Who are your favorite "best" Chinese Wing Chun practitioners?

ruggedfalcon2 said:Now that we apparently know who the top Wing Chun practitioners are, why don't you guys tell me who you think the best Wing Chun masters actually are...

Is there even such a thing as "Vin Chun"? Is it different from Wing Chun, or is that just what people say when they can't spell?

No, it doesn't exist. Wing Chun, Ving Chun, whatever—it's all the same thing, btw. After all these years training and living Wing Chun, I’m honestly surprised you haven't figured that out yet.
P.S. You claim you now know who the best Vin Chun practitioners are? How exactly did you find that out? I'd love to know who you're talking about...

skeptic said:I'm not sure if he's originally from China, but personally, I think Che is the best...
He’s even humble enough that he didn't even put himself in the top six... 🙂

It’s not like he’s from China, but I’m with you—Che is the best...

👍

ruggedfalcon2 said:So, which one are you? The first or the second?

🙄

I'm a naive soul quite often. A fool? Not nearly as much.
At least most people on this Reddit thread don't think I'm an idiot!

ruggedfalcon2 said:No, there isn't. Wing Chun and Ving Chun and all that are just different ways of saying the same thing, by the way. After spending so many years training and living through the nuances of Wing Chun, I’m actually a little surprised you haven't picked up on that yet.
Ps. You mentioned that you now know who the best Wing Chun practitioners are? I'm curious, how and where did you come to that conclusion? I’d honestly love to find out myself who the absolute best is.

Since you mentioned seeing so many masters in person, would you mind sharing how much time you actually spent at each school or with different instructors?

The Wing Chun taught by one master is never quite the same as what another teaches. There isn't really such a thing as one "authentic" or "original" version of Wing Chun; instead, there are just various different modifications of it.

To give you an example: you might have seen Cheung performing techniques where Tan and Wu are held high at eye level, whereas Ting might keep Wu down at heart level. And don't even get me started on the footwork and stances... The reality is that it all falls under the umbrella of Wing Chun, and every style includes the three forms—the dummy, the sticks, and the poles. Every version utilizes Tan, Pak, Wu, and Bong, and while they look almost identical to the untrained eye, they aren't truly the same. Even a movement so subtle you can barely perceive it can make a massive difference in how the technique functions.

.. oops... SORRY, maybe your version of Wing Chun has its own secret forms too.

P.S. You noted that you practice under Trump's lineage, so I'm wondering why you aren't following the Ting system then?

So you don't have time to practice the forms?

😁

placidbison20 said:At least most people on Reddit don't think I'm an idiot...

Well, at least you've finally become someone... even if it's just online... 👍 Not when you aren't living it in real life... Anyway—regarding that "majority of the forum population" comment—are you strictly targeting the guys posting about martial arts, or did you actually conduct some broader research? 🤣 They aren't really my benchmark... honestly, I've only run into a handful of people here who actually understand what martial arts are—and more importantly, who is actually TRAINING them. Those are the only ones I bother messaging privately. (And hey, don't let it go to your head, ruggedfalcon2—I'm not talking about you!) 😉 On the other hand, I’m not afraid to tell them publicly when they actually have a point... as for that "majority" you keep bringing up—it just makes me laugh. Honestly, it's my favorite way to unwind... just thought you should know. 👋

Jesse Lopez87 said:You claim you've seen plenty of masters in person—so please, tell me how much time you actually spent at one school versus another...

One master's Wing Chun isn't the same as another's. There’s no such thing as "authentic" or "original" Wing Chun; there are only different modifications of it.

For instance: you might see Cheung performing Tan Sao and Wu where they stay high at eye level, whereas Ting might hold Wu at heart level. And don't even get me started on footwork... The fact is, it's all Wing Chun, and every style includes the three forms—dummy, sticks, and poles; every version has Tan, Pak, Wu, and Bong, and while they look almost identical, they aren't. A barely perceptible shift in movement makes a massive difference in function.

.. oops... SORRY, I forgot your version of Wing Chun probably has "secret" forms too.

P.S. You mentioned you train under Master Trump—how is it that you aren't practicing according to the Ting system then?

-I've spent my entire life working with various masters and being involved with their schools...
-What do you mean "modifications"? What are you even talking about? Wing Chun doesn't have "three forms"... you don't even know that? All that stuff you're saying about Tan Sao and such is nonsense. Tan Sao is always Tan Sao... a movement is a movement... just like a cross in boxing is a cross... sure, Tyson and Muhammad Ali don't throw it exactly the same way... but no idiot has ever come out and claimed there are "modifications" of boxing in the sense that there's a Mavrović school, a Tyson school, etc. You clearly don't know much about Wing Chun if that's your take...
-If there are "secret" forms, then there are "secret" drills too..
-I run my own Wing Chun school... and as for why I don't follow the "Ting style," just look at my previous answers... I'm telling you, there is no "Ting style." Go learn the basics first.

