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Handball Euro: USA vs. Spain - Final Score 22:24

Started by George Chavez8 · · 👁 7 views · 55 replies

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Participants George Chavez8Olivia White25mellowcrane41placidlynx17Susan Jones57Raymond Palmer8Amanda Williams13mistymason12loneotter2Noah Ross7Anthony Wilson4Adam Collins4dustypanther6Angela Brooks4Gregory Ramos3Robert Morales6swiftbison2Edward Hernandez332steelmakerJonathan Cox4Alexander Hall6Christian Jonescrimsonharbor16Drew Edwards8 …
Anthony Wilson4 Anthony Wilson4 Member
11 messages
joined Feb 2018
#21 ·
Thomas Harris97 said:Coming in 5th place... sure, let's call that a massive success if it makes you feel better.
Everyone’s just looking out for their own interests anyway, so go ahead and keep singing those anthems until tomorrow comes.
I'm actually pulling for the French and the Spaniards to keep moving forward; at least they play with some actual sportsmanship, unlike this constant bickering we have here.

just grab a gun and do us all a favor, a single bullet would be more than enough...🙂
Angela Brooks4 Angela Brooks4 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Sep 2021
#22 ·
tnt_tunja As specified by Thomas Harris97:
Why bother even dealing with all this? Just grab a handgun, pull the trigger, and call it a day. It’s simple enough—one bullet, twenty dollars.🙂

Look, there are certain realities you just won't grasp right now, and honestly, that’s perfectly fine. I was thinking exactly like you are seven years ago. Please don't take this the wrong way—I actually find your optimism refreshing, and I truly mean that. But the world doesn't operate on idealism alone. When the mob effectively runs the state, the rules of the game change entirely. You have to play by a different set of laws.
Gregory Ramos3 Gregory Ramos3 Active Member
220 messages
joined Feb 2022
#23 ·
dustypanther6 said:I mean, how is that a double dribble? He didn't catch it right away, and even when he did, the ball was literally on the floor. Like, at the exact same moment, it was in his hand and hitting the ground. Then he just picked it up, took two steps, and let it fly. How on earth is that a double?

Man, it was a traveling call, plain and simple. We’ve all thought about calling it in a situation like that, but when the refs decide to go back and review it after such a huge delay, it just makes them look totally ridiculous...

Honestly, our heads just weren't in the game from the jump... If they had been, we wouldn't have been chasing a 3-point deficit right out of the gate. Yeah, we went on that absolute tear during those wild 5 or 6 minutes where everything clicked, but then the other guys slowed down their pace and tightened things up, while our squad just kept struggling to find any rhythm on offense..

Oh well, just one of those days, I guess..
Robert Morales6 Robert Morales6 Newcomer
4 messages
joined Jan 2012
#24 ·
Thomas Harris97 said:Finishing 5th—honestly, we can call that a win.
Everyone’s just looking out for their own interests at this point, and they'll be singing about it tomorrow, too.
I’m actually rooting for the Frenchmen and the Spaniards to move on—they actually seem to have some sportsmanship, unlike this constant bickering we've got going on here.

No offense intended, but I think this is just the classic American problem: people get way TOO AGGRESSIVE!! It’s true that maybe a few other players should've been on the court (like they were at the start), but these guys aren't to blame because things didn't go perfectly. You could tell they were working hard... look, we still have two games left, so let's wait until after that—if we don't make it then, then sure, everyone can go at them. But for now? We need to keep our heads up and stop tearing our own team down!!!
Angela Brooks4 Angela Brooks4 Newcomer
8 messages
joined Sep 2021
#25 ·
Robert Morales6 said:No offense intended, but this is the classic American problem: we take things way too seriously!! It’s true that certain other players should have been on the court (like they were at the start), but these guys aren't to blame just because things didn't go better. You could clearly see the effort they put in... we still have two games left, so let's wait until then. If we don't make the cut, then by all means, we can all tear them apart. Until then, we need to hold our heads high instead of tearing them down!!!

I'm more than happy to criticize the league leadership, but the players themselves are acting like cowards because they're just taking it.
swiftbison2 swiftbison2 Newcomer
9 messages
joined Dec 2007
#26 ·
dustypanther6 said:What double dribble? He didn't catch it immediately, and when he did, the ball was literally on the floor. It was in his hand and hitting the ground at the exact same time. Then he picked it up, took two steps, and shot. How is that a double?

