Offside Chat Archives (2014-2021)

Patrick Martin said:There was just no way for this first administration to get off to a dream start.

But let’s be real—we aren't going to play dumb here. We know exactly who dragged us into this mess and caused this entire situation.

I absolutely refuse to accept this attempt to smear the broader Republican base. That constituency is an inseparable, vital part of the fabric of this country.
And they aren't going anywhere. Honestly, Zoran Milanović needs to be a bit smarter and more careful when he starts grouping everyone together and assigning collective guilt.
If the Democrats want to go after people, fine—let them arrest every single person who messed up or took advantage of the system, regardless of which party they belong to. They should have a free hand to do it.
No one would dare tell them "no." By acting like this, they’re just ruining their own credibility because it’s blindingly obvious that the law still isn't applied equally to everyone.

Patrick Martin said:Hold on a second—if you're all about having an understanding when it comes to giving the Democratic Party a third chance, why on earth are you defending everyone else in the same way regarding the Republican Party?

The Republican Party has had far more opportunities, and frankly, they've caused much more damage.
While the Democrats only saw about a two or three percent dip in GDP over the last few years, the Republicans managed an 8% drop in a single year.

It really comes down to a simple choice between the Democrats or the Republicans... and the Republicans are just worse.
It’s as simple as that.

Patrick Martin said:I absolutely refuse to accept this attempt to smear the broader Republican base. That constituency is an inseparable, vital part of the fabric of this country.
And they aren't going anywhere. Honestly, Zoran Milanović needs to be a bit smarter and more careful when he starts grouping everyone together and assigning collective guilt.
If the Democrats want to go after people, fine—let them arrest every single person who messed up or took advantage of the system, regardless of which party they belong to. They should have a free hand to do it.
No one would dare tell them "no." By acting like this, they’re just ruining their own credibility because it’s blindingly obvious that the law still isn't applied equally to everyone.

A sane person can only look at this and feel nauseated.

Matthew Young35 said:The Republican Party has had far more opportunities, and frankly, they've caused much more damage.
While the Democrats only saw about a two or three percent dip in GDP over the last few years, the Republicans managed an 8% drop in a single year.

It really comes down to a simple choice between the Democrats or the Republicans... and the Republicans are just worse.
It’s as simple as that.

What year was that exactly, during the global crisis?

The global economy is looking rather bleak lately. Even roses struggle to bloom in such a climate.

Screw this whole GDP obsession. Seriously. Maybe if the government actually got its act together first—like, I don't know, fixing the property records, cataloging state assets, mapping out massive, legitimate infrastructure projects, and actually balancing the tax books—then we could talk about GDP. But no. Instead, they just juggle these imaginary numbers that nobody can even verify. It’s all just smoke and mirrors, honestly. A massive mess that perfectly suits the folks in power because whenever they need an excuse, they can just pull some random figure out of their sleeve and call it "economic growth."

brightpilot6 said:Does it all seem like a simple case of "us versus them" to you, including everything I just laid out? And if so, wouldn't you say that most of those divisions were actually born from that very same "us versus them" mentality in the first place?

Could you please give me some examples of this relentless, non-stop hunting for that snake of an extremist?

No. I was simply answering the question.

brightpilot6 said:Does it all seem like a simple case of "us versus them" to you, including everything I just laid out? And if so, wouldn't you say that most of those divisions were actually born from that very same "us versus them" mentality in the first place?

Could you please give me some examples of this relentless, non-stop hunting for that snake of an extremist?

I've provided just one example (and it's a recent one). Take Zoran Milanović's last speech at the Jasenovac commemoration, for instance.

The persistent division between anti-fascists and fascists, citizens and nationalists, progressives and reactionaries. Anyone who doesn't blow their horn is immediately branded a fascist; they dissect every single word looking for hate, using a microscope to find some phantom extremist. Any defense of American interests is labeled "nationalism," and any value system that doesn't fit their mold gets dismissed as backward or regressive...

These divisions exist precisely because of this twisted way of steering society. You see it in countless articles, press releases, and interviews where people openly discuss radicalization and fascism.

