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If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jul 3, 2009

Betty Morgan5 said:look, it's not like I was asking anyone to step in and save me... I've already come to the conclusion that I'm a lost cause!
and it really has nothing to do with you, so don't sweat it! it's my own business, and I'm sure you've got much more important things to deal with anyway...

I just can't quite wrap my head around why you'd choose to undermine yourself with that kind of mindset...
As for having something more productive to do, I tend to view whatever I'm currently focused on as my primary job, but if you aren't looking for a second opinion, that's entirely up to you 🙂

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jul 3, 2009

Betty Morgan5 said:mm... I'm just way too overwhelmed for all that!
but I suppose I could try, though what if absolutely nothing changes?
what if I end up right back where I started, having achieved nothing except giving myself a bunch of false hope!
🤷

Well, if that's the case, what's there to complain about? If you aren't willing to put in the work for yourself, why should you expect the rest of the world to go out of its way to please you?

Betty Morgan5 said:mm... I'm just way too overwhelmed for all that!
but I suppose I could try, though what if absolutely nothing changes?
what if I end up right back where I started, having achieved nothing except giving myself a bunch of false hope!
🤷

It seems a bit difficult to find any motivation to change when you're already so terrified of failing at the attempt itself.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jul 2, 2009

Betty Morgan5 said:Well, I probably wouldn't have pulled it off! At least, that's my take on it anyway...

So, if you swap out that hesitant "I think I might" for a more certain "I know I can," and then apply that shift to every passing second you spend reading this, everything changes. Start by holding onto that conviction during the smallest tasks—like just washing your hands, for instance—and then gradually expand it to the bigger, more significant moments in life. It’s almost laughably simple, really; just letting that flow of positive momentum take over, and you might find your whole world shifting for the better. 👍

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jul 2, 2009

Betty Morgan5 said:If you died, would you actually want to come back?
Hell no... it's that simple... I honestly hate my life so much right now that I’d rather just end the whole thing this very second!
What do you mean, "come back"?😢

Well, you’re the one who decides how your life unfolds, isn't that right? The question of returning isn't really about wanting to jump back into your current circumstances, but rather whether you'd choose to return to this dimension and its freedoms in general.
And since we have the agency to shape our own lives, I can't help but wonder why you've allowed yours to settle into a shape that doesn't suit you; why not just shake things up and take some decisive action to change it?

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 28, 2009

jadeskipper7 said:Not sure if everyone has moved on from this topic, but it still interests me, so...
I wanted to answer you, but then it hit me: you didn't actually mention the alternative. If I'm choosing what to do, what is the other option?

hmmm, thanks for pointing that out...
Well, when I talk about an alternative, I'm really referring to whatever someone expects to encounter once they pass away—which was the whole point of starting this thread—so for me, the alternative would be existing in some sort of spiritual dimension where everything is perceived purely through the mind. It would essentially be the same as our physical reality, except you aren't tethered to matter, meaning you could go wherever you want, think whatever you want, and move however you please, though you'd be entirely alone in that experience because there's no way to know if what you're seeing is another being or just a trick of your own imagination...
from what I understand of Buddhist teachings, that’s roughly how the spiritual realm is described, and I suppose that's precisely why achieving enlightenment during one's physical life is even possible...

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

Sandra Morgan2 said:Neo, you're getting worked up over nothing... It's better to doubt than to settle into complacency. Doubt leads you to reality; complacency eventually leads to frustration.

Morpheus: I imagine that right now you're feeling a bit like Alice. Tumbling down the rabbit hole?

Neo: You could say that.

Morpheus: I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why you're here. You're here because you know something. What you know, you can't explain. But you feel it. You felt it your entire life. That there's something wrong with the world. You don't know what it is, but it's there. Like a splinter in your mind -- driving you mad. It is this feeling that has brought you to me. Do you know what I'm talking about?

Neo: The Matrix?

Morpheus: Do you want to know what it is?
(Neo nods his head.)

Morpheus: The Matrix is everywhere, it is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it when you look out your window, or when you turn on your television. You can feel it when you go to work, or when you go to church, or when you pay your taxes. It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth.

Neo: What truth?

Morpheus: That you are a slave, Neo. Like everyone else, you were born into bondage, born inside a prison that you cannot smell, taste, or touch. A prison for your mind. (long pause, sighs) Unfortunately, no one can be told what the Matrix is. You have to see it for yourself. This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back.
(In his left hand, Morpheus shows a blue pill.)

