Do you have a spiritual mentor, and how much of an impact do they have on your life?

Paul Rogers94 said:That applies to any rational human being, or any self-aware entity for that matter. I'm not ruling that out, but building an entire culture based on the herd instinct of animalistic fear? That’s strictly subhuman territory.

Just to be clear—when I use terms like "subhuman," "animal," or "human being" in the full sense of the word, I'm not making some sort of moral judgment or trying to rank people...

We all have bits of all three in us, just in different proportions. The real question is which part is running the show psychologically—for the vast majority, it's the animal.

I honestly don't care about the linguistic nuances here; you can call it untermensch if it makes you feel better. It doesn't matter how you choose to categorize people or what values you assign to them—those are your own personal hang-ups, and I have no business interfering with them. My point, which I keep trying to hammer home, is that this idea of "primal herd fear" simply isn't a real thing. You're more than welcome to make up your own phrases (or borrow someone else's) that lack actual substance... but I’m also going to hold onto my right to avoid using your specific brand of doublespeak.

Paul Rogers94 said:That applies to any rational human being, or any self-aware entity for that matter. I'm not ruling that out, but building an entire culture based on the herd instinct of animalistic fear? That’s strictly subhuman territory.

Just to be clear—when I use terms like "subhuman," "animal," or "human being" in the full sense of the word, I'm not making some sort of moral judgment or trying to rank people...

We all have bits of all three in us, just in different proportions. The real question is which part is running the show psychologically—for the vast majority, it's the animal.

And what exactly are you using as a yardstick for that?

David Vaughn75 said:I explain everything to you three different ways and you still come back with the same questions 🤦

It doesn't matter if the guy is a celebrity or a complete nobody—what matters is whether he actually lives out his own BS. Your soul can sniff out who's legit. Like, look at parents who tell their kid to stay away from sugar while they're sitting there devouring a donut; those people have zero credibility, so their words don't mean squat.

Quincy:

How can you even tell if someone has actually found enlightenment and isn't just lying to you or playing you? Is it based on how smooth they talk, or the peace and compassion they radiate, or maybe all those deep thoughts and that charismatic vibe? They could even be using an aggressive, persuasive style. Honestly, all of that can be rehearsed, especially if the person is a natural performer.

The universe knows exactly what your intentions are, and it sends people your way based on that.

If you aren't looking for anything real and just want something to kill the boredom, that's exactly what you'll get—some con artist selling you smoke and mirrors.
But if you truly want to dedicate your entire life to God, the universe will send you a real teacher.

Quincy:

What does "living out your enlightenment" actually look like in practice? A Zen proverb 😁 says that before enlightenment, a man chops wood and carries water, and after enlightenment, he chops wood and carries water. You can't just watch someone and decide they're enlightened. In fact, they say only someone who's already reached that state can recognize it in someone else—though, by that point, they wouldn't really care anyway.

Personally, I prefer the idea of surrendering to God over "enlightenment," mostly because I haven't got a clue what enlightenment even is.
Someone who has surrendered is free from fear.

You can spot someone who has surrendered to God because they aren't out there trying to grab power over anyone else; their only real interest is helping other people find their own freedom.

But hey, this is just one way of looking at things. Not every enlightened soul walks the same path, after all.

Joseph Bailey41 said:I honestly don't care about the linguistic nuances here; you can call it untermensch if it makes you feel better. It doesn't matter how you choose to categorize people or what values you assign to them—those are your own personal hang-ups, and I have no business interfering with them. My point, which I keep trying to hammer home, is that this idea of "primal herd fear" simply isn't a real thing. You're more than welcome to make up your own phrases (or borrow someone else's) that lack actual substance... but I’m also going to hold onto my right to avoid using your specific brand of doublespeak.

And what exactly are you using as a yardstick for that?

😍

it sounds like you're describing yourself—sometimes you come off like a bucket of New Age garbage, desperately cluttering things up just to avoid facing the fact that there’s absolutely nothing underneath... and the more you try to fill the void, the more broken and empty you actually become.

🤣 🎉🤣

Paul Rogers94 said:😍

it sounds like you're describing yourself—sometimes you come off like a bucket of New Age garbage, desperately cluttering things up just to avoid facing the fact that there’s absolutely nothing underneath... and the more you try to fill the void, the more broken and empty you actually become.