If memory serves, he didn't just take two steps; he bounced the ball once first and then took two steps. That’s why the Spanish defenders let him slide—they were waiting for the ref to call the double.

I won't get bogged down in the technicalities of whether the hand-to-floor contact counts as a travel. 😕
Edward Hernandez332 Edward Hernandez332 Active Member
76 messages
joined Oct 2006
#27 ·
Some people here are genuinely out of their minds...

Tearing into Balic just because of one bad game? Seriously? We're spitting on a guy who has brought us more medals than anyone else. And now we’re nitpicking his "nonchalant" attitude on the court? Give me a break—that’s exactly how he played when he was walking away with MVP honors back in the day.

In the first game, the man steps on the floor and basically carries the team against the Icelanders all by himself. In the second, he plays enough to get the job done. I didn't catch the third one, so I won't pretend to know...

The guy has played an hour and a half across four games: he's sitting at 5/7 in goals and tied for the lead as the tournament assist leader (sharing the spot with a few others, sure, but still)...

It's pathetic.
steelmaker steelmaker Newcomer
6 messages
joined Jan 2006
#28 ·
Throughout this entire tournament, I can't help but feel a sense of dread whenever we try to break down an opponent's set defense, regardless of whether they’re playing five or six men out there. Our defense seems to be holding steady enough, though, mostly relying on those half-court transitions and fast breaks led by Duvnjak—not Balic, mind you. As for the offense... well, aside from what Laco and Buntic bring to the table, it's been an absolute disaster. The wings aren't doing much besides running the break, and honestly, Strlek has more speed in his pinky finger than all our other wing players combined...

In short, it looks like Keta really dropped the ball on the offensive schemes...
Adam Collins4 Adam Collins4 Regular
502 messages
joined Apr 2013
#29 ·
dustypanther6 said:What do you mean double dribble? He didn't catch it right away, and when he finally did, he was literally on the floor. Like, the ball was in his hand and hitting the ground at the exact same time. Then he just picked it up off the floor, took two steps, and shot. How on earth is that a double dribble?

That’s exactly the point. The ball was in his hand and then he made contact with the floor using the ball...

And then, while he was pivoting around the defender—trying not to travel—he slammed the ball against the floor again...

The first part is such a freak occurrence, but technically it "counts" as having caught the ball and then striking the floor with it before continuing...

So, because of that second dribble during the pivot, it's a double...

Look, it's an incredibly rare situation where a player hits the ground with the ball during that initial contact—or maybe they just lose their balance and end up "landing" on the ball...

The ball wasn't cleanly gathered, and that's what tripped him up right from the start...
Jonathan Cox4 Jonathan Cox4 Member
22 messages
joined Apr 2008
#30 ·
It’s probably better to take the loss now during this phase rather than later on. My only real concern is making sure this slump doesn't turn into a trend. 😁
That's just how it goes sometimes—you either have momentum or you don't.
I’m just frustrated that Goluz didn't call a timeout when we had possession and a massive numerical advantage with about 20 extra players on the floor. Maybe they could have run a set play, though I guess even that might not have saved us.
Adam Collins4 Adam Collins4 Regular
502 messages
joined Apr 2013
#31 ·
swiftbison2 said:From what I recall, he didn't just take two steps—he bounced the ball, then took two steps. That's why the Spanish refs let it slide so easily; they were just sitting there waiting for a traveling call instead.

I’m not really going to get into the weeds on why they counted the hand/floor combo as traveling. 😕

There are actually several different "types" of traveling... though technically, the correct term is just traveling.

I broke it down below...

The classic one where you just lose your footing and take an extra couple of steps...

The one where you hit the floor with both the ball and your hand—basically stumbling—so the ball hits the ground once during the fall (first travel), and then after a few steps, you bounce it again...

Then there's the third scenario: when a player dribbles with one hand, but instead of pushing it off the floor, they sort of catch it and immediately push it again—that's basically two travels back-to-back.

Fourth is that infamous "basketball" travel, where the player dribbles while rotating their palm...

Fifth is when someone pounds the ball too hard and it flies up past their shoulder...

So, yeah, there are plenty of little ways a player can trip themselves up.
swiftbison2 swiftbison2 Newcomer
9 messages
joined Dec 2007
#32 ·
Adam Collins4 said:There are several "types" of double dribbles... though technically, any of them count as a violation.