Morpheus:You take the blue pill and the story ends. You wake in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. (a red pill is shown in his other hand) You take the red pill and you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes. (Long pause; Neo begins to reach for the red pill)

Remember -- all I am offering is the truth, nothing more.

(Neo takes the red pill and swallows it with a glass of water)

Why do you keep coming after me directly? Could you perhaps frame this more abstractly, like a passing thought, similar to how most people here tend to communicate? Because by targeting me specifically, you trigger a response from me that you then misinterpret as anger.
And honestly, what makes you so certain you know what's "better" for me, or why you're convinced I'm just being complacent instead of questioning things? I'm not actually emotionally attached to this inquiry; I'm genuinely just curious about the reasoning behind your perspective.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

ironharbor8, thanks so much! 🙂

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

gentletiger20 said:I can even make the comparison because I’m coming at this from the exact same angle—just looking at life where people are terrified of dying, yet they can't exactly "return to life" since they're already stuck in it... if that makes sense. That's really all there is to it. They eventually just make a quiet, unspoken decision to avoid death altogether, but you can be damn sure nobody's making a comeback from the grave back into the living...

To get back to the heart of this misunderstanding:

gentletiger20 said:By the way, that isn't quite right; nobody is asking us to return because we haven't actually gone anywhere.

From a physical standpoint, sure, you haven't gone anywhere. But spiritually, you can depart whenever and wherever you please, into any dimension you desire.
So, strictly in material terms, you're correct.

gentletiger20 said:We don't leave because people dread change; they fear it, and there's no greater shift than the one you're describing.

Fear of change—or indeed, the entire experience of change itself—is entirely a matter of one's state of mind.

Physically, you stay put, so there is no tangible movement. Yet, spiritually, you are departing constantly, provided you have reached the maturity to realize it and embrace the shifts that come with it, since true experience tends to dissolve fear.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

gentletiger20 said:@rapidrider3
I guess it all depends on how you view life and whatever comes next... personally, I’m not really buying into that whole "good people go to heaven, bad people go to hell" thing. And honestly, I don't think someone doing shady stuff is necessarily having the time of their lives just because they think there won't be any consequences later...

@Michael Moore3
How is that even contradictory?
Look, we aren't dead yet, so we can't exactly decide whether or not to come back to this life—there's no vote on returning. Death and rebirth are basically the biggest shifts a human being ever goes through. People just freak out when things change on that scale...

It isn't a contradiction because you can't really compare them; one is a spiritual perspective while the other is purely material.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

rapidrider3 said:There isn't even much to debate here, right? Accept it or not, if someone spent their life doing terrible things, why would they expect to just waltz away from all that wreckage now? You can fight it all you want, but God is going to bring you right back around to fix it—to make sure you actually learn that's not how you live.

If you aren't looking for an out, then just don't go around causing chaos in the first place. Then you won't have anything to fear.😁

It doesn't quite seem like there's some sort of intermediary deciding your fate, especially not some entity called "God."
we decide for ourselves whether we'll embrace the return or not, though the real issue is whether we're actually aware of that choice. It’s somewhat like standing on the edge of the Atlantic and asking yourself if you truly want to swim across—assuming that's where your path continues—or if you'd rather stay put. There is no middleman involved. The question is whether you possess enough presence of mind to even ask yourself that in the moment, or if you're so blinded by whatever anxieties you carry that you rush blindly into the surf, only to be shocked when you encounter something like a jellyfish. That's what happens to "bad" people; the "evil" acts they committed throughout their lives have essentially hollowed out their spirits to the point where they view everything as a threat. Such a person suffers constantly because of their own actions, unable to see the transition from the material to the spiritual because, for them, everything feels like a horror movie... but it’s all just a matter of perception, and that can shift in a heartbeat.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

gentletiger20 said:btw, that's not even really true. Nobody's asking us to move back because we haven't actually gone anywhere... and we aren't leaving because people just hate change. They're terrified of it. And let's be real, this is probably the biggest shake-up anyone could ever imagine.

Well, I suppose it isn't true if you're looking at things through a purely material lens...

gentletiger20 said:btw, that's not even really true. Nobody's asking us to move back because we haven't actually gone anywhere... and we aren't leaving because people just hate change. They're terrified of it. And let's be real, this is probably the biggest shake-up anyone could ever imagine.

...and there you have it, offering up wisdom that holds true from a spiritual perspective.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 22, 2009

Sandra Morgan2 said:
No, Michael Moore3, I wouldn't go back...

