation of a British series.
James Garcia50 said:@shadow,
I think Kenneth Johnson12 mentioned that the thread should have actually been titled:

Why has most of the audience shifted toward bingeing American TV series over American films in the last few years?

It’s because there are more high-quality series out there and far fewer quality films.
I don't see any other reason.
@James Garcia50

I don't have the time, nor can I see any point in continuing this.

This thread is poorly defined, and frankly, I'm not even sure what we're debating anymore.
Are we discussing what's popular, or what's actually good?
Quote : shadow
For some people—and I mean a lot of them—true entertainment means watching war and violence on screen. But let me tell you again: don't generalize. Not every American film is just "pure entertainment."
Who’s actually enjoying which film? It’s pure guesswork at this point.
What exactly does "a huge audience" mean to you? Are you suggesting a winner on NBC doesn't count if they don't have massive ratings?

We weren't even discussing genius. You flat out claimed that non-American films are "lesser," and that people only find them valuable because Hollywood production has brainwashed them.

I couldn't care less about how happy people were under Marshall's rule. I only care about films and series.
Take a look at those box office numbers. If a movie doesn't deliver actual entertainment, it's going to tank. Isn't that just common sense?
It’s common knowledge which genres draw the biggest crowds—the ones people actually turn to for entertainment. I'm not talking about every single person out there, just the majority. And let's face it, most American films are nothing more than pure entertainment.

I don't need to listen to ten million people claiming things were better under Marshall. A few hundred voices saying the same thing is more than enough to draw a conclusion.

Quote : shadow
You clearly have no clue what today's audience actually wants. When my hundreds of followers clash with your hundreds of fans of modern American film, it’ll be a fair fight.
I couldn't find your few hundred compared to my own several hundred. What exactly am I supposed to do with that?
It’ll drop from hundreds down to just a few dozen soon enough. We're looking at a sample where one side actually outweighs the other. This is where people with actual, differing opinions gather—not just a bunch of mindless echo chambers.

Quote : shadow
I figured it out, and frankly, far too well.
You didn't even allude to "my theory"; you stated it before you and I even started this debate. You began with the premise that modern American films are garbage, and since you apparently believe no films exist outside of the US, you jumped to the conclusion that movies are insignificant compared to series—American series, obviously, because in your world, nothing else exists. It's just not true.
It’s just the same old story: American movies and shows pull massive numbers while everything else gets ignored. We're talking about pure viewership here, not actual quality. Why does that even matter?

Quote : shadow
Are you kidding me? Negligible?
Half of all modern American series are just uninspired remakes of shows from Europe. Why can't anyone come up with an original idea anymore?
Americans are snatching up remake rights for Danish series before they even finish filming. Since the US dominates the global market and those creators are just playing in a much smaller league, isn't this just blatant industry bullying?

Exactly. When it comes to movies and series, quality should always be the benchmark. If you argue that most people just love garbage, aren't we just circling back to the era of Marshall?
And honestly, watching them is sixty times better than those Danish originals. Why even bother with the source material?
Most people just want entertainment, but there’s a massive difference between quality art and total garbage. That’s exactly why audience scores and critic ratings exist. Why else would we bother?
Quote : shadow
You're basically making this sweeping judgment that every non-American film is boring and fails to connect with "real people," which is why they reject them. Even those who claim to enjoy international cinema only do so because Hollywood churns out such garbage that a Romanian film suddenly looks good by comparison—even when it actually isn't. Is that really how it works?

Art is entirely subjective. The quality of any film or series really just comes down to the viewer's eye—and my eye, your eye, and his eye are all going to see things differently. Isn't that just how it works?
Movies are supposed to be entertainment; people watch them to unwind and relax, at least for the most part. American films are pure escapism, but since the plots are so recycled, they've become incredibly predictable and often insult the viewer's intelligence. They serve as entertainment, sure, but they fail to actually engage the audience on any meaningful level. Non-American films don't suffer from those specific flaws, yet they lack that mass appeal because their themes simply don't resonate with the general public. I'm not saying these movies are bad—I'm saying they aren't masterpieces.

