John Zorn

2.11 Douglas
12.11 Sam Prekop

😲 may tiki tikr :heartattack:

I think "Pure" is complete garbage. Honestly... 😬

Kevin Chavez3 said:I think "Pure" is absolute garbage. Just total trash. 😬

But man, "Goat" is a total masterpiece.

Tyler Grant86 said:Masada is my favorite of Zorn's projects because it feels the most spontaneous and warm... I’m honestly surprised they booked him for the Jazz Festival. Everyone knows he won't even talk about a gig unless it's north of $20,000 and includes a five-star hotel stay.
Anyway, for the last five or six years, I've found whatever Douglas is doing much more interesting. He's the trumpeter for Masada and easily the top jazz musician in New York right now.😈

A Zorn and Masada show goes for $30,000.

But they got them because this Jazz Festival is backed by state and county funding...
The venue was tiny, barely holding 500 or 600 people...
So much for profitability and "return on investment."

I couldn't make it, but a friend told me they were fantastic.
Of course... typical. The crowd was packed with local pseudo-jazz snobs—mostly doctors, lawyers, and executives from the area who haven't the slightest clue who John Zorn is, yet spent the night looking baffled by Zornovin's unconventional style.
How dare he...

Speaking of price...
It's hard to believe that back in the day, you could catch him for 12,000 Lira.

coastalpanther11 said:But that’s exactly why Goat is such a sweet deal.

I guess liar feels the same way.

rapidbison42 said:Well, it’s just how things go, I suppose... the crowd was packed with those local pseudo-jazz snobs—you know, the doctors, lawyers, and corporate execs from the area who probably haven't the slightest clue who John Zorn is. They all looked so incredibly confused after the show by the unconventional outfits the Zornovin crew were sporting.
How dare they...

I wonder, was he wearing a Napalm Death or an Agnostic Front shirt? 😬

coastalpanther11 said:Well, Goat is a total gem.

Nah, not quite! 🙂

A liar, too.

Of course...
Man, I still remember that ridiculous "ughhh..." reaction to Whirl... that was ages ago.

Anyway, from what I heard, Zorn was wearing a red polo three sizes too big with chains hanging off his belt...

Nicholas Perez33 said:A liar, too.

Look, Goat actually resonates with me more. I was at that awkward, sensitive age when they first dropped, and then—God rest his soul—Baričević called me from the Army saying the Lizards were playing a gig in NYC. So there I was, me and the late d. Douglas, ditching some school play in the city to sneak off to the concert instead. And that’s just how it went down. It left its mark on my psyche. Since noise is basically just 😉 Šatro.
Man, everyone in this story is dead. Seriously, what a trip... 😢

It felt like being in some kind of military camouflage setup, honestly. The whole set was super intentional: you had one moment of pure Klezmer, then shifted right into that free-jazz vibe following in the footsteps of Ornette Coleman. It was seriously good!

And regarding the money? I mean, come on, the guy is a Jew 😁

The numbers were such that tickets should have cost at least three times more just to break even...

rapidbison42 said:A Zorn performance with Masada runs about $30,000.

I already made it clear—he won't even pick up the phone for less than $20,000; that’s his baseline for a solo set. Since Masada usually commands anywhere from $30,000 to $40,000, this was actually the cheaper option...

As for his style—that’s exactly what started getting under my skin. He dresses like some grit-soaked grindcore icon, acting like an underground legend, yet he refuses to play anything less than a five-star venue. Total hypocrisy. 🙂

That said, there's no denying he recorded (or "borrowed") some incredible albums...

Mr. Wrong said:To "Pure" record? Absolute garbage. Completely. 😬

Look—if Big Black, Scratch Acid, and Rapeman from '89 were your drug of choice, maybe you could claim that first Jesus Lizard release was some world-class masterpiece. But let’s be real: it doesn't even come close to Liar. And it certainly can't touch the GOAT, which remains firmly seated in my top ten greatest albums of all time. 😉

Tyler Grant86 said:Acting like some grindcore rebel or an underground icon, while simultaneously refusing to play anywhere that isn't a five-star venue... total hypocrite.

What's the big deal? 🙂

Me and my buddy were actually talking about this the other day. We joked about what we'd do if a major label offered us a contract. We’d do whatever they wanted—cut the screaming, slow the tempo down, play quieter... just so we could eat at the best restaurants, be around the best people, and live large for a year. If we have to complain about the stage monitors just to keep up appearances, so be it. A guy's allowed to enjoy himself once in a while... 🙂

dinsdale said:Man, this whole thing is just one big mess of people talking about things that aren't even happening anymore... goodness gracious. 😢

dada ?..

honestly, i think john zorn is just some jazz-intellectual bullshit... 😳

Tyler Grant86 said:I made it clear: if it's under $20,000, he won't even talk to you—that's his floor for a solo set. Meanwhile, booking a crowd usually runs anywhere from $30k to $40k... so this was actually the budget option.

As for how he dresses? That’s what started getting on my nerves. He plays this whole "underground icon" persona, acting like some grindcore fanatic, yet he won't perform anywhere less than a five-star venue. Total hypocrite.🙂

But yeah, the fact that he lifted tracks from great records is undisputed.

I'll second that.
A friend of mine told me the price and I was floored.
Knowing all the dive bars he used to play back in the day, and knowing he was playing tiny gigs in Italy just fifteen years ago, this is honestly laughable...
But hey... if someone offers you that kind of cash when you're starting out, only an idiot would say no.

then the first Jesus Lizard release would be the greatest thing on earth.

Are we talking about "Pure"?

A masterpiece.
The younger generation just doesn't get it...
...she sits in a tub and relieves stories she never lived...

Late March 1991... a show in Washington, D.C., right when I was on my regular rotation...
Pure gold!!!

rapidbison42 said:Late March 1991... there was a concert in Washington, D.C., right when I was stuck on my regular shift...
The law is the law.

Give me a break—don't start with me too. I'm already getting enough grief because back on March 17, 1991, I was serving as an assistant platoon leader and couldn't just desert the base to catch a show at some gallery...😠

By the way, Eugene Chadbourne—who recorded those early tracks with Zorn that he actually released himself—told me that John Zorn was never, ever part of the New York punk, no wave, or hardcore scenes. He said the guy was always ambitious and a sharp businessman; he used every opportunity to build his own cult of personality, which explains that whole grindcore aesthetic they leaned into...

I was just revisiting some footage from the Eugene Chadbourne show. It’s a shame the vibe felt a little off that night...
but hey, at least the energy was there..
...Punk Rockers, Punk Rockers, Punk Rockers Fuck OFF...

Tyler Grant86 said:Apparently, Eugene Chadbourne—who recorded those early tracks with Zorn that he just released himself—told us that John Zorn was never, ever part of the New York punk, no wave, or hardcore scenes. He claims the guy was always just an ambitious, sharp businessman who leveraged every opportunity to build his own cult of personality. That explains the whole grindcore aesthetic, I guess...

But where does Zorn actually stand with guys like Chadbourne, Kramer, the Fair brothers, and the rest of that crew?
Not even close.

For old Eugene:

🙏 🙏 🙏

Thinking back to when he showed up in this middle-of-nowhere wasteland during our darkest era...
Mad respect...
The way he used to tear up that banjo...