Posts by jadetinker85

northerntiger9 said:That doesn't hold much weight—especially regarding high schoolers or older generations living outside of major hubs like New York City. Back when I was in college, there wasn't really any other path besides teaching—it just wasn't an option. We all finished those degrees because there weren't any smart alternatives. Some actually ended up staying in the classroom, but most didn't.

When I was in school, everything had two paths: teaching or non-teaching. That went for everything from chemistry and biology to math, history, and English.

Drew Gonzalez75 said:I know all about subject-specific teaching, and the only people heading into those schools are the ones who couldn't find anything better to do.

Look, subject-specific teachers are people who actually went to college for an education degree. Does that mean anything to you?

Bryan Wells11 said:Exactly. This just goes to show how completely detached the Department is from reality and what’s actually happening on the ground. The idea that people will just swallow increasing levels of stress in exchange for a measly thousand or two more on a salary that’s already among the lowest for those with a Master's degree—it’s just not realistic.

And no, things aren't getting better. These days, when doctors, nurses, and judges demand (and likely receive) better working conditions, they get attention. But for education? Right at the start of these stretched-out, delayed negotiations, they were told there was no justification for asking for more money because—get this—"the cost of living hasn't risen." Etogac.

Apparently, the cost of living only went up for judges, and nobody else. 😁

Lisa Parker34 said:And maybe B2 if anyone actually wants to work... I think the goal here is just to make it look like math teachers in elementary schools are "earning" more than everyone else. It's a way to lure young mathematicians into the Department. But they won't mention the catch—the increased teaching hours and contact time. Where does the rest of the workload go? Realistically, this might bump up some salaries, but it saves the Department money because a whole bunch of people will just end up unemployed... some win, some lose. A smart move... on their part... at our expense.

School math teachers are essentially just there to offset the benefits they're planning to cut anyway.

mellowskipper said:Well, honestly, democracy isn't really a thing here either—it's pretty obvious whose word carries the weight, and going against them... well, it's probably not good for one's career.

If the principal doesn't agree, I don't see how you're planning to pull this off. The principal represents the school, and without their signature, nothing moves forward.

So hiddenseal14 is just going to report everything herself, bypassing the principal. Her own school plus another 40. Like Ali Baba and his 40 thieves.😁

Larry Walker24 said:From The New York Times:

Applications have been extended until May 5th.

So far, 17 schools have signed up.

Lincoln Elementary School is definitely going to be in on this.

Nothing's been decided at Springfield Elementary School yet; they're holding another meeting.

Drew Gonzalez75 said:Alright, genius, why don't you explain exactly what’s wrong with my statement? Are you suggesting teachers need rest because, what, they work with kids? What about the rest of us working long hours—is our job somehow less exhausting than teaching children?
Maybe they’re just looking to pad their years of service toward a pension. If that's the case, what were they even doing in the classroom if they found the kids so impossible to deal with?☕ I suppose I should have seen it coming. Teachers College is actually an incredibly demanding school—it’s right up there with MIT when it comes to being a target for jokes. It’s a classic cycle: you spend all your time complaining about the workload at college, only to carry that exact same attitude into your career. You moan about the stress, then complain that the job isn't fulfilling enough. It never seems to be enough.

If they want to go work somewhere else, let them. Honestly, I’m just worried about how much bread they’d burn through with all that "hard work" they claim to be doing—unless, of course, you count the rare exceptions. As for full-day schooling, it’ll happen eventually. People can cry and complain all they want, but it won't change anything. Even Bloomberg's mother couldn't talk his way out of certain realities, so why should these people be any different?

I’d love to lock myself in a classroom with those kids for a week just to show everyone who thinks nothing happens in schools. 😁

Notice I didn't make any comparisons to other professions. And yes, obviously surgeons need rest. But presumably, whoever runs the system organized it so there are enough surgeons available to allow for that rest?

