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Politics/Ukraine Discussion Thread #5

Started by Jessica Smith11 · · 👁 5 views · 26 replies

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Participants Jessica Smith11redheron30Jack Cook7rustydrifter10Charles Fox10mistyjackal14wiredangler5goldenowl73rowdytiger13
Jessica Smith11 Jessica Smith11 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Oct 2013
#1 ·
redheron30 said:pedophilia is just one branch of unnatural practices being forced upon us.

Honestly, this lie is so massive that I feel like commenting on it is almost beneath me. This idea that someone is somehow "imposing" pedophilia... I mean, just look at history. If you track how the age of consent and marriage laws have shifted alongside the increasing liberalization of society, it’s pretty obvious. Yet, you and your crowd keep insisting otherwise. Maybe try picking up a history book and actually checking the facts. Don't just take my word for it. Just verify it. And while you're at it, maybe check which countries still maintain the lowest age requirements for marriage today.

As for the Church, it's clear you don't actually care about those dark pedophilia scandals. It seems like you're just using it as an excuse to spit on Western values. Because if that weren't the case, surely you'd be just as outraged by those priests who were "drastically" punished. Why focus all your energy on attacking the West when you have these issues right here in your own backyard?
Jessica Smith11 Jessica Smith11 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Oct 2013
#2 ·
Jack Cook7 said:My point is this: if your opinion is somehow acceptable to the moderators, then I guess mine should be too.
Or maybe it's just as much NOT

You can't just have an "opinion" about whether someone is a pedophile. It’s a binary thing—they either are or they aren't. If you're going to make an accusation like that, you really ought to provide some actual proof. We all know what defines that kind of behavior, so just go ahead and prove it.
redheron30 redheron30 Newcomer
1 message
joined May 2013
#3 ·
Charles Gomez said:This lie is so massive it’s almost not worth responding to. I'm talking about people actively pushing pedophilia. Just look at history—watch how age limits for sex and marriage have kept sliding upward alongside the constant liberalization of society—yet you and your crowd keep insisting otherwise. Pick up a history book and check for yourself. Don't just take my word for it. Verify it. And while you're at it, go see which parts of the world still have the lowest legal age for marriage today. For example.

As for the Church, it’s obvious you don't actually give a damn about some shady pedophilia cases; you’re just using it as an excuse to trash the West. If that weren't the case, surely those "drastic" punishments for pedophile priests would bother you too. Why aim your vitriol at the West when you've got problems right under your nose?

Here, run this through a translator.
clitoral stimulation for kids aged 1 to 3, based on advice from German sexual educators.
http://www.blick.ch/news/schweiz/elt...id1674936.html

I have no clue where you read that I'm okay with priests abusing kids. I shouldn't have to explicitly state that—anyone sane knows that's sick.

So what do you think about this non-Western version of sexual education (aka pedophilia)?
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#4 ·
Charles Gomez said:Look, you don't just get to have an "opinion" on whether someone's a pedophile. It's not a vibe or a feeling—they either are or they aren't. If you're gonna throw that kind of label around, you better have the receipts to back it up. We all know what defines that, so go ahead, prove it.

And honestly? Same goes for calling someone a terrorist. You can't just claim that as an opinion.
Jessica Smith11 Jessica Smith11 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Oct 2013
#5 ·
redheron30 said:Here, just run this through a translator.
Clitoral stimulation for toddlers aged 1 to 3, based on advice from German sexual educators.
http://www.blick.ch/news/schweiz/elt...id1674936.html

I'm honestly not sure where you read that I have anything against clergy abusing children. I suppose I shouldn't really have to explicitly state my position on that; any sane person knows it's sick.

What do you think about this non-Western approach to sex education (pedophilia)?

And again, someone writes some manual that gets rejected, and you take that as ultimate proof that people are forcing pedophilia on us?
Just tell us exactly where this is actually being implemented.
Jessica Smith11 Jessica Smith11 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Oct 2013
#6 ·
Jack Cook7 said:You can't just go around labeling people as Mexicans.