And if you want me to prove it? I can't just throw a single number at you to settle this. It’s like trying to prove people were actually happier back in the Marshall era than they are now. But they were. They really were.

Let’s get one thing straight: I’m not talking about the quality of the films themselves. I am talking about current audience trends. I see this pattern clearly in a representative sample consisting of hundreds of regular moviegoers and series bingers. Why don't you provide an actual argument instead of just being contrarian?

Quote : shadow
What now? You personally called that new Hollywood film trash and insisted that TV series are better. Is that really your take?
Because they’re just trash. That isn't a matter of taste; it's a fact. If you try to excuse everything by calling it "subjective," then how are we supposed to distinguish between a good film and a bad one?
Maybe you didn't catch what I actually meant by that. I was addressing your theory that everything is just a matter of taste and can be excused that way. Well, it can't. There is a massive difference between having taste and being tasteless, and you can't pretend they're the same thing. You gain that sense through maturity and education; we all grow up learning the same fundamental values.

Quote : shadow
Spider-Man, Batman, and Hunger Games aren't exactly the pinnacle of world cinema, but I guess that's all you care about? Everything boils down to American films and US series for you, doesn't it? There are plenty of great shows outside the States, yet you stay conveniently silent about them.

I already said this, and I’ll say it again: high ratings don't equate to quality. Does a massive audience actually make a movie or series any good? Not necessarily.
I watch shows from France, Denmark, Finland, or whatever other foreign country, but they just can't compete with American series. Foreign productions are completely negligible compared to what we have here in the States. Honestly, the only thing that even comes close in terms of viewership is a soap opera.
We aren't discussing quality here. We are talking about audience reception as defined by the ratings.

Quote : shadow
I’m not dictating anything. I am simply responding to your opinion with my own. Is that really such a difficult concept to grasp?
Do we really want to turn this entire forum into a place where every single post is cluttered with some useless catchphrase? This is just my opinion.?
Sure, go ahead and throw in a cliché when you can't back up your point. There’s a massive difference between objective reality and whatever version of it you've decided to invent in your head.

Beauty is subjective, yet you’ve gone ahead and labeled every non-American film as tedious and boring tonight according to "people". I ask you again—which people, and how on earth do you know what they think?

What, you want me to list their full names and addresses? Try using Google for once, see how people actually live, and find some actual opinions.
This isn't CSI; I shouldn't have to hunt down bulletproof evidence.
Quote : shadow
I never said people... Most people? Hardly. Is anyone actually in control here? They actually think movies are better than TV series? Really?
It simply doesn't exist. What's the general consensus?In art, there is no such thing as a generalization. Why should there be?
You constantly claim that films are superior to series, and you present it as an absolute fact rather than just your own opinion. Is it really necessary to be so arrogant?
Everyone has some excuse ready, claiming it’s "art" or just a matter of taste. Is that really all there is to it?

Quote : shadow
They don't have them.
How can garbage actually impact the success of global cinema? Garbage is garbage, no matter how many people watch it.
Make up your mind. Is it actually garbage, or is it just a matter of taste that it's garbage?
Most people flock to these movies. Since when did popularity become a metric for quality? How can you be so sure they’re actually trash?

Quote : shadow
shadowangler50,
This isn't even about movies or TV shows anymore; it’s a fundamental clash of worldviews. Europe, Asia, and South America aren't just some "rest of the world." They aren't just sources for what you call "perfectly decent" films that you've unilaterally dismissed as boring and uninteresting to audiences. Which audiences exactly?

That "studio," shadowangler50, produces absolute masterpieces, but let’s be real—not every film is meant for everyone. And people aren't just some mindless, brainless mass controlled by a central headquarters in Hollywood like you seem to think they are.

So, you've basically written off global cinema just because it doesn't match the Hollywood standard, all while bowing down to Hollywood as if they're the sole arbiters of what counts as art? Are you serious?

