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How to fix Kyphosis and improve posture?

Started by Jeffrey Campbell97 · · 👁 8 views · 218 replies

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Participants Jeffrey Campbell97urbanwalker72wearyotter81Sean Bailey75rustybadger42quietpilot87Richard Cook2Nicole RossMelissa Perez10Arthur WilliamsJose Brown5Betty Gonzalez30Andrew Fowler4Rachel Turner2Nicholas Chavez70Walter Ross10Edward Vaughn10Michelle Sanders72rowdyangler5
Jeffrey Campbell97 Jeffrey Campbell97 NewcomerOP
3 messages
joined Jan 2014
#1 ·
I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?
urbanwalker72 urbanwalker72 Active Member
147 messages
joined Aug 2021
#2 ·
Jeffrey Campbell97 said:I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?

Are we talking about Kyphosis? Is it the thoracic spine? Are you describing a rounding in your upper back?
wearyotter81 wearyotter81 Member
28 messages
joined May 2015
#3 ·
Jeffrey Campbell97 said:I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?

First off, you really ought to get a professional to pinpoint exactly what’s going on with your spine. Once a specialist identifies your specific postural issues, then you can actually target them with the right exercises.

Without knowing the root cause, nobody can give you any real, actionable advice.
Sean Bailey75 Sean Bailey75 Member
29 messages
joined Jan 2014
#4 ·
Jeffrey Campbell97 said:I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?

It would probably be a good idea to see a specialist to determine if there is any scoliosis present alongside the Kyphosis. If the ultimate goal is to correct your posture and improve both your core strength and circulation, you'll likely need to strengthen your back muscles and work on spinal flexibility, all while bringing your weight down to a healthier range.

There are certain exercises you can perform right at your desk every thirty minutes or so during the workday. However, without supplemental training sessions—specifically focusing on how to move when standing up or lying down under the guidance of a pro—it can be pretty tough to master the proper form. A specialist could also teach you how to breathe correctly during these movements so you don't accidentally overstrain yourself.

There are so many variables here: How much weight are we talking about? What is your current height? When was the last time you were physically active? There are a lot of questions to answer before determining how much progress you can make on your posture without professional help.
rustybadger42 rustybadger42 Active Member
63 messages
joined Sep 2014
#5 ·
Jeffrey Campbell97 said:I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?

Best regards,
It sounds like your entire musculoskeletal system is out of sync. Even though you're already working on it—I assume you're doing specific spinal exercises—you keep sliding back into that slump because your muscles have been tight for too long and they've basically "memorized" that bad posture. The best move here is to focus on differentiation exercises. You can find more details on that at aeq.si🙂
quietpilot87 quietpilot87 Active Member
149 messages
joined Sep 2008
#6 ·
We don't have one here, but I'm sure there's some doctor out there 😁
Richard Cook2 Richard Cook2 Member
11 messages
joined Jan 2014
#7 ·
Jeffrey Campbell97 said:I’ve been wrestling with this issue of Kyphosis for quite a while now... I have some extra weight I really need to drop, and since my job is strictly desk-bound, the slouching is starting to become a genuine concern for me.

My goal is to finally fix my posture—to just naturally hold myself upright all the time—but I always seem to find myself curling forward again... and even when I do manage to sit up straight, I start feeling these nagging little aches because my body just isn't used to being in that position.

Does anyone have any advice on how to tackle this slouching and actually get my back straight again?

Stretch:
chest
anterior deltoid
upper trapezius
sternocleidomastoid
lumbar spine
hip flexors (like the psoas or rectus femoris)
adductors


Strengthen:

posterior deltoid
lower and middle trapezius
rhomboids
rotator cuff
core muscles
glutes
hamstrings
neck flexors


The thing is, sitting all day has disrupted your entire kinetic chain. It’s an incredibly common issue these days; honestly, almost every client I work with presents with some version of this problem. The only real variable is usually the severity of the postural distortion.

The key is to warm up, then stretch out those tight muscles, strengthen the weak ones, and then stretch the tight ones again. Ideally, you should follow this principle every single day. I've bolded the exercises related to lower body distortions, while the non-bolded ones target the upper body. You could alternate, doing the upper body one day and the lower body the next. However, you really need to do both because they are interconnected; one directly influences the other. In your case, the prolonged sitting likely caused your hip flexors to tighten first, which pulled your pelvis forward, leading to a functional lordosis, which then triggered a functional scoliosis.