Well, why don't you go ahead and point out where I actually called anyone a Mexican? Since you're so keen on quoting me in this thread. ☕
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#7 ·
Charles Gomez said:Alright, then go ahead—quote me where I actually called someone a Chetnik. Since you’re so keen on quoting me in this thread anyway. ☕

Look, I was saying basically the exact same thing as you:
Charles Gomez said:Oh my god...
Just look at how much the Russian rhetoric overlaps with that old-school extremist rhetoric from the nineties...
If the situations are supposedly so different, why does the talk sound so terrifyingly similar?

Jack Cook7
And what about the rhetoric from those drug-addled cannibalistic Nazi pedophiles?

I got banned, you didn't, and neither did any other user in that last quote. So, what's the actual difference between our posts?

Meanwhile, I've been slapped with bans twice for saying almost the same thing within just two months. That tells me there's a pretty consistent pattern in how at least two of the mods handle things over a few months. I'm just looking for some clarity on this "consistency" and what the rules actually are.

PS: I didn't even specify who I meant by "those representatives," but it was OBVIOUSLY clear who I was talking about. If it was that obvious, then it's clearly common knowledge to the mods, so why is my opinion considered a crime? Bottom line—either both takes are against the rules, or neither of them are.
Jessica Smith11 Jessica Smith11 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Oct 2013
#8 ·
Jack Cook7 said:I expressed an opinion that was completely identical to yours:

If you think those two things are the same, then I guess we're done here.
You're claiming two totally different concepts are identical. Whatever.
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#9 ·
Charles Gomez said:If you think those two things are the same, then we’re totally done here. There’s nothing left to talk about.
You're seriously claiming two completely different things are identical. Unbelievable.

Charles Gomez said:Oh boy, here we go...
Just look at the rhetoric used by Russian propagandists and compare it to that old-school extremist stuff from the nineties...
If the situations are so different, why does the language sound so terrifyingly similar?

Jack Cook7
And what about the rhetoric from the supporters of those drugged-out, cannibalistic, pedophile Nazis?

Seriously, can someone explain what the actual difference is? My point was actually way milder and more vague since I didn't even target a specific group (at least not in this post).
Jessica Smith11 Jessica Smith11 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Oct 2013
#10 ·
Jack Cook7 said:Could someone please clarify what the actual difference is here? I think my statement was actually more tempered and vague since I wasn't even targeting a specific group (at least not in this particular post).

Look, we all know who the Russian sympathizers are and we know who the old-school white supremacists are. Or do you really need me to spell that out for you too?
And we can clearly see how today's pro-Russian rhetoric mirrors the exact same lines used by those extremists back in the early nineties: the idea of being a persecuted minority, claims that fascists are in charge, a defenseless people fighting back, foreign mercenaries everywhere...

But then there's your take. What do you mean, pedophiles?!? Who exactly are these pedophiles you're talking about? Nazis? Cannibals? Junkies?

I'm guessing you got banned for trolling because your post is just completely nonsensical.
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#11 ·
Charles Gomez said:We all know who the Russian sympathizers are and we know exactly who the old-school extremists were. Do I really need to spell that out for you?
It’s just like looking at the rhetoric coming from Russian apologists today and comparing it to those radical militias back in the early nineties: the "persecuted underdog" act, claims that fascists are running everything, an unarmed people fighting for survival, foreign mercenaries everywhere...

But then there's your take. What do you mean "pedophiles"?!? Who exactly are these pedophiles you're talking about? Nazis? Cannibals? Junkies?

I'm guessing you got banned for trolling because, honestly, your post was pure nonsense.

Same goes for us. We "know" who the anti-Russian crowd is, we "know" who represents them, we "know" who's cutting their checks, and we "know" who the pedophiles, Nazis, junkies, and "cannibals" are. We "know" where they come from and we "know" who's been funding, legally protecting, and giving them free passes in the media for years now.

Your projection of rhetoric versus my projection of rhetoric.

