Avengers saga vs. Star Wars sequel trilogy

Emily Myers32 said:Well, when it comes to epic battle scenes, Lord of the Rings is king.

Honestly, Lord of the Rings exists in its own league—I’m pretty much obsessed with it, haha. I honestly can't even tell you how many times I've sat through all three movies; I've lost count...

I remember back when I was younger and had zero responsibilities—I'd just go totally wild and marathon all three films from evening until dawn XD.

Let me put it this way—and maybe it's just me—but there have been moments where I felt like I was actually going to explode from pure emotion in the theater (you know that feeling where you're just overwhelmed 🤣). It happened during certain Lord of the Rings scenes in the cinema, then again with some parts of the Dark Knight trilogy, and finally—Sugar at the end (and I'm sure there will be more moments like this)—the Avengers, specifically that "Avengers Assemble/Portals" scene.

P.S. Oh, and you want to know where else I might experience that kind of emotional explosion in a theater? (Judging by how much the trailer nearly floored me—forgive my language, haha)—that would probably be Top Gun: Maverick next summer.

Top Gun is such a huge part of my life and my childhood, so that's my personal reason right there. When the new movie drops, I'll be the first one standing in line at the AMC, I swear.

🍿

Kimberly Flores5,

I'm not arguing against AE, because I genuinely love it. But we're really talking about how Star Wars compares to the Avengers saga here. I actually became a fan of both franchises quite recently. The Force Awakens was my first ever Star Wars movie, and that’s what finally pulled me out of the "never seen Star Wars" club. I liked that one, and I found myself eagerly waiting for the sequels. Rogue One is an absolute masterpiece, though... and don't even get me started on TROS.

As for the Avengers saga, I didn't really follow it until way back in 2016—which was four years after the first Avengers!—after I'd only seen GotG and what I thought was CAWS. But I truly dove headfirst into the Avengers world after AIW, and since then, I've watched everything else a few times over.

I went back and forth on this, but I finally had to make a choice, I guess...
Honestly, I feel like they should've included the Hobbit in this poll too.😁

The thing is, Star Wars fans are actually the biggest enemies of the Star Wars franchise itself.
Some of these Star Wars fans remind me of religious zealots—like how followers of major religions can be, where any interpretation other than their own is considered heresy.
Even if an almighty God tried to film the Star Wars sequels, He wouldn't be able to please all of them, because trying to satisfy everyone would be impossible, just like trying to please every single different sect of every major religion.
With Marvel fans, you don't see all this heavy philosophical debating or deep theological drama. These movies are meant for chilling out and having fun; that's what they were built for, and nobody expects anything more.

On the flip side, people expected way too much from the Star Wars franchise. The real issue is those massive expectations, combined with certain people trying to push their own agendas through the films.

But even with all the creative flaws, I still think Star Wars will survive. In ten years, we'll still be sitting here arguing about what went wrong or why things didn't go this way or that... meanwhile, Marvel movies will probably end up meeting the same fate as Avatar.

The MCU doesn't have many flaws, but honestly, the weakest links so far have definitely been the Spider-Man movies. That one, Far From Home, felt like a total insult to my intelligence. I mean, Chuck, Tony consciously hands over EDITH to the kid instead of, say, Rhodey, who is actually a damn military pilot and a seasoned fighter. Tony gave the nano-suit to the kid, but where is that same suit for Rhodey? He’s Tony's BEST friend. Even though Far From Home is a fun watch, it feels like an insult to the whole MCU franchise (and the Spider-Man Universe too). As for GotG vol 2, the only reason it holds any value is because of Yondu's death, nothing else. Ego is an incredibly weak antagonist. And the Incredible Hulk isn't worth much now since Norton isn't playing him in future MCU films, and the MCU has basically nerfed Hulk's character anyway—it's only really notable for that snap moment where everyone came back.

Oh, and let me be clear: Rhodey is the true successor to Tony. Period! The MCU really messed up with that whole speech about Spider-Man being the heir.

In something like the Star Wars world, I've heard people claim the prequel trilogy was bad, but it's nowhere near as bad as Spider-Man in the MCU. It's the same with LOTR; it isn't bad at all. That scene where the ship gets sliced in half during hyperspeed? Holy f*ck! Best scene ever.

Ethan Martin said:Lord of the Rings is just in a league of its own—I’m honestly a total fanatic when it comes to it, haha. I can't even tell you how many times I've binged all three films... I've lost count...

