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Issues installing Windows 7?

Started by Sam Peterson6 · · 👁 8 views · 25 replies

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Participants Sam Peterson6Megan Thomas5darkcyclist92fadedorca66Alexander Diaz4coppersailor28Jack Cook7wearymason4shadowlynx102
fadedorca66 fadedorca66 Regular
372 messages
joined Nov 2022
#21 ·
I mean, your laptop—or rather, the SMART data—already told you it was toast. I guess I don't get why you were stressing out about it so much in the first place...
Alexander Diaz4 Alexander Diaz4 Member
39 messages
joined Sep 2021
#22 ·
Honestly, grabbing an old HDD from a buddy is way cheaper than actually dropping cash on an SSD
shadowlynx102 shadowlynx102 Active Member
91 messages
joined Oct 2017
#23 ·
Sam Peterson6 said:The issue is all sorted out now; turns out my hard drive was just dying on me, so a buddy of mine hooked me up with his old one. I got Windows installed and everything's running smoothly again.

Thanks

Honestly, you could have figured that out pretty quickly from this message here:

Sam Peterson6 said:Every time I boot up my computer, I get hit with a black screen and this error message right at the top:
1720-SMART Hard Drive detects imminent failure (Failing Attribute: 5) Please back up the contents of the hard drive and run HDD Self Test In
Press F1 key to continue
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#24 ·
shadowlynx102 said:Well, you could've spotted that right away from this:

Not necessarily though:
What is failing attribute #05?
Attribute #05 is the Reallocated Sector Count. The drive has too many bad sectors, probably more than 500.

Look, every single hard drive (and even SSDs) uses an ECC mechanism—basically software built right into the drive's controller—to fix one or two bits within a 512-byte sector (if you're dealing with those older small-sector standards). That’s why the actual physical sector size is always bigger than 512 bytes, sometimes hitting 700+!

When drives leave the factory, they go through intense "burn-in" testing. Any data about bad sectors that ECC can't fix, plus the info on sectors that *did* need fixing, gets logged into a special "hidden" table stored directly on the HDD or flash drive's firmware.

It’s basically the modern version of the old-school low-level formatting that users used to do back in the day before everyone stopped doing it. Where that table lives depends on how the drive organizes its data—like where the servo data for head positioning is tucked away, whether it's embedded in the sector, the servo cylinder, or the servo plate. All of that plays a massive role in how fast you can actually grab your data.

And hey, those "bad" sectors can't go on forever; there's a limit to how big that table can get for a bunch of different reasons. It gets even messier because there's this whole process of translating physical sectors (you know, Cylinder/Head/Sector) into logical ones. This is all optimized to speed up sequential access and help multi-disk or multi-head systems work in parallel, which is way harder than it sounds—especially when bad sectors start messing things up.

Usually, the drive's internal OS just reallocates a bad sector to a "healthy" one, unless it's one of those super critical ones (like how back in the day, if sector 1 on head 0, cylinder 0 got hit, it was game over for the whole drive—same goes for things like the FAT or MFT, though most of that's been fixed now). A "Low Level Format" basically wipes that table clean and scans the whole thing from scratch, but honestly, that doesn't always work great. Some sectors are just flaky—they look fine during one pass and then totally fail the next, just being unstable. Manufacturers handle this using huge statistical samples of identical drives. I’ve personally run tests for ten days straight without getting a clear answer, and that was just on relatively small drives.

While it's running, the drive's internal OS monitors things via ECC. If it sees a sector is acting up—meaning it constantly has to use software to patch the data—it'll run "scrubbing" (that's a periodic background refresh of the physical sectors) and after a few failed attempts, it'll finally kill off or reallocate that sector. That’s essentially what SMART is doing, among other things.

On top of all that, you've got the actual OS file system organization that hits the disk from the moment you boot up, but I won't bore you with all the details. I used to be able to "hide" a certain number of bad sectors myself, as long as nobody messed with the formatting or partitioning, regardless of what the factory tables said. The real question is just at which level you're going to deal with the table.

Basically, on a standard PC, you're dealing with two layers of operating systems:

- The OS living on the HDD/SSD itself
- Your standard OS (Windows/macOS/Linux)

And don't forget the BIOS/POST, which is really just a primitive OS in its own right. These days, it’s mostly replaced by UEFI, which is much more versatile, so you've basically got:

- OS at the HDD/SSD level
- UEFI OS
- Standard OS

If you’re running a SCSI/SAS setup or a RAID controller, you’ve basically got an extra layer stuck in the middle.

- OS at the HDD/SSD level
- RAID controller OS
- UEFI OS
- Standard OS

And then you throw disk storage on top of all that, and man, things get interesting.

Basically—asking "is this drive actually dying?" is way more complicated than it looks.

PS: if you're feeling adventurous and have some free time, check out Spinrite.
shadowlynx102 shadowlynx102 Active Member
91 messages
joined Oct 2017
#25 ·
To put it simply, the drive is dead, and having to deal with this slave-master setup just adds an unnecessary layer of frustration to the whole thing.
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#26 ·
Eh, whatever, I’m just flexing a little. 🕺

But hey, I actually know how to fix up a Harley-Davidson 5. 🕺

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