Of course, it would be wise to consult with a professional (someone reputable) or a trainer who specializes in corrective exercise (just be careful to avoid the charlatans).😉

If you search Google or YouTube, you'll find plenty of specific strengthening and stretching routines under these terms:
Upper cross syndrome
Lower cross syndrome

Good luck.😉
rustybadger42 rustybadger42 Active Member
63 messages
joined Sep 2014
#8 ·
Stretching and strengthening something that’s already tight and stiff—it's just going to make things worse
urbanwalker72 urbanwalker72 Active Member
147 messages
joined Aug 2021
#9 ·
rustybadger42 said:Stretching and strengthening something that’s already tight and stiff—it's just going to make things worse

Very well, Doctor...
Richard Cook2 Richard Cook2 Member
11 messages
joined Jan 2014
#10 ·
rustybadger42 said:Stretching and strengthening something that’s already tight and stiff—it's just going to make things worse

So, how exactly do you propose we fix muscle imbalances then? Just by magic? If a muscle is weak or overstretched because the central nervous system is inhibiting it, you actually have to strengthen it—you have to "teach" the brain to send signals back to those muscles so they can regain tone. It works the opposite way for muscles that are chronically tight; you need to stretch them to teach the CNS to dial down that tension. This is pretty much Kinesiology 101, so please, let's keep the unsolicited advice to a minimum while we're trying to help this guy out. Unless, of course, you have some actual scientific data or a solid explanation to back up your claim!
Nicole Ross Nicole Ross Active Member
61 messages
joined Sep 2014
#11 ·
So, how exactly does stretching teach the CNS to dial back the muscle tone?
If someone’s dealing with Kyphosis, it means their anterior tone is cranked way too high—but here’s the kicker: the nervous system thinks this is perfectly "normal." I mean, if it didn't think this was the baseline, wouldn't the anterior tension be lower, allowing them to actually stand up straight?
But if the CNS has already decided this state is "normal," why on earth would it bother changing?
How is it even possible for the definition of "normal" to shift so drastically just from sitting around all day? And why does the front of their body hurt so much when they try to stretch backward to straighten out?
Think about it—if the current length of those anterior muscles is now considered "normal," wouldn't strengthening them actually pull the front side even tighter? Wouldn't that just signal the CNS to tighten things up even more to maintain that "normal" status quo?
The result? You end up with an even tighter front side and an even tighter back side, which just kills whatever rotational mobility they had left—which is probably already pretty pathetic to begin with.

Do you honestly think the CNS can be retrained through the pain caused by stretching? And if that were the case, why aren't little kids constantly stretching to lengthen their anterior side and strengthen their posterior side just so they can eventually stand up and walk?
Melissa Perez10 Melissa Perez10 Member
23 messages
joined Aug 2013
#12 ·
To kick things off (and it’s a fantastic starting point!!), if you can manage it at your desk or wherever you spend your workday, try sitting on a stability ball instead of a chair.
I work in an office setting myself—I'm a secretary—and I've been using a Pilates ball for five years now, following the advice of my physical therapist and physiatrist... people actually chuckled at me a little when I first started, but now two of my coworkers have joined in too! 😉
Of course, you still need to do your dedicated workouts at home, but this is such a brilliant way to "exercise" your back and improve your posture while you're just sitting there.
rustybadger42 rustybadger42 Active Member
63 messages
joined Sep 2014
#13 ·
[QUOTE=Richard Cook2;48360385]So, what's your take on fixing muscle imbalances—is it really just this simple? If a muscle is weak or overstretched because the CNS is inhibiting it, you have to strengthen it and basically "teach" the brain to actually send signals there so it regains tone. It’s the exact opposite for tight muscles—you need to stretch them and teach the CNS to dial back that tension. That's just kinesitherapy 101, so please, let's stick to helping the guy here unless you've got actual scientific backing or a real explanation to offer![/QUOTE
The issue with the central nervous system isn't something you can fix just by targeting the periphery.[/QUOTE]
Arthur Williams Arthur Williams Newcomer
1 message
joined Jan 2014
#14 ·
Exercise and running have been huge lifesavers for me—though I still catch myself slouching quite a bit, especially when I'm sitting at my desk—but I've become way more mindful of it lately and try to correct it. Honestly, it’s just so much easier to maintain good posture if I get a workout and some stretching in first thing in the morning.
Richard Cook2 Richard Cook2 Member
11 messages
joined Jan 2014
#15 ·
Nicole Ross said:So, how exactly does stretching teach the CNS to dial back the muscle tone?
If someone’s dealing with Kyphosis, it means their anterior tone is cranked way too high—but here’s the kicker: the nervous system thinks this is perfectly "normal." I mean, if it didn't think this was the baseline, wouldn't the anterior tension be lower, allowing them to actually stand up straight?
But if the CNS has already decided this state is "normal," why on earth would it bother changing?
How is it even possible for the definition of "normal" to shift so drastically just from sitting around all day? And why does the front of their body hurt so much when they try to stretch backward to straighten out?
Think about it—if the current length of those anterior muscles is now considered "normal," wouldn't strengthening them actually pull the front side even tighter? Wouldn't that just signal the CNS to tighten things up even more to maintain that "normal" status quo?
The result? You end up with an even tighter front side and an even tighter back side, which just kills whatever rotational mobility they had left—which is probably already pretty pathetic to begin with.