I remember being younger, having zero responsibilities, and just going completely wild by marathon-watching all three back-to-back from evening until sunrise XD.

Let me put it this way—and maybe it's just me—but the only times I've felt like I was actually going to explode from pure emotion in a theater (you know, that feeling where you're just overwhelmed 🤣) were during certain scenes in Lord of the Rings, then some moments from the Dark Knight trilogy, and finally—Sugar at the end (and there will surely be more moments like that)—the Avengers, specifically that "Avengers Assemble" scene.

P.S. Oh, and do you know where else I might experience that kind of emotional explosion in a theater? (If you judge me based on how much I nearly lost it watching the trailer—excuse my language, haha)—that could be Top Gun: Maverick next summer.

Top Gun is such a huge part of my life and my childhood, so that's really my personal motivation... I'll be the first one standing in line at AMC, I swear...

🍿

Lord of the Rings will be on USA Network and Home TV for the Old and New Year's, all three movies in a row. 😁

But yeah, regarding those epic scenes, it's going to be hard to beat them. Man, that moment when they descend from the hill under Helms' direction and Gandalf releases the light... 😍
It's not that Avengers Assemble is better than that—it's just not. Honestly, for me, nobody can quite match those scenes.

Aaron Walker25 said:...

But despite all those creative shortcomings—and let's be honest, there are plenty—I still think Star Wars is going to endure. In ten years, people will still be sitting around debating what went wrong, why things weren't done this way or that, while Marvel movies will eventually meet the same fate as Avatar.

Exactly. And here’s my reasoning:
Absolutely nothing today compares to the sheer impact of when that first Star Wars movie hit theaters. It was something entirely unprecedented—completely out of left field.
And then, after that first installment, you actually had to wait four whole years to see what happened next! No rewatching, no dissecting every single frame in real-time.
Then Empire Strikes Back comes along and hits just as hard! And after ESB? Another three-year wait! That kind of massive buildup of tension—that collective anticipation—is something the film industry can never replicate again.
That's why Star Wars—specifically the original trilogy—will always be legendary, almost mythic. The peak of Star Wars will always get the pulse racing; it's basically a conditioned reflex for entire generations.

Meanwhile, the Avengers and the rest of the Marvel films will eventually—and honestly, pretty soon—just become another franchise among many others.

rustywalker1 said:Some people overanalyze the depth of Star Wars—even though George Lucas himself said it was basically just a family drama, almost a soap opera...

Aaron Walker25 said:I kept thinking about it and eventually had to pick an option, I don't know...
I really feel like the Hobbits should have been included in this poll.😁

The thing is, Star Wars fans are actually the biggest enemies of the franchise itself.
A certain segment of the fanbase reminds me of followers of Abrahamic religions—Orthodox Jews, Christians, Muslims—where any interpretation other than their own is considered sacrilege...
Even if God Himself tried to film a Star Wars sequel trilogy, He wouldn't be able to please them all—it would be like trying to satisfy Orthodox Jews, Catholics, Orthodox Christians, Shiites, Sunnis, and so on...
With Marvel fans, there isn't this level of philosophical debate or disagreement, nor has a whole theology developed; these are movies meant for relaxing and enjoying, which is how they were from the start, and nothing more is expected.

On the other hand, a lot was expected from the Star Wars franchise, and the biggest issue is those expectations—both from the fanbase and from those who tried to push their own agendas.

But despite all the creative shortcomings, I still think Star Wars will survive, and ten years from now people will still be arguing about what's wrong with them, why things are this way, or why it wasn't done differently... whereas Marvel movies might eventually meet the fate of Avatar.

Star Wars exceeded absolutely every expectation. Even Lucas couldn't have anticipated or hoped for such a result. I mean, nobody wakes up thinking, "Okay, now I'm going to create a cultural phenomenon of a new era"—that's just not how it works, right?

It’s honestly reached a point where some people feel even the creator of that world wasn't good enough, or that what he came up with wasn't sufficient. It's a mass psychosis of a strange kind. Clearly, the saga struck a chord with a huge group of people—enough to make them react to the film and story in this way, where the masses are capable of doing all sorts of nonsense because of it. For some reason, the crowd takes the whole Star Wars thing very personally and emotionally. I even have a theory about it, but I'll save that for another post so I don't ramble here...

Marvel movies are, I must say, very beautiful—the heroes are cool, everything is fun, etc.—but they haven't managed to strike that specific chord. No one has.