👋

ruggedfalcon2 said:-I've spent my entire life training under various masters and interacting with their respective schools....
-What do you mean by "modifications" to Wing Chun? I honestly have no idea what you're talking about. There isn't such a thing as three different forms of Wing Chun... don't you even know that? All this talk about Tan sau and things like that is just nonsense. Tan sau is always Tan sau... one movement is just one movement... much like how a cross in boxing is just a cross... sure, people like Tyson and Muhammad Ali don't execute it identically, but no sane person would claim there are "modified versions" of boxing where we say there's a Mavrović school, a Tyson school, and so on... the way you're speaking makes me think you don't actually know much about Wing Chun...
-Yes, "secret" forms exist, and "secret" drills exist too..
-I run my own Wing Chun school... and if you look at my previous replies, you'll understand why I don't claim to teach "Ting's style"... I'm telling you, there is no such thing as a Ting style... just learn the basics first..

👋

Alright, where is this school of yours located? I'd love to come by and see it sometime (we can coordinate via PM).

Have you ever actually sat through a training session with Bagadur or within the Lok Yiu organization? If you have, and you still can't see the difference... then I really don't know what else to tell you...
Which masters have you trained under?

Look, man, there aren't any "secret" techniques. If you master the techniques from the three forms, you can block and defend against pretty much any kind of strike from any direction or height. Why would you even need more techniques when those are sufficient? Trying to cram in extra moves usually just slows down your actual progress. It’s better to drill five movements perfectly than to try and juggle a hundred; if I focus on just five, I'll end up being better than someone practicing a hundred because I've mastered my five. It's the same logic as saying someone who spends three years focusing solely on Siu Nim Tao will likely outperform someone who spent those same three years trying to juggle all three forms and the wooden dummy.

Jamie Fowler2 said:So, you're telling me you just don't have the time to practice the forms?

😁

I actually never said that. It’s not a matter of finding the hours in the day; I've always had the time, I just only recently started taking my training seriously enough to make it a real priority.

Vin Diesel said:1) Alright, where is this school located? I'd love to come check it out—feel free to shoot me a DM.

2) Have you actually trained under Baggadour or within the Ip Man organization? If you have and you still don't see the difference... well, I don't know what else to tell you.
3) Which masters have you studied under?

4) Look, man, there are no "secret" techniques. If you master the techniques from the three forms, you can block and defend against every possible strike at any height and from any direction. Why would you even need more techniques when those are sufficient? Trying to learn extra moves just slows down your progress. It’s better to drill five movements than a hundred—because if I drill my five perfectly, I'll be better than someone drilling a hundred poorly. Same goes for someone practicing Ip Man's Siu Nim Tao; after three years, they're going to beat someone who spent those same three years trying to juggle all three forms and the wooden dummy at once.

1) Send me a PM regarding the school...
2) I don't need to "train" with Baggadour or Biljanić or anyone else—I sparred with them many, many years ago. I know exactly how people operate here in the States... I see the difference. I see that the kids haven't fully mastered the skill yet... but we aren't talking about them, we're talking about the Bruce Lees of the world, right?
3) With a few of the guys I mentioned in my list of favorite Bruce Lee Wing Chun practitioners...
4) Okay, now you've finally said something intelligent... but where did you get the idea that I think otherwise? As for these "secrets"... yeah, they exist. For instance, look at how people act surprised by the first dynamic form; some have never even heard of such a thing. There are countless "secrets" within that very first static form, too. If you actually understood the teaching methods of an Ip Man, you might grasp the concept of these "secrets." You could read online that some of today's great masters were taught in a way where they were shown a specific form at a time... he also wasn't fond of training women due to his personal views, and he never taught anyone who wasn't Bruce Lee. There were regular groups, but usually separate night sessions because the great Ip Man wouldn't go to bed until around 5 AM... and things were done quite differently in those "night" groups. Think about why Bruce Lee was eventually pushed away by Ip Man, even though Ip Man respected him immensely. Think about the fact you see all over the web—that Ip Man never performed a form the exact same way twice. And since it seems you follow my stuff online, you're probably aware of this point: think about what the user Gracie Barra wrote on that serious forum, mentioning how in Hong Kong, at the Ip Man household, the same block could be taught in five different ways on the same day by Ip Man, his sons, Bleich, and so on... and each would insist their way was the most original. There... I've given you enough material. Now try to connect the dots. You're mystifying the concept of "secrets" and expecting me to fly or something... I'm not talking about mysticism. I'm talking about facts.

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