Your opinion, my opinion.

Why should your consistently held views go unpunished while my consistently held views are constantly being penalized?
rustydrifter10 rustydrifter10 Regular
693 messages
joined Apr 2011
#12 ·
Come on, guys, let's wrap up this bickering already. Someone in charge will step in and look into what's actually going on soon enough.
Charles Fox10 Charles Fox10 Regular
352 messages
joined Mar 2009
#13 ·
If you start throwing around accusations of pedophilia—whether you think it's true or just imply it—expect a three-day suspension. Just don't go making those kinds of allegations here.

Calling someone involved in this conflict in Ukraine a thug, a fascist, or a Nazi... that’s an immediate strike for breaking the rules.

Inciting war, violence, or killing, along with justifying any of that, will result in a ban, much like belittling victims.

Insulting any nationality is a violation. We don't allow insults here.

A lot depends on context, but these are the basic guidelines. Consider yourselves warned, especially since we laid this out in the opening post of what is now the sixth part of this thread.

Most importantly, just report the post and ignore it. One of us will step in. Replying to a rule-breaking post actually violates our policy and only feeds the trolls, which we've told you repeatedly not to do.

This topic is complicated. Posts are flying in almost every minute, and even with all of us moderators on duty, it's hard to catch everything. If something slips through, let us know via a report or a DM.
mistyjackal14 mistyjackal14 Active Member
73 messages
joined Aug 2012
#14 ·
So, I’m stepping up to join this public call for discussion 😁

1. It seems to me that this "Nazi" propaganda actually started on the Russian side from day one, and honestly, it pops up in almost every single post I see.
2. Every other thing people bring up is some comparison to Syria. (It used to be Mexico all the time, though I guess Mexico has slipped down a few spots in the conversation lately.)
3. And then every third topic is anything and everything else, as long as it isn't actually about Ukraine.

There is such a massive difference between just throwing around empty labels like "Nazis, Nazis" and looking at the actual reality—which, if you think about it, feels a lot like seeing those paramilitary groups back in Crimea. I mean, you have both sides playing these roles, but it becomes almost negligible when you consider the historical parallels that we are watching unfold right before our eyes.
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#15 ·
Charles Fox10 said:Look, if you think someone’s a creep, fine—say it. But if you're just throwing around accusations or hinting at pedophilia without proof? Yeah, we’ll be seeing each other in court in three days. Seriously, quit tossing those labels around like candy. Don't go making baseless accusations.

Man, you call someone a Chetnik, a fascist, a Nazi, or just straight-up trash because of this whole mess in Ukraine, and you’re gonna get hit with a warning for breaking the rules faster than you can blink. Seriously.

Look, just a heads-up: if you start calling for war, glorifying violence, or cheering on people getting killed, you’re gonna get banned. Same goes for trashing the victims. Don't even go there.

Look, anyone trashing a whole nation? That’s an instant ban. We don't play that here—insulting people based on where they're from is strictly off-limits.

It all really comes down to the context of what’s being said, but I wanted to lay out some basic ground rules just so everyone’s on the same page. Consider this your heads-up, especially since we're diving into the sixth installment of this thread!

And most importantly? Just report the post and let it go. Seriously, just ignore it! One of us will jump in and handle it. If you start replying to a reported post, you’re basically breaking the rules yourself—plus, you're just falling for that whole "don't feed the trolls" thing we've all heard a million times before. It's getting old!

Look, this whole thing is getting pretty intense. Posts are flying in almost every single minute, and honestly? It’s getting tough to keep everything under control. No matter how many of us mods are pulling double shifts to watch the boards, stuff is bound to slip through the cracks sometimes. If we miss something, just give us a heads-up—either flag the post directly or shoot us a DM. We're doing our best!

Thanks for getting back to me so fast! That’s exactly what I was looking for this time around.
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#16 ·
PS: what about that cannibal and the junkie?
Charles Fox10 Charles Fox10 Regular
352 messages
joined Mar 2009
#17 ·
Jack Cook7 said:PS: What about the cannibal and the junkie?