I wouldn't compare Marvel movies to Avatar. Avatar is actually a silly movie with cool effects. I'll stick to comparing it to Jurassic Park. Still a great film, with a solid idea and excellent execution...

nimblemarlin6 said:Exactly. And here is why:
Absolutely NOTHING today compares to how it felt when the first Star Wars movie hit theaters. It was something entirely new, something we had never seen before.
And then, after that first film, you had to wait four whole years just to see what happened next! No rewatching, no chance to sit there and analyze every single frame.
Then ESB arrived and did it all over again! And after ESB, we faced ANOTHER three-year wait! That kind of intense tension building is something that can probably never be replicated in the film industry.
That’s why Star Wars—specifically the original trilogy—will always be a legend, a myth. The peak of Star Wars will always get the heart racing. It’s a conditioned reflex for entire generations.

Meanwhile, the Avengers and the rest of the Marvel movies will eventually—and likely very soon—just become another franchise among many others.

I agree. The Avengers definitely had their moments. It all kicked off in 2012 with the Chitauri invasion and wrapped up with Tony's snap in 2019, and that was it.

The Star Wars story started in 1977 and concluded in 2019.

Star Wars also has way fewer movies compared to the MCU, whereas you can't really watch the Avengers standalone without all the spin-offs, otherwise, you wouldn't understand the plot. The MCU turned its movies into series, which is cool, but it's exhausting to keep up with. It took me a full week to catch everything, and those were epic marathons. Star Wars is much easier to follow in that regard.

I still don't quite get why this sudden debate between Star Wars and the Avengers is happening right now?

Regarding AE, the Time Heist felt poorly executed to me. For example, why didn't the Avengers just call Carol, gather everyone together, and use the time travel device to go back to 2018 (during the AIW film), have Carol take out Thanos, grab the stones, and head back to the future? If they had, we wouldn't even need that Portal scene.

The Avengers aren't acting rational, and neither is Tony. With proper planning, Carol could have finished the job without all this trouble; Tony's sacrifice feels unnecessary. It's the same with Anakin's situation. Morgan has to live without a father because the Avengers failed to plan their attack on Thanos properly. Doctor Strange was also being foolish—he came back via the snap, allowed a minute or two to pass, instead of showing up immediately at the Avengers base or using some magic to wipe out the fiery rain from the Sanctuary II ship before the bombardment. Oh, and he could have used a portal to move the Infinity Gauntlet to three different moms, if not him, then Wong.

Even though AE is an epic film, it only reached that status because certain Avengers are incredibly clueless, and many people defend AE for various reasons. AIW is actually a bigger movie than AE. In fact, AIF eats A1 and AAoU for breakfast. A1 is just your average MCU film, while AAoU matured from being mediocre to something better because of the hundred factors revealed in the future (like Tony's vision). Ultron could have been the best antagonist, but he ended up being as smart as Skynet (which failed to trigger Doomsday—what a coincidence, Genisys came out the same year as AAoU, where Skynet is as dumb as Ultron, or vice versa).

Honestly, if I looked a little deeper, I'd conclude that Star Wars is better. But I won't say it because I love them both equally.

When you look closer, every Avengers movie becomes somewhat less enjoyable because you realize certain things shouldn't have happened that way. If I analyze AIW deeply, we see that all the Avengers were nerfed just to make Thanos look good. It just happens that the foolish Asgardians hand the Aether over to the Collector, that Ragnarok actually happens in Asgard in 2018, that the Civil War splits the group so badly that they act like bickering siblings who won't cooperate at any cost, that Gamora is the only one in the universe who knows where Vormir is, that the damn Hulk doesn't undergo his transformation into the Prime Hulk in Wakanda (as one deleted scene suggests), that Thor doesn't injure Thanos anymore after getting his chest pierced, that Ross watches the world burn and does nothing while bragging about taking down anyone in his way, that Tony didn't give the nano suit to Rhodey, who could have used it better than that kid Peter, that Carol didn't get any heads-up about the attack on Xandar where Thanos wiped a planet off the face of the Earth for the Power Stone, that Carol wasn't even aware of Thanos's actions after Ronan died in GotG1, that the Asgardians surrendered so easily to Loki even though Odin was supposedly retired on Earth (if he chose to retire, why didn't he contact Thor, and why didn't Thor meet Thanos during his search for the stones?), that the Asgardians weren't in touch with Nidavellir when Thanos destroyed everything back in 2015 (that was three damn years before Thanos's attack on Xandar!) just to make the gauntlet, and that the foolish Heimdall didn't sense anything (he's supposed to see every soul, and Eitri should be his guy, his personal smith), and he just let Loki take over Asgard and cause Ragnarok... if we keep going, he should have sensed Thanos's attack on Nidavellir in 2015, and no surviving Asgardian knew about the realm that was born after Odin's death, which could have cooked Thanos even if he theoretically came to Asgard for the Space Stone after the 2018 Xandar attack, and that the foolish Doctor Strange didn't freeze time, which would have allowed for killing Thanos on the spot back in 2018...