I’d thank God and just dissolve into Him—or maybe ascend to some higher plane altogether. You know, get some wings, grab a harp, all that stuff...

What kind of place is this, really? Look, I get it. Having a cold beer, a plate full of great food, someone warm to hold, jumping into a pool to splash around like you said... it sounds lovely. But let's be real: it’s hard to actually enjoy any of it. You can't drink too much because then you're sick—instead of feeling good, you're vomiting and your body feels toxic. You can't eat too much because the stomach is just one tiny little pouch; it can't handle everything your eyes want to see, and besides, you'll just end up overweight, unattractive, and unhealthy.

And travel? If traveling is your joy, you're stuck. You have to work so much just to fund it. Even people doing what they love spend an absurd amount of time working just to maintain a decent standard of living, or even just to exist...

You can't party too hard because you won't be able to function the next day. And sex? What about that? You can't overdo it there either—the average orgasm lasts maybe ten seconds...

And then what? In a few decades, your body will be old and worn out. You'll be popping antacids just to digest a meal, dragging old bones around the house, seeing the spark fade, and hearing your grandkids say, "Come on, Grandpa, move out of the way!" You'll just be waiting for game over, bothering everyone with stories about your wild youth. Then you leave, and your new persona pops up in this world again—back to diapers, starting from scratch, boring school, college, hunting for a job, finding a partner, reproducing, working and working just to sustain it all, with the occasional dip in a pool to make it feel worth it...

Hello, Michael Moore3... what's wrong with the picture?

Look, I'm not a depressive by nature. Honestly, life is beautiful—the bunnies, the streams, the sky, the ocean, traveling, dancing, eating, and hooking up... the challenges and all that. It's sweet. Life on Earth has its charms, and like little ants, we adapt to everything. But at the same time, it's all just a meaningless hamster wheel where there's more suffering than joy. And that's why
I'm choosing the one-way ticket. No return trip for me.
Thanks...

I wasn't actually planning on replying to your post, as I started this thread specifically to let people share their perspectives without getting into debates, but since you directed your comment toward me, I suppose I should offer my own take:
what acts as light to one person might be darkness to another; what serves as nourishment for one could be poison for someone else; what one person considers trash is treasure to another, and what feels like a chore to some is pure joy to others.
it all comes down to perception. if you want to expand that perception, you have to step outside of every mental "frame" you hold onto; you have to free your mind from its own boundaries, because the mind is essentially limitless in how it perceives the world. here is why I say that:
light to a human is darkness to a bat; food for a person might be indigestible to most animals; what a wealthy person tosses away is a windfall for someone struggling—just look at any local flea market; and while studying might feel like a burden to some, for an intellectual, it is a profound pleasure.

I am not judging you, because the universe you've constructed for yourself may not appeal to me, but I would ask that you don't try to impose it on me—if you hadn't addressed me directly, I wouldn't have felt the need to respond, and then it would have just been your opinion.
I don't have anything against your viewpoint; in fact, it adds variety to the conversation, provided we stay within the realm where we leave the choice to everyone else.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 21, 2009

ironharbor8 said:Read from the following:

The way you write suggests you’ve somehow ascended above the rest of us. You position yourself as an outlier. That is how your prose comes across. Furthermore, you attempt to lecture from a position of authority. One can only truly claim expertise once they have stepped entirely outside this endless cycle of birth and death. Otherwise, what you’re offering is merely borrowed information, devoid of actual experience. I shouldn't have to spell that out.

When it comes to linguistics and terminology, the concept of rebirth originates from the East rather than Western thought. I assumed you were actually well-versed in the subject matter you're writing about; if you truly understand the concept, then surely you're familiar with the terminology as well.

Exactly—it's just data without the weight of lived reality. Though, I wouldn't say this "absorption" was passed down to me through study, but rather through a sudden sense of clarity.
But what I'm actually curious about is whether you have a different version of this story—one born from the experience of actually existing outside that cycle.

ironharbor8 said:Read from the following:

The way you write suggests you’ve somehow ascended above the rest of us. You position yourself as an outlier. That is how your prose comes across. Furthermore, you attempt to lecture from a position of authority. One can only truly claim expertise once they have stepped entirely outside this endless cycle of birth and death. Otherwise, what you’re offering is merely borrowed information, devoid of actual experience. I shouldn't have to spell that out.

When it comes to linguistics and terminology, the concept of rebirth originates from the East rather than Western thought. I assumed you were actually well-versed in the subject matter you're writing about; if you truly understand the concept, then surely you're familiar with the terminology as well.

