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Why are religion threads being closed for no reason?

Started by cosmicskipper82 · · 👁 4 views · 10 replies

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Participants cosmicskipper82Brenda Cook4Morgan Rodriguez57Timothy Robinson2Chris Peterson53feralpilot0
cosmicskipper82 cosmicskipper82 NewcomerOP
7 messages
joined Mar 2011
#1 ·
I intend to lodge a formal complaint regarding the moderation of the 'religion' subforum and the general attitude displayed by the moderators toward the community.

Regarding the actual moderation, threads are being shut down without any coherent justification. Just Look Up at this instance.

As for the moderator's conduct toward users, my grievance lies in how she handled my perfectly civilized observation within a thread specifically designed for such discourse. My attempt at dialogue was met with a mere response consisting of a single sentence—which, I should note, was later amended—that essentially boils down to "I will not answer you." When I dared to point out that such a dismissal does not constitute an answer, the response I received was a blatant ad hominem attack.

Consequently, I propose that we either overhaul the way the religion section is managed or simply abolish the grievance book entirely, as it serves no purpose if moderators refuse to deign to address user feedback. If a user is permitted only a single reply, then one ought to provide a thorough explanation in that one shot. Of course, that assumes an explanation even exists. It appears to me that there is no objective reasoning behind these actions; rather, these threads are being closed based solely on the private whims and preferences of the moderator.
Brenda Cook4 Brenda Cook4 Regular
373 messages
joined Sep 2010
#2 ·
cosmicskipper82 said:I want to file a formal complaint here regarding the moderation of the 'religion' subforum, specifically concerning how the moderators interact with the community.

As far as the actual moderation goes, threads are being shut down without any logical explanation. Just Look Up...

Actually, I think the reasons are more than "logical" enough (just read my response).

Regarding how the moderators treat users, my issue is really about how that specific moderator handled my perfectly civilized critique within a thread meant for that exact purpose. My response was essentially a one-sentence dismissal (this part starting with 'only this' was added later) which boils down to 'I won't answer you.' But when I pointed out that wasn't an actual answer, I was met with an ad hominem attack.

The moderator was actually being quite lenient toward your 'complaint,' because usually, people only file these when they feel personally 'slighted' by a deleted or closed thread. You aren't staff, yet I still took the time to reply to you.
The rules state you get one follow-up, and anything beyond that is considered spam. If you want to participate in this forum and the PDF, you have to respect the ground rules. Even then, I was being very generous by simply deleting your post instead of hitting you with a spam penalty.
As for the alleged 'ad hominem,' that’s just not true. If you actually read your own comments in that thread, you weren't even addressing the topic; you were doing the opposite—arguing why the topic was pointless and trying to steer off-topic onto specialized forums. Then, once the thread is closed, suddenly your tune changes and you look for an excuse to start a fight.
So, my suggestion is either change how the religion section is moderated or scrap the complaint book entirely if it's useless because moderators refuse to dignify user feedback with a response. If we are only allowed one follow-up, then there's no reason not to write a detailed explanation. Unless, of course, there isn't one. To me, it feels like there isn't an objective reason for these closures at all; it seems like they happen purely based on the moderator's personal preferences.

Look Up.

...it seems like they happen purely based on the moderator's personal preferences.


Agajin, I believe I explained the reasoning for closing the thread in great detail, but you clearly can't be reasoned with. You shouldn't jump to such baseless assumptions, because there is absolutely no truth to what you're claiming.
Morgan Rodriguez57 Morgan Rodriguez57 Active Member
216 messages
joined Oct 2011
#3 ·
So, my post on this same thread got wiped out for absolutely no reason—like, totally out of nowhere—and all I was doing was pointing out a few basic facts...
Morgan Rodriguez57 Morgan Rodriguez57 Active Member
216 messages
joined Oct 2011
#4 ·
So, I just got a ping from one of the religion sub-forum mods saying my post was flagged as spam... I guess I should just be grateful they didn't go ahead and ban me entirely... 🙏

They’ve certainly set up their appeals process to follow their own little set of rules... honestly, it feels like the whole thread is just there for show, since any complaints that don't fit their narrative just get wiped away... I can't recall a single time one of my actual appeals wasn't just deleted...

Since I'm basically being silenced over there, I might as well just repeat what I wrote right here:

On a few different occasions, groups of users on this site have asked for dedicated religious sub-forums for various faiths—you know, to keep things organized—but they were turned down... back during those discussions, it was suggested that as a middle ground, we could open special threads for specific audiences (like for Catholics, for instance)... these topics would be clearly labeled in the title, and the mods would make sure the threads stayed clean from the usual trolling, spamming, and insults that tend to clutter up the "mainstream" threads...

