Suggestion for a new PDF format

Henry Hernandez7 said:Just send a link if that's how they want to argue. Or, if the author isn't feeling it, they can just vent their frustrations "from the heart" instead.

If we go down that road, you’re looking at a real mess:
a) any post saying "I replied via the link" would basically be flagged as spam.
b) even if those don't get nuked, what happens when the person you actually decided to reply to in a new thread just... ignores you?

I'm honestly worried that some trollish PDF would end up with its own little fanbase—people who don't actually contribute anything except waiting for a fight just to fan the flames. How on earth would an Admin manage that?

rustydrifter10 said:If you are, this starts sounding more like a debate, and we already have a PDF for that. 😬

A debate follows strict rules. This would be more like a gentleman's duel. 🙄

rustydrifter10, shadowpilot8 makes a fair point. This proposal isn't just about allowing boxing; it’s more like suggesting we turn this place into a street brawl—or if I may use an analogy, a bar full of crocodiles.

Matthew Anderson, you're absolutely right. Those who have no interest in participating in blatant trolling (if that isn't an oxymoron, as was just explained) will inevitably dismantle the entire concept. Consequently, the topic would once again be hijacked by actual trolls, simply because the "regular" users wouldn't bother showing up—or, alternatively, they wouldn't even realize they were being lured into a trap in some dedicated troll corner. The consequences here are twofold: either those who inhabit such a space would get along famously (given they tend to struggle with the rest of society rather than with people like themselves), meaning it wouldn't actually function as a troll thread; or, secondarily, people would migrate there after being shut down on a standard thread because the moderators prevented them from tearing each other apart. At that point, things would rapidly devolve into ad hominem attacks and end up sanctioned anyway (to quote the proposer's own words regarding the corner in the first post).

I believe the proposal requires significant refinement...

William Bennett53 said:it’s basically like those old movies where someone insults you at a diner and you challenge them to a showdown in the alleyway right outside. honestly, it solves a few problems:
1. inside the diner (our main thread), things stay chill because nobody's throwing punches; it stays a civilized little oasis.
2. the guys who actually have an itch for a fight can head out back to settle it, so everyone gets what they want.
3. if someone gets called out to the alley (meaning, off-topic) and decides to stay seated instead, they might take a tiny hit to their ego, but they don't get caught in the crossfire of the trolling.
everyone wins...
did I catch the drift of what you were getting at?

Spot on.

rustydrifter10 said:If you're asking me, it feels more like we're just spinning our wheels in a debate, and honestly, we’ve already got a PDF that covers all that. 😬

It’s a debate, sure, but honestly? It’s more like a low-key troll fight, which is something we just don't really see around here.

Matthew Anderson said:If you posted "I replied to you at the link," it would get nuked as spam immediately.

Even if you don't wipe it, what happens if you decide to reply to someone on a new thread and they just... don't hit back?

I’ve got this nagging feeling that those troll PDFs are just going to end up attracting a bunch of residents who don't actually produce anything—they just sit around waiting for a fight so they can stir the pot.

So, how exactly would you go about moderating that?

Even rustydrifter10 said the same thing, and honestly, I’m still scratching my head trying to figure out how to tackle this mess.

It’s nobody's business but his, really. If he doesn't want to get involved, that's fine by me. No skin off my nose.

Not bad for us folks who like to get a little rowdy once in a while.

Honestly, I’d throw my hat in the ring for a moderator position on that PDF if Admin would be willing to mentor me. We really need to start cracking down on the actual vitriol—you know, the "you're an idiot" or "get lost" type of garbage—instead of just policing people for how they package their insults. That’s the whole point of the document, isn't it?

shadowpilot8 said:Look, debates have their own set of strict rules, but this? This feels more like a gentleman's brawl. 🙄

Spot on.

William Bennett53 said:rustydrifter10, shadowpilot8 actually has a point here—the suggestion isn't even about sanctioned boxing anymore, it's more like inviting a full-on street brawl. To put it bluntly, it’s like opening up a bar filled with crocodiles.

Matthew Anderson, you’re totally right. Anyone who isn't looking to get sucked into obvious trolling—if that even makes sense given how we just defined it—basically kills the whole concept. If we went that route, only actual trolls would show up because regular users wouldn't bother, or they'd just be too clueless to realize they're walking straight into a trap. It’s a lose-lose situation. Either the people hanging out there would actually get along because they've got beef with the rest of the world rather than each other, which means it wouldn't even be a troll thread, or you'd get those guys who start acting out in normal threads and then find themselves blocked by a moderator when they try to go on a rampage. It would all devolve into petty personal attacks within minutes, and we'd end up back at square one with sanctions, just like the guy who originally suggested the corner said in his first post.

I reckon this proposal needs a fair amount of polishing up...

True, this draft definitely needs some work; might be worth tossing in a few fresh ideas for that PDF too.