Not quite. I haven't spent much time digging through texts or memorizing definitions; most of my understanding comes from direct insight. Consequently, I don't really lean on Eastern terminology and find myself needing to explain things using a more American cultural vocabulary.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 21, 2009

ironharbor8 Asks:
I wonder what gives you the sheer audacity to be so certain that you've already attained Kaivalya liberation—let alone ascended to Brahmaloka as your next plane of existence—and therefore feel entitled to bypass the cycle of rebirth entirely?

How exactly did you conclude that I’m convinced I’ve actually achieved what you're talking about? I don't recall ever claiming to have reached that point, much as you seem to think I have—though, if I could ask a small favor, perhaps we could try using terms that are a bit more intuitive to an American ear.

ambertinker2 said:So what's the deal with the people claiming they wouldn't return to Earth? If that's the case, why are they even hanging out in this thread? It makes zero sense—if they didn't want to be here in the first place, why would they keep showing up cycle after cycle? 😕

Maybe we should add a parameter for that internal disconnect—the way people harbor thoughts they aren't even aware they're keeping from themselves. It’s one of those grand delusions where we assume everyone possesses enough self-awareness to actually know their own mind, when in reality, most people are just remarkably dishonest with themselves.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 21, 2009

I suspect most of you fail to realize that you’re actually answering the question of whether you’d return on a daily basis, which is precisely why you find yourselves here. It strikes me, much like what Dragan mentioned, that this has been your default mode for a lifetime...

What I was really trying to nudge you toward is this: are you even aware that your answer to that remains stubbornly, relentlessly positive?

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 20, 2009

Mark Torres14 said:Let’s move away from death for a second. Let's pick something a bit less extreme.
Would you actually go back into a body and let a ten-year-old die?

Look, we aren't going to let people die, so please stop derailing the thread and go start your own discussion.
Thanks for understanding.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 20, 2009

ambertinker2 said:And what about you? Would you go back, and why? 🙂

The USA, without a doubt; I’d return simply because I’ve realized just how much of a playground material life can be, provided you choose to enjoy it on your own terms. It’s a bit like heading to a public pool: you could spend the whole afternoon huddled in some cramped corner of the deck, worrying about germs or whether the water is clean, essentially making yourself miserable for no reason, or you could actually dive in, run around, or just float lazily on a raft with a cold beer in hand, feeling perfectly content... life works exactly the same way. I suppose I’d play it all over again, much like how I find myself revisiting my favorite video games repeatedly, even though I’ve already mastered them more times than I care to admit.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 20, 2009

hollowbadger17 said:People tend to see exactly what they want to see...
Michael Moore3, I’m right there with you when it comes to loving the outdoors and the peace of nature, but let's be honest—everything eventually decays, and sometimes it feels like the rot starts from the bottom of hell up.

As for your question: No, I have absolutely no desire to be reborn. I don't want to cycle through this kind of existence over and over again. I just want to drift, to soar... take a guess where 😉

decay isn't some unnatural phenomenon, and honestly, you clearly don't have a grasp on what "hell" actually entails; perhaps try to be a bit bigger than your own ego and view my words not as a critique, but rather as a bit of guidance.

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 20, 2009

feraldriver8 said:I’m going to have to disagree there. Look, it's true we live in a sort of "prison"—especially those of us stuck in major cities that feel like literal controlled environments—and yeah, there’s enough injustice surrounding us that most people just choose to ignore. It's easy to look the other way.

But it's also true that there is so much good out there—so many decent people and beautiful spots (just head out to a national park with some friends or find a quiet creek to sit by and then tell me this country is pure hell...)

It’s probably a waste of breath trying to explain things to someone who refuses to see them.🙂
You might be better off just replying to the thread.🙂

If you could come back to life, would you? in Spirituality · Jun 19, 2009

Imagine a moment where you’re facing your own end, fully aware of the finality of it all—everything you’ve built, everything you’ve owned, and the entirety of your physical existence on this planet...
And then, with that heavy realization, you’re asked a single question: Would you choose to return to an Earth like this one? You’d start over as a completely different person, free from the baggage and anxieties of your previous life, beginning from scratch with the absolute freedom to design a life exactly how you want it. The only thing that carries over is your core essence, the fundamental "you." Would you actually opt back into a material existence like ours?"

So, would you take that deal? Yes or no, and what’s the reasoning behind it? 🙂