Do you honestly think the CNS can be retrained through the pain caused by stretching? And if that were the case, why aren't little kids constantly stretching to lengthen their anterior side and strengthen their posterior side just so they can eventually stand up and walk?

jaks;48361699 said:
Richard Cook2 said:So, how exactly do you propose we fix muscle imbalances then? Just by magic? If a muscle is weak or overstretched because the central nervous system is inhibiting it, you actually have to strengthen it—you have to "teach" the brain to send signals back to those muscles so they can regain tone. It works the opposite way for muscles that are chronically tight; you need to stretch them to teach the CNS to dial down that tension. This is pretty much Kinesiology 101, so please, let's keep the unsolicited advice to a minimum while we're trying to help this guy out. Unless, of course, you have some actual scientific data or a solid explanation to back up your claim!

Look, guys, I’m going to ask this once: please, do yourselves a favor and actually look up the information on your own before coming here to pester me. I really don't want to deal with people spamming this thread with basic questions they could have answered in five minutes with a quick search. It makes it impossible for anyone else to actually find the specific info they came here looking for.

If you want to understand how stretching actually teaches the central nervous system to lower muscle tone, you really need to dig into the physiology of Golgi tendon organs and muscle spindles located within your muscles and tendons. It’s also worth looking into how reflexes play a role in that process. You shouldn't have any trouble finding some solid resources online if you just search for something like "stretching and flexibility physiology."

"If someone is presenting with Kyphosis, it simply means their anterior muscle tone is far too high." Honestly, that's a bit of a fallacy—there isn't really a "front" or a "back" when you're looking at the body as a single, integrated system.
It’s defined that precisely because the body isn't just some flat, two-dimensional object. The muscles I mentioned are essentially shortened or tight, and they're pulling everything out of alignment.
The body leans forward because the muscles I mentioned earlier have become overstretched and weakened on the opposite side, leaving them without any functional tension.
The concept of "forces" used to align the body—well, if you want to truly grasp what I’m getting at here, you really ought to have a more solid grasp of human anatomy. It isn't just about moving parts around; it's about understanding how those internal tensions actually interact.
I’ve been spending quite a bit of time lately diving deep into the mechanics of muscle function—specifically looking at origin points, insertion points, and the underlying physiology that governs how they actually move. It's one thing to know which muscle you're working, but it's a whole different ballgame when you start analyzing the actual physics of the contraction and how those attachment points dictate the entire range of motion.

The principle is actually quite straightforward: if you're tight or stiff, you need to stretch. If you're loose or weak, you need to strengthen. Honestly, I feel like this is the kind of thing they should be teaching clearly back in elementary school science class. xD

The idea that a problem rooted in the Central Nervous System can be fixed by focusing solely on the periphery just doesn't hold water. The CNS and the periphery are inextricably linked—it’s an interconnected web, much like everything else in the human body. How exactly do you think a muscle contraction even occurs? It starts with the CNS sending signals down through the spinal cord. You can't address one side of the equation while ignoring the other.
which stimulate the muscles through the nervous system. Of course, to truly grasp that, one would need a deep understanding of muscle contraction physiology—concepts like actin, myosin, Z-discs, and all that good stuff...

In short: please don't pester me or confuse someone who is just looking for a little help!
Richard Cook2 Richard Cook2 Member
11 messages
joined Jan 2014
#16 ·
Arthur Williams said:Exercise and running have been huge lifesavers for me—though I still catch myself slouching quite a bit, especially when I'm sitting at my desk—but I've become way more mindful of it lately and try to correct it. Honestly, it’s just so much easier to maintain good posture if I get a workout and some stretching in first thing in the morning.