By the way, I support early retirement benefits for anyone working in vocational schools. I spent a year working in one, and what an experience that was.

frozenangler9 said:Honestly, I’m disgusted. I teach math—hourly contract, too—and even though I’m not that far from retirement, I’m seriously considering retraining and just getting out of education entirely. Math teachers have always been overworked as it is, regardless of having a slightly lighter load. Between the endless piles of tests that require actual focus to grade, the mandatory overtime, and the constant retakes... it's a lot. If this actually happens, who is even going to be qualified to teach math? My guess? Nobody.

If they want to bury Americans and math teachers under this kind of workload, they should go ahead and cut the number of exams, assignments, readings, essays, presentations, and projects that need reviewing.
How can Americans and math teachers be expected to carry the same or more hours than subjects where you don't even have to grade written work?

ironjackal said:Most kids are already stuck in a single-shift schedule:
"While roughly one-third of schools in America operate on split shifts, nearly two-thirds of all students actually attend them." Or am I looking at different statistics here?

The ultimate goal—from as far back as I can remember—has been to get everyone onto a single-shift schedule, regardless of whether we implement full-day schooling or not. And if you ask any student or parent currently dealing with split shifts, I’d bet my bottom dollar most of them hate it—it’s a logistical nightmare. If parents aren't home in the morning, extracurriculars have to be pushed to the evening, which they rarely are. Plus, given how the youth population is shrinking, while the number of schools and teachers is actually rising, moving toward a single shift is clearly where we're headed.

So, honestly, this whole debate about split shifts is a total red herring when it comes to this specific topic (full-day instruction).

Maybe I’m misreading the data, but if about a third of schools are running split shifts, those campuses are likely packed. You end up with double or even triple the student density compared to single-shift schools. Essentially, a much larger chunk of the student population is dealing with that shift schedule.

The goal should have been single-shift schooling a long time ago—independent of how much instruction happens daily. From what I’ve gathered from students and parents dealing with split shifts, most people hate it. It just doesn't work. If you're on the morning shift, there are no parents around during the day to help out, which means any extracurriculars or activities get pushed to the evening. You almost never see anything scheduled in the morning. And given how much the birth rate is dropping across the country... The number of schools and teachers has climbed, too.That’s definitely where things are headed.

So, the whole thing about shifts has nothing to do with this topic (the all-day sessions).

It’s a massive range of jobs. You've got the service sector—hospitality, tourism, retail—where afternoon shifts are standard. Then you move into essential services like doctors, pharmacists, dentists, police officers, and firefighters, where shift work isn't just common, it's the rule.

rowdypanther12 said:A lot of sports are only scheduled for the afternoon, which is why Sky Sports carries them.
My little girl only has availability in the afternoons too, so when school runs late, she ends up missing her practice.

But then again, plenty of sports aren't limited to just the afternoons. Swimming isn't, water polo isn't, soccer isn't, tennis isn't... I'll have to check how skating works... usually offered in both shifts. https://www.usahockey.com/schedule/
Ice hockey is the same story.

mellowskipper said:Well, personally, I think a single-shift schedule might actually be better for my kid, mostly because of their sports commitments.

Look, there’s just no logic to it. If everyone switched to private sessions, we'd run out of space instantly. There wouldn't be enough fields, pool lanes, or coaches to handle everyone at once.
Think about it. You have two soccer fields—how are you supposed to train the U-10s, the U-14s, the high schoolers, and the varsity kids all at the exact same time? Or take a few tennis courts: how do you manage 20 players simultaneously when they used to have staggered schedules throughout the day? Even with an ice rink, you can't just cram every group that used to use the morning and afternoon slots onto the ice all at once.

Drew Gonzalez75 said:And I suppose surgeons and other doctors don't need rest? They can just work shifts and call it even? 😵

What are you even talking about? I’m definitely not on board with single-shift schooling, and there are plenty of reasons why. It messes with everything—from how local music schools and youth sports leagues operate, to parents working afternoon shifts who'll barely see their kids until the weekend.

wanderingbadger44 said:I find myself nodding along with this sentiment.
It feels like a much-needed shift toward balance, ensuring elementary teachers carry a workload comparable to subject specialists, all while maintaining the invaluable advantage of working with small, intimate classes of about twenty students rather than being thrown into massive lecture halls of 120 to 300 kids depending on the schedule.