Thankfully for us cinephiles, nobody gets to dictate what true art is.
Who are you to decide if the first few seasons of The Wire are boring? Who are you to claim it's the greatest show ever made, or that Game of Thrones is just some exhausting piece of trash? You’re lecturing me on taste and artistic opinion, yet you clearly don't respect them yourself.

Maybe the audience obsessed with Hollywood movies is smarter. Maybe those Hollywood films are geniuses and Korean cinema is just trash. But how do you actually prove that?
As you claim, that's what constitutes art. Art is defined by beauty, and beauty is entirely a matter of taste. De gustibus non est disputandum.

We’re just spinning our wheels here. Why are we wasting so much time on this circular debate?
This whole thread falls apart the second you look at the title. The term "everyone" isn't even defined, and the OP hasn't provided a shred of evidence to back up their claim.

The premise is imprecise. You should have said "most people," not "everyone." There isn't a single thing in this world that everyone can agree on.

Your sample size is way too small to draw these kinds of conclusions.
You can't just browse a couple of forums and websites and decide that the general public is "mostly satisfied" with series and dissatisfied with movies.
Movies and shows aren't judged en masse; every work stands on its own merit.

Your opinion and these arbitrary conclusions are just a drop in the bucket.
I stand by my view, and you stand by yours—the difference is you keep using the word "we" to justify your own perspective.

Making baseless claims about "universal acceptance" based on a handful of forum users doesn't constitute a global conclusion that "everyone prefers" series over movies.
In short, what you're writing isn't a "fact."

What exactly do you want me to provide? If there were a global survey with a billion participants, I’d give you the results.
All I can do is offer a sample, and then we can debate whether that sample is representative. You haven't offered anything to support your claim, whereas I've at least provided something.
My voice might be a drop in the ocean, and it might not matter since this is about quantity rather than quality.
Maybe my conclusions are arbitrary or my opinion is wrong, but at least I'm basing them on something. What are you basing your opinion on when you claim most people currently prefer movies over series?
The general consensus regarding the relationship between films and series is a factual reality. If you have a better way to determine this precisely, feel free to suggest it.

Many people (maybe including you) tend to equate "Hollywood" with "film," so they see all that Hollywood trash as film in a general sense.
Hollywood might have lost its luster (there's a separate thread on that), but films from France, Denmark, Belgium, Spain, Argentina, Japan, Taiwan, Thailand, and Korea are stronger than ever.


Hollywood churns out catastrophically bad movies—you watch fifteen minutes and you're already done—but those are the movies that get watched. They have the biggest budgets and, ultimately, the biggest impact on global box office success.
The rest of the world produces perfectly solid films, but they just can't pull in the massive audiences.
It isn't even a marketing issue; people simply aren't interested in the themes being explored, or the material isn't worth watching more than once.
To be honest, those are decent movies, but not masterpieces. It actually feels like people value them more than they deserve simply because Hollywood has nothing high-quality on its roster right now.
Maybe they'll become a major factor eventually, but for now, Hollywood is the main player and they set the rules.
I can talk about art all day, but without money, there is no art. Whoever provides the capital (Hollywood) dictates the art.

Audiences and critics don't always see eye to eye; when it comes to truly brilliant works, their opinions can drift as far apart as ships on the ocean.

High viewership doesn't mean a thing.
Look at an old American sitcom like *All in the Family*. It pulled massive numbers. Critics tore it apart, yet audiences celebrated it as one of the greatest shows ever. Where is the weight in those numbers?
They don't have to agree, but what happens if they do? Surely, that carries some weight that shouldn't be ignored or dismissed as irrelevant.
I've said it at least three times now: popularity alone isn't enough to judge a movie or a series. But if you have audience approval as the first condition, critical acclaim as the second, and high viewership as a third supporting factor, then you have a rock-solid foundation.