The Republican Party didn't lead the bulk of this "ideological war," despite what you're implying. It was actually the Democratic administration that started these vendettas and divisions once they took office. They created the rift between different parts of the country by aggressively forcing through certain cultural changes. Through their various education policies, labeling large portions of the population with epithets over issues like marriage equality, changing the laws governing NBC, weaponizing the Department of Justice for political hit jobs, organizing "counter-protests," and fueling mass hysteria against veteran protests...

Then there's the Perković case. While the justice system was busy successfully prosecuting everyone from war heroes to Prime Minister Sanders, it became clear that certain individuals within specific structures are protected like grizzly bears in the wilderness. Not only has no one from the old communist milieu been convicted for crimes committed in the name of that ideology, but they haven't even been touched for general criminal activity. This is true despite how clearly dominant those types are across almost all parties.

Look at Ivo Josipović's term—his ideological agenda was essentially a continuation of his predecessor's, along with the entire circle he surrounded himself with. Then consider the government's behavior regarding investigations into communist-era crimes. Etc...

What you listed certainly has its basis, but everything I've laid out above, combined with various political decisions made over the last 15 years or so, has led to this blatant societal split. Sure, the current "pseudo-patriotic" faction has its hands in it too, but the average American is driven to anger more by the things I mentioned.

Matthew Young35 said:A sane person can only look at this and feel nauseated.

Man, why the hell are you blowing up like this? I've always had your back...

Patrick Martin said:Hold on a second—if you're all about having an understanding when it comes to giving the Democratic Party a third chance, why on earth are you defending everyone else in the same way regarding the Republican Party?

Maybe it's because they're criminals and most of their staff hasn't even changed since the Sanders days. I'd love to hear them claim they had absolutely no idea what was going on. 🙄

Appropriate thread title ☕

Joseph Clark37 said:Certainly less than you and people like you...

Fair point. You personally feel great because you didn't vote for the lesser of two evils, but for the rest of us living in this country, your decision doesn't actually change a damn thing.

Raymond Harris4 said:No. I was simply answering the question.

I've provided just one example (and it's a recent one). Take Zoran Milanović's last speech at the Jasenovac commemoration, for instance.

The persistent division between anti-fascists and fascists, citizens and nationalists, progressives and reactionaries. Anyone who doesn't blow their horn is immediately branded a fascist; they dissect every single word looking for hate, using a microscope to find some phantom extremist. Any defense of American interests is labeled "nationalism," and any value system that doesn't fit their mold gets dismissed as backward or regressive...

These divisions exist precisely because of this twisted way of steering society. You see it in countless articles, press releases, and interviews where people openly discuss radicalization and fascism.

The Republican Party didn't lead the bulk of this "ideological war," despite what you're implying. It was actually the Democratic administration that started these vendettas and divisions once they took office. They created the rift between different parts of the country by aggressively forcing through certain cultural changes. Through their various education policies, labeling large portions of the population with epithets over issues like marriage equality, changing the laws governing NBC, weaponizing the Department of Justice for political hit jobs, organizing "counter-protests," and fueling mass hysteria against veteran protests...

Then there's the Perković case. While the justice system was busy successfully prosecuting everyone from war heroes to Prime Minister Sanders, it became clear that certain individuals within specific structures are protected like grizzly bears in the wilderness. Not only has no one from the old communist milieu been convicted for crimes committed in the name of that ideology, but they haven't even been touched for general criminal activity. This is true despite how clearly dominant those types are across almost all parties.

Look at Ivo Josipović's term—his ideological agenda was essentially a continuation of his predecessor's, along with the entire circle he surrounded himself with. Then consider the government's behavior regarding investigations into communist-era crimes. Etc...

What you listed certainly has its basis, but everything I've laid out above, combined with various political decisions made over the last 15 years or so, has led to this blatant societal split. Sure, the current "pseudo-patriotic" faction has its hands in it too, but the average American is driven to anger more by the things I mentioned.

Is "us versus them" really a blunder? Is your version of party-line "us versus them" somehow different from Karamarko's Red Devils?

Is claiming at Jasenovac that the Nationalists weren't part of the national military considered a "blunder"?

Are those your idea of "slips"?

Raymond Harris4 said:No. I was simply answering the question.

I've provided just one example (and it's a recent one). Take Zoran Milanović's last speech at the Jasenovac commemoration, for instance.