I broke them down below...

The classic version where they lose their footing and bounce it twice...

The one where they hit the floor with both the ball and their hand—essentially tripping—so the ball hits the ground first, then they take a few steps and strike it again...

Third is when they carry it with one hand, essentially palming it instead of bouncing it, then resetting the dribble... that’s also a violation.

Fourth is the famous "basketball carry," where they rotate their palm underneath the ball while moving.

Fifth is when they bounce it too hard and it flies above shoulder height.

Basically, there are plenty of ways a player can mess this up.

I just thought the call was tricky because it's hard to tell if he caught her during the fall or just brushed against her. 🤷 But you could tell immediately by how the Americans reacted; they just let him go, clearly expecting the whistle.
Alexander Hall6 Alexander Hall6 Newcomer
4 messages
joined Jan 2012
#33 ·
I honestly don't see what all the fuss is about.
We aren't going to win every single game; frankly, it's better to take the loss now rather than later 🙂

Mistakes are just lessons in disguise 🙂
Christian Jones Christian Jones Active Member
218 messages
joined Feb 2012
#34 ·
Adam Collins4 said:Two completely different halves from Team USA here. My gut feeling? We closed things up way too early and thought we had it in the bag. Way too many technical fouls... you just can't play like that against the heavy hitters. Balic and Vori were just off today, and Vori couldn't find his rhythm to save his life. That’s four bad games in a row now. Those technicals really bit us in the end and decided the last 15 minutes. Goluz looked totally lost; he didn't even try to fix it with some rotation.

The refs were all over the place on both sides. Weird calls on exclusions, terrible awareness of advantage plays... and they kept wiping the floor, which just killed the flow of the game.

I see Nincevicev's "steps" have caused a massive debate, though it mostly just confused him and the already confused Cosic. It was a double dribble, not traveling.

All in all, just too many mistakes. Mirko was excellent once again...

You can forgive Balic for having an off day, but Vori? Not for a fourth straight game. Now, back to what I was saying before—it was a huge mistake not having Sulic on the national team. mus and Maric aren't anywhere near Sulic's level. And if Vori isn't producing, Sule would be a perfect wild card off the bench. I'm pretty sure we'll take down the Frenchies, especially those Canadians. Yesterday, the loss was fueled by some questionable officiating... like how passive offense basically doesn't exist for these refs when playing against Spain, and those exclusions were just insane, especially that one on Kopljar.
Adam Collins4 Adam Collins4 Regular
502 messages
joined Apr 2013
#35 ·
swiftbison2 said:I mean, I just think it’s a toss-up when you're calling that kind of play—it’s honestly tough to tell if he actually caught her during the fall, if it was just a graze, or if it was something else entirely. 🤷 You could tell immediately by how his closest Spanish friends reacted—they just let him walk right past them, basically standing there waiting for the inevitable boos from the crowd.

Yeah, he caught her because that pass was just plain garbage—totally poorly thrown—and then he ended up fumbling it under his feet since the ball itself was acting all awkward and unpredictable... just a mess, really.

The thing is—and this is what I was getting at when Gregory Ramos3 mentioned that the refs were a bit slow on the whistle—there’s that specific moment where everything just looks ugly. It’s one of those situations where the officiating gets sloppy, and suddenly the whole vibe of the game turns sour.

I’ve talked about this quite a bit before—you know, that whole thing where you see something, make an instant judgment call, and then actually have the guts to show everyone exactly what you decided—but apparently, the folks on this forum thought I was just being a comedian...

Look, I’m not exactly out here playing defense attorney for the refs—believe me, I know they can be a disaster—but you have to admit it isn't exactly easy. Especially when the stakes are high and the atmosphere in the stadium gets that certain kind of electric, high-pressure heat... it changes things.

Honestly, I called it from the jump—it was a double. I was watching it on TV, so there wasn't any doubt about what was actually happening right in front of me.

The real issue here is that after decades of broadcasting these games, our commentators still don't have a clue about the basic rules of handball—so then you've got everyone sitting at home in front of the TV just losing their minds.

