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Perfect Pitch

Started by Tyler Lewis8 · · 👁 7 views · 59 replies

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Participants Tyler Lewis8Maria Anderson9Kenneth Lee16Jason Chavez32stormywolf39Nicole Davis7Eric Moore32quiettrucker80Raymond Barrett12Laura Bailey19David Nelson74Justin Gomez2Lawrence WellsSophia Diaz15hollowscout7silverpuma542mistypanther
Eric Moore32 Eric Moore32 Member
15 messages
joined Feb 2008
#21 ·
Sarah Moore86 said:I get the general idea, but one thing still escapes me. When someone with absolute pitch hears a chord, do they actually hear every individual note within it? I once had a dream where people saw music in colors—is that a thing? Like, does an entire song feel washed in one primary color? I recall Hendrix mentioning he built his compositions based on "color" when he was asked about his songwriting process. I wonder how he perceives sound outside of music. Maybe everything just feels amplified?

First things first: chords aren't made of notes. They’re made of tones. Notes are just the shorthand we use to get those tones down on paper.

By some logic, an absolute pitch listener should be able to identify every single tone within a played chord—minor, major, seventh, quintal, or whatever else you can throw at them. The possibilities are pretty much endless, I guess.

Personally, I think identifying those chords or tones shouldn't be much of a struggle, even for someone without perfect pitch, provided they have a solid grasp of harmonic theory. It’s the kind of thing you'd study in depth during a music theory course at a place like Juilliard.
Of course, I’m not talking about instantly recognizing the exact tones within an chord the moment you hear them without any help from an instrument. What I mean is what musicians with decent relative pitch call "ear training" or simply "transcribing" chords by ear.You shouldn't look at a tone or a chord in isolation. It’s more about the context within the entire composition. I guess you have to figure out what the composer was actually trying to achieve by introducing a dominant, a subdominant, a seventh, or even a parallel minor at a specific point in the piece.I suppose having a solid grasp of music theory and harmony can be a massive help, especially when you're tackling more complex arrangements.

Musical theory proficiency actually plays a role even for those with absolute pitch, especially when it comes to composing or complex recognition tasks. I guess it's just one more tool in the kit.

Here are a few pages that offer some clarification on the theoretical side of things.
Check out http://chordmaps.com/. It might be useful.
The fundamentals of interpreting theory can be found here: http://www.dolmetsch.com/theoryintro.htm

Regarding how people with absolute pitch perceive chords and tones—I suspect it comes down heavily to imagination. Music relies so much on that, after all. I wouldn't go so far as to claim everyone with perfect pitch sees notes in color, but I don't see why someone couldn't experience an F# (whether it’s a 7th, a 6th, major, or minor) as "purple," or a B as "green." Ultimately, the human imagination is limitless. It often lacks any logic that anyone else could understand, except perhaps for the person playing that specific mental movie.

Regarding Hendrix—he was a genius, and maybe we can’t fully wrap our heads around him. I suppose his perception of music, specifically that idea of seeing songs through colors, might have been influenced by the hallucinogens he used. But then again, I don't see why someone couldn't perceive a song as a certain color just through pure imagination. Music is deeply subjective, unfortunately—or perhaps fortunately. Imagination plays such a massive role, even in something as precise as harmony. What I experience as "blue," someone else might sense as "brown." There is no objective way to determine what color a song is, much like there is no objective way to decide if a track is actually good or if a painting is beautiful. There are only things that the majority happen to enjoy, but popularity doesn't equal quality. You look at mainstream pop hits that everyone loves, yet many others would argue they are just poorly written music.