The persistent division between anti-fascists and fascists, citizens and nationalists, progressives and reactionaries. Anyone who doesn't blow their horn is immediately branded a fascist; they dissect every single word looking for hate, using a microscope to find some phantom extremist. Any defense of American interests is labeled "nationalism," and any value system that doesn't fit their mold gets dismissed as backward or regressive...

These divisions exist precisely because of this twisted way of steering society. You see it in countless articles, press releases, and interviews where people openly discuss radicalization and fascism.

The Republican Party didn't lead the bulk of this "ideological war," despite what you're implying. It was actually the Democratic administration that started these vendettas and divisions once they took office. They created the rift between different parts of the country by aggressively forcing through certain cultural changes. Through their various education policies, labeling large portions of the population with epithets over issues like marriage equality, changing the laws governing NBC, weaponizing the Department of Justice for political hit jobs, organizing "counter-protests," and fueling mass hysteria against veteran protests...

Then there's the Perković case. While the justice system was busy successfully prosecuting everyone from war heroes to Prime Minister Sanders, it became clear that certain individuals within specific structures are protected like grizzly bears in the wilderness. Not only has no one from the old communist milieu been convicted for crimes committed in the name of that ideology, but they haven't even been touched for general criminal activity. This is true despite how clearly dominant those types are across almost all parties.

Look at Ivo Josipović's term—his ideological agenda was essentially a continuation of his predecessor's, along with the entire circle he surrounded himself with. Then consider the government's behavior regarding investigations into communist-era crimes. Etc...

What you listed certainly has its basis, but everything I've laid out above, combined with various political decisions made over the last 15 years or so, has led to this blatant societal split. Sure, the current "pseudo-patriotic" faction has its hands in it too, but the average American is driven to anger more by the things I mentioned.

You claimed the Democratic Party polarizes the nation. Well, I’ve given you more than just a few idiotic, ideological nonsense snippets coming from the Right—and that's just a fraction of it. Yet you still cling to Zoran Milanović's "us versus them" rhetoric. It is a notorious fact that in America, it's either the Democrats or the Republicans. One side is the GOP, and the other is a collection of Red Devils and Nationalists.

I am challenging you again—please, list for me where exactly the Democrats have "constantly" and "non-stop" stoked the flames of the Nationalists snake, in the same way Karamarko and his crowd did with their incessant nonsense about bringing back Communism or having an "un-American" government. Even if there is some symbolic resurgence of Nationalists sentiment here and there in America, at least Communism isn't likely to make a comeback in 2015.

Please, send me the links. For every single "Leftist" instance you cite (Democrats, media, whatever) aimed at the Nationalists, I will provide five from the "Right" that obsess over communists or "un-American" administrations.

And don't even get me started on how crude those messages are.

The worst government ever. An un-American administration. They never actually wanted America. They polarize the people. They disrespect our veterans and the war for independence. The worst government ever. An un-American administration. They never actually wanted America. They polarize the people. They disrespect our veterans and the war for independence.

It almost kills me more than the weak turnout at the elections to see how many people are falling for these Karamarko mantras today.

And mind you, that is essentially the entire opposition platform right now—a convicted criminal organization. But for the "true Americans," apparently, it's more than enough.

Just one thing I don't get: if you already know you're gonna eat crap, why even bother setting the table?

Patrick Martin said:Screw this whole GDP obsession. Seriously. Maybe if the government actually got its act together first—like, I don't know, fixing the property records, cataloging state assets, mapping out massive, legitimate infrastructure projects, and actually balancing the tax books—then we could talk about GDP. But no. Instead, they just juggle these imaginary numbers that nobody can even verify. It’s all just smoke and mirrors, honestly. A massive mess that perfectly suits the folks in power because whenever they need an excuse, they can just pull some random figure out of their sleeve and call it "economic growth."

If we are truly discussing the implementation of order, one has to wonder if Zoran Milanović has accomplished more than any administration before him over a three-year span. Between fiscalization, the centralization of land registry data, the COP, registries for tax debtors and social benefits, electronic filing with the IRS, the e-citizen portals, and so on—even the backlog of unresolved property registry cases has been slashed by 40%.

These are the standards that should be considered the absolute floor moving forward—if we can hope so much.