That makes perfect sense. It’s because those weaker muscles have been activated during your workout, allowing them to maintain tone for several hours afterward. To keep that benefit long-term, you really need to stimulate those stretched muscles daily to sustain that tone, while also making sure to stretch out any muscles that are overactive so they can finally relax.

😉
Sean Bailey75 Sean Bailey75 Member
29 messages
joined Jan 2014
#17 ·
rustybadger42 said:Stretching and strengthening something that’s already tight and stiff—it's just going to make things worse

If you're doing it wrong, anything can happen.

If someone were to train correctly and follow the guidance of a professional, they would almost certainly see improvements in a short amount of time simply by engaging the motor reflex of contraction and relaxation. Specifically, if everything is stiff because it's constantly spasming, then even basic exercises focused on maximal tension and release could actually improve circulation and yield results.

Doing nothing as a solution definitely won't produce any results; in fact, things could just get worse.

Nicole Ross said:So, how exactly does stretching teach the CNS to dial back the muscle tone?
If someone’s dealing with Kyphosis, it means their anterior tone is cranked way too high—but here’s the kicker: the nervous system thinks this is perfectly "normal." I mean, if it didn't think this was the baseline, wouldn't the anterior tension be lower, allowing them to actually stand up straight?
But if the CNS has already decided this state is "normal," why on earth would it bother changing?
How is it even possible for the definition of "normal" to shift so drastically just from sitting around all day? And why does the front of their body hurt so much when they try to stretch backward to straighten out?
Think about it—if the current length of those anterior muscles is now considered "normal," wouldn't strengthening them actually pull the front side even tighter? Wouldn't that just signal the CNS to tighten things up even more to maintain that "normal" status quo?
The result? You end up with an even tighter front side and an even tighter back side, which just kills whatever rotational mobility they had left—which is probably already pretty pathetic to begin with.

Do you honestly think the CNS can be retrained through the pain caused by stretching? And if that were the case, why aren't little kids constantly stretching to lengthen their anterior side and strengthen their posterior side just so they can eventually stand up and walk?

That is a majorly flawed assumption. In reality, slouching most often occurs due to muscle atrophy in the back and poor circulation in that area. This imbalance doesn't necessarily mean the chest and abdominal muscles are strong if the back and postural muscles are far too weak. Most of the time, the issue is actually that many of those muscles have wasted away from atrophy. In such a case, claiming this is a "normal" state would be counterproductive, because it's an abnormal state that leads to serious health issues.

The only way to help oneself is to take action—start exercising under the supervision of a professional initially, and once you've mastered the basics, move on to more advanced movements.
urbanwalker72 urbanwalker72 Active Member
147 messages
joined Aug 2021
#18 ·
Richard Cook2 said:Look, guys, I’m going to ask this once: please, do yourselves a favor and actually look up the information on your own before coming here to pester me. I really don't want to deal with people spamming this thread with basic questions they could have answered in five minutes with a quick search. It makes it impossible for anyone else to actually find the specific info they came here looking for.

If you want to understand how stretching actually teaches the central nervous system to lower muscle tone, you really need to dig into the physiology of Golgi tendon organs and muscle spindles located within your muscles and tendons. It’s also worth looking into how reflexes play a role in that process. You shouldn't have any trouble finding some solid resources online if you just search for something like "stretching and flexibility physiology."

"If someone is presenting with Kyphosis, it simply means their anterior muscle tone is far too high." Honestly, that's a bit of a fallacy—there isn't really a "front" or a "back" when you're looking at the body as a single, integrated system.
It’s defined that precisely because the body isn't just some flat, two-dimensional object. The muscles I mentioned are essentially shortened or tight, and they're pulling everything out of alignment.
The body leans forward because the muscles I mentioned earlier have become overstretched and weakened on the opposite side, leaving them without any functional tension.
The concept of "forces" used to align the body—well, if you want to truly grasp what I’m getting at here, you really ought to have a more solid grasp of human anatomy. It isn't just about moving parts around; it's about understanding how those internal tensions actually interact.
I’ve been spending quite a bit of time lately diving deep into the mechanics of muscle function—specifically looking at origin points, insertion points, and the underlying physiology that governs how they actually move. It's one thing to know which muscle you're working, but it's a whole different ballgame when you start analyzing the actual physics of the contraction and how those attachment points dictate the entire range of motion.