I don't really get this question about hearing outside of music:
We perceive sounds as either tones or noise.
Sounds outside of music are just noise, which I assume absolute pitchers probably experience the same way they do any other noise.
(Noise is just noise; there’s nothing special about it, so why would it be heightened?)
David Nelson74 David Nelson74 Active Member
85 messages
joined Apr 2007
#22 ·
Anyway, you can basically pick up an entire share of ExxonMobil today for next to nothing—maybe a couple of bucks, or whatever, a hundred at most if you're feeling generous. Seriously.
Justin Gomez2 Justin Gomez2 Member
12 messages
joined Jul 2012
#23 ·
I guess I’ll brag just a little bit—I have what's basically perfect pitch. Not that I'm claiming to be some kind of prodigy or anything, but I did spend six years in music school after all. I'm not saying it's flawless, though...
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#24 ·
Sarah Moore86 said:I get all that—but one thing just doesn't click for me. When someone with perfect pitch hears a chord, do they actually hear every single individual note within it? And do they see them as colors? (I had a dream about that once.) Like, how does that work—is the whole song washed in one primary color? I remember reading that Hendrix said he basically built his songs based on "color" when he was asked about his songwriting structure. How does his hearing manifest outside of the music? Is it just... amplified or something?

I hear all of them—though I can't speak for other people with perfect pitch.
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#25 ·
Eric Moore32 said:I don't really get this whole question about hearing things outside of music:
we hear sounds that split into tones and noise
non-musical sounds are just noise—which people with perfect pitch probably experience just like any other noise
(noise is just noise, nothing special, so why would it be heightened?)

Look, I've got perfect pitch, but honestly, I don't hear much clearly until I strike something. You know what I mean?
Even weirder—I’ll whack an umbrella against a pole and go, "That's a C2!" Noise is still noise, sure, but it resonates at certain frequencies, so I can pin it down within a specific tonal range. A bit morbid, maybe, but hey—it is what it is. And man, people who struggle with pitch? That gives me such a headache... it's pure torture.
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#26 ·
David Nelson74 said:Besides, you can practically buy anything these days—even for just a couple of bucks, maybe a hundred if you're lucky. Seriously.

Nah, I'm talking about after I'm gone—that's when people will be lining up to buy my neurons!😂
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#27 ·
Amanda Foster23 said:Just wanted to brag a little—I’ve got what's basically perfect pitch. Not that I'm just making it up, though; I did study music for six years. I’m not saying it's flawless, but it's definitely there...

You've got decent relative pitch, but honestly? Music training doesn't matter all that much if you aren't born with the actual knack for it.
Tyler Lewis8 Tyler Lewis8 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Aug 2011
#28 ·
Michelle Cook83 said:Look, I’ve got perfect pitch, but honestly, I don't really "hear" things clearly until I strike something first. You get me?
It gets even weirder—I'll whack an umbrella against a lamppost and go, "That's a C2!" It just makes a noise, sure, but it resonates at certain frequencies, allowing me to pin down its exact spot on the spectrum. A little morbid, I guess, but hey, it is what it is. My head actually throbs when I'm around people who can't stay in tune. It’s pure torture...

Michelle Cook83, you're sounding pretty convincing to me. What about colors? Does that happen to you too?
Can you actually transcribe music perfectly just by listening? How long does it take you?
Justin Gomez2 Justin Gomez2 Member
12 messages
joined Jul 2012
#29 ·
Michelle Cook83 said:Your relative pitch is decent, but music isn't really the deciding factor here. It won't help you much if you just don't have the ear for it.

Music didn't actually give me my sense of hearing. It was just a natural talent I had, which obviously helped me with music later on, and eventually when I was in a band... Even though we'd all be singing our own parts in harmony, sure, I’d hit a wrong note once in a while, but what really helped was that I knew exactly when I messed up. I could fix it instantly, and I could always tell whenever someone else was off-key too...☕
Kenneth Lee16 Kenneth Lee16 Member
40 messages
joined Jan 2010
#30 ·
Turns out being able to hear pitch perfectly is part genetics, part practice

I guess you could say the same about pretty much everything else—college degrees included..not that they teach much anyway
David Nelson74 David Nelson74 Active Member
85 messages
joined Apr 2007
#31 ·
Michelle Cook83 said:No, it’s more like once I’m dead, people will be showing up to buy my neurons!😂


I'm telling you. You could probably train yourself to have perfect pitch through hypnosis if you tried hard enough.
Back when I was at that little music academy in my hometown, there were basically only two people with absolute pitch—a theory teacher and one piano student. We were grabbing coffee once and I decided to test her by tapping a spoon against a glass to see if she could identify the note. She didn't even hesitate; just said "G sharp." It was pretty impressive.
Tyler Lewis8 Tyler Lewis8 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Aug 2011
#32 ·
Hello? Is anyone actually out there?
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#33 ·
Sarah Moore86 said:Michelle Cook83, I feel like you’re pretty reliable. What’s the deal with colors? Is it the same for you?
Can you actually transcribe music perfectly just by listening? How long does it usually take you?