I can’t even begin to tell you how many times I’ve sat there in my local diner and watched people lose their minds—literally shouting at the TV, demanding to know what on earth the ref just called. And the funniest part? The official usually made the exact right call. It’s always the same thing: people acting like they’re experts because they have zero clue how the game actually works. Take the whole Cosic situation, for example—it’s a perfect case in point. You’ll have some guy at the next table acting absolutely stunned, genuinely baffled, as if he’s witnessing a glitch in the matrix, all because he thinks a seven-point play can only happen if the defense is out of position. He’s sitting there, eyes bulging, wondering how it could possibly be seven points when "the player wasn't in the zone" or whatever nonsense he's cooked up. Honestly, it's exhausting watching people argue with reality just because they don't understand the rules.
crimsonharbor16 crimsonharbor16 Newcomer
7 messages
joined Aug 2008
#36 ·
So, long story short, after these last few games, I wouldn't say we're playing poorly. We've knocked off three wins against some decent squads, which means we’re still right up there with the best in world handball... definitely in the top 5. The play could be sharper, though. Honestly, our previous generations spoiled us... they were used to that flair and creativity from a few superstars, but this is basically a new generation. To be blunt, they aren't quite as talented or as synchronized yet. Some guys just don't belong on the national team right now—take Kopljar, for example. You can see he’s got the shot and the jump, but he lacks the guts to really step up. He's just not there. You'll never get a real player out of him unless he finds that inner grit and starts playing angry. As for Balic, his time is done... but at his age, he can't be expected to mentor the new kids by just playing off himself. The point is, our entire system has revolved around Balic for years. Every single player has to read his movements perfectly to make the passing work, because he rarely throws a ball away for nothing. These young guys just don't get him, and it drives me crazy... Buntic is a player I'm actually grateful for. He’s the kind of guy who doesn't need two teammates setting him up to score; he gives the rest of the team a breather while he chips in a goal or two to keep us in it. I'd love to see him working the offense constantly, and Kopljar working the defense.

It’s tough, though... replacing someone like Peru Metlicic is nearly impossible. Given what he accomplished, nobody is going to step into his shoes for at least another few years. We’re missing those goals from the right wing, and honestly, that's exactly the margin we need every game to pull off a win. Luckily, Mirko has started guarding the net, otherwise I was worried we'd be total pushovers in goal.

Against the Frenchmen, I’m expecting a grind. It's going to be a hard fight to win, and it's risky to call anything, except maybe that it'll be high-tension. There's going to be plenty of physical play, and everyone is desperate for the points.
Jonathan Cox4 Jonathan Cox4 Member
22 messages
joined Apr 2008
#37 ·
Adam Collins4 said:I'm not trying to defend the refs, but it isn't exactly easy, especially when things are even and the atmosphere gets "heated"...

Honestly, with how much we've been officiating lately, they should probably just get medals for surviving. 😁
Good grief, we can't just blame the officials for everything all the time. 😁

crimsonharbor16 said:our guys have been spoiled over the years

Yeah, exactly. 🙏
It’s just that typical American mentality where nothing is ever quite good enough.
All things considered, I'm proud of them! 🙂
swiftbison2 swiftbison2 Newcomer
9 messages
joined Dec 2007
#38 ·
Another point is simply that they lack a higher gear. We saw it yesterday during the first half; even if Vori were sitting out, this lineup wouldn't have lost.

The real issue is getting the sense that certain people in America couldn't care less about winning—they’re just focused on offloading Kopljar and other nonsense.
Jonathan Cox4 Jonathan Cox4 Member
22 messages
joined Apr 2008
#39 ·
Sometimes things just click, and sometimes they don't.
I’ve had games where I lost to opponents who could barely even walk; some days are just like that.
It’ll get better. 🙂
And look, Kopljar isn't some new issue from yesterday. He's been getting pushed for a while now, and unfortunately, there's nothing we can do about that...
Drew Edwards8 Drew Edwards8 Member
10 messages
joined Mar 2009
#40 ·
So I’m scrolling through the sports news right now and apparently Balic is out there crying foul about the refs. Honestly? Give me a break. After the way we played that second half—especially those final ten minutes—blaming the officials is just a pathetic excuse. If we want any shot at this tournament, we need to start coming out swinging with our heavy hitters like Lackovic, Duvnjak, and Buntic right from the jump. It makes zero sense to me how Strlek and Lackovic just sit there on the bench watching the clock run out during the most critical stretch while we're out there struggling just to find the back of the net.

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