Thanos really lucked out, didn't he? Everything just fell perfectly into place. It feels like everyone else was basically nerfed just so he could collect those stones without breaking a sweat.

Oh, and the stones haven't been destroyed yet either. They've just been broken down into atoms, so Pym could theoretically bring them back and scale them up using a locator.

Aaron Walker25 said:I spent some time thinking about it, and I finally had to make a choice—I don't know...
Personally, I feel like the 😁Hobbit
should have been included in this poll.
The thing is, Star Wars fans are actually the biggest enemies of the franchise itself.
A certain segment of the fanbase reminds me of followers of Abrahamic religions—you know, Orthodox Jews, Christians, Muslims—where any interpretation of the faith other than their own is considered sacrilege.
Even if an almighty God tried to film the Star Wars sequels, He wouldn't be able to please all of them; it would be just like trying to satisfy Orthodox Jews, Catholics, Orthodox Christians, Shiites, Sunnis, and so on...
With Marvel fans, you don't see this kind of philosophical debate or deep-seated disagreement—there isn't a whole theology built around it. These movies are meant for relaxing and having fun; they were designed that way from the start, and nobody expects anything more.

On the flip side, people expected a massive amount from the Star Wars franchise, and the biggest issue is those very expectations—combined with certain groups trying to push their own agendas through the series.

But despite all the creative shortcomings, I still think Star Wars will survive. In ten years, people will still be debating what went wrong, why things happened the way they did, or why it wasn't done differently... whereas I suspect Marvel movies might eventually meet the fate of Avatar.

I agree with pretty much everything you said, except for the part about the Avengers meeting the fate of Avatar. Avatar was a phenomenon, but a bit of a hollow one—not necessarily the movie itself, but the concept. It didn't have a backstory before the film, nor did it have a dedicated fanbase beforehand (since there was no "Avatar" in comics or anywhere else), whereas the MCU has actually existed much longer than Star Wars if we're being honest—dating back to 1961🙂, just not on the big screen until recently.

For instance, personally (and I can't speak for everyone, just me), I grew up reading comics featuring all these MCU characters. In that sense, I'm basically just like any typical American, haha.

P.S. I have to hand it to you, though—comparing Star Wars fans to followers of Abrahamic religions? Hahaha, you absolutely nailed it.👍

Emily Myers32 said:Star Wars has honestly exceeded every single expectation. Even George Lucas couldn't have predicted—let alone hoped for—a result this massive. I mean, you can't just wake up one morning and decide, "Alright, today's the day I’m going to go out and create a cultural phenomenon for a new era." That's just not how it works, right?

It’s honestly reached a point where some people feel even the creator himself wasn't good enough—as if what he originally envisioned simply didn't meet their standards. It feels like a mass psychosis, a strange kind of phenomenon. Clearly, this saga struck a chord with such a huge group of people that they're reacting to the films and the storytelling in an extreme way—to the point where a certain crowd is willing to act out in completely irrational ways just because of it. For some reason, a massive portion of the fanbase takes the entire Star Wars saga incredibly personally and emotionally. I actually have a theory about why this is happening, but I'll save that for another post—I don't want to get too carried away here.

I will say this—Marvel's movies are visually stunning, the heroes are great, and everything is undeniably fun—but they just haven't quite struck that perfect chord. Not for me, anyway. No one really has.

I wouldn't go around comparing Marvel movies to Avatar. Honestly, if you ask me, Avatar is just a flashy film that relies way too much on special effects to carry its weight. I’d much rather stick to comparing them to Jurassic Park—it’s still a fantastic movie, featuring a solid concept and truly stellar execution.

Honestly, if you ask me, Jurassic Park is ten times better than all three of the Star Wars sequels combined—and I mean in every single aspect of filmmaking. 😁.