🤣 🎉🤣

What even is this? An attempt at an ad hominem attack? 🤣

And here I thought we were on good terms. I guess I'll go cry about it to my cat. ☕

Paul Rogers94 said:It’s fear itself that strips us of our rationality. It's what allows low-level clowns like Hitler and Stalin to manipulate millions... acting out of fear isn't rational. You can't be a rational actor while living in psychological bondage to fear. I won't argue just for the sake of arguing—I already covered that in my last post—but being fearless doesn't mean being a mindless idiot; quite the opposite. Fear is exactly what turns people into mindless idiots.
Just because someone's actions aren't driven by fear doesn't mean they'll go jumping out of a plane without a parachute.
Not being a slave to fear doesn't equate to having no brain.

Fear is a primal herd instinct—an unconscious drive for survival and continuity. It works fine for animals. However, when that herd instinct dominates a species that is supposed to be distinguished from animals by self-awareness, you end up with something that isn't fully human yet, but isn't quite an animal either. I call it "subhuman"—a transitional stage between animal and true human being. Only an individual can transcend this subhuman state to reach a true human state, where their life isn't dominated by basic animalistic herd instincts—that unconscious, animal fear. That is the only time one acts from reason rather than fear.

Acting rationally out of fear is impossible.

That applies to all emotions. They surface, overwhelm us, and only once they begin to subside can reason take the wheel, allowing us to view things objectively and respond appropriately. However, this isn't always achievable. Emotions vary in intensity and duration; sometimes they hit all at once, sometimes they are too powerful for logic to regain control quickly, and occasionally we just have an off day where our sense of reason simply vanishes. 😁

Fear is one of the most effective tools for manipulation, and it is something we must guard against. Some people handle it better than others. Some are naturally more anxious, while others are inherently bolder. Still, resisting fears that people are conditioned to feel throughout their lives is difficult. If you grow up in a society that raises you on fear, breaking free from it is no easy task.

Every new fear tends to awaken old ones, making you realize that all your fears have merely been dormant within you all along. They never truly disappeared; they were just waiting to be stirred. Therefore, the idea of "freedom from fear" is essentially an illusion.

The fact that I am not currently afraid of a pandemic doesn't mean the fear doesn't exist. It simply means my reason has determined that being afraid right now is unjustified and harmful, so it has suppressed the feeling. But if the situation shifted and people began dying all around me, that fear would emerge from its hiding place very quickly.

mistybison said:That applies to all emotions. They surface, overwhelm us, and only once they begin to subside can reason take the wheel, allowing us to view things objectively and respond appropriately. However, this isn't always achievable. Emotions vary in intensity and duration; sometimes they hit all at once, sometimes they are too powerful for logic to regain control quickly, and occasionally we just have an off day where our sense of reason simply vanishes. 😁

Fear is one of the most effective tools for manipulation, and it is something we must guard against. Some people handle it better than others. Some are naturally more anxious, while others are inherently bolder. Still, resisting fears that people are conditioned to feel throughout their lives is difficult. If you grow up in a society that raises you on fear, breaking free from it is no easy task.

Every new fear tends to awaken old ones, making you realize that all your fears have merely been dormant within you all along. They never truly disappeared; they were just waiting to be stirred. Therefore, the idea of "freedom from fear" is essentially an illusion.

The fact that I am not currently afraid of a pandemic doesn't mean the fear doesn't exist. It simply means my reason has determined that being afraid right now is unjustified and harmful, so it has suppressed the feeling. But if the situation shifted and people began dying all around me, that fear would emerge from its hiding place very quickly.

It's an illusion because those (AI-generated) fears are illusions too... when they meet, they basically cancel each other out.

(The High Priestess told me so last night on that Paul Rogers94 link. 🤣 )

My spiritual mentor isn't some guy in a robe; it’s my entire environment, the raw reality I breathe in, and every single experience that hits my senses or drops a fresh bit of knowledge into my lap.

My spiritual mentor is found in every single new answer to every single new question I dare to ask.

My spiritual mentor is the very force that, through sheer action, elevated humanity far above every other species on this planet.

My spiritual mentor holds this staggering, almost terrifying potential within the minds of nearly everyone who puts their faith in it, yet why on earth can we never seem to witness that potential manifesting as a collective?

My spiritual mentor doesn't have a face, but it possesses a voice that very few actually bother to listen to—and an identity that everyone knows.

That name is Reason.

Disclaimer: any resemblance to Bog is purely intentional satire aimed at those spiritual squabbles known as theism.