But it looks like that possibility—and that whole promise—just sort of slipped through the cracks, and when Lutnja finally tried to make use of it, they suddenly found an excuse to shut the whole thing down...

And of course, after posting all that in the appeals section, the religion mod crew is calling it spam here too, telling me I should be happy I haven't been kicked off the site yet... 🙏 👍
Timothy Robinson2 Timothy Robinson2 Member
27 messages
joined Feb 2011
#5 ·
Morgan Rodriguez57 said:The religion mod just messaged me saying my post was spam... I guess I should be glad they didn't just ban me outright... 🙏

Well, you have this: which Catholics should probably use.

Besides that, there are a few stickied threads for Christianity, Islam, and Judaism.
Chris Peterson53 Chris Peterson53 Active Member
114 messages
joined Dec 2010
#6 ·
Basta;32752858 said:
cut

Quote

What kind of promise are you talking about, and when exactly did that happen, Basta?
There have been suggestions and debates—sure—but zero concrete decisions made.
You’re playing the "clueless outsider" card here, even though you know perfectly well that moderators don't just make unilateral calls regarding the layout of the site or its subreddits.
Every major structural change is decided by the owner and the admin team of this Reddit!
And as for what you’re claiming (or rather, trying to frame as the collective desire of all users)—subreddits based on religious affiliation haven't been approved, and frankly, I think they're unnecessary. The religion this forum PDF wasn't designed according to the concept you're pushing; the moderator blue bird already made that clear.
You're working overtime to paint the moderators as tyrants who just do whatever they feel like, acting like you can't stand the rules—even though you conveniently cite them whenever someone else's comment gets under your skin. How would that PDF (or any document, for that matter) look without rules????

What do you mean, "deleting legitimate complaints" in the Suggestion Book and Appeals?
The purpose of those sections was explained ages ago (try actually reading it), and
everything gets an answer (except for trolling and spam). Resolved threads are cleared out at the end of the month because we can't allow the place to get clogged up with old posts.
Your deleted post was pure spam, because you didn't offer an unbiased suggestion—instead, you jumped into a dialogue between another user and a moderator just to throw accusations and grievances at the staff.

Bottom line, Basta: if you're really this dissatisfied with the current Religion PDF concept, then lay out your vision for changes clearly, logically, and without the (unnecessary) bitterness right here (this is the place for it), and then maybe the decision-makers will actually consider your proposals.
Morgan Rodriguez57 Morgan Rodriguez57 Active Member
216 messages
joined Oct 2011
#7 ·
Chris Peterson53 said:Wait, what promise? When did that even happen, Morgan Rodriguez57?

...

Look, Morgan Rodriguez57, if you’re really that unhappy with how the Religion sub-forum is set up—like, truly dissatisfied—then just lay out your vision for changes right here. Be specific, make some solid arguments, stay neutral, and maybe skip the extra bitterness... this is the place for it, and then the admins can actually look over your suggestions.

Regarding those debates about religion in this specific section... they actually rejected the idea for separate sub-forums, but they did open things up for specialized topics... if those discussion threads haven't been wiped from the archives yet, everything should still be searchable and readable...

I am, yeah, I'm unsatisfied. This whole forum feels like it's run by hardcore atheists, and anyone who doesn't fall into the specific group the moderators favor ends up totally unprotected... I feel like I'll just end up getting banned simply because, for some reason, I've been labeled a "fundamentalist," while the "progressive" and "enlightened" crowd gets all the special treatment...

As for my actual views, they're already laid out in those other threads I mentioned earlier...
Chris Peterson53 Chris Peterson53 Active Member
114 messages
joined Dec 2010
#8 ·
You aren't being objective, Busta!
Between the plants, the insults, and the blatant twisting of words—not to mention the facts themselves being skewed—there’s plenty of toxicity coming from both sides, whether you're religious or not. We've had enough of it already.

And which "side" are these moderators supposedly favoring?
Sanctions are handed out to everyone across the board—surely even you've noticed that by now.
Are you actually falling for that false equivalence trap? It's a tactic used to highlight moderator bias, but it incorrectly equates a user's opinion with their standing as a forum participant—which, regardless of their role as a moderator, should still grant them the right to speak as a regular user.
What exactly are we talking about here? Should a religious moderator ban atheists from voicing their views? Or vice versa?
That’s precisely why we need rules in place—to rein in anything that crosses the line of civilized dialogue.
I don't know where you stand—if you've been labeled a fundamentalist or if you even subscribe to that definition yourself...
but I can't shake the feeling that you have this very specific, personal vision of the Religion subreddit that bears almost no resemblance to how it was actually designed, implemented, and approved. Honestly, you need to settle that conflict within yourself and decide if you actually want to be part of this community.
As for this "empire" business...
I’d say the entire Reddit is essentially a new empire—one where you either agree to follow the rules, written or unwritten, or you simply walk away.
Morgan Rodriguez57 Morgan Rodriguez57 Active Member
216 messages
joined Oct 2011
#9 ·
Chris Peterson53 said:You're being biased, Morgan Rodriguez57!
There’s plenty of trolling, insults, and twisting words happening on both sides—from the believers and the non-believers alike—so there's more than enough of that to go around...