I don't suppose you expect us to draft an official list of banned terms, even if it's pretty obvious these fall under that umbrella.
Jack Cook7 Jack Cook7 Regular
376 messages
joined Aug 2017
#18 ·
Charles Fox10 said:You can't seriously expect us to sit here and write out a massive list of banned terms when it’s already obvious they fall under that umbrella.

Charles Fox10
If you call someone in this Ukraine conflict a thug, a fascist, or a Nazi... yeah, you're looking at a minimum ban for breaking the rules.

Look, I get all that, really I do. But my questions from the jump have been pretty straightforward.

Take this: if a country, a government, or some specific group of people is super chill with drug users or actually promotes drug production—whether it's official policy or just the vibe—can I call that culture "junkie culture"? Or maybe even "pro-drug"?

Basically, am I allowed to say on this forum that Western culture is junkie-driven? Whatever "Western culture" actually means in this context.

And following that logic, can I say everyone representing that culture is basically a representative of addiction?

That’s the whole point of why I started this thread. I just want us to be crystal clear about the criteria for handing out bans.

Why is it totally fine to ignore someone calling another guy a total extremist based on zero facts, but if I call someone a junkie, I get slapped with a penalty?
wiredangler5 wiredangler5 Active Member
54 messages
joined Mar 2013
#19 ·
Charles Fox10 said:If you call someone a pedophile or imply it, expect to be banned within three days. Just don't throw those accusations around.

If you start calling people involved in this conflict in Ukraine names like thugs, fascists, or Nazis... you're looking at a minimum ban for breaking the rules.

Inciting war, violence, or murder—or justifying any of that—will get you banned just like disrespecting victims will.

Insulting any nation is an automatic strike because insults aren't allowed here.

A lot depends on context, but these are the ground rules. You've been warned in the intro post, and this is already the sixth part of this thread.

Most importantly, please just report the post and ignore it. One of us will step in. If you reply to a flagged post, you're technically breaking the rules yourself, and honestly, it's better to just follow the "don't feed the trolls" advice.

The topic is complicated and posts are flying in every minute. It’s hard to catch everything even with all of us moderators on duty, so if we miss something, please let us know via a report or a DM.

Amen.

Avoid labeling anyone. No matter which side they're on, stay away from terms like thugs, fascists, cannibals, or pedophiles. Any such name-calling will result in a warning, regardless of your actual stance or how polite the rest of your post is.


Jack Cook7 said:I get all that, but my questions have been pretty straightforward since this thread started.

For instance, if a country, government, or culture is lenient toward drug users or promotes drug production—officially or otherwise—can I label that culture as "drug-addicted"? Or at least "pro-drug"?

Can I say on this forum that Western culture is drug-addicted? Whatever "Western culture" implies in this context.

And by extension, can I say that everyone representing that culture represents drug addiction?

No, because that's hard to define accurately and usually leads to overgeneralizing. Just because a government pursues a certain policy doesn't mean every single person follows or supports it.
Charles Fox10 Charles Fox10 Regular
352 messages
joined Mar 2009
#20 ·
Jack Cook7 said:I’ve had enough, but my initial questions here were actually quite straightforward.

For instance, if a certain state, government, culture, or group of people is benevolent toward drug users or the production of drugs—whether they promote it officially or just through subtext—do I have the right to label that culture as drug-addicted? Or at least drug-friendly?

So, am I allowed to say on this forum that Western culture is addicted to drugs? Whatever that term might encompass.

And following that logic, can I claim that all representatives of that culture are representatives of addiction?

That is the core reason I started this thread. Just a simple attempt to objectively clarify the criteria for handing out bans.

Why is it that someone can be persistently labeled a terrorist based on completely baseless claims without pushback, yet if I call someone an addict, I get penalized?

I already laid out the basic outlines of our moderation policy, emphasizing that context is everything. That’s really all there is to it.

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