Melissa Cooper3 said:My spiritual mentor isn't some guy in a robe; it’s my entire environment, the raw reality I breathe in, and every single experience that hits my senses or drops a fresh bit of knowledge into my lap.

My spiritual mentor is found in every single new answer to every single new question I dare to ask.

My spiritual mentor is the very force that, through sheer action, elevated humanity far above every other species on this planet.

My spiritual mentor holds this staggering, almost terrifying potential within the minds of nearly everyone who puts their faith in it, yet why on earth can we never seem to witness that potential manifesting as a collective?

My spiritual mentor doesn't have a face, but it possesses a voice that very few actually bother to listen to—and an identity that everyone knows.

That name is Reason.

Disclaimer: any resemblance to Bog is purely intentional satire aimed at those spiritual squabbles known as theism.

That’s a beautiful way to put it, though there aren't really many theists hanging out in this corner of the internet. 😁

Joseph Bailey41 said:That’s a beautiful way to put it, though there aren't really many theists hanging out in this corner of the internet. 😁

Look, I don't actually care how many theists are lurking around; my point was whether my specific brand of sarcasm would actually land a laugh from at least one person (besides myself), and honestly? Mission accomplished.

Melissa Cooper3 said:Look, I don't actually care how many theists are lurking around; my point was whether my specific brand of sarcasm would actually land a laugh from at least one person (besides myself), and honestly? Mission accomplished.

Well, in that case, I truly hope you hit that goal. 🙂

Personally, I don't find your way of writing funny—it’s more beautiful, inspiring, and poetic to me... which makes it spiritual in a broader sense. So, I really hope you keep posting here on this subforum.

Joseph Bailey41 said:Well, in that case, I truly hope you hit that goal. 🙂

Personally, I don't find your way of writing funny—it’s more beautiful, inspiring, and poetic to me... which makes it spiritual in a broader sense. So, I really hope you keep posting here on this subforum.

When I said "make me laugh," I didn't mean I was expecting a full-blown belly laugh! Honestly, just that little smirk, that tiny twitch at the corner of the mouth that reaches the ears? That's more than enough of a reaction for me.

mistybison said:[Beljki mode on] A child might not actually be avoiding sugar, or perhaps they say they aren't eating it just to be good. We don't know if diabetes is the real reason for the dietary restriction or if the boy is simply acting out of pure kindness. 🤔[/Beljki mode off] 🤣

One should always maintain a reasonable level of skepticism to protect oneself from various... charlatans 😁 looking to take advantage of us. 🧐

Quincy:

The universe knows your intentions and sends people to you based on them. If you aren't looking for anything serious and just want something to kill the boredom, that is exactly what you will get: some joker selling you smoke and mirrors. If you want to dedicate your entire life to God, the universe will send you a true teacher.

That sounds a bit too New Age for me. I used to believe in those kinds of ideas when I was nineteen, but I moved past that long ago... 🤷

Quincy:

I prefer the concept of surrendering to God over enlightenment, mostly because I have no idea what enlightenment even is. A person who has surrendered is freed from fear. You can recognize someone who has surrendered to God by the fact that they don't seek power over others, but instead focus solely on helping others find freedom.

How can you tell if someone is free from fear or capable of freeing others? I just heard news about a priest who was administering communion to congregants in a church—violating gathering protocols—from the same bowl. Clearly, neither he nor his followers fear the virus, believing that God protects them. Is that who you want to be? Having "blind faith" in God and walking through fire and water for your convictions?

There's a massive difference between being a skeptic and just being a jerk to the person you're talking to.

Personally, I figured you were smart enough to get the point I was making.
Instead, you're just throwing out mindless questions just to hear yourself talk.

That sounds way too New Age for me. I used to buy into that kind of stuff when I was nineteen, but I grew out of it a long time ago, so... 🤷

If you don't have anything actual to contribute, then don't quote me.

How do you even know he's free from fear? And how do you know he can even liberate anyone else?

Ask a psychic and find out. Pretty sure that's the only way to read someone's mind.

Joseph Bailey41 said:Let’s switch things up for a second. Instead of just hyping each other up—which I love because we really get each other—let’s actually try to define what this whole "herd instinct" thing even means, and what a "herd" per se actually is. From what I see when I head down into the city, it doesn't look like a "herd" at all. It looks like a bunch of individual personas just wandering aimlessly, each playing their own little political game. It’s more like the chaotic movement of subatomic particles than some kind of organized super-organism.