Generally, I wouldn't want to pile more onto any teacher than they already have. You can't work with kids if you're burnt out. Finn understood that perfectly.
Just look at how much they're going to load up the history and math departments.

mistydrifter73 said:Duh. No way.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_..._duty

What was the reaction? People from Charleston tend to be pretty proud of their history.

mistydrifter73 said:Found this in a Facebook group. These were some choice words from Josip Burušić (the special advisor to the Secretary of Education regarding all-day schooling) at a meeting for CDŠ in San Francisco:

"...there’s been way too much laziness."
"If you enjoyed yourselves, then fine, you enjoyed yourselves..."
"Things have been easy for you long enough; it's about time you actually started doing something."
"I honestly don't know why you guys even get a paycheck. If it were up to me, I wouldn't give you a dime."
"Teachers have gotten used to coasting, and now that they actually need to work, suddenly it's an issue."
"The only people showing up to the public forums are the ones who aren't working. I personally checked their teaching hours to see for myself."

Nothing beats feeling like your hard work is actually recognized. 🎉 😍

Safe to assume he's never spent a single day in a classroom.

Susan James said:Someone once told me that full-day programs are really designed for kids whose parents work late shifts. Without those programs, they'd just be waiting around for their parents to get home around 9 or 10 PM, and at least with school care, they're supervised during the day rather than being left alone.🤦

Honestly, I don't quite get why everyone assumes a parent needs to be right there helping with schoolwork. If people want that level of support, they can pay for the full-day option. There are plenty of kids in first grade who are already pretty independent, and by fifth grade, that independence is basically expected!

Besides, at least with split shifts, they're together in the mornings. And don't even get me started on music lessons or local sports leagues—they won't have enough room to take everyone if everything is pushed to the afternoon.

rowdypanther12 said:

I think I might have made a typo there. My apologies. rowdypanther12 says:
And I still have to cram lunch in there, too.

It’s not just about lunch; I mean having more frequent breaks and some extra downtime too. 🤣
I honestly don't get how someone who can't even grasp basic math is running the Department of Education. 🤷 Even the journalists aren't asking him anything. Why hasn't anyone pressed him for the exact numbers?
Mr. Secretary Fuchs, how exactly do you expect us to squeeze 33 hours of regular classes, lunch, and all that extra tutoring into an 8:00 AM to 2:00 PM schedule?

Probably because Divjakica designed the curriculum, and since she's a mathematician, they assumed everyone could handle addition and subtraction up to 50. 🤷

rustyowl7 said:I recall during a discussion regarding this very issue, a supporter of CNBC argued that quality matters far more than quantity.
But let's look at the reality: if the kids are in school until 3:00 PM, and I am working an alternating shift from 2:00 PM to 10:00 PM, I wouldn't see them at all. I simply refuse to accept that trade-off. With the current schedule, we actually share the same block of time...

My hairstylist made the same point. She doesn't get home until 9 PM, so weekends are basically all she has left for family.

rowdypanther12 said:I'm honestly not sure. 😂
Students who don't have electives are looking at about 27 hours a week—that's basically two days ending at 1 PM and three days ending at 12 PM.
Those taking things like foreign languages, computer science, or religious studies end up with 33 hours a week, which means at least three days until 2 PM and two days until 1 PM.
And that’s all assuming they don't try to pack extra credit or supplemental classes into that mandatory block, 😁
leaving absolutely no gaps in the schedule. 😁

Then there's the issue of squeezing lunch in there somewhere.

rowdypanther12 said:That basically means they're going to cut hours since kids are already getting out of school by 1:00 or 2:00 every day anyway.

How do they actually plan to pull that off?