That show isn't even a series; it's just a collection of movies. They are comedies aimed exclusively at men. There’s no deep point or hidden message to debate here. It’s purely a matter of taste—do you like crude humor or not? The public likes it, the critics don't, which means it lacks universal appeal. Both sides have a valid argument.
If you were looking for me to validate your theory using an example, you should have brought up *The Sopranos*. That show hits all three conditions. The other example only meets two, and it's missing the most important one.
But why should I bother proving its importance? What's the point? I already stated that judging any single film or series ultimately comes down to personal taste.
We aren't here to debate the quality of one specific title; we are discussing the general attitude of the public toward films and series as a whole.
No.
We aren't debating whether series are watched more than movies, because nobody has provided any actual proof for that.
Broad generalizations don't hold water here; you can only judge on a case-by-case basis.

Individual opinion is all that matters, because deciding to watch a movie or a show is a choice made by you and you alone. We don't pick what to watch based on reading various forums or seeing who's right; we choose based on our own aesthetic standards.

When we're talking about art rather than politics, a consensus carries zero weight or value. You, shadowangler50, can call a film bad if you back it up with arguments. No single film or series is going to be good for everyone. Providing an argued opinion isn't an insult to the director or your interlocutor. When I evaluate a film or a series, your "others" have nothing to do with me; I don't need a consensus in art.

The topic is why people seem to prefer series over movies lately. So, we aren't discussing raw numbers—whether more people have watched one or the other (which is impossible to determine since they aren't even the same format)—but rather whether people believe series are better or higher quality than movies today.

I'm not talking about individual movies or shows where opinions vary wildly and mostly come down to taste. Even taste is relative when determining if something is "good" or "bad." You might like a film or you might not, but that doesn't mean it's objectively bad or good. Simply put, some films are crafted so well that you might still dislike them, but you can't call them bad. And vice versa.

I am talking about movies and series in a general sense: is the audience more satisfied with one or the other? Based on the people I know, the forums, and the various US entertainment sites that cover this industry, much more attention is being poured into series.
There are far more comments on news regarding currently popular movies than there are on the latest series. And even when news breaks about older films, there are still way more comments compared to the newest ones. There is also a constant sense of dissatisfaction with current movies, whereas audiences seem largely satisfied with series.

So, I am talking about the current state of movies and series and the public's relationship with them. We aren't arguing about whether you personally prefer movies or series; your voice is just a drop in the ocean and means nothing regarding this specific question. We aren't voting or making decisions by majority rule; we are simply stating the factual situation.

As for evidence, just look at the number of series and movies that have been almost universally acclaimed by both audiences and critics over the last few years and compare that to previous eras. We've never seen this many series and so few movies in our current era.

There is no such thing as a "peak" film or a "peak" series, nor should they be used to drive anything. Some people love one thing, others love another; there is no collective yardstick when it comes to the quality of film or TV productions.

Certain films and series have had a massive impact on the evolution of cinema and on people in general. Many projects would never exist if they hadn't been inspired by ideas from those specific works. Mediocrity is never a role model, and nothing of value ever comes from it.

If a show stays relevant for years on end, it’s probably just some cheap soap opera.

High ratings don't automatically guarantee quality. However, when a series manages to win over both the critics and the general public while pulling massive numbers, that actually carries some weight.
Ratings are just one more variable that might—or might not—reflect how good a show really is.
James Garcia50 said:There have been three or four movies based on Tolstoy’s Anna Karenina, and none of them hit the mark.
I think there was an American series made too, but I wouldn't bet on it being any good.
The thing is, Tolstoy—just like Stephen King—doesn't play well when you try to move his work to a different medium.
You can film it, but it’ll never feel right (if you don't believe me, just look at Under the Dome).