Sure, right now they might all be sharing the same emotional state (and honestly, it's a vibe you can smell from blocks away, so I personally prefer keeping my distance), but in the grand scheme of things, it's all temporary and fleeting. If you were to ask any one of them what they're actually afraid of, they wouldn't even be able to put it into words... so by definition, this isn't fear, it's paranoia. That's why conspiracy theorists are having the time of their lives right now; they feel like pigs in mud because finally, other people are starting to "see" the Illuminati, the Masons, and whatever else they're obsessed with.

How do you teach a "herd" anything? You don't. You can't. Because a "herd" doesn't have reason, it can't remember, it can't learn, and it can't achieve insight. It doesn't even have an instinct, because that concept doesn't exist in this context; it's just a mental construct used by people who try to control others because they're lonely and empty inside. Reason—and even emotion, intuition, or instinct—is something possessed exclusively by individuals. You can only have a conversation with individuals; they are the only ones you can teach, and the only ones you can learn from. A herd (whether you call it a mass, a crowd, or just the unwashed masses) isn't a factor. It isn't a force of nature, and it isn't a conscious, active subject. It's nothing. It’s just a temporary mental illusion sustained only by "faith" in the concept itself—basically, by us accepting the terminology. It's a cheap magician's trick.

Well, obviously you're going to teach individuals. How else would you do it?

But look, a Man is a pack animal by nature; without a community, he wouldn't have survived a day in the wild.
That’s why you teach the individual how to behave within the herd. 😉

David Vaughn75 said:There's a massive difference between being a skeptic and just being a jerk to the person you're talking to.

Personally, I figured you were smart enough to get the point I was making.
Instead, you're just throwing out mindless questions just to hear yourself talk.

That sounds way too New Age for me. I used to buy into that kind of stuff when I was nineteen, but I grew out of it a long time ago, so... 🤷

If you don't have anything actual to contribute, then don't quote me.

How do you even know he's free from fear? And how do you know he can even liberate anyone else?

Ask a psychic and find out. Pretty sure that's the only way to read someone's mind.

If you aren't able to identify a true teacher, you run the risk of falling prey to many frauds. I truly hope that doesn't happen to you. 🙂

mistybison said:If you aren't able to identify a true teacher, you run the risk of falling prey to many frauds. I truly hope that doesn't happen to you. 🙂

Look, I already told you—God looks out for people. You're sitting here questioning how I could have believed that back in my younger days, but honestly, what else am I supposed to say?

Bottom line is, if you're looking for something real, you'll find it, because God takes care of us.

David Vaughn75 said:Look, I already told you—God looks out for people. You're sitting here questioning how I could have believed that back in my younger days, but honestly, what else am I supposed to say?

Bottom line is, if you're looking for something real, you'll find it, because God takes care of us.

Does this psychopath care about little kids too? You know, the ones he kidnaps, rapes, murders, rapes again, and then bakes in an oven? Or is that when "necessary measures" only apply? perembozanskerucice Karma, right here. Karma? What's that supposed to mean? Forget karma. I'm stronger than that. JebesKara JaSamJaci God?

It all comes down to whatever baseless fantasy is convenient enough to bridge the gap between the nonsense we believe in and actual reality. 🕺

David Vaughn75 said:Look, I already told you—God looks out for people. You're sitting here questioning how I could have believed that back in my younger days, but honestly, what else am I supposed to say?

Bottom line is, if you're looking for something real, you'll find it, because God takes care of us.

I respect your convictions, even though I don't share them. 🙂

Melissa Cooper3 said:When I said "make me laugh," I didn't mean I was expecting a full-blown belly laugh! Honestly, just that little smirk, that tiny twitch at the corner of the mouth that reaches the ears? That's more than enough of a reaction for me.

Sold. 😬

David Vaughn75 said:Well, obviously you're going to teach individuals. How else would you do it?

But look, a Man is a pack animal by nature; without a community, he wouldn't have survived a day in the wild.
That’s why you teach the individual how to behave within the herd. 😉

Look, we all have our own traditions to follow. My teachers are following the same path laid out by those Bago writes about—think of them like the collective spirit of the Deer, the Owl, or the essence of Sjenica... I won't list them all here because I’ll inevitably miss someone. I capitalize those names intentionally; I’m not talking about just any random deer or owl, but rather the "collective soul" or the underlying "essence" of those species. I don't really function well within a "herd" mentality, and honestly, I wouldn't dream of trying to teach others something I haven't mastered myself. To truly guide people, one would first have to encounter the true Man, and even Diogenes couldn't manage that in broad daylight, let alone expect me to find my way through the darkness of my own ignorance.