Regarding what you mentioned about Star Wars—you're not wrong, those fans really can be intense. I mean, look, there’s a massive difference between being a true fanatic for a saga—for instance, I’m a huge devotee of Terminator 1 & 2 (the whole Terminator franchise, really; I’m sure everyone reading this PDF already knows that part)—and just being completely obsessed. There is a distinction between having a deep appreciation for Art and just being plain crazy.

Now, in my honest opinion—and I mean this sincerely—Star Wars fans are borderline delusional. It’s actually wild. I honestly can’t wrap my head around what keeps half of them from seeking out a professional psychiatric evaluation; they really should be checked out because that whole crowd is just... well, they aren't exactly sane.

At the end of the day, the real difference between the Star Wars fanbase and any other group of film buffs is that Star Wars actually has a religion—and I mean that quite literally. It’s an officially recognized belief system, not just a hobby.

Honestly, those people have completely lost the plot—there isn't enough sense in the world to deal with them, it’s just pure madness. I’ve crossed paths with plenty of them over the years, and I never once viewed them as actual movie fans; they were just straight-up lunatics. Usually, my only solution was to just stop engaging with them entirely. They aren't enthusiasts—they're fanatics. Especially those die-hard Star Wars OT fans? Those guys are genuinely unhinged and could probably use some professional help. There is absolutely no excuse or justification—I don't care how much someone argues about how massive Star Wars became—nothing justifies that level of behavior. It’s beyond irrational.

You really can't have a rational conversation with certain Star Wars "fans"—and I use that term loosely—because they’re basically obsessed with psychological profiling over actual storytelling. They remind me of those ISIS fanatics you see on the news; just total zealots who refuse any kind of dialogue. Honestly, they have zero connection to the cinematic world itself. It makes you wonder if they should even be categorized as film fans at all, or if they’re just a group of people who need a clinical evaluation. Truly, they are.

In that regard, Star Wars is definitely a unique phenomenon—I mean, just look at the fanbase. It’s reached a point where some fans are borderline sociopaths—well, if you really think about it, they kind of are.

I mean, look... I’ve seen plenty of Star Trek fans out there—and honestly, call me a fanatic if you want, because I’ve watched every single episode of every series multiple times now—but there's a difference. Star Trek fans seem pretty level-headed; they aren't going to go on a rampage or start attacking people. It's just not that kind of toxic culture.

I’ve seen the die-hard fans of Lord of the Rings, I've seen the Matrix devotees, and honestly, I’ve encountered enthusiasts for pretty much every major film franchise out there—but nobody is quite as intense as the Star Wars fanbase. No offense intended to anyone here, really, but man—certain segments of the Star Wars community are just on another level. It’s reached a point where it doesn't even seem to be about the movies anymore; it feels like they’ve completely lost the plot. At this stage, Star Wars shouldn't even be categorized under "Film" in a database—you might as well just list it under "Religion." ☕

Or... better yet, just hand the Star Wars fanatics a PDF titled PSYCHOLOGY.

Honestly, you just have to look at those guys over at RedLetterMedia—they spend three and a half !!! dissecting the Rise of Skywalker. Three and a half !!!

HEY!

It doesn't even matter how interesting they might be regarding movies in general; I mean, spending THREE AND A HALF HOURS debating a single film on YouTube? Come on!

People don't spend that much time discussing things like if Jesus showed up on MTV or appeared on a show like Sunday at 2 so that man

So, those people (including Mr. Plinkett, whoever he may be to some) are basically candidates for a psychiatric evaluation—and why those evaluations aren't more common globally is a whole different conversation.

I’ve seen it happen so many times where, say, with the prequels, those fanatics weren't just analyzing the plot; they were analyzing the clouds in the sky—like, were the clouds positioned incorrectly? Was the Force used the right way in the prequels?

Hahaha, I mean... look, sociopaths—no offense intended to anyone.

Because if they weren't Socoipat, or even—dare I say—psychopaths, they wouldn't have driven the actor who played Jar Jar Binks into a breakdown. I mean, the guy was innocent, LITERALLY unknown, and yet the way they treated him over the CGI Binks stuff was so relentless that he practically needed psychiatric help. He spent years dealing with the fallout, and that kid who played Anakin Skywalker in The Phantom Menace is struggling with schizophrenia today.

At this point, we aren't talking about movie fans; we're talking about sociopaths or even psychopaths.