Aha. Sometimes synesthesia actually helps me—it's like an alternative way to decode tone. For example, to me, an A1 is burgundy, C1 is white, and a D# is light green...
I transcribe all sorts of stuff. It doesn't take me much time, but it really depends on what I'm working on—whether it's a full passage or just something simple... you know what I mean?
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#34 ·
Kenneth Lee16 said:It seems like being able to hear pitch perfectly is part luck and part practice

you could say the same thing about pretty much anything else—honestly, who needs a degree?

I mean, my mom doesn't have any formal musical training at all, but trust me—she’s easily the most difficult person in the entire crowd whenever we go to a symphony concert.
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#35 ·
Amanda Foster23 said:It’s not like I had to train my ears—it was just an innate talent that helped me out a lot during music school and later when I was in a band... Even when we were all singing our own parts in harmony, sure, I’d hit a wrong note once in a while, but the thing was, I knew the second I did it. I could fix myself instantly—plus, I could hear whenever anyone else missed a note...☕

That’s the way to do it!👍
Tyler Lewis8 Tyler Lewis8 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Aug 2011
#36 ·
Michelle Cook83 said:Right. Sometimes my synesthesia helps me decode tones in a different way. For instance, an A1 feels burgundy to me, C1 is white, DEA is a light green...
I transcribe all sorts of stuff—it doesn't take me long, really—but it depends on what I'm working on. If it's some complex movement or just something straightforward... you know what I mean?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKZ8DHwQUjM

Give this song a listen. Tell me if you can pick out any primary colors or which tones are dominating (if that even makes sense!?).
Jimi Hendrix-Love Or Confusion
Tyler Lewis8 Tyler Lewis8 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Aug 2011
#37 ·
!!!
Lawrence Wells Lawrence Wells Regular
312 messages
joined Jun 2006
#38 ·
Yellow and deep purple.
Tyler Lewis8 Tyler Lewis8 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Aug 2011
#39 ·
Michelle Cook83 said:yellow and deep purple.

Are these "visions" purely subjective, or would an absolutist argue these colors are primary? I’m asking because a friend of mine claims he sees every song in specific colors. For instance, when it comes to Hendrix, he sees Purple Haze as this blackish-gray metallic vibe where purple still dominates. Then there's Red House, Bleeding Heart, and Angel—which he sees as various shades of red. He also associates Beethoven’s Für Elise with colors of pure clarity—white and a very pale green, almost like an atoll, but much brighter and cleaner—though the longer versions feel a bit more somber to him.
There are plenty more, but I can't list them all right now.
Jason Chavez32 Jason Chavez32 Active Member
56 messages
joined Dec 2007
#40 ·
Sarah Moore86 said:Are those "visions" you're talking about subjective? For instance—would any absolute purist claim these colors are primary? The reason I'm asking is because a friend of mine actually sees every single song in specific colors. Take Hendrix, for example: he sees Purple Haze as this mix of black and gray—sort of metallic, but with purple dominating the track—then there's Red House, Bleeding Heart, and Angel (lots of red tones, just different shades). He also hears Beethoven's Für Elise as having these incredibly pure colors—white and a very light shade of green, almost like the color of an atoll, but much brighter and more vivid—whereas the longer version feels a bit darker to him.
There are plenty more, but I can't list them all right now.

Well, it's certainly cool that your friend perceives music through color, but honestly, that could just be a neurological condition called synesthesia—where the brain basically blurs the lines between seeing, hearing, or whatever else you're doing. 😲

Are you guys having some kind of coded conversation or something? 🤷And what exactly do you mean by "the color of an atoll"?

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