So, maybe this conversation would flow a little more naturally if you shared something about your teacher and how you two actually got along. We’re all coming at this from our own personal perspectives, so without that context, I feel like we’re just spinning our wheels.

David Vaughn75 said:Look, when you’re "learning" like that, there might be a tiny chance you actually pick up something useful, but honestly? The odds are astronomically low.

And please, don't lecture me—gurus have existed in Hinduism since forever.

I believe this is a long-term unhealthy religious phenomenon. It pushes the psychological regressiveness already found in religious groups to an extreme, trapping people in a perpetual illusion of security through a childish relationship with pseudo-parental figures, which ultimately prevents them from reaching full maturity and responsibility.

Seriously, why would anyone walk away from a warm, loving home where everything is perfect just to go chase some spiritual teacher?

No kid in their right mind would ever do that.

Wait, so what? You're saying hell is actually a great place and we shouldn't be scared of it, but instead we should head down there to find spirituality? That theory is a massive stretch.

To me, it just makes sense that someone passes on their own knowledge; they aren't going to pass on someone else's.

I suspect that isn't actually the case.

From what I understand, there is a sect in Bengal known as the Baula, a group of somewhat unorthodox Vaišnavas who are heavily criticized and rejected by many others in India who fall outside that circle.

One of their songs begins roughly like this:

"That is why, brother, I became an impulsive baul,
refusing to follow the commands of any master."

I cannot recall the specific mood I was in when I read that poem, only that the book was written in our language.

If they truly do not follow the dictates of a master, choosing instead to live by the whims of their own intuition, aligning themselves with nature through impulse and acting purely on their own volition—much like a wind that shifts unpredictably from one direction to another—then, of course, they possess no guru at all.

casualtiger2 said:My guru is Makaj.
Unfortunately, I’m one of those subpar students—
so I don't even really know how much he actually means to me.

I believe this might be the most sincere post in this entire thread.

bluemason3 said:Does this psychopath care about little kids too? You know, the ones he kidnaps, rapes, murders, rapes again, and then bakes in an oven? Or is that when "necessary measures" only apply? perembozanskerucice Karma, right here. Karma? What's that supposed to mean? Forget karma. I'm stronger than that. JebesKara JaSamJaci God?

It all comes down to whatever baseless fantasy is convenient enough to bridge the gap between the nonsense we believe in and actual reality. 🕺

God just makes sure everyone gets exactly what's coming to them.

Look, at the end of the day, nobody is going to pile more weight onto your shoulders than the stuff you went out and cooked up for yourself. You know how it goes—you make your own mess, you deal with your own fallout. It’s all on you.

Joseph Bailey41 said:Sold. 😬

Look, we all have our own traditions to follow. My teachers are following the same path laid out by those Bago writes about—think of them like the collective spirit of the Deer, the Owl, or the essence of Sjenica... I won't list them all here because I’ll inevitably miss someone. I capitalize those names intentionally; I’m not talking about just any random deer or owl, but rather the "collective soul" or the underlying "essence" of those species. I don't really function well within a "herd" mentality, and honestly, I wouldn't dream of trying to teach others something I haven't mastered myself. To truly guide people, one would first have to encounter the true Man, and even Diogenes couldn't manage that in broad daylight, let alone expect me to find my way through the darkness of my own ignorance.

So, maybe this conversation would flow a little more naturally if you shared something about your teacher and how you two actually got along. We’re all coming at this from our own personal perspectives, so without that context, I feel like we’re just spinning our wheels.

I’ve never even heard of some collective deer or owl nonsense before. Honestly, what are we even talking about here? Total gibberish.
Look, here’s the deal—you could basically become an owl if you reincarnate into one, and then that owl gets to be a man. It's all wild, right?

Look, if you really want to get down into the weeds of this stuff, there's only one true collective Over-soul out there—it's Paramatma, which is basically just the yogic side of God.

Look, maybe this whole conversation would actually go somewhere if you’d just open up a bit about your teacher—you know, what they were actually like and how you two clicked (or didn't). Right now, we're all just throwing out our own random takes based on our own baggage, and honestly? We're just spinning our wheels and talking in circles.

Look, there's just way too much ground to cover here—I could go on forever—so you really need to narrow this down. Pick a specific angle or a tighter topic if you actually want to get anywhere with this question.