Anna Karenina isn't exactly tailor-made for the screen, but lately, any modern adaptation of a classic seems worse than the originals. Just compare this latest version of Romeo and Julia to the one starring Leonardo.
Mini-series are clearly the only way to go for stories like this. You can't cram a 500-page novel into a two-hour movie; those films need to be at least four hours long to actually matter.
When I think about what they did to The Last Legion, it makes my stomach turn. They took a 450-page book with massive potential and crushed it into a mindless 90-minute mess. It's pure robbery.
James Garcia50 said:You're wrong, shadow.
The whole point of a debate is having a stance that's at least somewhat backed by logic.

That bolded part is total nonsense. You can't compare a movie to a series any more than you can compare a heart to a kidney. And honestly? I don't care if people agree with me; I'm not running for Congress, I'm just a film buff.

With the internet, almost everything is available to us now. We all have the chance to watch them; it's just a matter of choice. Popularity isn't quality—I mean, plenty of people saw Titanic, but that doesn't automatically make it a masterpiece.

We are discussing why series are more watched or, more accurately, more accepted than movies today. Individually, you can't compare a single series to a single film, but generally speaking, one can conclude which medium provides higher quality content.
You talk about argumentation, yet you haven't provided a single actual argument other than your general opinion that series aren't better than movies right now. Some users have cited specific series, but you haven't cited a single film.
An individual's opinion might be irrelevant, but the consensus of a large group of people forms a perspective that actually carries weight regarding the subject at hand. If a huge number of people share an opinion, that opinion holds significance. Otherwise, I could just call The Godfather a bad movie and justify it by saying I personally hated it. Suddenly, I’d be right and everyone else would be wrong.
The problem with movies is that we haven't seen a true masterpiece shake up cinema in over a decade. There have been good films, sure, but nothing legendary. In contrast, we've seen an unprecedented surge in top-tier series.
If everything is available to us, we choose what to watch, and logically, you pick what is better. It's possible for something to be overrated and not deserve its popularity, but that mostly applies to movies because people watch them regardless of whether they like them since they are short. With series, people keep watching only if they actually enjoy them. If a massive audience watches the same series for five years straight—especially given today's endless supply of options—then that series is undeniably high quality.
James Garcia50 said:Rectify, check it out. Two seasons are out and it's great—you'll love it.

Gotta go scrape together a list once I find my notepad.

Not everyone wants dry realism...

Would a series based on a Tolstoy novel even be worth remembering?

I was just using that to show how poorly they adapt classics these days, compared to how much better they were handled twenty years ago.
Besides, a limited series would definitely be superior to a single movie.
James Garcia50 said:I don't care about comparisons like that.
Checking box office numbers before a movie doesn't change my mind if the lead actor is a jerk. And I don't read reviews either.
My take on movies and shows is mine alone, based strictly on what I watch.

It’s the exact same story with TV series—pandering to kids and the lowest common denominator of an uneducated mass.

Anyone can claim their opinion is unique, but that doesn't make it right. What's the point of this discussion if everyone just sticks to their own subjective views? Without a standard, how would we ever distinguish a great film from a mediocre one?

Name a few modern movies you think outshine today's series and see how many people actually agree with you.
But name some classics—films that actually shaped cinema, things most people have seen and that left a lasting legacy. Series and movies that only a handful of people ever watch don't leave any mark on the industry or the culture.
Carl Hill53 said:shadowangler50, look, it’s just the truth of the matter. I mean, if I’m being generous—and I usually am—we barely get maybe ten decent movies a year on a global scale that are actually worth sitting down for.

Since we’re already talking about series, I have to mention this one mini-series I find myself revisiting every few years—mind you, I’ve always been a massive fan of Dumas. It is quite simply a perfect adaptation!

The Count of Monte Cristo

And honestly, if you draw a parallel to the movie The Count of Monte Cristo, you realize the film is absolutely nothing compared to the series. I was actually genuinely shocked to see it holding such a high rating 😲

But... yeah, the series is incomparably better.

I watched that series a few years back, and it’s a fantastic adaptation of the book. The movie? Nothing special.
Just look at the latest Anna Karenina film; it's a prime example of how catastrophically they handle these stories nowadays.