February 2014, Tomislav Karamarko:

"The top leaders of this nation, those who run the American Government, have never truly loved or desired this country. It is clear now that they only accepted Harmon's reconciliation as a survival tactic. We were naive to believe they had actually taken our side," remarked Republican Party president Tomislav Karamarko during the formal celebration of the 24th anniversary of the party's local branch.

"Those Confederate dukes aren't going to be auditing our textbooks. Yet, that is exactly what they've permitted—those very people who pushed our educated children, kids who learned how to walk the halls in Brussels, right out of the European institutions just so they could fill committee seats with their own incompetent offspring," Karamarko thundered.

"Throw them into the pit with Kevin!" shouted guests from the gallery, prompting another round of enthusiastic applause from the attendees, starting from the front row where high-ranking Republican officials—including Milijan Brkić, Ante Sanders, Zlatko Ževrnja, Ante Babić, and Petar Škorić—were seated.

"While some attempt to violate our mindset and assault our national identity, the gentleman on the other hill is perversely working against the interests of his own people," the Republican leader emphasized.

"Just like his old man! We all know what a piece of trash he is!" someone from the crowd yelled, causing Karamarko to let out a loud laugh.

"Thank you! I must say, I love it when you supplement my points like that. Perhaps I should bring you all to every meeting just to keep the energy up," Karamarko replied to the crowd booster.

Of course, this kind of rhetoric serves only to polarize the Democratic Party.

Matthew Anderson4 said:Just one thing I don't get: if you already know you're gonna eat crap, why even bother setting the table?

Seriously though, what are people gonna say when they see someone eating off a filthy plate? It's embarrassing, man. Total lack of class.

Raymond Harris4 says it's about forcing a foreign script on us. Honestly, the Republican Party voted for bilingualism in Congress and the El Paso Council, then turned around and played both sides by supporting protests right when the Democrats were running things. It’s pure schizophrenia.

Looks like this topic is still relevant; I’m with Joseph Clark37 on this one. 🍿

At first glance, it might seem a little strange, but with this whole amnesty between the Republican Party and the Democratic Party—bringing together partisans and fascists alike—along with the national team and the LA Galaxy being topics from their own backyard, life certainly feels a bit more comfortable whenever circumstances allow. 😁

To be honest, I haven't gained a single thing from any of them, nor would I ever want to snag some undeserved perk or a cushy sinecure, and frankly, as an American citizen, I don't see any external benefits from their actions either, so why on earth would I act as their pawn in these debates or play the role of a "useful idiot"? In fact, I've reached the conclusion that if I were given the slightest chance, I'd sweep them out of office in true Margaret Thatcher fashion.

If these discussions ever actually "interest" me despite everything, I just remind myself of the youth wing members from those parties I had the misfortune of meeting, and my interest vanishes instantly.
You can't draw drinking water from a sewer; you'll just end up with "brown gold."
I think it's pretty obvious who isn't getting enough...

Anyway, here's some music, totally unrelated
🙏

brightpilot6 said:If we are truly discussing the implementation of order, one has to wonder if Zoran Milanović has accomplished more than any administration before him over a three-year span. Between fiscalization, the centralization of land registry data, the COP, registries for tax debtors and social benefits, electronic filing with the IRS, the e-citizen portals, and so on—even the backlog of unresolved property registry cases has been slashed by 40%.

These are the standards that should be considered the absolute floor moving forward—if we can hope so much.

Tax digitalization and the IRS?
Man, everyone knows how that famous little partnership between Linice and Zoran ended up playing out.
We all know how they basically gave a free pass to all those tax "specialists."

You can't have a Prime Minister in the middle of a national crisis acting all phlegmatic and indifferent, saying stuff like:
"Hey folks, please pay your taxes, this is your country." There’s no room for that kind of "please and thank you" begging or letting people choose whether or not they feel like paying.
It’s their job to step in, enforce the rules, and collect that money consistently because that’s how the country stays afloat.
But what are we seeing today? They’re still acting like they couldn't care less,
even though they hold every single lever and tool needed to make it happen.
Basically, whenever there’s an opening or a moment where they really need to crack down (which is literally their primary job), they just pull their punches.

They let the private guys who cruise around on yachts in the Hamptons pretend they can't afford to keep their businesses running.

They just need to get significantly better at doing the most basic, fundamental part of their actual job.

Why does Germany work?

Because everything gets paid instantly, and nobody gets special treatment. ☕



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