The principle is actually quite straightforward: if you're tight or stiff, you need to stretch. If you're loose or weak, you need to strengthen. Honestly, I feel like this is the kind of thing they should be teaching clearly back in elementary school science class. xD

The idea that a problem rooted in the Central Nervous System can be fixed by focusing solely on the periphery just doesn't hold water. The CNS and the periphery are inextricably linked—it’s an interconnected web, much like everything else in the human body. How exactly do you think a muscle contraction even occurs? It starts with the CNS sending signals down through the spinal cord. You can't address one side of the equation while ignoring the other.
which stimulate the muscles through the nervous system. Of course, to truly grasp that, one would need a deep understanding of muscle contraction physiology—concepts like actin, myosin, Z-discs, and all that good stuff...

In short: please don't pester me or confuse someone who is just looking for a little help!

It is far too late for that; he isn't even checking this board anymore.

For those who might find it useful, in addition to the resources you mentioned, I would suggest looking into the following:

book : Kit Laughlin

Kelly Starret: 'Becoming a supple leopard'

web

http://www.mobilitywod.com

book:

Kit Laughlin: 'Stretching and flexibility'

web:

http://kitlaughlin.com/forums/
Nicole Ross Nicole Ross Active Member
61 messages
joined Sep 2014
#19 ·
Sean Bailey75 said:If you're doing it wrong, anything can happen.

If someone were to train correctly and follow the guidance of a professional, they would almost certainly see improvements in a short amount of time simply by engaging the motor reflex of contraction and relaxation. Specifically, if everything is stiff because it's constantly spasming, then even basic exercises focused on maximal tension and release could actually improve circulation and yield results.

Doing nothing as a solution definitely won't produce any results; in fact, things could just get worse.

That is a majorly flawed assumption. In reality, slouching most often occurs due to muscle atrophy in the back and poor circulation in that area. This imbalance doesn't necessarily mean the chest and abdominal muscles are strong if the back and postural muscles are far too weak. Most of the time, the issue is actually that many of those muscles have wasted away from atrophy. In such a case, claiming this is a "normal" state would be counterproductive, because it's an abnormal state that leads to serious health issues.

The only way to help oneself is to take action—start exercising under the supervision of a professional initially, and once you've mastered the basics, move on to more advanced movements.

Don't you think that when someone hunches forward, it shifts their center of gravity? Like, their chin starts jutting out and their weight moves toward their toes instead of staying over their heels?

If you agree with that—which I think you should—then you also have to admit that the body tries to compensate by cranking up the activation in the back, glutes, hamstrings, and calves just to keep the head and torso upright.

You can test this yourself quite easily—just stand up straight and slowly push your head forward while hunching over. You'll feel it immediately—more contraction in the abs, more tension in the back, the glutes, the posterior chain, and even the front of the feet.
Right?

So then, how does a muscle group that's working overtime to hold up the weight of the head and shoulders end up becoming atrophied and weak?
If you give someone with bad posture a little poke, you'll notice they feel incredibly tight all along that entire posterior kinetic chain.

And look, nobody is saying "do nothing"—far from it. But in my experience, the fastest and most lasting results come from gaining better control over the anterior side—basically learning how to relax those overactive chest and abdominal muscles—which is what actually allows the posture to straighten out.
rustybadger42 rustybadger42 Active Member
63 messages
joined Sep 2014
#20 ·
Richard Cook2;48363144 said:
rustybadger42 said:The CNS and the periphery are interconnected—just like everything else in the body. How exactly do you think muscle contraction happens? The CNS sends signals through the spinal cord
which then stimulate the muscles via the nerves. Of course, to understand that, one would need a solid grasp of muscle contraction physiology—terms like actin, myosin, Z-discs, and so on...

Basically: please don't badger me or confuse someone who's actually looking for help!

They are connected, obviously—that’s exactly the point I was making. What I mean is that if you want to achieve what you called "learning," you have to involve the CNS itself, rather than just focusing on the peripheral muscles at the center of the issue.
If his psoas is tight and his pelvic muscles are short and rigid, while his back muscles are being stretched by exercises that only further strengthen the abs—or even more stretching of the back—you'd just end up worsening his existing posture.
The only lasting solution involves differentiation exercises. Out of all the physical therapy methods out there, these are the only ones that address the core problem within the CNS—which, from what I read and hear from people dealing with the exact same issues as the author here, is what actually brings locomotion back to center.

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