And which side are the moderators actually favoring?
Sanctions get handed out to everyone, if you've bothered to notice...
Are you falling into that trap where people equate a user's personal opinion with the official stance of the site—which is a tactic used to claim moderator bias—thereby trying to strip everyone else of their right to speak as just regular users?
What, should a religious moderator ban atheists from sharing their views? Or vice versa?
That’s exactly why we need rules—just to keep things within the bounds of civilized conversation...
I don't know about you, or how you'd be categorized—if you're considered a fundamentalist, or what that even means to you personally...
but I can't help feeling like you have this specific version of the Religion section in your head, one that's totally different from how it was actually designed, set up, and approved. And honestly, that's something you really need to figure out for yourself... then decide if you even want to stay...
As for this whole "empire" thing...
I’d say the entire CNN is basically its own little kingdom, and you either agree with the rules—written or unwritten—or you move on...

exactly... the Religion section wouldn't be any different, because even on other parts of the site, you don't exactly have absolute freedom of speech... try expressing total freedom of opinion on a politics thread, or try talking nonsense about global warming on the science board, and boom—you'll see the sanctions come flying... on the religion board, anyone who's just a bit out of line—sorry to the outliers—can get called out... that's why religion can't ever rise above the level of middle school textbooks, internet memes, or media hysteria... it just ends up being a pamphlet for a small group of protected, chosen people...
feralpilot0 feralpilot0 Active Member
142 messages
joined Jul 2018
#10 ·
Morgan Rodriguez57 said:exactly... a religious PDF wouldn't be anything special because...

That’s just overreaching. And frankly, pointless.

If you argued that moderation favors believers over atheists—which, let's face it, might actually hold water—then maybe we'd see more freedom to push religious dogma and doctrine.
But even that is open to scrutiny, since this is an American forum, and we always circle back to that reality.

The only way they could work it would be by embedding religious tenets directly into the site rules—but then everyone else would revolt, including the moderators themselves.
Timothy Robinson2 Timothy Robinson2 Member
27 messages
joined Feb 2011
#11 ·
I don't think religion should be mostly about wearing your faith on your sleeve like that. If it becomes all about proselytizing, it just stops being a conversation. It’s just preaching at people, I guess.

Honestly, the posts that have nothing to do with the actual topic just bother me. It’s all just people taking cheap shots at someone else, and nobody ever does anything about it. I mean, maybe a ban is overkill, but they should at least delete the post. There are times when you see someone using certain terms to insult another user, and they just get away with it. No consequences. Nothing. Even after all those reports... nothing changes. I guess.:

  • It's like I'm talking to some idiot who keeps making up things I never even said.
  • Maybe you should learn how to quote text properly.
  • Are you dyslexic or something?
  • You’re seriously obsessed, man. I guess.
  • Are you kidding me? Are you actually serious right now?
  • I guess you'd have to be a special kind of idiot to think I'm talking about some conspiracy theory.
  • Man, are you sick or something?
  • I feel like I'm talking to an idiot.
  • And now you’re trying to flip this all on me like some kind of idiot. I guess.
  • God, what kind of idiots am I dealing with here?

Just for comparison, I wanted to throw out a few statements. They’re pretty one-dimensional. Maybe they make sense on their own, I guess, but compared to what was mentioned above? Not really.

  • Look, you're just trying to get a rise out of me. Fine. If you want me to step away for a bit, I guess I can do that.
  • Look, you might think I'm being malicious, but I'll try to explain my reasoning:
  • You’re obviously pissed off about some priest or something, but honestly, you're being unfair.
  • What does that even have to do with rational thinking?

When that guy complains, I think he’s mostly just fed up with how often it happens. You see these obvious atheists throwing insults left and right, and they just get away with it. It’s insulting, really. Sometimes even the mods get targeted, and yet somehow, their bans just end up getting lifted anyway. I guess that's just how it goes.

There are plenty of atheists out there. Honestly, they probably make up most of the population at this point. And they’re actually capable of having a conversation—using actual arguments instead of just trolling or throwing personal insults. I guess that's saying something.

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