Henry Hernandez7 said:3. It’s not a bad idea for those of us who enjoy stirring the pot a little.

In other words, your proposed subreddit serves no purpose other than giving you and your crew of troublemakers a private corner where you can be moderated even less than we are here.

The whole thing is fundamentally flawed. You won't even be on the main sub, yet someone on some troll thread will quote a post from the main site, and nobody will respond—except for the specific group that calls the troll sub their home base.

Henry Hernandez7 said:4. I’d actually volunteer to moderate that sub myself under Admin’s mentorship. We’d target stuff like "you're an idiot" or "go to a strip club," rather than punishing people for just being incredibly sarcastic. That’s the whole point of a sub like that.

Given your track record of drama, I highly doubt anyone would ever back you for a moderator position.

Henry Hernandez7, you think it’s actually time you finally launched your own forum?

Matthew Anderson said:Basically, your sub is just a playground for you and your group of trolls to hang out in a space where we won't have to moderate half as much as we do here.

2. There’s also a bigger issue at play. You aren't even active on Reddit, yet some guy on a troll thread quotes an American subreddit post, and nobody responds—except for the specific crowd that calls that troll thread their home base.

3. Honestly, after all the drama you've stirred up, I don't see anyone actually backing you for a moderator role.

1. The whole point is just to reduce the amount of bans happening in the main threads.

2. Yeah, and there's nothing wrong with that. We aren't messing with the main subreddit, so everyone stays happy.

3. Look, we could figure that part out as we go; I don't think it's a dealbreaker. If you really want to be a mod for that sub, go for it.

hollowtrucker77 said:Henry Hernandez7, why don't you just start your own forum?

This thing's big enough, honestly, especially considering how many people are hanging out here.

Henry Hernandez7 said:1. It’s mostly about keeping the clutter down in the main thread.

2. And yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. We aren't trolling the master thread; everyone stays happy.

3. Fair enough, we could tackle that on the side, though I don't think it's a dealbreaker. Hey, feel free to be the moderator of that thread if you're that eager.

1. You're starting from the assumption that everyone actually wants to move the conversation to a new thread, which isn't necessarily true. I don't see a massive crowd of people wanting to run two parallel discussions on the exact same topic.

2. Like I said before, the trolls—or those who swear they aren't trolls—are just going to keep posting in the master thread regardless.

3. No thanks, I haven't lost my mind.

😁

Don't mind mellowlynx68, they're just trolling this thread. Trying to have a serious conversation about this proposal is... well... honestly just a waste of time 😬.

Matthew Anderson said:First off, you’re assuming everyone actually wants to jump over to a new thread just to keep the debate going, which isn't necessarily true. I don't see a ton of people being down to run two separate discussions on the same topic at once.

2. Like I said before, the trolls—or the people who think they aren't trolling while they totally are—are just gonna keep posting on the main thread anyway.

3. No thanks, I'm not crazy.

😁

1.& 2. We're talking about assumptions here.

3. Since when is that crazy!?

mellowlynx68 said:Look, Nick's just trolling this thread at this point because trying to have a serious conversation about this proposal is... well... let's just say it's pretty ridiculous 😬.

What makes the proposal so ridiculous?

Henry Hernandez7 said:1. Even rustydrifter10 mentioned something similar, so I’m honestly stumped on how to tackle this issue.

Can I just send a private message to the other user?

rustydrifter10 said:Should we just slide into their DMs instead?

I mean, sure, but I feel like that’s just a one-way ticket to clogging up someone's inbox.

Honestly, they probably ought to just touch base with the technical Admins about some tech glitch or whatever, maybe mention that a certain user found the answer buried in a PDF or something like that.

Henry Hernandez7 said:Honestly, they should probably check in with the technical admins about sending out some kind of system alert since a user actually replied inside that PDF. Or something along those lines.

Why though? You think this is spam? The forum only pinged me because Henry Hernandez7 decided to write a reply inside a troll PDF.

I figured it’d make things easier for everyone to chat, but if it’s just coming off as spam, fine by me. Anyone actually interested in that PDF can just head over there and grab it, simple as that.

rustydrifter10, who’s actually signing off on the new PDF—is it Mr. Anderlon or did he just hand the reins over to you guys? Obviously, I'm asking assuming we finally figure out how to actually notify people once there's a response to that file.

Henry Hernandez7 said:I mean, they really ought to touch base with the technical admins about some kind of tech update, maybe suggesting that certain users have specific answers tucked away in a PDF or something like that.

I was actually chewing on that same idea myself, and now that I'm looking over your suggestion, I think we definitely need to look into tweaking the vBulletin setup down the road to accommodate something like this.

I honestly don't get how nobody thought of this sooner—you'd obviously need to know your way around vBulletin to even suggest it, so Henry Hernandez7, did you stumble upon this somewhere or did it just pop into your head?

Anyway, it's pretty interesting stuff.